Do You Ever Ride Without A Helmet

[madjbs]

Very interesting article, I am happy that I use Shark helmets now, which are Euro certified and softer. I find it amazing that Index helmets are supposedly DOT certified, as they are rock solid with only a thin layer of foam.

[BigBikeBKK]

Very interesting article, I am happy that I use Shark helmets now, which are Euro certified and softer. I find it amazing that Index helmets are supposedly DOT certified, as they are rock solid with only a thin layer of foam.

I've never seen a DOT certified Index brand helmet though I've heard they exist. The only easy to find Thai brand I've seen that is DOT certified is REAL brand. Decent helmets at budget price, but they seem to be made to fit round asian heads and really don't fit my egg head...

[madjbs]

My Real helmet fits me nicely, and their quality has greatly improved over the last couple of years too, definitely a good helmet for the price. I just checked my Index helmet and it doesn't have a DOT sticker actually, so I am not sure if they make DOT helmets or not, my guess is not.

As far as helmet test standards, The new snell 2010 seems better, although won't be in place till the end of this month. The new UK SHARP test rating system also seems to be very good. My Shark Evoline scores a 4.

Edited March 26, 2012 by madjbs

[wantan]

Everyone looking for a good cheap helmet should take a look at the Real brand. My Real helmets also fit me good. And i sure don't have an asian egg shaped head. But the downside of such good quality helmets is that you have to take care of them. They are not as robust as all those supermarket buckets that can stay into sun all day and that can be thrown around everywhere. If you use a quality helmet you have to take good care of it to be sure it will protect you properly.

All this discussion about helmet standards is sure interesting. But people discussing helmet standards will most probably already wear a helmet and know the advantages of doing so. I don't want to call it off topic, but i think its more interesting to discuss the reasons why people don't wear a helmet and how to convince them to do so.

[IanForbes]

Let me see, I think I rode my motorbike 6 times the past two days without wearing a helmet. Of course I was only going half a kilometer each time carrying a plastic tub full of my gear from one location to another. Yah, I know, most accidents are within a kilometer of home, but sometimes there are risks you take just for the hell of it. I didn't wear my body armour either. And, the past 3 nights I went out wearing only shorts and a short sleave shirt. But, I DID wear a helmet and gloves.

However, considering that I rode my bicycle 28 miles each day to work and back for 14 years wtihout wearing a helmet or padding I was over due for an accident or two. I was riding along a busy highway on Vancouver Island on the bike and my speed averaged about 20 mph..

So I guess the answer to the original question is YES, I do occasionally not wear a helmet. But hey, a LOT of people say I'm crazy riding anything in Thailand.

See you in hospital....or worse?

Possibly. But my plane might crash when it heads back to Canada next thursday and I won't have to worry about helmets. Or, I might get eaten by one of the many bears I encounter while in Canada these coming 7 months. Or, I might run into a log jamb in my jet boat while in Canada and drown. Or, I just might have cancer of the prostate gland and I won't have to worry about anything else.

No, I'll take my chances of surviving riding a motorbike in Thailand... Whether I wear a helmet or not. That is by far one of the most risky things i've ever done, which includes para-sailing, sky diving, big wall rock climbing, playing with venomous snakes, going over waterfalls in rafts and kayaks and a bunch of other things I've done in the past.

[taichiplanet]

Everyone looking for a good cheap helmet should take a look at the Real brand. My Real helmets also fit me good. And i sure don't have an asian egg shaped head. But the downside of such good quality helmets is that you have to take care of them. They are not as robust as all those supermarket buckets that can stay into sun all day and that can be thrown around everywhere. If you use a quality helmet you have to take good care of it to be sure it will protect you properly.

All this discussion about helmet standards is sure interesting. But people discussing helmet standards will most probably already wear a helmet and know the advantages of doing so. I don't want to call it off topic, but i think its more interesting to discuss the reasons why people don't wear a helmet and how to convince them to do so.

I like the REAL Helmet too, and have had several of them. The great thing is that now it is possible to get different sizes. When i first came to Thailand to live 4 years ago i started looking around for a reasonable but cheap helmet that fitted well. I walked into a shop that had lots of helmets and asked to try a medium size one, they said "Free size"! They probably wondered why i walked out of the shop laughing.

