Farangs That Have A Lower Standing As Dogs / Do They Deserver It?

[robblok]

First off, i have been there. I had a Thai lady back when i was 26 in the Netherlands. I met her in a shopping mall in Bangkok when she was shopping for her beauty salon. It all started of nice but slowly got worse and worse. She was 6 years older then me and suddenly wanted her daughters to live with us.

I raised them while their mom went out and gambled flirted and had sexual relationships with other guys (found that out later) and generally called me fat and stupid. This became worse and worse, but because it went slow it did not register straight away. Once it registered and my eyes were opened i hesitated to act because of the kids. I felt sorry for them, but in the end i choose for myself and ended it. I played it fair and was nice to the kids. They still visit me from time to time (they live in Europe still). The mom is now busy with her 3rd divorce.

So yes i know about relations where you have nothing to say. My excuses i was young and there were kids to consider. Else i would have acted much faster. In the end if you don't save yourself your an idiot with low self esteem.

Here in Thailand you often see it with guys who want girls that are normally out of their reach so they buy them. That is not a healthy way to start a relationship and for the girl your only a walking ATM. No wonder you don't get any respect. If you can't get her because of your looks wit or manners but have to draw your wallet (pay her a salary / pay her family / pay for the sick buffalo) Then you have to stop thinking with the wrong head.

You have to make sure you keep in charge int he relation and don't get yourself in a vulnerable situation like a house that you bought and paid for (keep a mortgage on her name and pay in parts).

Not all girls are the same there are plenty of girls that will love you for who you are but maybe they are not the little Isarn beauty queens that you want and closer to your own age. They will respect you and love you and (if you are smart enough) listen to your advice.

For guys who stay in those relationships.. its your bed and you made it. If you don't act once you realize it you deserve it. Acting does not always mean breaking up.

[Ulysses G.]

Yes, many deserve it, but not all. There are some really selfish losers here.

(Not on Thai Visa of course).

Edited June 3, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[edwinclapham]

Excellent post Rob! Not easy to get such a valid point over in another language .. fair play to you mate!

[phuturatica]

I think this applies to all relationships not just Westerner's with Thai women.

At the end of the day, if you notice that something is not right in your relationship then you have a choice to act upon it and do something about it. This could means working through things or laying down your terms of a relationship.

Don't be a mug and don't get pushed over.

[robblok]

I think this applies to all relationships not just Westerner's with Thai women.

At the end of the day, if you notice that something is not right in your relationship then you have a choice to act upon it and do something about it. This could means working through things or laying down your terms of a relationship.

Don't be a mug and don't get pushed over.

Of course it does apply to all relations its only common sense. You are right.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Here in Thailand you often see it with guys who want girls that are normally out of their reach so they buy them. That is not a healthy way to start a relationship and for the girl your only a walking ATM. No wonder you don't get any respect. If you can't get her because of your looks wit or manners but have to draw your wallet (pay her a salary / pay her family / pay for the sick buffalo) Then you have to stop thinking with the wrong head.

You have to make sure you keep in charge int he relation and don't get yourself in a vulnerable situation like a house that you bought and paid for (keep a mortgage on her name and pay in parts).

It is perfectly possible to have a healthy transactional relationship where all the cards are on the table, you play it smart and keep her respect. The key is pre-screening those with unreasonable expectations, so they're not even in the running, ideally you're not even having the intial conversation with them because you know your appearance isn't matching their target profile.

All depends on knowing what you want, figuring out how to get it, and most importantly realizing when the negatives outweigh the positives and cutting her loose.

Just don't think you're buying "love" - that can only be earned, and is entirely possible even when the beginning of the relationship was purely transactional. And note I said possible, not likely, that's not the goal IMO, more happy serendipity when it comes. And then more often than not it goes, so it goes, that's life.

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post has been removed as well as a rational reply to the flame.

[BookMan]

For guys who stay in those relationships.. its your bed and you made it. If you don't act once you realize it you deserve it. Acting does not always mean breaking up.

I agree. Once you realise you are being treated poorly or used for your money and you are not happy about that situation,then it is up to you do something about it yourself. Personal responsibility.

You don't have to end the relationship. You can try and make some changes within it so you aren't a doormat or punching bag or ATM, or whatever the grievance is. That might not work out, so if you stay in the relationship you can't really complain.

