It's Gone Far Beyond Yingluck And Prem: Thai Opinion

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It's gone far beyond Yingluck and Prem

Tulsathit Taptim

Imagine if Sir Alex Ferguson hugged Roberto Mancini wholeheartedly and invited him to dinner.

BANGKOK: -- Fergie could even make Mancini the first name on his will. Or Mancini could kiss Fergie's hand and tearfully declare that the Scotsman was in fact his long-lost father. To go to the extreme, either man could plead on his deathbed for fans of Manchester United and Manchester City to reconcile. Try to imagine anything that either manager of the rival football clubs could possibly do to bring both sets of fans together.

And they would still fail. The reason why is simple: soccer rivalry is not about two men. A city is divided into a blue and a red half, and nothing is going to change that. Of course, it's just a sporting polarity, but that is the whole point. Any politician who believes that two "enemies" meeting can automatically bring peace to a country is delusional. No matter how hard it is to unite rival sports fans, to reconcile politically divided people is much harder.

Polls show that the meeting between Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and Privy Council President Prem Tinsulanonda has made the Thai public happy. Again, the reason why is simple: the Thai public manages to be happy because last Thursday's encounter was about two people. Thais saw polite smiles and beautiful outfits - so, with the exception of some extremists, there was nothing to be unhappy about.

Now, let's imagine Prem telling the public to accept a charter change even though it would absolve Yingluck's big brother. Or imagine the prime minister saying that Thailand's aristocrats only mean well for this country and the red shirts should sympathise with them.

Both Yingluck and Prem would fail. Thailand's political strife may have started at the top, but it can't be patched up from there. Thaksin can embrace Prem and play golf with every Army general who matters, but that will never bring back peace. Whoever is responsible for this political "war" is learning a very important lesson: you can tell people to hate, but you can't simply make a u-turn and tell them to love each other again.

Things are getting increasingly complicated for the Thaksin camp. There is no doubt that Prem is, in the red shirts' eyes, a top representative of Thailand's "aristocrats". But while his meeting with Yingluck is an eyesore to certain red shirts, her paying homage to him is just another straw on the camel's back. The grassroots movement, or some of its factions at least, has been upset before by an administration it supports.

Political downfalls in Thailand can come from reconciliatory gestures. Ask Yingluck's predecessor Abhisit Vejjajiva. In a bid to be seen as "fair" toward the red shirts, he alienated himself from his key allies, the yellow shirts, and in an awkward attempt to maintain his strained relations with the yellow shirts, he could never win the hearts of the reds. Adding to the complexities was the need to protect his own position, when both "colours" wanted him to leave.

Yingluck and Thaksin still boast solid red support. In some areas, though, resentment has simmered and questions have been asked. Some red shirts feel that this government has not made any real effort to take legal action against officials the red shirts hold responsible for the 2010 political bloodshed. To date, only Abhisit and former deputy prime minister Suthep Thaugsuban have faced prosecution over the violence, and the legal process against them has been slow. Then there are the issues of the government's vow never to change the lese-majeste law and the sluggish efforts to rescue imprisoned reds from jail.

The disappointment has not turned into a crisis of red-shirt confidence in Yingluck only because many red shirts still hold Thaksin in high regard. These Thaksin loyalists do not mind the apparent imbalance of the government's "reconciliation" steps that seem to focus on the man in exile. They view Thaksin's return as their ultimate goal, a symbolic restoration of justice to society.

It's "the other reds" that Thaksin and Yingluck should be aware of, those who do not consider his comeback as a victory, especially if the return is a result of a political compromise with the aristocrats.

As former owner of Manchester City, Thaksin knows full well that no fan will ever wear the jersey of "the other team". And that is just in sports. Here in Thailand, there has been real blood, real tears, real losses, and ideological differences ebbing to the extreme at both ends.

What will happen is hard to predict. We only know that political peace can no longer be achieved in Thailand with two estranged figures exchanging enigmatic smiles during an annual festival. Only specific people can start a war, but even they can't put a real end to it.

-- The Nation 2012-05-02

[MaiChai]

New money versus old money. The old money will always look down on the new money. Both parties don't care about the poor; I think that's pretty clear. Reconciliation is just a disguise to hide the real intention. I don't think anyone believes political enemies can agree, although compromises have been done in the past for mutual benefit.