I don't think the safety standards are off topic, as the info contained in those articles also addresses why someone should wear a helmet. People probably choose not to wear them because they don't like being told to wear them or they like the wind in their hair. Sometimes laws are there to help protect people from themselves. In the US you now have the ridiculous situation where people get injured from airbag deployment in cars. Why? Because they see it as their constitutional right to choose not to wear them (not sure how many US states don't enforce the wearing of seat belts). In countries where wearing safety belts are mandatory the airbags can deploy slower and therefore less injuries. I remember in Australia when the law was changed so that it was mandatory for motorcyclists to wear helmets; guys were going to their doctors to try and get a certificate saying that they were unable to wear a helmet due to health reasons!! Sorry, but that is plain stupid but i suppose Darwin's theory of natural selection may eventually play it's role!

There is a good chance that a lot of people not wearing a helmet won't be in an accident but is it worth the consequences to yourself, your family, your friends and even to the others involved in the accident? Let alone all the resources used to save/fix you. As i,ve said before, i don't care if someone wears a helmet or not; as long as they take the responsibility for not wearing one and they don't try to blame someone else for their injuries. Though i prefer not to have on my conscious that someone died in an accident i was involved in, especially if they could have been saved by just wearing a helmet. An example for Thailand (correct me if i am wrong) is that if a farang is involved in an accident and someone dies, then there is a good chance that they will be convicted of involuntary manslaughter. With this conviction the farang can have their visa revoked and be deported. An extreme case i know, but i don't want to be put in that situation, just because someone doesn't have the brains (pun intended) to wear a helmet that might have saved their life.

Maybe there should be a code on people's bike driver's licence that indicates whether they are willing to wear a helmet or not. f you indicate you want to wear a helmet and are caught not wearing one, then you are fined. If you indicate that you intend not to wear a helmet you cannot be fined but if you are involved in an accident then others involved in the accident are not held responsible for you injuries/death. that way, i don't care if someone wear a helmet or not as i won't be held responsible.

Edited March 26, 2012 by taichiplanet

[smedly]

I'm an experienced rider and was knocked off my Honda CBR 250 on beach rd.

It happened so quickly that I could do nothing and when I came down I had a lot of pain for the next week and have scars to prove it. My head with full faced helmet hit the road and the helmet was scratched badly. I got up and walked away so I'm still here to support my wife and baby.

Really wearing a hemut is a must as people dont realise how fragile our head is.

A friend of mine worked in the emergency ward at an Australian hospital and use to deal with it on Saturday nights. She said many people simply never left the hospital and this was not from motorcycling but simply from drunk people falling over and hitting their head on the sidewalk. If you can die falling over what hope do you have going head first into the road at 60K's an hour.

very true but one thing I would add, falling of a bike at 60kmph (or even 140kmph) or walking and falling drunk or whatever can often result in the same size of impact of your head on the ground - think of it as distance to the ground, serious injuries from bike accidents excluding road rash and friction burns are when you hit something hard that is solid and not moving or while you are down something like a car or other vehicle hits you, most of the motoGP accidents you see during races will be a rider going down and sliding across the track or in the gravel - very safe as there is nothing to hit (this is why motocross riders experience more injuries eventhough the speeds are a lot less, you do see the odd broken finger or collar bone or strain injury where a rider might get highsided (thrown onto the air) and slamed into the ground, We all know of the recent MotoGP rider that lost his life last season, his accident was caused by a freak collision with another bike and in fact it was so traumatic that his Helmet was ripped from his head.

At low speed you reduce the risk of hitting something while you are sliding along the ground but the risk increases in towns and cities as there are more things to hit, accidents in pattaya where a bike rider has been seriously injured have either involved other vehicles or where the rider has hit something usually not wearing a helmet - would a helmet have saved many of these - hard to say but it certaintly would have improved their chances

I sort of get what you are saying here and trying to make sense of it. You are saying someon falling over drunk is the same as coming off a motor bike. If all variables were the same meaning the object you are going to hit and the direction you hit then this would go against Newtons second Law of motion. Applied force equals mass by acceleration, so my mass would remain the same but the acceleration I have hitting the road from a motorcycle is far hagher than falling over therefore the applied force is higher causing more damage to my head.

from a posted article

quote.....

the vast majority of head impacts occur when

the rider falls off his bike and simply hits his head on the flat road surface.

