Apprehension!

[er1c]

Hi all!

My girlfriend and I are due to arrive in Koh Samui in early february for a week, staying on Lamai beach, after travelling around Thailand for a couple of weeks. After reading about recent events, and indeed, many comments on this forum following these events(the murder of the English girl in particular) I am now filled with apprehension with regards to staying on Samui. Can anybody put my mind at rest as I am seriously considering cancelling our hotel reservation..??

[limbos]

Eric,

You know how many people come to Thailand or Samui on a yearly base and how many out of these get murdered % wise?

You're probably more at risk crossing a road in your home town.

[er1c]

Eric,

You know how many people come to Thailand or Samui on a yearly base and how many out of these get murdered % wise?

You're probably more at risk crossing a road in your home town.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its not the being murdered that is worrying me - its more the inference of many members of this forum that there is a vast amount of local corruption, crime, western lager louts and chavs on Samui - this being far removed from the idyllic impression given to me by friends who visited the island a few years ago.

[suegha]

Eric,

You know how many people come to Thailand or Samui on a yearly base and how many out of these get murdered % wise?

You're probably more at risk crossing a road in your home town.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its not the being murdered that is worrying me - its more the inference of many members of this forum that there is a vast amount of local corruption, crime, western lager louts and chavs on Samui - this being far removed from the idyllic impression given to me by friends who visited the island a few years ago.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Er1c, trust me when I say just go for it and enjoy yourself. I've been going to Samui for years and I have a house there, I have never seen anything untoward! Yes it does go on, as it does anywhere. Check you local newspaper for similar stories, chances are you'll find more than you bargained for. I'm assuming you are from the UK, but I know it's the same everywhere, check the news, read the papers, if you were a non-Brit would you visit Britain? Good and bad everywhere! Enjoy your stay.

[britmaveric]

Eric,

You know how many people come to Thailand or Samui on a yearly base and how many out of these get murdered % wise?

You're probably more at risk crossing a road in your home town.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its not the being murdered that is worrying me - its more the inference of many members of this forum that there is a vast amount of local corruption, crime, western lager louts and chavs on Samui - this being far removed from the idyllic impression given to me by friends who visited the island a few years ago.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Most places in Thailand qualifies for that generalization. Stick to your plans and remember just because you are on holiday doesnt mean you let your guard down.

[phuketsiam]

yes take great care at all times, do not relax, may as well just stay at home then

[zaz]

Don't let it put you off mate, just be careful as normal, be nice to everyone and enjoy yourself - you'll have a great time, Koh Samui is brilliant. Good luck.

[suegha]

Exercise as much care as you would anywhere in the world!

[sabaijai]

Like others here are saying, overall the island is pretty safe (much safer than almost any Caribbean island, for example). But Lamai does have a certain reputation. When I heard a tourist had allegedly been murdered on the island, I immediately guessed it had to be Hat Lamai.

Lamai has a reputation as being a bit 'rough', lots of girlie bars, mafia, etc. There are also some very good resorts there, but my Thai friends tell me - and I have the same personal impression - that there is more illegal activity going on in Lamai than at all the other beaches on Samui combined. Because of its 'boys town' feel, female friends of mine who know the island well typically choose Chaweng, Bo Phut, Mae Nam, etc, when vacationing there.

[BattyBatty]

Eric, pay no attention to the comments about mafia etc... Its nonsense. The comparisons to Pataya (which incidentally isn’t that bad) are just plain silly. Samui is a safe place to holiday or reside, trust me... you will feel completely at ease, safe and relaxed.

Samui has a Mafia, but you will not be aware of there presence as they have nothing to do with tourists, and for the record the samui mafia are different to western mafia in many ways.... you will see no one walking around with a tommy gun and a briefcase (more likely an old lady working shop counting her Baht from all the land and house revenue.)

As for the chances of being mugged, stabbed, raped or shot..... The odds are so low it’s not even worth thinking about. A posh, up market London suburb is more dangerous at 3pm than the worst areas of samui at 3am. Very, very little threat, next to nothing to worry about.

In over 2 years on the island I fail to recall a single incident where I felt in danger.