I'm hesitant to say that everyone 'deserves' what they get in a relationship though. Some guys definitely do. I have met some champion d_cks in Thailand and Australia with Thai GFs and wives. I find it hard to feel sorry for those blokes if they get done over somehow.

But I have also met some champion good blokes who don't deserve to get done over and I feel sorry for their lot when they do get emotionally wrung out or financially fleeced.

I think you are ultimately responsible for yourself and responsible for your own decisions in life and your relationships. If the relationship is particularly nasty and is encumbered with mental or physical abuse, and then monetary scams, that might affect mental health or well being you have to change that situation. You might not have realised getting into the relationship but as soon as you do you need to act.

Ultimately some guys have got themselves into a bad situation and have to bear the responsibility for their own actions but they often don't deserve the shafting they get.

[BookMan]

Here in Thailand you often see it with guys who want girls that are normally out of their reach so they buy them. That is not a healthy way to start a relationship and for the girl your only a walking ATM. No wonder you don't get any respect. If you can't get her because of your looks wit or manners but have to draw your wallet (pay her a salary / pay her family / pay for the sick buffalo) Then you have to stop thinking with the wrong head.

You have to make sure you keep in charge int he relation and don't get yourself in a vulnerable situation like a house that you bought and paid for (keep a mortgage on her name and pay in parts).

It is perfectly possible to have a healthy transactional relationship where all the cards are on the table, you play it smart and keep her respect. The key is pre-screening those with unreasonable expectations, so they're not even in the running, ideally you're not even having the intial conversation with them because you know your appearance isn't matching their target profile.

All depends on knowing what you want, figuring out how to get it, and most importantly realizing when the negatives outweigh the positives and cutting her loose.

Just don't think you're buying "love" - that can only be earned, and is entirely possible even when the beginning of the relationship was purely transactional. And note I said possible, not likely, that's not the goal IMO, more happy serendipity when it comes. And then more often than not it goes, so it goes, that's life.

+1

[robblok]

For guys who stay in those relationships.. its your bed and you made it. If you don't act once you realize it you deserve it. Acting does not always mean breaking up.

I agree. Once you realise you are being treated poorly or used for your money and you are not happy about that situation,then it is up to you do something about it yourself. Personal responsibility.

You don't have to end the relationship. You can try and make some changes within it so you aren't a doormat or punching bag or ATM, or whatever the grievance is. That might not work out, so if you stay in the relationship you can't really complain.

I'm hesitant to say that everyone 'deserves' what they get in a relationship though. Some guys definitely do. I have met some champion d_cks in Thailand and Australia with Thai GFs and wives. I find it hard to feel sorry for those blokes if they get done over somehow.

But I have also met some champion good blokes who don't deserve to get done over and I feel sorry for their lot when they do get emotionally wrung out or financially fleeced.

I think you are ultimately responsible for yourself and responsible for your own decisions in life and your relationships. If the relationship is particularly nasty and is encumbered with mental or physical abuse, and then monetary scams, that might affect mental health or well being you have to change that situation. You might not have realised getting into the relationship but as soon as you do you need to act.

Ultimately some guys have got themselves into a bad situation and have to bear the responsibility for their own actions but they often don't deserve the shafting they get.

Sure its not all that black and white, but its so hard to put it all in one post without boring everyone to death.

I also feel that ending a relationship is just something you do after you tried all other things. It was not that ended it right away. I tried to make changes had a few periods that it went better and then worse again.

I would say try first then end it if it really does not work.

[robblok]

Here in Thailand you often see it with guys who want girls that are normally out of their reach so they buy them. That is not a healthy way to start a relationship and for the girl your only a walking ATM. No wonder you don't get any respect. If you can't get her because of your looks wit or manners but have to draw your wallet (pay her a salary / pay her family / pay for the sick buffalo) Then you have to stop thinking with the wrong head.

You have to make sure you keep in charge int he relation and don't get yourself in a vulnerable situation like a house that you bought and paid for (keep a mortgage on her name and pay in parts).

It is perfectly possible to have a healthy transactional relationship where all the cards are on the table, you play it smart and keep her respect. The key is pre-screening those with unreasonable expectations, so they're not even in the running, ideally you're not even having the intial conversation with them because you know your appearance isn't matching their target profile.