The biggest impact in a given crash will typically happen on that first

contact, and the energy is proportional to the height from which the rider

falls—not his forward speed at the time. A big highside may give a rider

some extra altitude, but rarely higher than 8 feet. A high-speed crash may

involve a lot of sliding along the ground, but this is not particularly

challenging to a helmeted head

[Brissance]

.

Maybe there should be a code on people's bike driver's licence that indicates whether they are willing to wear a helmet or not. f you indicate you want to wear a helmet and are caught not wearing one, then you are fined. If you indicate that you intend not to wear a helmet you cannot be fined but if you are involved in an accident then others involved in the accident are not held responsible for you injuries/death. that way, i don't care if someone wear a helmet or not as i won't be held responsible.

I agree that if some-one opts to not wear a helmet, whilst riding a motorcycle, then, in part, they have made a contribution to any head injuries they may sustain. But, if you caused the accident, then, it would be your fault, irrespective of how they were dressed.

Perhaps you would also prefer pedestrians to sign disclaimers, if they don't wear a 'Michelin' suit, to protect themselves against impacts from road vehicles.

.

[taichiplanet]

.

Maybe there should be a code on people's bike driver's licence that indicates whether they are willing to wear a helmet or not. f you indicate you want to wear a helmet and are caught not wearing one, then you are fined. If you indicate that you intend not to wear a helmet you cannot be fined but if you are involved in an accident then others involved in the accident are not held responsible for you injuries/death. that way, i don't care if someone wear a helmet or not as i won't be held responsible.

I agree that if some-one opts to not wear a helmet, whilst riding a motorcycle, then, in part, they have made a contribution to any head injuries they may sustain. But, if you caused the accident, then, it would be your fault, irrespective of how they were dressed.

Perhaps you would also prefer pedestrians to sign disclaimers, if they don't wear a 'Michelin' suit, to protect themselves against impacts from road vehicles.

.

The Michelin suit would have to be air-con, as would get quiet hot in the tropics.

The point is, that if you don't wear a helmet and suffer injuries that otherwise you wouldn't have gotten if you wore a helmet then it shouldn't be anyone else's fault except your own; irrespective if someone else caused the accident. Phew, try saying that after a few drinks!

If it was my fault i would be happy to pay for your broken arm repair costs as obviously a helmet wouldn't have prevented that, but not for the metal plate that has to be inserted in your skull as a helmet would have prevented that. I'd even think twice about paying for the plastic surgery to have your face re-attached as you should have been wearing a full face helmet.

Edited March 26, 2012 by taichiplanet

[wantan]

What about whole families riding on one scooter? Maybe father wearing a helmet. Small children, even babies on the bike. Most without helmet. Do you want the parents to make a statement like "We are responsible for our head injuries of our children".

I hope i will never be involved in a crash with children who suffer. My fault or not, doesn't matter. It would scare me to hell and maybe i would even stop riding, driving, whatever, forever...

TiT. People sitting at the back of a PickUp at 130kmh, eating SomTam drinking Lao Kao. Some fall down, others die in small crashes, because they were thrown onto the street. IMO not really useful to have a driving license with such a "I am responsible" helmet statement. If there is a law saying you have to wear a helmet than you have to do so. Pretty easy. And if you continue to break the law than at some point you should lose your driving license for a while. And at some point you should lose it forever. Very easy. And very effective in many countries all over the world

[transam]

What about whole families riding on one scooter? Maybe father wearing a helmet. Small children, even babies on the bike. Most without helmet. Do you want the parents to make a statement like "We are responsible for our head injuries of our children".

I hope i will never be involved in a crash with children who suffer. My fault or not, doesn't matter. It would scare me to hell and maybe i would even stop riding, driving, whatever, forever...

TiT. People sitting at the back of a PickUp at 130kmh, eating SomTam drinking Lao Kao. Some fall down, others die in small crashes, because they were thrown onto the street. IMO not really useful to have a driving license with such a "I am responsible" helmet statement. If there is a law saying you have to wear a helmet than you have to do so. Pretty easy. And if you continue to break the law than at some point you should lose your driving license for a while. And at some point you should lose it forever. Very easy. And very effective in many countries all over the world

The only reason the dad wears a helmet is the 200bht fine. The law was, driver must wear a helmet, most don't know the law has changed and it seems where l am the BiB don't know either.