Katherine's death is a tragedy and I feel very sad for her family.... a tragic waste of life at such a young age, at the hands of a person who deserves to be shot for this appalling crime. Having said this, with one million tourists per year coming to Samui, multiplied by the amount of fellang murders here, the chances are completely remote.

Any destination in the world with a large turnover of people coming and going suffer tragedies such as this from time to time... it is no reflection on the island/people in any way shape or form.

[sabaijai]

Eric, pay no attention to the comments about mafia etc... Its nonsense.

OK.

Samui has a Mafia, but you will not be aware of there presence as they have nothing to do with tourists,

uh which is it?

The mafia presence at Lamai may not directly involve tourists - no one's saying they were connected to the alleged murder (though no one can say otherwise either, yet) - but it's part of the atmosphere there, and it explains why law enforcement is less effective there than at most other beaches on Ko Samui. To my mind - and to those who know Samui best (the Thais who live there), it's known as the least safe spot on the island. Again that doesn't mean it has to be avoided or that it's crime-ridden - far from it. But one does need to exercise a little more caution there, I'd suggest, than at other beaches on the island.

If Batty Batty has been living on the island over two years and doesn't know that Lamai has this reputation among the Thais, then s/he hasn't really gone beneath the surface of things, I'd suggest.

[BattyBatty]

''Again that doesn't mean it has to be avoided or that it's crime-ridden - far from it.''

Precisely.

I’m aware of mafia, both Thai and PTY based fellang who come to Samui every few weeks. I conducted a little business with 'Samui Mafia' once previously, who were the nicest Thai's I ever dealt with and helped me out with a few problems from time to time (nothing silly or dodgy, I literally mean one solitary legal issue and helping me out with a very small project I was involved in, so small I was surprised how keen they were to help). The point I am trying to make to someone like Eric, the OP, is that Samui mafia are worlds apart from western mafia, and nothing to worry about from your average Joe Fellang's point of view. Actually, in my experience, they are nothing to worry about from a resident’s point of view. Residents here of stuff that puts a slight tint on the overall impression, but tourists are not aware of anything untoward.

Local crime stats indicated in the Community magazine monthly invariably report motorbike accidents, occasional break-in's and Thai-Thai violence both mild and fatal. Of course they are not going to report on anything that would land them in trouble, but then again we don’t really need to know about clandestine Thai business as it doesn’t involve or affect us by and large. Aside from this, my only other source of local crime is through the grape vine - a large network of Fellang and Thai friends of all walks of life, and let me say that rarely do I here anything that worries me about (previously) living on Samui.

Having said that, I have to be honest and concede I know very little about Lamai, so yep I may be wrong but I doubt it... its a small island and people talk, if lamai was a hel_l-bent dog eat dog town I'm quite sure I would know though.

Hopefully you will agree with me on this: much talk around LOS currently through various media that Samui has turned to shit and is a violent, trashy place to live. This is complete rubbish.... Samui is a tropical island with cracking nature, belting nightlife, friendly and unique locals and great beaches. And it’s cheap! Hardly a &lt;deleted&gt; place to holiday, IMHO.

I may be wrong…. I dunno, maybe a case of looking at the world through RC Glasses. I doubt it though,… Personally, I always felt safe there and think the talk of mafia/violence etc is a little bit silly if you don’t mind my saying so… no offence intended to anyone who has that view.

Anyways, I’m sure Eric and his folks will have a blast.

Best, Batty.

[RAZZELL]

I think the reality is that Samui is not the quiet, tropical paradise that it's sometimes made out to be...or the Wild West.

The biggest resort, Chaweng, is like a busy Greek or Spanish holiday destination...

And anyone who's been to Greece or Spain knows that they have their own "mafia" types, chav holidaymakers and dodgy expats...

Relax and enjoy... if you don't like the resort you're in...go somewhere quieter..

[BattyBatty]

''I think the reality is that Samui is not the quiet, tropical paradise that it's sometimes made out to be...or the Wild West.''

Fair point.

Its not as rosey as i describe i suppose but its certainly not a worry to holiday there.

[davethailand]

Eric,

You know how many people come to Thailand or Samui on a yearly base and how many out of these get murdered % wise?

