Chiangmai Ram, What Would Your Reaction Be?

[uptheos]

certain noises for me seem to me far louder than it should be [ eg. thai soaps].

Nothing wrong here doppa....they are!

Do I recall you having a 'good' experience at Ram with some orthopaedic surgery?

Hope all gets sorted mate, tinnitus is horrible and I only had it for a few weeks.

[anselpixel]

In re tinnnitus, that's something I've enjoyed for decades. I was a DJ in the '60s, when earphones were designed to destroy human hearing.

You learn to live with it. I have some balance problems, but manage not to fall down very often. The hardest part is going to sleep with all that racket inside my head.

Chok dee!

Just back from the Chinese doc on Loi Kroh. He looked at my neck, said "abcessed small wound," and gave me an antibiotic which he thinks will shrink things back to their normal size in three days.

If not, he'll cut. Total charges under 300 baht, and he was very professional and courteous. A refreshing change from the factory approach at Ram. There may be good and bad doctors at Ram, but I think the business plan has superceded the original mission of caring for patients. It's totally unacceptable to diagnose without looking at a patient. My takeaway from that sort of thing is that the gate-keepers are there to spot referrals to specialists. Not good medicine.

[uptheos]

In re tinnnitus, that's something I've enjoyed for decades. I was a DJ in the '60s, when earphones were designed to destroy human hearing.

You learn to live with it. I have some balance problems, but manage not to fall down very often. The hardest part is going to sleep with all that racket inside my head.

Chok dee!

Just back from the Chinese doc on Loi Kroh. He looked at my neck, said "abcessed small wound," and gave me an antibiotic which he thinks will shrink things back to their normal size in three days.

If not, he'll cut. Total charges under 300 baht, and he was very professional and courteous. A refreshing change from the factory approach at Ram. There may be good and bad doctors at Ram, but I think the business plan has superceded the original mission of caring for patients. It's totally unacceptable to diagnose without looking at a patient. My takeaway from that sort of thing is that the gate-keepers are there to spot referrals to specialists. Not good medicine.

Dr. Tawachai at Loi Kroh clinic is OK with a scalpel. I've had a few biopsies done by him, felt nothing and hardly left a scar.

[Wavefloater]

I'm not at all surprised to hear some of these stories. Medical treatment, and specifically the knowledge of many doctors Thai, is appallingly bad. I AM speaking from first-hand experiences.

What's particularly interesting is that the high-priced hospitals that set them selves up to cater to foreigners seem to be the worst in term of having good knowledgeable doctors. I suspect that their priorities are virtually all superficial -- they get the prettiest nurses and spend huge amounts of money on the appearance of the hospitals but don't seem to bother worrying about the quality of the doctors.

[uptheos]

I'm not at all surprised to hear some of these stories. Medical treatment, and specifically the knowledge of many doctors Thai, is appallingly bad. I AM speaking from first-hand experiences.

What's particularly interesting is that the high-priced hospitals that set them selves up to cater to foreigners seem to be the worst in term of having good knowledgeable doctors. I suspect that their priorities are virtually all superficial -- they get the prettiest nurses and spend huge amounts of money on the appearance of the hospitals but don't seem to bother worrying about the quality of the doctors.

Sort of reminds me of an old British comedy series; Never Mind The Quality Feel The Width.

[doppa]

certain noises for me seem to me far louder than it should be [ eg. thai soaps].

Nothing wrong here doppa....they are!

Do I recall you having a 'good' experience at Ram with some orthopaedic surgery?

Hope all gets sorted mate, tinnitus is horrible and I only had it for a few weeks.

yes i did have a good experience at ram, dr paiboon, hip op, first class, but i researched it first,which i probably should have done with my recent episode.

