2 Quick Questions About Rice.

[pattayadingo]

Hopefully these are not totally idiotic questions

Up in Nong Buah Lam Phu in the Khon Kaen area.

When are they due or likely to start the new rice planting?

Roughly how much Baht per Rai does it cost to buy the rice, clean the paddies and plant the rice? ( I realise this may be lacking in actual content about labour, machines etc., but am looking for a rough cost only).

Thanks

[ozzydom]

It depends on a few factors,

do they have their own machine (iron buffalo)

do they broadcast seed or transplant

did they save seed from last harvest or have to buy

[loong]

I can't offer any advice, but it would be good for people to know how many rai you are considering farming.

I am just venturing into cassava farming and my biggest fear is being unable to get labour come harvest time. Round here people would rather lay around all day than work for less that 250 Baht plus food per day. 2 years ago, they would work for 100 or 150 Bt per day, not anymore. What will it be like at harvest time when everyone is hiring and labour is short?

I am going out to do some work every day. I can't get anybody to work. If it is raining, they say that it will make them sick. If the sun is shining, it's too hot.

[tingtong]

since we are near that general area, here is what i have as costs (this year)

plowing x2....250 baht/rai...(last year it went for 280, maybe more competition).

spraying weedkiller, around 100thb/rai for the chemical, we do our own spraying so no cost for work, else they charge 250thb/200liter sprayed here (exclude the chemical cost)...1 rai needs around 60-80liter...

we broadcast the rice, the same time the 2nd plowing (or whatever then they doing ) is done.

the seed you can buy from farmers i guess, probably not that much more expensive than selling goes...

today's price at rice buyers in my location was 13.20thb/kg for sticky rice, 15thb/kg for hom mali/jasmine rice.

as i see, the rice seed is the cheapest imput in the whole process.

so much for planting costs and getting it started.

...then comes fertiliser, and comes more weed spraying, more fertiliser, and harvest....

hope helped a bit, as i mentioned, all the prices above are very current, we are right in the middle of planting...

[fezzy]

We have relatives in Bang Fang Khon Kaen and they start getting the land ready for plowing after the first rain ,as it will soften the land to make easy work for the tractors . Then they can plant the rice .They harvest will be sometime around November December.

[pattayadingo]

since we are near that general area, here is what i have as costs (this year)

plowing x2....250 baht/rai...(last year it went for 280, maybe more competition).

spraying weedkiller, around 100thb/rai for the chemical, we do our own spraying so no cost for work, else they charge 250thb/200liter sprayed here (exclude the chemical cost)...1 rai needs around 60-80liter...

we broadcast the rice, the same time the 2nd plowing (or whatever then they doing ) is done.

the seed you can buy from farmers i guess, probably not that much more expensive than selling goes...

today's price at rice buyers in my location was 13.20thb/kg for sticky rice, 15thb/kg for hom mali/jasmine rice.

as i see, the rice seed is the cheapest imput in the whole process.

so much for planting costs and getting it started.

...then comes fertiliser, and comes more weed spraying, more fertiliser, and harvest....

hope helped a bit, as i mentioned, all the prices above are very current, we are right in the middle of planting...

Thanks for that. Helpful information too. I appreciate you taking the time to post the details.

[pattayadingo]

I personally am not wanting to start a rice farm but have a friend who is being asked to help pay for the new planting season. He has no computer so cannot access the internet like we can for information. Also he is a pensioner and likes to take care of his limited funds so I said I can at least ask for a general idea on the cost per Rai, hence the question on here.

I doubt if they have their own machine but from what I understand the family do not have much money (as ever here) or so they say.

tingtong's post is helpful and I can calculate that and pass the information on and leave the rest up to him.

[tingtong]

if they have no mashines, even more relevent the prices i gave, since all we own a sprayer.

the tractor prices and harvester price are all contracted work.

[pattayadingo]

if they have no mashines, even more relevent the prices i gave, since all we own a sprayer.

the tractor prices and harvester price are all contracted work.

i asked this afternoon.

They have no machines at all. And this is for 5 Rai of rice. Seems they want 20000 Baht.

[IsaanAussie]

Perhaps I can help. "New" Seed rice is usually purchased after two or three seasons and is quite expensive. This year we still havent had enough rain to get the plough in the ground. There was no seed left in the grain merchants and we bought first season paddy rice paying 7,000 baht for 300Kg.

If this family has no transport they will have to pay someone to cart it as well. But work on the seed being around 24 baht a kg and 25 kg per rai needed to hand broadcast. If they buy in sacks of seed then for 5 rai, 5 sacks.

The process here is to spray the weeds a week before plough and planting. The herbicide comes in 5 litre jugs and we use i jug per 4 rai, The guy that sprays it brings the gear and dilutes and dispenses in 200 litre drums to use the chemicals up. He charges by the 200 litre drum sprayed.