All depends on knowing what you want, figuring out how to get it, and most importantly realizing when the negatives outweigh the positives and cutting her loose.

Just don't think you're buying "love" - that can only be earned, and is entirely possible even when the beginning of the relationship was purely transactional. And note I said possible, not likely, that's not the goal IMO, more happy serendipity when it comes. And then more often than not it goes, so it goes, that's life.

+1

I also agree here.

[farang000999]

Good post Rob. I think what happens often is that the farang really cannot leave the relationship because either he has children or has already put a lot of his assets into the woman, by buying her house and land and farm equipment and cars. So if he leaves, she will keep all the stuff and he will be nearly skint. Or he will be afriad what will happen to his kids down the road. I feel bad for these men and it does not bother me when I read them expressing themselves on Thai Visa.

[robblok]

Good post Rob. I think what happens often is that the farang really cannot leave the relationship because either he has children or has already put a lot of his assets into the woman, by buying her house and land and farm equipment and cars. So if he leaves, she will keep all the stuff and he will be nearly skint. Or he will be afriad what will happen to his kids down the road. I feel bad for these men and it does not bother me when I read them expressing themselves on Thai Visa.

It does not bother me either, but i just think they should help themselves. The kids issue is big that was the part that i found hardest when leaving my ex (and the kids weren't even mine) Money is bad too but you can always try to make more money.

I would not want to live sad all the time so i can save a few $

[zzaa09]

Yes, many deserve it, but not all. There are some really selfish losers here.

(Not on Thai Visa of course).

Reap what you sow...

But never mind the natural instinct that almost all Westerners retain by looking down their noses at the lower status Asians [or any other ethnicities that don't fit]

Edited June 3, 2012 by zzaa09

[endure]

Is this the Sunday sermon?

[TommoPhysicist]

Many relationships in Thailand are started by purchase.

It's called sinsot and is very traditional.

Letting yourself be taken for a ride is entirely different, and easily avoidable.

Bringing up another mans children is also a different game, and 'up to you'.

[chrisinth]

My tupence worth..........

From what I have seen in my few years here, most of the relationships (certainly not all) that have failed have come down to the male side of the relationship probably more than the female side. When you have people coming to a country like Thailand for the first time, on advice from their friends who have been here for a 2 week holiday and described all the good (important word) aspects of the trip they already have the rose-tinted glasses on before they arrive.

They get involved in a relationship with the 1st (or 2nd) BG that they meet and the rest is history. The majority of these male visitors are not world-wise or even street-wise out of their own country. The female may be the scam artist in the relationship, but the male is so blinded by Love (spelt L-u-s-t, pronounced <deleted>) that when the crap hits the fan and the tinted glasses fall off, it is normally too late.

As stated earlier, this is not what happens all the time. Some of the girls play the long game and let the relationship develop before dropping the hammer. Or, and this may hurt some male's egos, they get bored with the relationship as it didn't turn out the way they expected (often an overlooked view in these threads) and decide to milk it for what they can get.

Feel the water before diving in!

EDIT: And of course some relationships work; been married now for 13 years and just can't get rid of her........

Edited June 4, 2012 by chrisinth

[smokie36]

I don't have these issues thankfully.

(Now where is the smug grin emoticon?)

[473geo]

Be careful not to miss the important aspect of these relationships.....while they are good, the guys are enjoying a fantastic time, so really when the wheels come off as they can in any relationship.........they skid along on their arse for while.....but have you noticed......most come back to the fairground....

[DowntownAl]

Luckily I don't have that sort of problem. I'm old, fat, ugly and poor (relatively) to boot.. . I am also a very cool, romantic, and caring man who the mercenaries tend to shy away from. As a Chinese friend of mine, who snagged herself a hardworking Canadian soldier says: "Don't worry, you don't need money, you will find your woman in Thailand, you have a pension and a quality passport."

[kerryk]

I dated a BG for three years. She moved in with her daughter. Then she got a boyfriend. She started giving him money and clothes. I supported her and her daughter. Her daughter was 20 years old. I ran away with her 20 year old daughter.

[theblether]

Thailand is one of many cnuntries where women, beautiful women, will fall over themselves to be with a guy that can give them a step up in life.