[HappyInCM]

just to let everyone know, as i'm the original poster, i went back to ram and insisted to see a ent specialist,[considering everything else i had checked out was ok, i thought this had to be an ear problem] fortunately both were working at the time.

first doc basically checked ear drums, ok, next doc gave me a hearing test, not ok, possibly due to my 'mini stroke' its damaged the inner ear, so certain noises for me seem to me far louder than it should be [ eg. thai soaps].

the docs conclusion is i've got 'tinnitus', which i believe there's no known cure, i'm trying some medication which is relatively new, will then try acupuncture after that as the final resort.

so the conclusion for me is, thai hospitals are full of good and poor docs, trouble is we don't know which from which, unless we can get recommendations from other folks history, procedures in just about all the hospitals ive visited are crap, if it wasn't for my persistence in trying to find out what my problem was/is, i really don't know what would have happened, it was me who suggested to these docs, should we check this, should we check that ,they don't seem follow a logical path, i would have thought getting a hearing test done many months ago would have been high on the priority list to do, maybe it was my fault for not doing that in the first place, or suggesting it!

thanks for all your comments, my complaint is still on the hospital table for 2 weeks now, we shall see!

I prefer doctors that have been board certified in the west but there don't seem to be that many in cm I guess. I have had some good experiences with non western board certified doctors but I think the western board certification shows a minimum level of competency. Unfortunately ram seems to be just as expensive as the big bkk hospitals.

[KayCee]

We're pretty new here, so I'm reading along with interest, and can't offer too much in the way of direct experience yet. We did have a couple of outpatient illnesses for our kids they helped us with - was more impressed with the pediatrician we saw than with the internal medicine person who saw the older child, but to be fair, her complaint was a bit harder to diagnose probably.

We also had an emergency room call for a first onset, severe asthma attack - I was pretty impressed, by the speed, the equipment, the x-ray, the kindness of the staff, and constant attention. They asked us to have him stay overnight - possibly unnecessary, but as it was his first attack, and his O2 level wouldn't get up even with multiple breathing treatments and we live pretty far away it felt like a good idea to us. We were quite happy with the room, the staff, the doctor, and the overall level of care, including quite significant amount of time explaining things to us. A follow-up visit a week later saw us with the same pulmonary pediatric specialist, who saw us, confirmed all was well, and told us "no charge". All in all we were very satisfied.

I suppose I should note that we've lived in poorer Asian and African countries before retiring here, so perhaps by comparison, we are so relieved to have good quality care available in an emergency. And by the standards of those places, the speed, efficiency, and overall kindness of staff is so much better here, even in immigration or the electricity office, so we're not as critical, yet at least, as I guess others coming from other experiences might be.

[justamember]

Last Saturday night, I went to the RAM EMERGENCY ROOM due to unbearable stomach pain (a day later diagnosed as acute appendicitis). The emergency room doctor did a quick 30 second evaluation, injected a pain medication and told me that I could go home now! I stayed as at this point I couldn't only roll up in pain. While I was rolled up in pain on the bed in the emergency room, the emergency room doctor sat at his desk doing paperwork without paying the slightest bit of attention to me, his patient!! Two hours later they gave me enough morphine so that I could sleep.

The next morning a surgeon (apparently from Suan Dok) came, diagnosed acute appendicitis and performed surgery to remove the swollen and infected appendix. All went well, the operating room looked surprisingly modern, and the doctor did a great job.

Two days later I was ready to go home after the surgeon did a final evaluation. Then I waited, and waited, and waited... No, I was not allowed to leave till my insurance company gave the okay. Eventually it turned out that RAM had messed up the paperwork and not sent a medical report, I and I could convince them to let me go after I gave them my credit card as security.

When I returned to RAM to sign the paperwork, I discovered something interesting:

- total bill was THB 100,000

- fee of surgeon was THB 15,000

- and then there was a line item "2.6.44 Oversea Claim Service (Other Hospital Charge) -- THB 20,000"

When I asked about this charge, I was told that it was their service fee for contacting an overseas insurance company and receiving payment. Wow!!

Now I too agree with the majority opinion in this forum: Don't go to Ram. Go to Sripat instead.