[Brissance]

What about whole families riding on one scooter? Maybe father wearing a helmet. Small children, even babies on the bike. Most without helmet. Do you want the parents to make a statement like "We are responsible for our head injuries of our children".

I hope i will never be involved in a crash with children who suffer. My fault or not, doesn't matter. It would scare me to hell and maybe i would even stop riding, driving, whatever, forever...

TiT. People sitting at the back of a PickUp at 130kmh, eating SomTam drinking Lao Kao. Some fall down, others die in small crashes, because they were thrown onto the street. IMO not really useful to have a driving license with such a "I am responsible" helmet statement. If there is a law saying you have to wear a helmet than you have to do so. Pretty easy. And if you continue to break the law than at some point you should lose your driving license for a while. And at some point you should lose it forever. Very easy. And very effective in many countries all over the world

I apologise for my poor editing of taichiplanet's post and please re-read my comments between the smilies. .At no time did I say that I condone or support non-compliance with the rules of the road, or law,

What I did say (or at least tried to) was that a person cannot (and should not be allowed to) completely abrogate their responsibility in causing an accident, by utilizing the fact that the victim's lack of a helmet played a significant role in the resultant outcome. However tragic that may be. That person still caused the accident to happen.

Or, are you suggesting that it's o.k;. to seriously injure or kill some-one who isn't wearing a helmet, but it isn't o.k;. to seriously injure or kill some-one who is.

What I did (try to) say, was that the victim's failure to abide by the rule of law, should be taken in mitigation and the financial and/or penal penalty should be commensurate with the penalties imposed, if the victim had been complying with the rule of law and survived with a lesser injury.

Regarding the other scenarios you highlighted, my opinion is much the same and if the person 'in charge' of the other vehicle survived, while others in it were seriously injured, or killed. Then, they too should suffer a severe penalty.

[wantan]

@Brissance:

There seems to be some confusion. In my last post i was replying to thaichiplanets suggestion of having "a code on people's bike driver's licence that indicates whether they are willing to wear a helmet or not.".

Just an short addition to my last post:

I guess i have said this before, but better to repeat it. I think it is the best and easiest solution to stick to law. There is a law saying you have to wear a helmet. So people should do it. And they should be punished if they don't do it.

But for me it would be also OK, if we get rid of the helmet law. I think the law is good and it makes sense, but i also thinks its up to everyone to wear a helmet or not.

BUT:

It absolutely makes no sense to have laws that are not enforced! This is a joke and a disgrace for the government and the whole executive authorities. This is the behaviour of a "Banana Republic". The whole world laughs at such a country and can't take it seriously.

[Brissance]

@Brissance:

There seems to be some confusion. In my last post i was replying to thaichiplanets suggestion of having "a code on people's bike driver's licence that indicates whether they are willing to wear a helmet or not.".

Just an short addition to my last post:

I guess i have said this before, but better to repeat it. I think it is the best and easiest solution to stick to law. There is a law saying you have to wear a helmet. So people should do it. And they should be punished if they don't do it.

But for me it would be also OK, if we get rid of the helmet law. I think the law is good and it makes sense, but i also thinks its up to everyone to wear a helmet or not.

BUT:

It absolutely makes no sense to have laws that are not enforced! This is a joke and a disgrace for the government and the whole executive authorities. This is the behaviour of a "Banana Republic". The whole world laughs at such a country and can't take it seriously.

My thoughts on this topic are that most folks here are kind of in agreement about what is sensible and what is not. We just express ourselves differently.

I agree that it's best to stay within the law. Even if the law is an ass!!! However, I strongly believe that there are better ways to improve peoples; behaviours without collecting revenue for the state

In an earlier post, some-one broached the subject of cyclists wearing 'safety' halmets. I don't know if you have noticed. but I regularly see (Thai) cyclists wearing protective headgear. Especially members of cycling clubs. Now, there isn't any legislation which demands compliance with the rule of law.So, I ask myself. why do they do this when they don't have to? Is the answer in; education, or marketing?

I suspect that good marketing is the chief likely answer.