Don't be kidded that it's all that in that regard. The point is, it's nothing to do with the country, nothing to do with the woman, it's all to do with you as an individual.

You have to value yourself highly, you have to be able to say no, in fact, no way. Robblok is totally right about maintaining control, ie with the drip drip drip of mortgage payments.

Do not lose control of your self worth, self esteem, and personal financial strength. Always remember one thing about Thailand, and Kerryk just pointed it out, there's no need to take crap from Thai women, even their daughters have no compunction in abandoning them.

There is ( can be ) a stunning level of emotional casual brutality in Thailand.....the way Thais think is the antithesis of our Judeo-Christian Western culture. I mean seriously, the daughter abandoned her mother to go with Kerryk? And the thing is none of us doubt it happened.

It can be Man Heaven, it can be Man Hell, which one it turns out to be depends entirely upon you. Do not lose control of yourself and you'll be fine.

Is it the oldest line on TV? Don't park your brain at the airport? So true, so true.

[KeyserSoze01]

Thailand is one of many cnuntries where women, beautiful women, will fall over themselves to be with a guy that can give them a step up in life.

Two can play that game. We are improving our lives also, until the fateful requests for $$$ come in. That's when I go from being an international man of mystery to being a broke pauper living on the dole. Well, at least that's what I tell them anyway.

[Headgame]

I dated a BG for three years. She moved in with her daughter. Then she got a boyfriend. She started giving him money and clothes. I supported her and her daughter. Her daughter was 20 years old. I ran away with her 20 year old daughter.

I admire a pragmatic man.

[theblether]

Thailand is one of many cnuntries where women, beautiful women, will fall over themselves to be with a guy that can give them a step up in life.

Two can play that game. We are improving our lives also, until the fateful requests for $$$ come in. That's when I go from being an international man of mystery to being a broke pauper living on the dole. Well, at least that's what I tell them anyway.

Treat it like a game of poker, only the greatest of fools would go all in not knowing the hand they have beem dealt.

Unfortunately there have been plenty of fools fleeced in Thailand, and now they have created a flourishing industry of expert players waiting for the next victim.

[richard_smith237]

Farang's That Have A Lower Standing As Dogs / Do They Deserver It?

I've personally never experienced it, I also don't know any Western friends who are in relationships with Thai ladies and experience it, they all seem to have a relationship consisting of nothing less than mutual respect. This also extends through to the families.

We've either been very careful or lucky. Perhaps this is because none of us have dated or married ladies who are not well educated, are financially independent or from a more promiscuous walk of life (i.e. they type of girl who actively hunts a westerner).

We have not been a financial or security choice, we have simply been a choice of the heart as the ladies in question.

I draw attention to this not to show off; there is nothing to show off about, but to identify that when approached normally as we would in the west, a relationship has a far higher chance of success and simply be 'normal' without any major dramas, surprises or ship wrecks. Thats not to say it doesn't happen, but the chances of a ship wreck are reduced with normalcy.

Most relationships I witness are therefore just 'normal', between couples of similar education, background, age grouping etc... so no real surprises for the parents etc (apart from their daughters marrying a westerner, which in all cases I know of was taken well after meeting the 'Suitor to be' in question; decent and respectable guys).

No real surprises for the girls either, who got what they dated and married - A normal guy who treats them well but also has plenty of self respect.

THUS: Do Westerners who get treated poorly deserve it ??? No, of course they don't deserve it. But, those who are treated poorly with lesser standing than a dog and tolerate it do themselves no favours whatsoever, the warning signs are easy enough to spot, but I suspect they are also easy enough to ignore as is suggested on this thread that many have. The same applies through any country and culture.

Most importantly is self respect - the rest should follow, if it doesn't.. walk...

Edited June 6, 2012 by richard_smith237

[TommoPhysicist]

Farang's That Have A Lower Standing As Dogs / Do They Deserver It?

I've personally never experienced it, I also don't know any Western friends who are in relationships with Thai ladies and have a relationship consisting of anything other than mutual respect. This also extends through to the families.

We've either been very careful or lucky. Perhaps this is because none of us have dated or married ladies who are not well educated, are financially independent or from a more promiscuous walk of life (i.e. actively hunting a westerner).

We have not been a financial or security choice, we have simply been a choice of the heart as have our better halves.