Edited September 28, 2012 by justamember

[cloudhopper]

That mis-diagnosis at the Ram ER could have been fatal. Very scary!

[brommers]

That mis-diagnosis at the Ram ER could have been fatal. Very scary!

I agree. But I have only had good ER experiences, with gastro intestinal and with hand injury issues. In both cases I went at about 6 am & both times I was given a preliminary exam by the ER staff. As on both occasions they decided that I needed a specialist I was made comfortable and a specialist was called. In both cases I was then treated with further examinations and in a short time taken to surgery and operated on successfully.

Having used hospitals in Asia, Africa & the UK I can say that in countries where English is not the first language it is necessary to be very clear in describing your condition in easy to understand language, and not to be stoic about the pain. That way they can readily understand your true condition. And asking questions is a good idea to ensure that they have taken in what you are saying. I am reminded that many years ago I was told that if I was ever ill in a place where no-one spoke English I should go to a vet because they diagnose by observation and not description.

In my view RAM is a good well run hospital. But it is essential to remember that in any country it is the individual doctor/staff who are actually giving you the treatment. So don't blame the hospital when in fact it is the personnel who are the cause of inferior treatment.

[justamember]

Brommers, I would say that it's the hospital's responsibility to ensure the quality of their doctors and the quality of their doctors' treatments. So, bad doctor => bad hospital. But it's very possible to find a good doctor in a bad hospital.

The time of arrival in the ER may also be of importance due to how the hospital operates different shifts. In my case, it was about 1 am.

[cloudhopper]

That mis-diagnosis at the Ram ER could have been fatal. Very scary!

I agree. But I have only had good ER experiences, with gastro intestinal and with hand injury issues. In both cases I went at about 6 am & both times I was given a preliminary exam by the ER staff. As on both occasions they decided that I needed a specialist I was made comfortable and a specialist was called. In both cases I was then treated with further examinations and in a short time taken to surgery and operated on successfully.

Having used hospitals in Asia, Africa & the UK I can say that in countries where English is not the first language it is necessary to be very clear in describing your condition in easy to understand language, and not to be stoic about the pain. That way they can readily understand your true condition. And asking questions is a good idea to ensure that they have taken in what you are saying. I am reminded that many years ago I was told that if I was ever ill in a place where no-one spoke English I should go to a vet because they diagnose by observation and not description.

In my view RAM is a good well run hospital. But it is essential to remember that in any country it is the individual doctor/staff who are actually giving you the treatment. So don't blame the hospital when in fact it is the personnel who are the cause of inferior treatment.

Yeah I had to pretty much admit myself to Phuket International once when I had septicemia - but acute appendicitis isn't the most challenging diagnosis and the poster was hardly being stoic. Hopefully it was a one-off; I also use Ram and had good outcomes there as well.

[uptheos]

.When I returned to RAM to sign the paperwork, I discovered something interesting:

- total bill was THB 100,000

- fee of surgeon was THB 15,000

- and then there was a line item "2.6.44 Oversea Claim Service (Other Hospital Charge) -- THB 20,000"

When I asked about this charge, I was told that it was their service fee for contacting an overseas insurance company and receiving payment. Wow!!

Now I too agree with the majority opinion in this forum: Don't go to Ram. Go to Sripat instead.

Yes, surgeon's fees can be quite reasonable, but all the hospital 'add on's' unfortunately drive up the price.

I gather you was in tremendous pain and at such times it's not always easy to 'be rational' and you just want to get to a hospital. Getting to the hospital of your choice can sometimes be problematical, especially if unconscious.

Anyway, how are you feeling?

[Loaded]

Last Saturday night, I went to the RAM EMERGENCY ROOM due to unbearable stomach pain (a day later diagnosed as acute appendicitis). The emergency room doctor did a quick 30 second evaluation, injected a pain medication and told me that I could go home now! I stayed as at this point I couldn't only roll up in pain. While I was rolled up in pain on the bed in the emergency room, the emergency room doctor sat at his desk doing paperwork without paying the slightest bit of attention to me, his patient!! Two hours later they gave me enough morphine so that I could sleep.

