Where I Can Buy Solar Cells In Thailand?

[electau]

This is how a grid tied system operates. This is one type of billing system.

The solar PV array is connected to the inverter and then to a digital meter with a microprocessor which calculates the kWh input from the grid, the kWh supplied to the installation during harvesting hours, generally 8 to 4 pm, and the excess supplied to the grid, which is charged at the feed in tarriff rate.

Example, 6 hour harvesting period, 4 kWh useage during this period. If the solar array is 1.6kW providing there is 100% output you will use 4kWh and supply 5.6kWh to the grid. If your daily consumption of power is 18kWh you will be supplying 5.6kWh to the grid, 4 kWh from the solar array and you would be charged for 8.4kWh by the electricity distributor, you would also receive a credit of 5.6kWh at the feed in tarriff itemised on your account.

Your savings are 4kWh a day plus the 5.6kWh supplied to the grid.

In practice this may be 90% full output and of this 65 to 70% will may be the actual output depending on sunlight availability, cloud cover and periods of heavy rain during the billing period.

For safety reasons the inverter must shut down when the grid supply is not available.

PV panels are generally rated at 200W with a voltage of 35VDC and are about 1600mm x 800 x 50mm.each.

There is generally a max PV array size for domestic individual residential use eg, 5kW.

　

Edited July 10, 2012 by electau

[sirineou]

In Thailand selling power back to the Utility company is not a viable option yet. I know it is available at some places but as I understand it , only to a limited number customers, and that number is full.

Most places we have trouble getting a straight read in our regular meter, never mind feeding back to the grid and getting credit for it.

At this point in Thailand, the grid tie option is so that you can fave power from the grid when the PV is not suppliying adequate power, such as when at night or rainy days.

[electau]

In Thailand selling power back to the Utility company is not a viable option yet. I know it is available at some places but as I understand it , only to a limited number customers, and that number is full.

Most places we have trouble getting a straight read in our regular meter, never mind feeding back to the grid and getting credit for it.

At this point in Thailand, the grid tie option is so that you can fave power from the grid when the PV is not suppliying adequate power, such as when at night or rainy days.

You are quite correct on that point.

The feed in tarriff only applies to excess kWhs supplied to the grid, not what you use from the solar PV array.

　

[tig28]

Solar powered aircon are really available in thailand? I think is really expensive?

Regards

Thomas

Hi Thomas

Yes they are -- check here:

http://www.saveenergyasia.com/products/solaraircon.html

[electau]

Using solar assisted airconditioning with thermal panels will reduce your consumption of electricity in kWh. So will thermal panels for storage type water heaters.

[Schuimpge]

I'm looking around for as much info I can get, renovating a new house next to my old one.

Since we are exactly at the East West axis, I'm planning to install panels on the roof.

Just a steel frame, horizontal, to lay down all the panels that can fit.

Electric will be 100% replaced with "proper European standards' work.

Main cost: batteries.

Good thing: My company recycles electronics, so lots of UPS's and other things that we get in.

Recently dismantled a Server Room including a large Battery backup room with 48 pieces of 2v batteries.

Each of them about 75kg, so no little ones that where used to backup around 50 racks of servers and other equipment.

Panels are getting cheaper. Or maybe I should say: you get more Wattage for the same price!

Cost-effective? Well, I'm running a lot of pumps and lights for my fish-tanks and due to the fact that I replaced and properly installed electric in my old one as well, it will be very easy to change groups from 220V to 12V or 24 V from the PV-installation or put an inverter in to supply 220V to all PV-connected outlets.

Aircons will be a different matter. I went to Amorn in Zeer Rangsit (Basement), where they have indeed every bit and piece of equipment you'd need. One of the guys (they are quite good on the technical / installation details), told me that at least 7 panels at 220W are necessary to power 1 aircon-unit. Batteries will be a monster, but it can be done.

Now, last...to calculate your requirements and to get estimates on the cost, try this website:

http://www.leonics.com/support/article2_12j/articles2_12j_en.php

Incredible detailed information to use for your first idea on cost and viability of your project.

Look forward to read more replies from other people on TV.

[Morakot]

that said, if you do succeed, i for one would be ecstatic to hear of your experience and perhaps benefit from it.

I would like to hear your experience too.

[Morakot]

An inverter compressor is using an AC motor. The input AC is converted to DC and then again converted to AC at different frequences to adjust the compressor speed.