You're probably more at risk crossing a road in your home town.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its not the being murdered that is worrying me - its more the inference of many members of this forum that there is a vast amount of local corruption, crime, western lager louts and chavs on Samui - this being far removed from the idyllic impression given to me by friends who visited the island a few years ago.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

this being far removed from the idyllic impression given to me by friends who visited the island a few years ago.

Don't worry about it, Are you going to Chaweang? Its like bloody Spain or Tenerife there.

If you're scared just come to Pattaya, you'll feel alot safer

[Ollie]

''I think the reality is that Samui is not the quiet, tropical paradise that it's sometimes made out to be...or the Wild West.''

Fair point. 

Its not as rosey as i describe i suppose but its certainly not a worry to holiday there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Gee, BattyBatty, you sure know how to sell a place! I have never been tempted by this isle and now, having read your posts, you gangsters moll, or whatever you might imagine you are, I'll most certainly pass.

[Templer]

Well I have been going to Sumui for the last 9 years,

yes it has changed allot, over the years . But I can not say I have ever felt unsafe in the resorts.

I the only time I feel unsafe is driving a motor bike at night at closing time . to many Drunks riding back to there hotels.

Needless to say I will be back to Lamai in February with my family.

[BattyBatty]

QUOTE

''now, having read your posts, you gangsters moll, or whatever you might imagine you are''

Sigh.....

Honestly, I gave that impression? Seriously? Just by stating that I had a very brief, legal encounter with them regarding a very small matter?

I previously rented a building of them, and needed help with a couple of legal and above board issues I had. I did not need 'mafia' to assist me as any Thai in business could have helped, it just so happens I paid my rent to these guys so they helped out with a very small matter that was perfectly legal, that’s all. This was a relevant post to the OP who mentioned mafia, as I was trying to convey that samui mafia are usually simply powerful business people, but very ordinary and approachable by regular people like me. I am certainly not trying to present myself as a'mafia wanabee' simply because I mention a brief moment with them... you condescending little tit have you nothing better to do than flame me?

QUOTE

''I'll most certainly pass.''

And....?

[gisele]

Well I have been going to Sumui for the last 9 years,

yes it has changed allot, over the years . But I can not say I have ever felt unsafe in the resorts.

I the only time I feel unsafe is driving a motor bike at night at closing time . to many Drunks riding back to there hotels.

Needless to say I will be back to Lamai in February with my family.

I agree, I have been going to Samui for years, now, we live on the mainland and often go for weekends and I've never ever had any problems.

For many vacationners, a holiday mood seems to anesthetise their brain cells, they behave in such ways as if immune to harm, forgetting they are in unknown territory putting themselves in situations that they avoid back home.

It's like any place in the world, you must be aware of your surroundings and just be careful.

Isn't it the same whether in Hawaii, St-Tropez or Jamaica?

[KhunMarco]

In the end Samui is what you make of it.

If you are a tipical tourist, enjoining the wonderfull nature. nice resorts and all that stuff, 99.999% nothing is going to happen to you.

If you are a tipical %hithead, there are a thousand ways to screw your life in a coupla minutes.

reading of this poor girl, I have a vision of another girl I saw last year, riding a bike with a Thai, he was so intoxicated,he could not even talk (he came in the restaurant ). When he stopped the scooter, he forgot to put his feet down. They hit the ground like a bag of potatoes.

The owner sent them to their way, and wrooom, they went toward Bo Phut swinging right and left, without light in the night... many ways ,as I said.

Edited January 5, 2006 by KhunMarco

[jrincon17]

Hi all!

My girlfriend and I are due to arrive in Koh Samui in early february for a week, staying on Lamai beach, after travelling around Thailand for a couple of weeks. After reading about recent events, and indeed, many comments on this forum following these events(the murder of the English girl in particular) I am now filled with apprehension with regards to staying on Samui. Can anybody put my mind at rest as I am seriously considering cancelling our hotel reservation..??

Just be smart , be together when its dark . dont walk alone . Have respect for others !

[Malice in Wonderland]

Like others here are saying, overall the island is pretty safe (much safer than almost any Caribbean island, for example). But Lamai does have a certain reputation. When I heard a tourist had allegedly been murdered on the island, I immediately guessed it had to be Hat Lamai.