The next morning a surgeon (apparently from Suan Dok) came, diagnosed acute appendicitis and performed surgery to remove the swollen and infected appendix. All went well, the operating room looked surprisingly modern, and the doctor did a great job.

Two days later I was ready to go home after the surgeon did a final evaluation. Then I waited, and waited, and waited... No, I was not allowed to leave till my insurance company gave the okay. Eventually it turned out that RAM had messed up the paperwork and not sent a medical report, I and I could convince them to let me go after I gave them my credit card as security.

When I returned to RAM to sign the paperwork, I discovered something interesting:

- total bill was THB 100,000

- fee of surgeon was THB 15,000

- and then there was a line item "2.6.44 Oversea Claim Service (Other Hospital Charge) -- THB 20,000"

When I asked about this charge, I was told that it was their service fee for contacting an overseas insurance company and receiving payment. Wow!!

Now I too agree with the majority opinion in this forum: Don't go to Ram. Go to Sripat instead.

There's a formal procedure in order to be admitted at Ram. If the doctor said you could go home, how could you be admitted for the night? It doesn't make sense.

And you say while at Ram a doctor came from a different hospital, examined you and ordered Ram to organize a surgical procedure. It doesn't make sense.

They then wouldn't allow you to leave until they knew you would be able to pay for the operation. At last, something that makes sense.

[justamember]

Loaded, I apologize that this was not clear enough. Let me explain so it makes sense to you.

1) The ER doctor said that I could go home. I said that I would not be able to, that I wanted to stay, and that I wanted to be further examined. So I got admitted to the hospital. And yes, the admission is a formal procedure.

2) You may not be aware but a large number of doctors at RAM are actually regular doctors at Suan Dok and working at RAM only part-time or on an as-needed basis. The surgeon who did both the examination and surgery works at RAM on Sundays only.

3) The issue I raised about the discharge was not payment (I actually offered that I would pay myself and once they figured out the issue with the insurer, they could reimburse me; this offer was declined by RAM) but that they would have had me stay an additional night because they were waiting for an "Okay" from the insurer, which was not forthcoming because RAM did not send the repeatedly requested medical report to the insurer in the first place. Does this make sense to you? It sure doesn't to me...

[chiang mai]

The Suan Dok part is correct and the extra night vis a vis insurance sounds right also, the patient themselves, their physical presence is the surety bond to ensure the hospital gets paid, offering to pay the bill yourself means that the hospital would have had to accept a lower amount since insurance bills are usually padded.

[hellodolly]

Service price quality.

Just go to the Hospital across from the Holiday inn. There is not the nice accommodations you can get at Ram but they were not built for that they were built for medical reasons. There will be stories of woe there also but that is to be expected of any hospital.

I went to Siraphat for a eye exam didn't cost much but a witch doctor could have done better. Went to see a chest specialist and was given an x ray pulmonary test along with a 20 minute consultation on what my problem was. Doctors back in Canada automatically assumed I had Asama. Not so but they never told me what was wrong. This Doctor explained it to me.

I have since been going to the one by the Holiday inn and have no complaint. (Yet) good and fast service plus they have a Chiropractor. Prices are reasonable.

I had dizzy spells recently particularly after a shower. My doctor sent me to see the ENT at Ram. He told me it was common for people with diabetes at my age. Prescribed some pills and said it would go away. I got there pills and had to refill the prescription three time before it went away. He said it was some thing to do with a calcium build up in the ear.

Edited September 29, 2012 by hellodolly

[anselpixel]

Rajavej is the hospital across from the Holiday Inn. Very impressive place. I'm having a hip replacement done there next month. I originally dealt with Sripat in the matter, but their base price was almost double that at Rajavej.