Panasonic has introduced a model with a variable speed DC compressor (voltage triggered speed) to avoid the energy loss of converting AC/DC back and forth which can be as high as 6-8%. but i have no idea whether it would work without a storage (battery) buffer. whatever, as far as the OP is concerned any discussion is purely academic although quite interesting.

Would a capacitor work instead of batteries, hypothetically?

[Crossy]

Would a capacitor work instead of batteries, hypothetically?

Yes, but it would probably end up being the size of a small planet

[phl]

do not know if its been said yet, but have seen different sizes for sale in Amorn(Tuk Com) Pattaya.

they might have some technicians able to install

[Schuimpge]

do not know if its been said yet, but have seen different sizes for sale in Amorn(Tuk Com) Pattaya.

they might have some technicians able to install

For Amorn in Zeer Rangsit, the shop is dedicated to Solar Power equipment only. From Lights, inverters and batteries to panels, pumps and charge-controllers...Everything you might need.

[hopdafru]

Wow... yes PV can be a bit complex as there are many applications and ways of going about it.

I just 'installed' solar at home, it cost me $200 for:

1 used 120w solar panel

1 used 20 amp controller (240Watt @ 12Volt, 480W @ 24V)

1 new gel / deep cycle battery 50Amp Hour

This is a tiny system but In my case, when the power goes down (which it does several times a week), I have light on the patio and/or a working fan, really nice when it's Hot! (and it works several hours, enough to survive the blackout...)

Also, it powers my 50W pump + AirPump for my Aquaponics so the fish and plants stay happy!

I'm planning on running a dehumidifier / water evaporation cooling unit or a DC air con with solar hyper-heating device in the near future, depending on what's available at what price.

Re. cost, unless you get a great deal on panels ($3-20 per max watt, ie full sun) and especially gel batteries ($2 per amp-hour), it's still expensive and given the low prices of electricity here probably not economically viable (in Germany the KWh buy back price is 17 euro-cents I think, about $0.25)

Do consider though that prices are dropping very fast, flexible panels / thin film (which don't brake during transport and weigh considerably less than poly/mono glass panels) now cost $0.51 per watt (if you buy several kw...) - worth looking at... (even if they are only half as efficient as poly/mono but hey you'll add shade to your roof and reduce the dam_n heating of your house - and you just have to 'paste' them on the roof, just like like a sticker!)

http://www.solarserv...CFYtV4godACYA1g

Edited September 9, 2012 by hopdafru

[sunee7777]

I use a grid tie system with 8 X 275 watt mono panels & a Fronious 2kw inverter. Installation is a piece of cake, mounting the panels might be the only difficulty depending on your roof. The panels cost 150,000 from the ABO guy in Chiang Mai 12 months ago, the inverter cost 15,000 on ebay. This is quality gear with a life expectancy of over 25 years so avoid cheap gear. Most of the day I'm producing around 1,700 watts this has halfed my electric bill & should drop to zero when I add a few more panels, I have 1 or 2 air conditioners running all day & night. Try to reduce your consumption using LED lighting & efficient inverter air cons & you should be fine. The ABO guy was very helpful. It's best to use a grid tie inverter as batteries are expensive & hassle.

[Crossy]

I've noticed that the Amorn outlet in Zeer now has a shop selling LED lighting, inverters (didn't see any grid-tie mind) and solar panels of various sizes, IIRC 120W panels are 10k each or 2 for 17k, possibly bigger discounts for greater quantity.

Probably stick a few panels on the roof of the car-port when it gets built.

[MauroHKT]

I use a grid tie system with 8 X 275 watt mono panels & a Fronious 2kw inverter. Installation is a piece of cake, mounting the panels might be the only difficulty depending on your roof. The panels cost 150,000 from the ABO guy in Chiang Mai 12 months ago, the inverter cost 15,000 on ebay. This is quality gear with a life expectancy of over 25 years so avoid cheap gear. Most of the day I'm producing around 1,700 watts this has halfed my electric bill & should drop to zero when I add a few more panels, I have 1 or 2 air conditioners running all day & night. Try to reduce your consumption using LED lighting & efficient inverter air cons & you should be fine. The ABO guy was very helpful. It's best to use a grid tie inverter as batteries are expensive & hassle.

Just a question:

I assume that you don't have a contract with ppea to sell back electricity, right ???

In case your system is producing 1,700 W per day and now one in your house using power, the meter will run backward ???

I have the thai standard 3 phase 220V meter (not the digital one that you can find in Europe or America).

In this case if you feed a bit less than your monthly consumption nobody will know about your grid tie system....