Lamai has a reputation as being a bit 'rough', lots of girlie bars, mafia, etc. There are also some very good resorts there, but my Thai friends tell me - and I have the same personal impression - that there is more illegal activity going on in Lamai than at all the other beaches on Samui combined. Because of its 'boys town' feel, female friends of mine who know the island well typically choose Chaweng, Bo Phut, Mae Nam, etc, when vacationing there.

Oh please spare me "I immediately guessed it was Hat Lamai" Have you ever even been there ?????? As a Lamai RESIDENT (as opposed to a sad armchair critic) for the past 3 years let me tell you there is very little to worry about and as for the "Mafia" - eh???? been reading too many crime novels have we ??? Get a F***ing life you muppet - they don't exist!!!!!!

In future keep your unjustified and unsubstantiated witterings to yourself-you're not helping anyone!!!!!

[BattyBatty]

Malice....

Its amazing how people over react, isnt it? I know hundereds of people on the island and fail to recall one single time that any of these people had a bad expereince with the 'mafia'.

The mafia are simply powerfull business people. If you dont ###### with them, they wont ###### with you. You could spend decades on the island without even knowing they exist.

[somchai jones]

Malice....

Its amazing how people over react, isnt it? I know hundereds of people on the island and fail to recall one single time that any of these people had a bad expereince with the 'mafia'.

The mafia are simply powerfull business people. If you dont ###### with them, they wont ###### with you. You could spend decades on the island without even knowing they exist.

Agreed.

Let's get this whole thing into perspective.

Koh Samui has developed rapidly over the last few years, as has Pattaya, Phuket, etc.

However, in Thailand, where ever I may be, I still feel etremely safe.

If as a foreigner here you are conducting yourself legally, interaction with the Thai 'mafia' will be non-existant.

You may come into contact with the standard corruption, e.g. paying off a traffic cop for forgetting to put your seatbelt on, but hey, it beats the astronomical 'official' fine you'd have to pay in your own country.

[sriracha john]

Most likely a lot of damage to the tourism industry on Samui has already been done by this latest crime. That's why Thaksin and TAT are so busy in "damage control mode".

Justified to some degree, people's apprehensions about coming to Samui are very real and to say that there is no crime or nothing to be concerned about is misleading...albeit as misleading as saying it's a festering crime hole, but still...

misleading.

[Carmine6]

Eric,

You know how many people come to Thailand or Samui on a yearly base and how many out of these get murdered % wise?

You're probably more at risk crossing a road in your home town.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its not the being murdered that is worrying me - its more the inference of many members of this forum that there is a vast amount of local corruption, crime, western lager louts and chavs on Samui - this being far removed from the idyllic impression given to me by friends who visited the island a few years ago.

I think your friends' view will more closely match your experience than some of the stories here. I stayed in Lamai 2 years ago and would definitely stay again. I'd actually planned on staying there with my girlfriend last September but we ended up staying in Chawaeng since her sister and brother-in-law were there.

I walked all over Lamai by myself at night and never felt uneasy. I actually found the town a bit subdued, as were the people. It's physically small unless you really get outside the tourist areas, so harder to find trouble. Had a very relaxing time.

Come to think of it, I did get a little fright from some of the speedos and some women who shouldn't bathe topless.

[mogoso]

Hi all!

My girlfriend and I are due to arrive in Koh Samui in early february for a week, staying on Lamai beach, after travelling around Thailand for a couple of weeks. After reading about recent events, and indeed, many comments on this forum following these events(the murder of the English girl in particular) I am now filled with apprehension with regards to staying on Samui. Can anybody put my mind at rest as I am seriously considering cancelling our hotel reservation..??

The most dangerous thing on Samui are the coconut trees. I think two or three people get smacked on the noggin every year. Not suprising as there are two million trees on the island. I wonder why the polical correct crowd hasn't demanded that they be cut down, oh come to think of it the enviorntalist would oppose them

Next most dangerous item are Evel Knieval wannabes on the rented motorbikes, bloody morons some folks can be.

After that beware of the chilis

[gisele]

In the end Samui is what you make of it.

If you are a tipical tourist, enjoining the wonderfull nature. nice resorts and all that stuff, 99.999% nothing is going to happen to you.