My tractor is out of commission so we use a local guy who runs a plough that has a rake mounted as well so the process is to plough and rake the seed into the ground. I used to plough first and then rotary hoe, broadcast the seed and then rotary again.

Other prices are close to what TingTong has given and he is closer to the area in question.

As a general statement, the 20,000 baht sounds a pretty realistic budget to get the rice grown and harvested by a family that has no gear hence must pay others to do the work.

Remember they are Thai and you have to understand a bottle of whiskey before the workers start and when they finish is expected. Often meals are included and a trip to buy seed and chemicals has a cost as well. It is those extras that run the bill up.

If your friends money is tight then not all needs to be handed over at once. There is the preparation and planting, two fertiliser applications then harvesting spread over the three to five month growing period dependant on rice type. If you want a guess, then I would suggest 10K first, another 3 in a month then 7 at harvest should fix most methods of harvesting. But please take that with a heavy warning that it is only a guess.

Paying in stages stops the money "leeching" away on other things if you are not there to watch things, but Thai culture really dictates that you should hand it over and then butt out. That money, the way it is spent and the rice at the end belongs to the head of the family and dispersements are up to him.

Edited June 16, 2012 by IsaanAussie

[David48]

IsaanAussie ... I really like your post above.

From both a technical view point (and I know sh*it about rice apart from I learnt from my ex in Udon and her rice farming family) and from the business plan offered.

Not only factual but also the Cultural insight in the last paragraph.

My gf is coming to Australia for 3 months and is the main bread winner in the Farm Family and I have never offered a stipend, but made the undertaking to support the Farm when she can no longer work.

Well she has quit her job and now my promise will be forthcoming.

But, and it's a big but, I refuse to pay the 3 months in a lump sum for exactly the reason that you alluded to above ... but my spin is more attuned to some Thai's are poor Budget Planners, so better to pay little and often and when needed then in a lump sum at the beginning.

[IsaanAussie]

Yeah, that is a tough one to come to terms with. It has taken me years to just accept it the way it should be done. Nar, I'm not all the way there yet. But consider what happens on holidays when those working in the big smoke come home to the village. The smart ones bring only as much as they are prepared to hand over and within a day or two it is gone and that is the end of it. The rural people can get past with practical nothing, they just get on with it. It appears that money to a Thai is like vegemite to me, lovely to have but you can get by without it.

My advice is to ask the GF what she would do and follow what she says.

Here, one of the brothers is away working and the other just a village drunk. Every time the one that has a few bucks comes home he antes up when his brother asks but he gives the money to my wife to dispense as she sees fit. And believe me it doesnt get given out lightly. They do have a system and it seems to work.

[ozzydom]

Of course another way to look at IA,s mates situation is that 20,000 baht is within the ballpark of what they will receive for the crop, will the family bank this so as to have the finances to cover the next years crop or will the hand be held out again?

I would lay a bet on what the answer to that will be.

As this cash crop will be their annual income some will be sold and some held for home consumption,The cash will be gone in a flash so apart from a bit of rice to eat (maybe) they will be no better off.

Cash is available to Thais with land for planting from within the village system so it is not imperative that these funds come from a benevolent farang..

The difference is that one is to be repaid with interest while the other is a "gift".

[David48]

Cash is available to Thais with land for planting from within the village system so it is not imperative that these funds come from a benevolent farang..

The difference is that one is to be repaid with interest while the other is a "gift".

... and ozzydom supplies the other book-end of an excellent post.

The concept of a 'Thai Loan'. That is of money that is 'lent' with the agreement that it is paid back, but in reality, the loan is never repaid and if it comes from you ... it is assumed to be 'gifted'.

I only 'loaned' one time, only 3,000 Baht, only had to learn that lesson one time ... ... I'm a fast learner!

Edited June 17, 2012 by David48

[David48]

Here, one of the brothers is away working and the other just a village drunk. Every time the one that has a few bucks comes home he antes up when his brother asks but he gives the money to my wife to dispense as she sees fit. And believe me it doesnt get given out lightly. They do have a system and it seems to work.

I know exactly what you mean. There is no effective Tax System in Thailand amongst the Cash Economy ... nor really an effective Social Welfare System.

But IsaanAussie, what you have described above is very close to the effective redistribution of wealth form those who have to those who are most in need.

And while there are exceptions, the head Lassie does rule the roost, rules with an iron fist (full of dollars) but rules fairly and your statement

gives the money to my wife to dispense as she sees fit. And believe me it doesn’t get given out lightly. They do have a system and it seems to work.

is how I have seen it work.

[cheeryble]

If I let someone grow rice how much per crop would I expect as a "rental"?

I envisage building on the land eventually, but maybe building and garden to be left as "islands" in a sea of rice.

Would they have valid objections if I raised some "island" areas with fill so that demarcation borders of vegetation could be grown, trees started, and fill allowed to settle for foundations?

Cheeryble