Asia's Endangered Species: The Expat

[Bakseedaa]

Accurate article. I have been trying for eons to get a transfer to Singapore. The position is "easily" filled by a local. Perhaps, not as experienced or skilled as me, but I know the personnel are qualified and good at what they do. I can't complain as it is a fair policy, and cost effective too. In Asia, the locals want to deal with a local not a foreigner. The acceptance of foreigners in these positions has been on the wane for some years and is much different than the Australian, EU and Canadian openness. (I left out the USA as the acceptance of "forrinners" makes Thailand's position seem welcoming.)

The article is focusing on skilled expat labour. The expat beer bar operators/pimps hair dresser/massage/laundry investors need never worry because their positions are safe. As long as they continue to mary Thailand's undesirables and to piss their money away on such foolish ventures, they will always be welcome.

What a boring life you must lead..... suicide is painless...

[rubl]

My neighbor manages a very large factory here. He said the top 3 layers use to be all expats. It's now down to 2 layers and they are trying to get it to just the top boss. Big changes over the past 10 years according to him.

Exactly.However my experience this has been a developing process for nearly twenty years, with a possible exception being the Japanese investment community where several layers of expatriate management can still be found.The old style expatriate package I enjoyed thirty years ago has all but disappeared save for a few very highly placed individuals.

My experience only goes back to around 1995. From a company with a few levels of expats starting with the Country Manager (of course ) I'm now in 'more-or-less' the same company with three/four non-Thais, all in technical, non-hierarchical functions, myself included. I must admit me being a non-hierarchical technical expert is probably the only reason I'm still here. My 'very nice expat package' got adapted though, to a level I accept as 'reasonable' compared to my value to the company. No offence, but a week ago when finally called when others were puzzling for days and on-site I solve a problem within FIVE minutes I think I've justified once more my non-Thai level salary.

Edited April 1, 2012 by rubl

[TheyCallmeScooter]

When they say "Asia" they are 90% correct. Most Asian countries can speak English fairly good where Thailand falls WAY behind in that. Most asian countries I have worked in I can communicate in English with the Engineers, office staff right down to Reception and even some cleaners where in Thailand I could only communicate with 50% of the Engineers in English and any staff below them could speak or understand NO English at all.

In 2015 when ASEAN is in place Thailand doesn't stand a chance because of their lack of the English language. Sad but true.

It certainly looks that way but Thailand's going to be 'okay'.

We (as in the 7 billion humans who share membership of this inhumane humanity) aren't speaking thousands of dialects by accident. Technology caught our ranchers napping briefly, but they are not going to let us all start talking to each other. Heaven forbid, we might find out that those who would 'comfort' or 'protect' us, first had to make us all afraid.

The ranchers are wide awake now, and the signs are everywhere. Westphalia isn't going anywhere any time soon. They still need us more than we could ever imagine we need them, and that's very unfortunate for everyone. Especially them. Warlords have less fun than you'd assume, based on how they fight over the right to control us.

They are panicked now and English isn't going to save the world. They won't allow it. It's just as 'well' for Thais as if this was a sane world, the way they've been manipulated into failing to act in their own best interests has been incomparable.

Of course if this was a sane world; we wouldn't be ruled by religious warlords and kept terrified and ignorant enough to fear, and fight, and ignore our DNA saying to each of us, "Hey. Is all this violence and conflict and lost Opportunity really in our best interests?"

A. It's not. Nationalists are 'confused'. They confused Thailand pretty good.

In 2015 when ASEAN is in place Thailand doesn't stand a chance because of their lack of the English language. Sad but true.

The people that are building the hotels in Pattaya know this.

Are you being delightfully insightful? Though I suppose it won't be that delightful for the native Thai-speakers who will be the reason those hotels fill.

"As long as they continue to mary Thailand's undesirables "

What an amazing sweeping statement.

I thought the same, I admit. But as I'm prevented from making quite that 'convincing' a counter-argument and being satisfied, I tried to counter and failed. I can't help but wonder whether we both might have been wrong, at first blush? Which would suggest the sweeping statement sweeps truly?

[TheyCallmeScooter]

The driving need to learn English in schools rather than other subjects such as math science history social studies will in the end deprive the students of every day living skills. It will turnout millions of students who have no need for English and really haven't learned it any how. Those who are inspired will find a way to learn it.

I think the idea is that, either the world is going to learn Thai...or Thailand can act in their own best interests and step into the future. If they did, what you suggest will happen obviously...couldn't.

Those who trust the state with matters like this, had parents who trusted the state too. The French are getting played in that way, the way you imagine the Thais will be. But that's not learning English! What the French do is insane. The definition of sanity is acting in your own interests. Everything else is nuts.

You wouldn't leave something as important as your child's education and future prospects to the schools; because they are staffed by those who cannot do. And shouldn't really be promoted to teach, for that reason.

Why if you do something like that your kids could end up working the blunt end of the world's brothel. Theoretically....

Posted with Thaivisa App http://apps.thaivisa.com

Posted with Thaivisa App http://apps.thaivisa.com

[GentlemanJim]

I don't believe this is news at all. !00% guaranteed this is commissioned editorial paid for by Spencer Stuart and Korn/Ferry International. It is so obvious I cannot understand why it has been put in News.

I read the article first in the Wall Street Journal.

http://online.wsj.co...0300265926.html

You mean they conned them too?