To support this argument, I'll use Holland as an example. I don't know if you.ve been there, but I'm sure many have. Holland has a very high proportion of the population that uses bicycles to get around (google for statistics), What I noticed was this: Folks who rode what I'll call 'traditional' bicycles, wore everyday chlothes and on many occasions carried a deployed umbrella. Folks that rode; sporty. or racy bicycles wore; protective headgear and lycra. Why would they do this, if thwy didn't have to?

Is that, good education, by compamies marketing their products?

Like you, I don't particularly care if wearing a helmet is legal or not. When I wear my helmet (.and other gear, dependant on;bike and journey), I do it because I have assessed the risk. I would do the same, even if I didn't have to. My actions just happen to comply with the legislation.

[Kwasaki]

My thoughts on this topic are that most folks here are kind of in agreement about what is sensible and what is not. We just express ourselves differently.

I agree that it's best to stay within the law. Even if the law is an ass!!! However, I strongly believe that there are better ways to improve peoples; behaviours without collecting revenue for the state

In an earlier post, some-one broached the subject of cyclists wearing 'safety' halmets. I don't know if you have noticed. but I regularly see (Thai) cyclists wearing protective headgear. Especially members of cycling clubs. Now, there isn't any legislation which demands compliance with the rule of law.So, I ask myself.

To support this argument, I'll use Holland as an example. I don't know if you.ve been there, but I'm sure many have. Is that, good education, by compamies marketing their products?

Like you, I don't particularly care if wearing a helmet is legal or not. When I wear my helmet (.and other gear, dependant on;bike and journey), I do it because I have assessed the risk. I would do the same, even if I didn't have to. My actions just happen to comply with the legislation.

Sorry to break up post but it is just to clarifly.

" My thoughts on this topic are that most folks here are kind of in agreement about what is sensible and what is not. We just express ourselves differently."

Absolutely spot on.

" I agree that it's best to stay within the law. Even if the law is an ass!!! However, I strongly believe that there are better ways to improve peoples; behaviours without collecting revenue for the state."

Yeah so do I !! but some better training is only for the good and it doesn't have to be done in a way as to shoving anything down people thoats.

" the subject of cyclists wearing 'safety' helmets ".

I just see that as a fashion show off thing in Thailand, sorry.

To support this argument, I'll use Holland as an example. I don't know if you.ve been there, but I'm sure many have. Is that, good education, by compamies marketing their products?

Yeah I have been there for sure !! I use to go window shopping there.

" if wearing a helmet is legal or not !! I do it because I have assessed the risk !!.

Exactly assessment and good old common sense, way to go.

Edited March 26, 2012 by Kwasaki

[BigBikeBKK]

I'm an experienced rider and was knocked off my Honda CBR 250 on beach rd.

It happened so quickly that I could do nothing and when I came down I had a lot of pain for the next week and have scars to prove it. My head with full faced helmet hit the road and the helmet was scratched badly. I got up and walked away so I'm still here to support my wife and baby.

Really wearing a hemut is a must as people dont realise how fragile our head is.

A friend of mine worked in the emergency ward at an Australian hospital and use to deal with it on Saturday nights. She said many people simply never left the hospital and this was not from motorcycling but simply from drunk people falling over and hitting their head on the sidewalk. If you can die falling over what hope do you have going head first into the road at 60K's an hour.

very true but one thing I would add, falling of a bike at 60kmph (or even 140kmph) or walking and falling drunk or whatever can often result in the same size of impact of your head on the ground - think of it as distance to the ground, serious injuries from bike accidents excluding road rash and friction burns are when you hit something hard that is solid and not moving or while you are down something like a car or other vehicle hits you, most of the motoGP accidents you see during races will be a rider going down and sliding across the track or in the gravel - very safe as there is nothing to hit (this is why motocross riders experience more injuries eventhough the speeds are a lot less, you do see the odd broken finger or collar bone or strain injury where a rider might get highsided (thrown onto the air) and slamed into the ground, We all know of the recent MotoGP rider that lost his life last season, his accident was caused by a freak collision with another bike and in fact it was so traumatic that his Helmet was ripped from his head.