The main problem is that Taksin refuses to be be happy with what he has. The smart man would have pursued growing business wealth and put the political aspirations aside. He could have left the political scene for several years to reappear at a later date but instead he chooses to remain in the spotlight constantly stirring up trouble and not letting Thailand move on. I think most Thais are fed up with this and tired of him constantly in the news; I know I am!

Edited May 2, 2012 by MaiChai

[sparebox2]

Notice he dress in Orange.

We all know what that colour represent.

[FOODLOVER]

He's a University of Texas fan! Hookem Horns baby!

[Skywalker69]

New money versus old money. The old money will always look down on the new money. Both parties don't care about the poor; I think that's pretty clear. Reconciliation is just a disguise to hide the real intention. I don't think anyone believes political enemies can agree, although compromises have been done in the past for mutual benefit.

The main problem is that Taksin refuses to be be happy with what he has. The smart man would have pursued growing business wealth and put the political aspirations aside. He could have left the political scene for several years to reappear at a later date but instead he chooses to remain in the spotlight constantly stirring up trouble and not letting Thailand move on. I think most Thais are fed up with this and tired of him constantly in the news; I know I am!

100% agreed, he feel he has lost face and needs to get it back.

[shunima]

Notice he dress in Orange.

We all know what that colour represent.

The dutch?

[stevenl]

Notice he dress in Orange.

We all know what that colour represent.

The dutch?

Yes, was just thinking the same.

[heiwa]

New money versus old money. The old money will always look down on the new money. Both parties don't care about the poor; I think that's pretty clear. Reconciliation is just a disguise to hide the real intention. I don't think anyone believes political enemies can agree, although compromises have been done in the past for mutual benefit.

The main problem is that Taksin refuses to be be happy with what he has. The smart man would have pursued growing business wealth and put the political aspirations aside. He could have left the political scene for several years to reappear at a later date but instead he chooses to remain in the spotlight constantly stirring up trouble and not letting Thailand move on. I think most Thais are fed up with this and tired of him constantly in the news; I know I am!

Spot on - both robbers with different coloured shirts

[Chang_paarp]

Notice he dress in Orange.

We all know what that colour represent.

It is a mixture of red and yellow. Something of an irony you might have missed.

[retarius]

Iy's all a bit like the French revolution....the bourgeoisie vs the aristocracy, and the bourgeoisie had the urban poor on their side....and we all know how that ended.

In Thailand the new money have the urban and rural poor on their side...a bit of reconciliation might not be such a bad thing.

Well done Yingluck for taking the initiative.

[hyperdimension]

Well done Yingluck for taking the initiative.

I don't think it was her initiative.

[AleG]

...

The main problem is that Taksin refuses to be be happy with what he has. The smart man would have pursued growing business wealth and put the political aspirations aside. He could have left the political scene for several years to reappear at a later date but instead he chooses to remain in the spotlight constantly stirring up trouble and not letting Thailand move on. I think most Thais are fed up with this and tired of him constantly in the news; I know I am!

The thing is, Thaksin has made his fortune on the back of governmental corruption, he failed at all his money making schemes until he hit the jackpot with a cozy deal handed out to him from his father in law, followed by shoddy telecommunication deals, and of course all the hugely conflicting interests between his private companies and the state during his time as PM.

Getting into politics was his best investment ever, he's not going to let go of the Golden Goose so easily.

[virtualtraveller]

good article, makes a strong point.

[MILT]

The article does make some very good points. With that said I do believe that sport rivals are way more bitterly entrenched in their perspective ideology's than most political differences. In Politics there are greater areas that allow, debate, disagreements and bipartisanship.

Edited May 3, 2012 by MILT

[hyperdimension]

I do believe that sport rivals are way more bitterly entrenched in their perspective ideology's than most political differences. In Politics there are greater areas that allow, debate, disagreements and bipartisanship.

Big money can turn enemies into friends overnight.

[ratcatcher]

A cat can take a ball of string and in a few minutes turn it into a complex tangle that is almost impossible to sort out without using scissors, this is how I view Thai politics. Now in Thailand who is the cat, it is not Thaksin or Abhisit, they are just lengths of string, nor is it the army, they are the scissors, it is a much higher group of people.

The gentleman in the orange shirt represents the higher group of people. Beyond him is off limits for discussion.

[Thai at Heart]

I do believe that sport rivals are way more bitterly entrenched in their perspective ideology's than most political differences. In Politics there are greater areas that allow, debate, disagreements and bipartisanship.

Big money can turn enemies into friends overnight.

Just ask Mr. Tevez.