No I don't mean that at all or I would have said it. Commissioned editorial is a perfectly normal practice, a way of advertising without an advert. The people who want to push their name and services get the article written and then pay to have it printed in the newspaper. It looks like the newspaper is endorsing them but they have just written it themselves for commercial gain. It isn't news it is a paid for advert, however interesting it may be.

[Misterwhisper]

I'd like to replace my maid with a leggy, tall, blonde Ukrainian Expat maid who will work for the same amount of salary. Qualifications are: being able to change a light bulb without having to bother the employer; avoiding letting the water run for half an hour for no reason; telling the employer that the washing detergent is empty before it's actually empty; letting the employer know that you're off for 4 days because you have to attend the cremation of someone close before actually taking off.

[Microwave]

I fall under category 2 i.e. the foreigner with MUCH experience in Asia, and I can speak both Thai and Mandarin Chinese. I've spent almost 2/3 of my life living and working in Asia and have seen a huge drop-off in expats employed by western multinationals since I began working in Asia in the early 1980's.

My employer has learned that not all Asian nationalities get along with one another (I could have told them that). Therefore a position with regional Asian responsibilities can sometimes be staffed best by an outsider such as myself who doesn't have the stigma of being from one Asian nation or another. I "blend" much better in Asia than I do in my home country of Canada due to my professional experience being almost completely in various Asian countries. Additionally, I'm not one to job-hop as the category 1 type of individual may be prone to do (as suggested by the original article).

[Sing_Sling]

15 years as an (overpaid) expat in Asia with US IT multi-nationals . . . and our days are numbered - and so they should be. We are fooling ourselves if we think we can do it better than any locals, typifying some people's post-colonial mindset . . .

Yes, there are instances where one of 'us' could figure out a problem in five minutes that had the locals stumped, but how often does that happen? Added to which, in this age of tele-conferencing, off-site systems analysis etc... 'we' may still do the clean-up, but do it from the confines of our HQ cubicles in San Jose, London or Munich.

The main difference I can find now is that ten years ago the distributors' clients would see it as a bonus to see a manufacturer's techies come to see them along with their local parties . . . now, it is seen as the locals not being qualified - ergo sum = a no-no.

The Japanese are different, they still have their three-tier expat system in place.

I met the Malaysian Siemens Chief the other day - an India-born Indian who is quite an impressive man, in terms of his knowledge and the way he commands a room.

Siemens is on a good thing, a smart thing.

I don't believe this is news at all. !00% guaranteed this is commissioned editorial paid for by Spencer Stuart and Korn/Ferry International. It is so obvious I cannot understand why it has been put in News.

I read the article first in the Wall Street Journal.

http://online.wsj.co...0300265926.html

You mean they conned them too?

No I don't mean that at all or I would have said it. Commissioned editorial is a perfectly normal practice, a way of advertising without an advert. The people who want to push their name and services get the article written and then pay to have it printed in the newspaper. It looks like the newspaper is endorsing them but they have just written it themselves for commercial gain. It isn't news it is a paid for advert, however interesting it may be.

You're saying this is the case here?

[kerryk]

15 years as an (overpaid) expat in Asia with US IT multi-nationals . . . and our days are numbered - and so they should be. We are fooling ourselves if we think we can do it better than any locals, typifying some people's post-colonial mindset . . .

Yes, there are instances where one of 'us' could figure out a problem in five minutes that had the locals stumped, but how often does that happen? Added to which, in this age of tele-conferencing, off-site systems analysis etc... 'we' may still do the clean-up, but do it from the confines of our HQ cubicles in San Jose, London or Munich.

The main difference I can find now is that ten years ago the distributors' clients would see it as a bonus to see a manufacturer's techies come to see them along with their local parties . . . now, it is seen as the locals not being qualified - ergo sum = a no-no.

The Japanese are different, they still have their three-tier expat system in place.

I met the Malaysian Siemens Chief the other day - an India-born Indian who is quite an impressive man, in terms of his knowledge and the way he commands a room.

Siemens is on a good thing, a smart thing.

I don't believe this is news at all. !00% guaranteed this is commissioned editorial paid for by Spencer Stuart and Korn/Ferry International. It is so obvious I cannot understand why it has been put in News.

I read the article first in the Wall Street Journal.

http://online.wsj.co...0300265926.html

You mean they conned them too?

No I don't mean that at all or I would have said it. Commissioned editorial is a perfectly normal practice, a way of advertising without an advert. The people who want to push their name and services get the article written and then pay to have it printed in the newspaper. It looks like the newspaper is endorsing them but they have just written it themselves for commercial gain. It isn't news it is a paid for advert, however interesting it may be.

You're saying this is the case here?

I don't think Jim is going to answer you. Because you are right and he is not. But I do have a question. What is the Japanese three tier system?

[thaihome]

I too am a 15 year [overpaid] full package Asian O&G non-technical expat having worked in some 6 different countries. In my wake I have left local workers that could do my job after I left. The only thing they all lacked was a big picture sort of view that can only come from have spent 3 years in corporate HQ before coming to Asia. But than most of my peers back in US lack that experience and view as well, so it probably makes little difference.

I was told when I first came out here that my primary job was to train a local to take my place. I have diligently followed that direction as best I could, waiting for the day when I would be told I was no longer needed. 15 years on, I’m still waiting.

The funny thing is there is a very good likelihood that I will be going to Australia next to train those locals. I have heard they are much worse than Thais to train as there is an inherent lazy streak and their English sucks, is that true?

TH