[chiang mai]

Rajavej is the hospital across from the Holiday Inn. Very impressive place. I'm having a hip replacement done there next month. I originally dealt with Sripat in the matter, but their base price was almost double that at Rajavej.

Let's be careful here, surgeons fees are one thing, hospital costs are another, which of the two hospitals has the best surgeon and why? I have no doubt that Rajavej is an excellent hospital that contains many fine surgeons, but for Sriphat to be twice the price makes me believe you are not comparing apples and apples. For those not aware, Sriphat is associated with and forms a part of the CMU medical teaching facility.

[uptheos]

Rajavej is the hospital across from the Holiday Inn. Very impressive place. I'm having a hip replacement done there next month. I originally dealt with Sripat in the matter, but their base price was almost double that at Rajavej.

Let's be careful here, surgeons fees are one thing, hospital costs are another, which of the two hospitals has the best surgeon and why? I have no doubt that Rajavej is an excellent hospital that contains many fine surgeons, but for Sriphat to be twice the price makes me believe you are not comparing apples and apples. For those not aware, Sriphat is associated with and forms a part of the CMU medical teaching facility.

Dr Chanarkarn an excellent orthopaedic surgeon (son of Professor Kannika) performs a lot of surgery at Rajavej hospital, including hip and knee replacements.

[TommoPhysicist]

When I returned to RAM to sign the paperwork, I discovered something interesting:

- total bill was THB 100,000

- fee of surgeon was THB 15,000

- and then there was a line item "2.6.44 Oversea Claim Service (Other Hospital Charge) -- THB 20,000"

When I asked about this charge, I was told that it was their service fee for contacting an overseas insurance company and receiving payment. Wow!!

Now I too agree with the majority opinion in this forum: Don't go to Ram. Go to Sripat instead.

This operation would be 30-50k in most Thai hospitals.

Start at 100k, remove the 20k insurance surcharge, remove the 15k surgeon fee, reduce the farang x2 pricing = 32.5k bill for a normal private hospital.

Edited September 29, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[elektrified]

When I returned to RAM to sign the paperwork, I discovered something interesting:

- total bill was THB 100,000

- fee of surgeon was THB 15,000

- and then there was a line item "2.6.44 Oversea Claim Service (Other Hospital Charge) -- THB 20,000"

When I asked about this charge, I was told that it was their service fee for contacting an overseas insurance company and receiving payment. Wow!!

Now I too agree with the majority opinion in this forum: Don't go to Ram. Go to Sripat instead.

This operation would be 30-50k in most Thai hospitals.

Start at 100k, remove the 20k insurance surcharge, remove the 15k surgeon fee, reduce the farang x2 pricing = 32.5k bill for a normal private hospital.

I think it would be more than 32.5K THB LOL but certainly not as much as 100K THB (for that type of operation). Somewhere in the middle.

[TommoPhysicist]

I think it would be more than 32.5K THB LOL but certainly not as much as 100K THB (for that type of operation). Somewhere in the middle.

You forgot to add the surgeons fees of 15k making a total bill of 47.5k

But two months ago

I was quoted 52k for a gall bladder removal in a BK private hospital (all inclusive)

And the same operation at 32k in a government hospital in CM (buy my own food).

Shouldn't be any cost difference between an emergency appendix and a gall bladder removal.

Edited September 29, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[uptheos]

I think it would be more than 32.5K THB LOL but certainly not as much as 100K THB (for that type of operation). Somewhere in the middle.

You forgot to add the surgeons fees of 15k making a total bill of 47.5k

But two months ago

I was quoted 52k for a gall bladder removal in a BK private hospital (all inclusive)

And the same operation at 32k in a government hospital in CM (buy my own food).

Shouldn't be any cost difference between an emergency appendix and a gall bladder removal.

Had a cholycystectomy done via laparoscopy by Dr. Sandhu Trichak at Sripat about 6 years ago, with no problems since. One night stay and the cost was 40,000 baht. I assume the same surgery will be much more expensive now (assuming same surgeon, same hospital).