At low speed you reduce the risk of hitting something while you are sliding along the ground but the risk increases in towns and cities as there are more things to hit, accidents in pattaya where a bike rider has been seriously injured have either involved other vehicles or where the rider has hit something usually not wearing a helmet - would a helmet have saved many of these - hard to say but it certaintly would have improved their chances

I sort of get what you are saying here and trying to make sense of it. You are saying someon falling over drunk is the same as coming off a motor bike. If all variables were the same meaning the object you are going to hit and the direction you hit then this would go against Newtons second Law of motion. Applied force equals mass by acceleration, so my mass would remain the same but the acceleration I have hitting the road from a motorcycle is far hagher than falling over therefore the applied force is higher causing more damage to my head.

from a posted article

quote.....

the vast majority of head impacts occur when

the rider falls off his bike and simply hits his head on the flat road surface.

The biggest impact in a given crash will typically happen on that first

contact, and the energy is proportional to the height from which the rider

falls—not his forward speed at the time. A big highside may give a rider

some extra altitude, but rarely higher than 8 feet. A high-speed crash may

involve a lot of sliding along the ground, but this is not particularly

challenging to a helmeted head

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object...

[BigBikeBKK]

If there is a law saying you have to wear a helmet than you have to do so. Pretty easy. And if you continue to break the law than at some point you should lose your driving license for a while. And at some point you should lose it forever. Very easy. And very effective in many countries all over the world

Welcome to Thailand- you make a number of assumptions that run counter to the facts of life here in the Land of Smile.

First, traffic laws in Thailand are randomly enforced at best, and the penalty for non-compliance is rarely a fine and more often a small bribe. This is why you see so many folks carrying a helmet on their arm or in the basket of their scooter, which they put on if there's a police checkpoint, and promptly remove once past said checkpoint. The helmet is not worn to protect one's head, rather to protect one's wallet

Some years ago I read an article that stated that less than half of Thai motorists possessed a valid drivers license. I expect more people have their license now, but still a huge percentage of motorists in Thailand are riding or driving without. Many Thais, especially in rural areas simply don't feel a need for a license, since the chances of getting caught are minute and even if caught, a small bribe to their local BiB will send them on their way. So, your idea that people should lose their driving license for repeated traffic offenses in Thailand doesn't make much sense. Do you really think that not having a license if going to stop anyone from riding or driving?

[wantan]

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object...

But this video is against racing on public streets. Its not about wearing helmets. If you crash aginst a concrete pillar or a bus at higher speeds even a helmet will not help you.

If there is a law saying you have to wear a helmet than you have to do so. Pretty easy. And if you continue to break the law than at some point you should lose your driving license for a while. And at some point you should lose it forever. Very easy. And very effective in many countries all over the world

Welcome to Thailand- you make a number of assumptions that run counter to the facts of life here in the Land of Smile.

First, traffic laws in Thailand are randomly enforced at best, and the penalty for non-compliance is rarely a fine and more often a small bribe. This is why you see so many folks carrying a helmet on their arm or in the basket of their scooter, which they put on if there's a police checkpoint, and promptly remove once past said checkpoint. The helmet is not worn to protect one's head, rather to protect one's wallet

Some years ago I read an article that stated that less than half of Thai motorists possessed a valid drivers license. I expect more people have their license now, but still a huge percentage of motorists in Thailand are riding or driving without. Many Thais, especially in rural areas simply don't feel a need for a license, since the chances of getting caught are minute and even if caught, a small bribe to their local BiB will send them on their way. So, your idea that people should lose their driving license for repeated traffic offenses in Thailand doesn't make much sense. Do you really think that not having a license if going to stop anyone from riding or driving?

I know LOS for a long time and also stay here long enough to know the country and habits of people. But i am also concerned about what is best for the country and what is best for the people. It seems that you are more interested in your daily fun and just fear someone could disturb your rides.

What happens in your home country if you continue to ride without license? In many countries people even go into prison if they do not stop driving without license. A law is a law and has to be complied with in most parts of the world. If government thinks different then they should get rid of the helmet law. But making laws and not enforcing them is a joke. And it is sure not the best for the people. It raises confusion, endangers people and makes the whole law and justice useless.

Yes, helmet law is not the only law that doesn't get enforced properly . But this thread is about wearing helmets. So please stay on topic.

[smedly]

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object..

many posts I have made on this forum have some reference to the nature of having an accident on a public road as opposed to on a track, your gear will save you from road rash and your Helmet will save you from a small impact but hit anything hard and solid at a speed over 30kmph and you are in big trouble no matter what you are wearing, read the PDF file posted earlier about accident stats - very good article

[bristolgeoff]

i wear a helmet 50 percent of the time,i know it can happen anytime,but it is my choice

[bristolgeoff]

i wear a helmet 50 percent of the time,i know it can happen anytime,but it is my choice

[BigBikeBKK]

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object...