Or I'm wrong ?

thank's for clarification

[Naam]

I use a grid tie system with 8 X 275 watt mono panels & a Fronious 2kw inverter. Installation is a piece of cake, mounting the panels might be the only difficulty depending on your roof. The panels cost 150,000 from the ABO guy in Chiang Mai 12 months ago, the inverter cost 15,000 on ebay. This is quality gear with a life expectancy of over 25 years so avoid cheap gear. Most of the day I'm producing around 1,700 watts this has halfed my electric bill & should drop to zero when I add a few more panels, I have 1 or 2 air conditioners running all day & night. Try to reduce your consumption using LED lighting & efficient inverter air cons & you should be fine. The ABO guy was very helpful. It's best to use a grid tie inverter as batteries are expensive & hassle.

tell me again the story of running 2 aircons via photovoltaic panels and a 2kW inverter. on a slow day like today i like interesting diversions and jokes (like yours)

[sunee7777]

I use a grid tie system with 8 X 275 watt mono panels & a Fronious 2kw inverter. Installation is a piece of cake, mounting the panels might be the only difficulty depending on your roof. The panels cost 150,000 from the ABO guy in Chiang Mai 12 months ago, the inverter cost 15,000 on ebay. This is quality gear with a life expectancy of over 25 years so avoid cheap gear. Most of the day I'm producing around 1,700 watts this has halfed my electric bill & should drop to zero when I add a few more panels, I have 1 or 2 air conditioners running all day & night. Try to reduce your consumption using LED lighting & efficient inverter air cons & you should be fine. The ABO guy was very helpful. It's best to use a grid tie inverter as batteries are expensive & hassle.

Just a question:

I assume that you don't have a contract with ppea to sell back electricity, right ???

In case your system is producing 1,700 W per day and now one in your house using power, the meter will run backward ???

I have the thai standard 3 phase 220V meter (not the digital one that you can find in Europe or America).

In this case if you feed a bit less than your monthly consumption nobody will know about your grid tie system....

Or I'm wrong ?

thank's for clarification

[sunee7777]

Yes if you produce more than you consume the meter would reverse including a standard 3 phase meter eliminating any need for batterys. I have seen my meter count down but most of the time I use in excess so I just have a reduced bill. Hopefully this will answere the joker NAAM comment, I never said 1.7kw was enough to run 2 air conditioners full time but it gets close on a sunny day using ultra efficient low power inverter air conditioners. I'm just trying to give helpfull info here & have no need for idiots like him. The Pana PS9MKT air cons that I use typicaly use less than 700w so if you are not capable of simple maths maybe it's bettyer if you stay out of this debate NAAM.

[hopdafru]

I use a grid tie system with 8 X 275 watt mono panels & a Fronious 2kw inverter. Installation is a piece of cake, mounting the panels might be the only difficulty depending on your roof. The panels cost 150,000 from the ABO guy in Chiang Mai 12 months ago, the inverter cost 15,000 on ebay. This is quality gear with a life expectancy of over 25 years so avoid cheap gear. Most of the day I'm producing around 1,700 watts this has halfed my electric bill & should drop to zero when I add a few more panels, I have 1 or 2 air conditioners running all day & night. Try to reduce your consumption using LED lighting & efficient inverter air cons & you should be fine. The ABO guy was very helpful. It's best to use a grid tie inverter as batteries are expensive & hassle.

Hi Sunee,

Thanks for the useful info, some comments on this thread do show that there is a lack of knowledge re. PV systems, and perhaps unrealistic expectations as well - PV indeed has various applications depending on ones needs, whether on/off grid or for people going camping etc.

Your Fronious inverter is indeed one of the best pieces of PV equipment out there, if you ever decide to go beyond the 2KW barrier, I'll be interested in buying it from you; let me know if /when that happens.

If you have a name/contact for ABO I'm interested as well, I'm having trouble getting a hold of quality panels here (in Laos) at a fair price ('broken' panels though are easy to get, great for camping / small application). Your advice re. avoiding the cheap stuff is spot on, the electronics used for inverters/controllers play an important role in maximizing power output / charging batteries / getting clean electricity etc.

@ MauroHKT: Sunee's system produces about 1700W per hour, not per day. It's like the difference between making $1700 per hour or per day... not the same thing! ;-)

FYI, this corresponds to about 15amps @ 220Volt and roughly 150amps @12 volts - his PV system probably runs at 24/48/96 volts DC to avoid high currents burning the cables.