Edited September 29, 2012 by uptheos

[anselpixel]

Rajavej is the hospital across from the Holiday Inn. Very impressive place. I'm having a hip replacement done there next month. I originally dealt with Sripat in the matter, but their base price was almost double that at Rajavej.

Let's be careful here, surgeons fees are one thing, hospital costs are another, which of the two hospitals has the best surgeon and why? I have no doubt that Rajavej is an excellent hospital that contains many fine surgeons, but for Sriphat to be twice the price makes me believe you are not comparing apples and apples. For those not aware, Sriphat is associated with and forms a part of the CMU medical teaching facility.

Yes, apples to apples - right down to the parts to be used. I have had the opportunity to speak with two of this surgeon's hip replacement patients, and have no doubts about his ability. I also know the add-on prices at the hospital, and with all accounted for, the total price is still 80,000 baht less than the surgeon's fee alone at Sripat.

To be perfectly frank, I came away from my interviews at Sripat with the impression they didn't really need my business. That happens, and I don't mind. Perhaps they have all they can handle at the moment.

Also, the surgeon at Sripat ordered a 10K baht MRI follow-on to my very vague-looking X-rays, and determined there were developing problems with the other hip. The Rajavej team who, along with me and everybody else who tried, couldn't open the Sripat DVD of the MRI, nailed every bit of detail with two passes in their conventional radiology theater. Even I could see they had as much detail as the MRI results I had viewed in film format at Sripat.

1200 baht instead of 10K baht.

I understand there are many in the expat community who feel that the relationship between the University and the hospital in some way assures a level of professionalism that other medical centers may not have. I happen not to share that assumption, and I did due diligence to arrive at my decision.

It may or may not be pertinent to the discussion, but I am a cash customer, and not using any insurance. The Sripat surgeon knows that, and the Rajavej surgeon does not. Therin may lie another apples to apples discussion. We'll see soon enough.

Edited September 29, 2012 by anselpixel

[eyecatcher]

I think it would be more than 32.5K THB LOL but certainly not as much as 100K THB (for that type of operation). Somewhere in the middle.

You forgot to add the surgeons fees of 15k making a total bill of 47.5k

But two months ago

I was quoted 52k for a gall bladder removal in a BK private hospital (all inclusive)

And the same operation at 32k in a government hospital in CM (buy my own food).

Shouldn't be any cost difference between an emergency appendix and a gall bladder removal.

Had a cholycystectomy done via laparoscopy by Dr. Sandhu Trichak at Sripat about 6 years ago, with no problems since. One night stay and the cost was 40,000 baht. I assume the same surgery will be much more expensive now (assuming same surgeon, same hospital).

Ups; You have to be the leading authority on hospital treatments; I am sorry you have suffered so much to help so many others.....but if you ever get arterial damage to your sense of humoUr; come to me; I can help.

[chiang mai]

Rajavej is the hospital across from the Holiday Inn. Very impressive place. I'm having a hip replacement done there next month. I originally dealt with Sripat in the matter, but their base price was almost double that at Rajavej.

Let's be careful here, surgeons fees are one thing, hospital costs are another, which of the two hospitals has the best surgeon and why? I have no doubt that Rajavej is an excellent hospital that contains many fine surgeons, but for Sriphat to be twice the price makes me believe you are not comparing apples and apples. For those not aware, Sriphat is associated with and forms a part of the CMU medical teaching facility.

Yes, apples to apples - right down to the parts to be used. I have had the opportunity to speak with two of this surgeon's hip replacement patients, and have no doubts about his ability. I also know the add-on prices at the hospital, and with all accounted for, the total price is still 80,000 baht less than the surgeon's fee alone at Sripat.

To be perfectly frank, I came away from my interviews at Sripat with the impression they didn't really need my business. That happens, and I don't mind. Perhaps they have all they can handle at the moment.