But this video is against racing on public streets. Its not about wearing helmets. If you crash aginst a concrete pillar or a bus at higher speeds even a helmet will not help you.

Actually I'd argue that this video IS about wearing helmets and pointing out that even FULL GEAR won't save your life if you ride recklessly on public streets. There's a danger when a rider thinks that their gear will make them invincible.

If there is a law saying you have to wear a helmet than you have to do so. Pretty easy. And if you continue to break the law than at some point you should lose your driving license for a while. And at some point you should lose it forever. Very easy. And very effective in many countries all over the world

Welcome to Thailand- you make a number of assumptions that run counter to the facts of life here in the Land of Smile.

First, traffic laws in Thailand are randomly enforced at best, and the penalty for non-compliance is rarely a fine and more often a small bribe. This is why you see so many folks carrying a helmet on their arm or in the basket of their scooter, which they put on if there's a police checkpoint, and promptly remove once past said checkpoint. The helmet is not worn to protect one's head, rather to protect one's wallet

Some years ago I read an article that stated that less than half of Thai motorists possessed a valid drivers license. I expect more people have their license now, but still a huge percentage of motorists in Thailand are riding or driving without. Many Thais, especially in rural areas simply don't feel a need for a license, since the chances of getting caught are minute and even if caught, a small bribe to their local BiB will send them on their way. So, your idea that people should lose their driving license for repeated traffic offenses in Thailand doesn't make much sense. Do you really think that not having a license if going to stop anyone from riding or driving?

I know LOS for a long time and also stay here long enough to know the country and habits of people. But i am also concerned about what is best for the country and what is best for the people. It seems that you are more interested in your daily fun and just fear someone could disturb your rides.

What happens in your home country if you continue to ride without license? In many countries people even go into prison if they do not stop driving without license. A law is a law and has to be complied with in most parts of the world. If government thinks different then they should get rid of the helmet law. But making laws and not enforcing them is a joke. And it is sure not the best for the people. It raises confusion, endangers people and makes the whole law and justice useless.

Yes, helmet law is not the only law that doesn't get enforced properly . But this thread is about wearing helmets. So please stay on topic.

"making laws and not enforcing them is a joke"

Yep! Gotta love Thailand! Laughing my arse off every day!

Everyone with half a brain cell knows that wearing a helmet is a good idea. Some choose to wear one, others choose not to. If someone gets their head caved in because they CHOOSE not to wear a helmet, well, Som Nam Na and life goes on.

While it's an interesting topic to debate, at the end of the day our OPINIONS on this forum don't count for <deleted> here since we're not Thai.

I wear a helmet 99% of the time but from time to time it's nice to roll without one. If I get killed as a result I will have no one to blame but myself.

Live to Ride, Ride to Live!

T

[BigBikeBKK]

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object..

many posts I have made on this forum have some reference to the nature of having an accident on a public road as opposed to on a track, your gear will save you from road rash and your Helmet will save you from a small impact but hit anything hard and solid at a speed over 30kmph and you are in big trouble no matter what you are wearing, read the PDF file posted earlier about accident stats - very good article

I was just responding to your quote which spoke only of an initial impact and then sliding, which completely ignores the risk of hitting something during the slide:

"

the vast majority of head impacts occur when

the rider falls off his bike and simply hits his head on the flat road surface.

The biggest impact in a given crash will typically happen on that first

contact, and the energy is proportional to the height from which the rider

falls—not his forward speed at the time. A big highside may give a rider

some extra altitude, but rarely higher than 8 feet. A high-speed crash may

involve a lot of sliding along the ground, but this is not particularly

challenging to a helmeted head

"

[wantan]

Tony (BBBkk), we all know that your interest is not in serious discussing such things. And your posts prove that you have not read the last pages of this thread. Why do you not just leave such threads if you have nothing to say?

[BigBikeBKK]

Tony (BBBkk), we all know that your interest is not in serious discussing such things. And your posts prove that you have not read the last pages of this thread. Why do you not just leave such threads if you have nothing to say?