If you are a tipical %hithead, there are a thousand ways to screw your life in a coupla minutes.

reading of this poor girl, I have a vision of another girl I saw last year, riding a bike with a Thai, he was so intoxicated,he could not even talk (he came in the restaurant ). When he stopped the scooter, he forgot to put his feet down. They hit the ground like a bag of potatoes.

The owner sent them to their way, and wrooom, they went toward Bo Phut swinging right and left, without light in the night... many ways ,as I said.

I was in Samui yesterday, just for the day, 5:30 in the afternoon we came out of Atlas supermarket on Chaweng, my husband nods for me to look back at the store front and whispers that the woman sleeping on the bench was a farang. The cashier had just told him she lives here and is often seen in such a state. There she was clutching a can of chips, shoes off, sunglasses dangling, skirt hiked up, wallet in clear view, so vulnerable .

I wondered what will happen to her, so easy for anyone to take advantage. In such a state anyone is a magnet for trouble.

The sad thing is that she isn't alone in similar precarious situation.

[sriracha john]

And serious crimes are occuring.... rapes.... murder.... the whole gamut...

Not all tourists who come here expecting paradise, do so... Sadly, some instead, end up going back home in a box.

From other TV threads:

Irish women's holiday horror (2001)

TWO men are being questioned by police after an alleged sexual assault on two young Irish women on a paradise island in Thailand. A major hunt was under way for a third man suspected of being involved in the vicious attack.

The attacks took place on the tropical island of Koh Samui. They were dragged into the jungle where they were brutally assaulted.

There were fears yesterday that if the attackers, believed to be locals, are caught, the two women might have to wait five years to see them brought to court. Few rapes are prosecuted in Thailand.

But officials on the island - which is highly dependent on foreign tourism - said they were taking the recent attack extremely seriously.

http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2001/.../story11458.asp

The body of Briton Katherine Horton is moved from a forensic lab to the airport in Bangkok. Her remains were to be flown back to the UK today.

Raped by two Thai men

Jan 7 2006

Western Mail

ALL Western tourists who gave blood samples for DNA testing in the search to find Katherine Horton's killer have been told they are free to go home.

After three days of checks, Thai police have ruled out the possibility that the Welsh backpacker was killed by a Westerner.

Police in the resort said they were also investigating the rape of a 12-year-old Swedish girl by a barman.

Callum Macdonald, 23, from Blackhall, Edinburgh, the former boss of an IT company, was one of the last people to see Katherine alive.

He said, "Attacks against women here don't seem to be uncommon.

"When I was giving a statement at the police station on the table next to me the parents of a Swedish girl were giving evidence about the rape of their 12-year-old daughter by a barman."

===============================================================

THAI COPS CLOSE IN ON KILLERS

DNA evidence found on Thai beach murder victim Katherine Horton last night confirmed two "Asian" men had sex with her around the time of her death.

Police on the holiday island of Koh Samui are now trying to match the samples to suspects.

Katherine's body was found on the beach on January 2. The 21-year-old from Cardiff had been raped, then asphyxiated.

Her body was flown back to Wales last night, accompanied by her dad Ian, 53, and brother Chris, 25.

Rest in Peace

Edited January 7, 2006 by sriracha john

[BattyBatty]

''I was in Samui yesterday, just for the day, 5:30 in the afternoon we came out of Atlas supermarket on Chaweng, my husband nods for me to look back at the store front and whispers that the woman sleeping on the bench was a farang. The cashier had just told him she lives here and is often seen in such a state. There she was clutching a can of chips, shoes off, sunglasses dangling, skirt hiked up, wallet in clear view, so vulnerable .

I wondered what will happen to her, so easy for anyone to take advantage. In such a state anyone is a magnet for trouble.

The sad thing is that she isn't alone in similar precarious situation.''

Yep, she has been here years. I wont mention her name or were she is from here, but she is usualy seen outside burger king/islander with a bottle of loco or chang, very pissed and talking to herself/shouting at tourists. Completley bonkers, proper lost the plot.

Rumour has it (and i have heard this of a few people) that she used to be a concert pianist. Honestly. For whatever reason, she came to the island, over-indulged too much and lost the plot. Has a half Thai kid here.