Also, the surgeon at Sripat ordered a 10K baht MRI follow-on to my very vague-looking X-rays, and determined there were developing problems with the other hip. The Rajavej team who, along with me and everybody else who tried, couldn't open the Sripat DVD of the MRI, nailed every bit of detail with two passes in their conventional radiology theater. Even I could see they had as much detail as the MRI results I had viewed in film format at Sripat.

1200 baht instead of 10K baht.

I understand there are many in the expat community who feel that the relationship between the University and the hospital in some way assures a level of professionalism that other medical centers may not have. I happen not to share that assumption, and I did due diligence to arrive at my decision.

It may or may not be pertinent to the discussion, but I am a cash customer, and not using any insurance. The Sripat surgeon knows that, and the Rajavej surgeon does not. Therin may lie another apples to apples discussion. We'll see soon enough.

A balanced reply so thanks you for that, what I'm interested in is arriving at the answer of "where is best" and your post helps answer that question, I'll be interested to see if your opinion remains the same over time.

[Loaded]

Rajavej is the hospital across from the Holiday Inn. Very impressive place. I'm having a hip replacement done there next month. I originally dealt with Sripat in the matter, but their base price was almost double that at Rajavej.

Let's be careful here, surgeons fees are one thing, hospital costs are another, which of the two hospitals has the best surgeon and why? I have no doubt that Rajavej is an excellent hospital that contains many fine surgeons, but for Sriphat to be twice the price makes me believe you are not comparing apples and apples. For those not aware, Sriphat is associated with and forms a part of the CMU medical teaching facility.

Dr Chanarkarn an excellent orthopaedic surgeon (son of Professor Kannika) performs a lot of surgery at Rajavej hospital, including hip and knee replacements.

I believe Dr Chanarkarn is also the professor of Sports medicine at CMU's school of medicine. Plus, I believe, he's the official orthopedic surgeon to the Thai Olympic team. If you were paying for the same expertise in the USA, you would be in the top 0.01% wealthiest portion of the population.

Edited September 29, 2012 by Loaded

[market trader]

Last Saturday night, I went to the RAM EMERGENCY ROOM due to unbearable stomach pain (a day later diagnosed as acute appendicitis). The emergency room doctor did a quick 30 second evaluation, injected a pain medication and told me that I could go home now! I stayed as at this point I couldn't only roll up in pain. While I was rolled up in pain on the bed in the emergency room, the emergency room doctor sat at his desk doing paperwork without paying the slightest bit of attention to me, his patient!! Two hours later they gave me enough morphine so that I could sleep.

The next morning a surgeon (apparently from Suan Dok) came, diagnosed acute appendicitis and performed surgery to remove the swollen and infected appendix. All went well, the operating room looked surprisingly modern, and the doctor did a great job.

Two days later I was ready to go home after the surgeon did a final evaluation. Then I waited, and waited, and waited... No, I was not allowed to leave till my insurance company gave the okay. Eventually it turned out that RAM had messed up the paperwork and not sent a medical report, I and I could convince them to let me go after I gave them my credit card as security.

When I returned to RAM to sign the paperwork, I discovered something interesting:

- total bill was THB 100,000

- fee of surgeon was THB 15,000

- and then there was a line item "2.6.44 Oversea Claim Service (Other Hospital Charge) -- THB 20,000"

When I asked about this charge, I was told that it was their service fee for contacting an overseas insurance company and receiving payment. Wow!!

Now I too agree with the majority opinion in this forum: Don't go to Ram. Go to Sripat instead.

There's a formal procedure in order to be admitted at Ram. If the doctor said you could go home, how could you be admitted for the night? It doesn't make sense.

And you say while at Ram a doctor came from a different hospital, examined you and ordered Ram to organize a surgical procedure. It doesn't make sense.

They then wouldn't allow you to leave until they knew you would be able to pay for the operation. At last, something that makes sense.

Where did justamember state that the doctor from a different hospital ORDERED Ram to organize a surgical proceedure? In my experiences I have seen the same doctor at different hospitals.