I draw attention to this not to show off (there is nothing to show off about), but to identify that when approached normally as we would in the west, a relationship has a far higher chance of success and simply being 'normal' without any major dramas, surprises or ship wrecks.. Thats not to say it doesn't happen, but the chances of a ship wreck are reduced with normalcy.

I don't believe you, hang on, I might believe this is what you think, but that would make you hopelessly naive, and I do know lots of guys with their heads in the sand, being fooled by their 'nearest and dearest' aka 'suckers'.

Oh, and these sorts of guys always make the same claims, our girls are our age, were never hookers, are educated, have good jobs, etc.

Edited June 6, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[eek]

As soon as someone disrespects you, be it friendship, relationship, or general interactions, and you allow that to happen, you will be low in their regard and feel even less respect for you.

Some just automatically take advantage of the fact a person ALLOWS themselves to be treated like dirt. Hard to have respect for someone who doesnt respect themselves. In that case, work on yourself first.

But, some people are skilled manipulators, starting with a few subtle digs, particularly clever if they are actually initially truths..but then, the digs and comments start chipping away at you. Once they know they have you, and know your weaknesses, its easy to emotionally blackmail and manipulate every situation for their benifit. Often control freaks and/or selfish self-absorbed narcisists. Utterly toxic.

[richard_smith237]

Farang's That Have A Lower Standing As Dogs / Do They Deserver It?

I've personally never experienced it, I also don't know any Western friends who are in relationships with Thai ladies and have a relationship consisting of anything other than mutual respect. This also extends through to the families.

We've either been very careful or lucky. Perhaps this is because none of us have dated or married ladies who are not well educated, are financially independent or from a more promiscuous walk of life (i.e. actively hunting a westerner).

We have not been a financial or security choice, we have simply been a choice of the heart as have our better halves.

I draw attention to this not to show off (there is nothing to show off about), but to identify that when approached normally as we would in the west, a relationship has a far higher chance of success and simply being 'normal' without any major dramas, surprises or ship wrecks.. Thats not to say it doesn't happen, but the chances of a ship wreck are reduced with normalcy.

I don't believe you, hang on, I might believe this is what you think, but that would make you hopelessly naive, and I do know lots of guys with their heads in the sand, being fooled by their 'nearest and dearest' aka 'suckers'.

Oh, and these sorts of guys always make the same claims, our girls are our age, were never hookers, are educated, have good jobs, etc.

Your cynicism is noted, your logic unsound, your opinion fundamentally flawed.

You are implying that by being in happy and normal relationship I might be naïve, have my head buried in the sand and be blinded by lust. That friends and I are on the cusp of being treated worse than dogs, that our relationships are on the brink of imminent collapse and that we blindly go forth towards catastrophe.

It is incredible how you suppose to know me better than I do !

I very much doubt that Daughters of Politicians, Lawyers, Chula Professors, Thammarsat Masters graduates etc… were ever hookers. I also very much doubt that many people could consider those who date or marry such ladies be considered suckers. I do however doubt that you could believe that westerners can end up with normal people because that appears to fall so far outside of your range of mongering experience.

You may choose to lie with dogs, wake up bitten by fleas and pass all judgment based on this experience. However, by periodically thinking beyond the gutter and outside of your ‘box of experience’ you might enhance your insight beyond the levels of general disappointment….

Edited June 6, 2012 by richard_smith237

[TommoPhysicist]

It is incredible how you suppose to know me better than I do !

I very much doubt that Daughters of Politicians, Lawyers, Chula Professors, Thammarsat Masters graduates etc… were ever hookers. I also very much doubt that many people could consider those who date or marry such ladies be considered suckers. I do however doubt that you could believe that westerners can end up with normal people because that appears to fall so far outside of your range of mongering experience.

I don't know you, but I know your sort.

And they all think that no Daughters of Politicians, Lawyers, Chula Professors, Thammarsat Masters graduates etc… won't cheat them or sleep with men for money. They are wrong, not all will but enough will.

PS

As for the 'monger' insult, I've only had sex with one woman in Thailand, and that is my wife (can you say the same?).

PPS

A person that thinks Thai Politicians and Lawyers (or their daughters) don't lie, steal or cheat ........ 555, that has to be a first.

Edited June 6, 2012 by TommoPhysicist