This picture tells a thousand words, and no doubt about who is holding the whip hand here. Nice that they had a chat, but don't believe that if things go too far against the wishes of those at the top, they will be brought back to heel. No doubt the politics situation here is in a mess, but in true Thai fashion, no doubt a negotiated result will be achieved, and Mr. T will be back, because the entire situation is descending into farce.

[h90]

...

The main problem is that Taksin refuses to be be happy with what he has. The smart man would have pursued growing business wealth and put the political aspirations aside. He could have left the political scene for several years to reappear at a later date but instead he chooses to remain in the spotlight constantly stirring up trouble and not letting Thailand move on. I think most Thais are fed up with this and tired of him constantly in the news; I know I am!

The thing is, Thaksin has made his fortune on the back of governmental corruption, he failed at all his money making schemes until he hit the jackpot with a cozy deal handed out to him from his father in law, followed by shoddy telecommunication deals, and of course all the hugely conflicting interests between his private companies and the state during his time as PM.

Getting into politics was his best investment ever, he's not going to let go of the Golden Goose so easily.

He bought his license from Suchinda. At this time he wasn't so much into democracy yet.

[hyperdimension]

No doubt the politics situation here is in a mess, but in true Thai fashion, no doubt a negotiated result will be achieved, and Mr. T will be back, because the entire situation is descending into farce.

It's a pity that the pawns have only just realized that they've been used like cannon fodder. They thought they were fighting against the aristocrats for true democracy, but really they were only fighting and risking their lives, some of which were lost, for the interests of a megalomaniac and his clan.

From 2bangkok.com:

Thaksin and the Buffaloes

From Manager, April 25, 2012

Thaksin is holding a cape that reads: Aristocrat

Left: Ram… ram now! [meaning he is ordering the buffalo to attack Thailand's aristocrats]

Right: Worship… worship now!

The caption reads: Do like this and the buffalo will be confused.

Edited May 3, 2012 by hyperdimension

[metisdead]

No matter how veiled the insinuations are, do not go there:

2) Not to express disrespect of the King of Thailand or anyone else in the Thai royal family, whether living or deceased, nor to criticize the monarchy as an institution. Speculation, comments and discussion of either a political or personal nature are not allowed when discussing HM The King or the Royal family. Discussion of the lese majeste law or lese majeste cases is permitted on the forum, providing no comment or speculation is made referencing the royal family. To breach this rule will result in immediate ban.

Some posts have been removed.

[swillowbee]

This appears as a tactic that might have worked in generations past. In Thailand's tried and true patronage system, the rank and file follow their leader without question. In that system there is no ideology ... only distribution of money, ill-gotten through corruption.

A couple of game changers here ... one is ideology ... the other is the loss by the leadership of control of information.

The rank and file now have access to direct information that was previously channeled to an illiterate population through the local kamnan, who was paid for in the patronage system by the highest bidder. The access to other information sources has changed that.

From increased access to information, a rough ideology seems to be forming ... if the leadership is out of step with the rank and file, they will not succeed.

The Madam MP is using rusty hammers and nails in world that uses circuit boards and optical cables ... her tools no longer work here.

[Pseudolus]

Both sides make too much money from there being a conflict, and it enables them all to keep the poor in their place. Nothing will change and no one wants it too.

Edited May 3, 2012 by Pseudolus

[volk666]

Opposing camps do not follow different clubs or different political ideology. It's all about Thaksin and whether one loves him or not, all other differences are illusory, just a bunch of emotionally charged words that have no relation to actual situation, people, events, ideologies etc.

Reds have not a clue about democracy or about their place in a society or about freedom of speech or about their long term vision for the country or about anything else, for that matter. They say one thing but elect their leaders to do just the opposite and reds don't even realize it.

Yellows are more in tune with the reality with their charge against evil capitalists manipulating the "democratical" system to their own ends, but, frankly, no one cares. If they started this discussion in the West they'd find plenty of sympathizers from "occupy" movement but here when people hear about these capitalists reaping all the benefits for themselves the very first thought in the heads - where can I sign up to join this club?

We also have Democrats and their supporters who think that democracy will prevail in the end, like it "did" in Greece or UK or the US - that people's voice really matters when it comes to big decisions like trillion dollar bail outs and debts write offs or going to wars. Democrats' intentions are nice but they are a bit naive to believe in that old fairy tale.

Fighting over Thaksin, unfortunately, prevents people from talking to each other and forming the course for the country's overall direction.