Being grid-tied is really smart as one can then take a hot shower while the AC is running without shutting down the system, using more that a few KW at the same time is rare for almost everyone, but is sometimes needed (int the morning for example: hot water for coffee, hot shower, AC etc). The 'grid-tie sell back' system isn't much of an issue here in SEA unless the power company buys your extra KW back at a high price as in Germany ($0.20+ /KWh) - here in laos the first 25kwh cost 4THB each - it would take centuries to recoup the price of the extra solar panels... and it could be dangerous / illegal.

@naam Using A/C with 'inverter' technology, ie DC compressor turning at slow speed while not cooling (the compressor doesn't turn on/off all the time) is much more efficient and although more expensive to buy, they last longer and consume much less... 700w+ sounds about right for a 9000 BTU. There are also add-ons which enable the coolant to be super heated by the sun, making the cooling process even more efficient.

Look around / educate yourself before dismissing such interesting information for TV users as a 'joke'. We really don't need any more 'disinformation', there's enough of it out there already! - probably an honest 'mistake' though...

Sokh Dee Der...

Edited September 12, 2012 by hopdafru

[Crossy]

I suspect Naam mis-read the post regarding sunee having a grid-tie system. He's usually pretty switched on on the matter of aircon

Whether an off-grid system of the same size would actually start a 9000 BTU aircon is debatable as even inverter units have a significant start surge.

[Naam]

@naam Using A/C with 'inverter' technology, ie DC compressor turning at slow speed while not cooling (the compressor doesn't turn on/off all the time) is much more efficient and although more expensive to buy, they last longer and consume much less... 700w+ sounds about right for a 9000 BTU. There are also add-ons which enable the coolant to be super heated by the sun, making the cooling process even more efficient.

-the OP mentioned two aircon units. he didn't say anything about 9,000btu/h nor inverter.

-comment on super heated refrigerant which makes the cooling process more efficient... that would be a combination of compressor/absorption cooling which cannot be combined.

splitting hairs based on assumptions is not very helpful.

[Naam]

Yes if you produce more than you consume the meter would reverse including a standard 3 phase meter eliminating any need for batterys. I have seen my meter count down but most of the time I use in excess so I just have a reduced bill. Hopefully this will answere the joker NAAM comment, I never said 1.7kw was enough to run 2 air conditioners full time but it gets close on a sunny day using ultra efficient low power inverter air conditioners. I'm just trying to give helpfull info here & have no need for idiots like him. The Pana PS9MKT air cons that I use typicaly use less than 700w so if you are not capable of simple maths maybe it's bettyer if you stay out of this debate NAAM.

idiots are those who submit shitty instead of clear information!

[hopdafru]

I suspect Naam mis-read the post regarding sunee having a grid-tie system. He's usually pretty switched on on the matter of aircon

Whether an off-grid system of the same size would actually start a 9000 BTU aircon is debatable as even inverter units have a significant start surge.

This is why PV systems have batteries, which can start a car or a truck (big surge here); the possible fail-point is then the controller / inverter (the 'real inverter' which turns DC into AC if the AirCon is an AC unit). If you use DC + a DC compressor, the air-con plugs directly into the battery bank just like a car/truck starter. Has anyone on TV done this?

I'm using a 30amp off-grid system which has a max constant load of 30amp @ 12 or 24Volt (thus providing max 360 or 720 Wh from the controller; more if plugged directly into the battery bank). My main water pump (which gets the stuff 20 meters down) is powered by the PV/Battery system and it works great, although there is a definite surge each time one opens a water valve; using a water tank along with gravity reduces the multiple surge loads.

In my case, this off grid system is separate from the grid and powers 12V lighting, all my electronics, water pump and fans.

Re. Naam's post I was a bit surprised as well having read hundreds over the years ;-)

[hopdafru]

Yes if you produce more than you consume the meter would reverse including a standard 3 phase meter eliminating any need for batterys. I have seen my meter count down but most of the time I use in excess so I just have a reduced bill. Hopefully this will answere the joker NAAM comment, I never said 1.7kw was enough to run 2 air conditioners full time but it gets close on a sunny day using ultra efficient low power inverter air conditioners. I'm just trying to give helpfull info here & have no need for idiots like him. The Pana PS9MKT air cons that I use typicaly use less than 700w so if you are not capable of simple maths maybe it's bettyer if you stay out of this debate NAAM.

idiots are those who submit shitty instead of clear information!