Please try to stay on topic if you can- this thread is about helmet use, in case you forgot.

You don't read so well- I made my position clear-

I wear a helmet 99% of the time but from time to time it's nice to roll without one. If I get killed as a result I will have no one to blame but myself.

Live to Ride, Ride to Live!

T

[loserlazer]

Do you ever ride without a helmet ? : what a stupid thread this is.

Is it really that important? What will this thread add your biking knowledge?

I really do not wonder who rode without any helmet before. Every biker at least once or twice rode without any helmet in their lives and we are all responsible for our own heads.

Oh man.

[transam]

Do you ever ride without a helmet ? : what a stupid thread this is.

Is it really that important? What will this thread add your biking knowledge?

I really do not wonder who rode without any helmet before. Every biker at least once or twice rode without any helmet in their lives and we are all responsible for our own heads.

Oh man.

I did in the 1960's, but l was invincible then.

[smedly]

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object..

many posts I have made on this forum have some reference to the nature of having an accident on a public road as opposed to on a track, your gear will save you from road rash and your Helmet will save you from a small impact but hit anything hard and solid at a speed over 30kmph and you are in big trouble no matter what you are wearing, read the PDF file posted earlier about accident stats - very good article

I was just responding to your quote which spoke only of an initial impact and then sliding, which completely ignores the risk of hitting something during the slide:

"

the vast majority of head impacts occur when

the rider falls off his bike and simply hits his head on the flat road surface.

The biggest impact in a given crash will typically happen on that first

contact, and the energy is proportional to the height from which the rider

falls—not his forward speed at the time. A big highside may give a rider

some extra altitude, but rarely higher than 8 feet. A high-speed crash may

involve a lot of sliding along the ground, but this is not particularly

challenging to a helmeted head

"

mate you obviously have not read many of the posts I have made both on this thread and others on the subject

on another note the link below is not strictly related to this thread but shows the damage that can be caused when one not so solid vehicle comes in contact with one that is........be warned although not gruesume in any way it is quite shocking

http://rmirror.net/r/videos/comments/q5hu9/car_accident_nsfl/

[Kwasaki]

Except that on public roads a high speed crash usually doesn't end with you simply sliding to a stop.

Your slide is likely to be stopped by an immovable object..

many posts I have made on this forum have some reference to the nature of having an accident on a public road as opposed to on a track, your gear will save you from road rash and your Helmet will save you from a small impact but hit anything hard and solid at a speed over 30kmph and you are in big trouble no matter what you are wearing, read the PDF file posted earlier about accident stats - very good article

I was just responding to your quote which spoke only of an initial impact and then sliding, which completely ignores the risk of hitting something during the slide:

"

the vast majority of head impacts occur when

the rider falls off his bike and simply hits his head on the flat road surface.

The biggest impact in a given crash will typically happen on that first

contact, and the energy is proportional to the height from which the rider

falls—not his forward speed at the time. A big highside may give a rider

some extra altitude, but rarely higher than 8 feet. A high-speed crash may

involve a lot of sliding along the ground, but this is not particularly

challenging to a helmeted head

"

mate you obviously have not read many of the posts I have made both on this thread and others on the subject

on another note the link below is not strictly related to this thread but shows the damage that can be caused when one not so solid vehicle comes in contact with one that is........be warned although not gruesume in any way it is quite shocking

http://rmirror.net/r..._accident_nsfl/

Do your ever ride without a helmet in Thailand.

" mate you obviously have not read many of the posts " You have really lost the plot, that didn't look like Thailand to me and not really any relation to the road condition here in Thailand, it is pretty obvious what the problem was that caused that accident.

Your problem is that you think you know it all because your older than bbbkk, and your inability to understand younger bike riders in Thailand stands out a mile, you do not know what training he has had and from his video's your can seen he has a high level of experience, cut some slack and maybe you will make some friends here eh !!. K

[smedly]

Kwasaki

eh' I don't know it all and don't imply that I do, I stated the link was unrelated to this thread - wind your neck in a little it's obstructing your fingers, I don't know Tony or you only from what I have read here - enjoy your bike riding and be safe, having a personal go at me is not really constructive, we all have opinions about many things, I don't have time for people who get personal on these forums, if you have something to contribute then please do so and argue your point - otherwise...........