I/Sunee are idiots for posting info on this thread; thank you, as well as everybody else I suppose. Naam: You win, you are the best, wisest etc. and we should really stop providing information about our systems... really, we should just hang'em high and dump our anger/shit on other members instead of asking questions which could be helpful to those interested in the original OP, much more productive...

I shall now remove myself from this thread, I have better things to do.

Sokh Dee

[hopdafru]

@naam Using A/C with 'inverter' technology, ie DC compressor turning at slow speed while not cooling (the compressor doesn't turn on/off all the time) is much more efficient and although more expensive to buy, they last longer and consume much less... 700w+ sounds about right for a 9000 BTU. There are also add-ons which enable the coolant to be super heated by the sun, making the cooling process even more efficient.

-the OP mentioned two aircon units. he didn't say anything about 9,000btu/h nor inverter.

-comment on super heated refrigerant which makes the cooling process more efficient... that would be a combination of compressor/absorption cooling which cannot be combined.

splitting hairs based on assumptions is not very helpful.

Despite the non-encouraging comments and for the sake of properly informing readers of this thread, below are a few examples of 'solar aircon'

http://kingsofgreen.wordpress.com/2010/09/19/principles-of-solar-air-conditioning/

http://www.fafcosolar.com/go-solar/hybrid-solar-air-conditioning/how-hybrid-solar-air-conditioning-works/

http://www.gocleansolarpower.com/aboutsolar.html

For those using google, there are many more.

[sunee7777]

Hi,

Completly agree, naam is a genious, my lifetime spent as an elecrtical engineer has been wasted, teslar also wasted his life striving for nothing that came close to naam.

Please just read through this forum and ask who was providing the information |& who is providing garbage.

I was trying to help people through my own extensive experience in this field & have been ridicululed for no reason. BTW naam could you run that by me again about R410a superheated regrigerant, again amazing.

Totaly bored with his now, if naam has one fault in my comments please respond in a scientific way rather than ignorant BS.

[hopdafru]

In Thailand selling power back to the Utility company is not a viable option yet. I know it is available at some places but as I understand it , only to a limited number customers, and that number is full.

Most places we have trouble getting a straight read in our regular meter, never mind feeding back to the grid and getting credit for it.

At this point in Thailand, the grid tie option is so that you can fave power from the grid when the PV is not suppliying adequate power, such as when at night or rainy days.

Blog below as example of grid tied PV system (in Thailand) making the meter 'turn backwards':

http://whynotsolar.b...0&max-results=2

Edited September 22, 2012 by hopdafru

[Morakot]

Blog below as example of grid tied PV system (in Thailand) making the meter 'turn backwards':

http://whynotsolar.b...0&max-results=2

I wonder what your local electricity authority would say if you feeding back several ten thousand kwh per month, without having a producer contract, as the Phuket example suggests.

Edited September 23, 2012 by Morakot

[stovepipe9999]

Hello There

I'm Phil Im a Railway signalling tester working in Austrailia , Looks like Sunee and Naam know more than me than solar powered cells (and to be honest would not be a great feat) but in Railway Signalling I'm sure I'd win , all the same I respect people that know their stuff and can confirm that you guys do . I've got a simple request for the gurus and that is to attach a couple of solar cells on a hard hat (using velcrove , coz no doubt HSE would say it would destroy the integrity of the hard hat blah blah blah) Do you think that it would be possible to generate 24 volts to give some sort of effective power source to drive a strong enough fan ( as probably seen in the Dyson new fans that are out) to blow a strong enough flow of air down your face (not just to keep cool ) but to keep the flies off your face (that drive me nuts) , also keeping in mind that the sun is unrelentless in NW Austrailia

I'm not trying to re-invent the wheel , just simply trying to think of a way that could benefit me and my mates for practically free , Im in Chiangmai for the next month and welcome any response to tell me yeah or nay

Phil

[electau]

Alternative power supplies. APS.

1. Diesel generator or inverter supplied by batteries. Change over switch required manual or automatic (ATS).

2. Grid connected PV solar array. Permanently conected to the grid. Must have backfeeding protection installed within the inverter.

3. Stand Alone system. May be a generator or an inverter supplied by batteries.

With system 1. The grid supplies power under normal conditions.

With system 2. The grid supplies power in parallel with the inverter while the solar cells are producing energy. In the event of loss of supply on the grid the inverter will NOT generate any output.

With system 3. There is no connection to the grid.

With system 2. The consumer must have a contract with the supply authority and at the present time this is not available (AFAIK) for most consumers in Thailand.