Thai Police Arrest 19 North Korean Refugees

[webfact]

Thai police arrest 19 North Korean refugees

Bangkok, June 22, 2012 (AFP) - Police arrested 19 North Korean refugees in northern Thailand on Friday who asked to be sent to a "third country", most likely South Korea, officials said, and charged them with illegal entry.

The 11 women and eight men were taken into custody on a bank of the Mekong river in Chiang Rai province, some 780 kilometres (490 miles) north of Bangkok, after they disembarked from a boat, local police said.

An immigration officer confirmed the arrests, explaining they will be fined or jailed in lieu of money, and sent to a holding centre in Bangkok to wait to see if another country will accept them.

"They said they want to go to a third country, which normally means South Korea," said Lieutenant Colonel Kriangkrai Ariyaying, immigration chief in northern Chiang Saen district.

Almost all refugees escaping from North Korea make their way on foot to China but face repatriation if caught there.

Many then travel surreptitiously on what is nicknamed the "underground railway" to Southeast Asia and then seek resettlement in South Korea.

The Mekong river snakes through China's Yunnan province, Myanmar and Laos before reaching Thailand, where the refugees often disembark in the knowledge Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea.

Some 22,000 North Koreans have defected from their impoverished and hunger-stricken homeland for South Korea since the 1950-1953 war, the vast majority in recent years.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2012-06-22

[mickyboy]

wish them well for there future

[Steele404]

a start up salary, a condo apartment and a new life awaits them in South Korea

[Payboy]

"They said they want to go to a third country, which normally means South Korea,"

No it means "please don't put us on an engine-less boat without food and water and tow us out to the high seas"

Edited June 22, 2012 by Payboy

[TomTao]

I wish them all the best, I hope they are sent to their new homes sooner rather than later.

[Semper]

What's wrong with NK? The leader/s in the country says that it's the country to stay in. Could they be wrong?

[Jessi]

I hope they can find a new life.

Australia welcomes boat people with open arms.

[ManInSurat]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

China has a policy of returning refugees, which is terribly sad knowing what life (death) the people will be forced to return to and the fact their family and extended family will be affected too. I think Russia is the same.

If anyone's interested I was reading a heartwarming article about some defectors today that have their own talent-cum-chatshow in South Korea. Check it out here.

If there's people here who want to do some more research and get a really good picture of DPRK then I highly recommend this book. Check it out here. I managed to get it as a downloadable audiobook. So sad and poignant and moving.

a start up salary, a condo apartment and a new life awaits them in South Korea

"Though more than 23,000 North Koreans have made their way south since the 1990s, they find it hard to settle in, ending up in menial jobs and often shunned by their southern brethren."

Quoted from a source I linked above. Alright it's the DailyMail but I have no reason to doubt them over this statement.

I'd still imagine it's a much better life than the alternative. Just trying to put across the idea that it's not all a bed of roses as everyone seems to think with defectors, not to mention what happens to the defectors' families after. That must be a terribly difficult thing to have to live with.

What a horrible situation to have to be born into.

I wish you the very best luck in the world defectors and may your families be safe. Thinking of you here in Thailand.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Edited June 22, 2012 by ManInSurat

[geriatrickid]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Why would you say this? Under international refugee conventions, Thailand should not return the North Koreans. The fact that the Chinese do so, only speaks to China's complete disregard for human rights and its lack of both compassion and morality. China's position is understandable though, since North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese. Thailand on the other hand needs to stay on good terms with South Korea, and the west. Unlike the situation with the Rohingyas, these countries would protest and Thailand would get a retaliatory smack if the refugees were deported. The reality is that it would have been difficult to get these people back to North Korea. It's much easier to dump the refugees from Myanmar and Laos. No one really cares about them and the protests from countries are somewhat hollow. Yes, the Thai government is to be commended for doing the right thing, but do we need to commend a government for being moral and complying with international refugee conventions? It's not as if Thailand is going to pick up the bill for these people. South Korea will provide the moneies necessary to care for the refugees.

[elshaheen]

Thai police arrest 19 North Korean refugees

Bangkok, June 22, 2012 (AFP) - Police arrested 19 North Korean refugees in northern Thailand on Friday who asked to be sent to a "third country", most likely South Korea, officials said, and charged them with illegal entry.

From what I gather from this article, North Koreans are still not satisfied with their new leader Kim Jong Un and desire to be with their southern counterparts – South Koreans.

From what I remember when North Koreans settle in South Korea, they are welcome with open arms and the process of reassimilation begins back into South Koreas culture. I have read stories about the plight of North Koreans coming to Thailand seeking Asylum and end up being sent to South Korea to live, to get job training and start a new life.

I know that the journey from North Korea to say Thailand is very traitorous and chances of being caught is horrifying. I know that Thailand and South Korea have good relations with each other so North Koreans feel comfortable to escape to Thailand and seek refuge knowing they will have to serve a little time and if they are fined South Korean embassy in Thailand will simply pay it off for them.

Here is an article about North Koreans coming to South Korea.

http://laurapohl.com/hope-and-struggle-among-north-koreans-living-in-south-korea/

[ManInSurat]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Why would you say this? Under international refugee conventions, Thailand should not return the North Koreans. The fact that the Chinese do so, only speaks to China's complete disregard for human rights and its lack of both compassion and morality. China's position is understandable though, since North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese. Thailand on the other hand needs to stay on good terms with South Korea, and the west. Unlike the situation with the Rohingyas, these countries would protest and Thailand would get a retaliatory smack if the refugees were deported. The reality is that it would have been difficult to get these people back to North Korea. It's much easier to dump the refugees from Myanmar and Laos. No one really cares about them and the protests from countries are somewhat hollow. Yes, the Thai government is to be commended for doing the right thing, but do we need to commend a government for being moral and complying with international refugee conventions? It's not as if Thailand is going to pick up the bill for these people. South Korea will provide the moneies necessary to care for the refugees.

Because any progress that Thailand can make towards its dealings with refugees from other Asian countries is definitely to be encouraged, if at all possible in the hope this becomes their blanket policy for all genuine refugees.

I distictly remember the boat full of ethnic Rohingyas being left to rot on a powerless boat from a couple of years back.

I'd say that now Burma has moved into sharp focus for good reasons, the ethnic minorities from there won't be treated anywhere near as badly.

Also because the fact Sino-Thai relations run very very deep in this country and you'd expect Thailand to follow suit.

Smack Thailand? LOL! Like Thailand would even care.

I know you're highly critical of the Thai system GA so I really don't want this to degenerate in a "my point is more valid and correct than your point" fight. You have your agenda, for whatever reason. That's cool, but I'm not really up for it.

My real sentiment here is - Well done defectors. I wish you the best in your new lives and are thinking of you and your families. People know about your plight and are genuinely moved by it.

Edited June 22, 2012 by ManInSurat

[baboon]

It is a pity that in all probability they will be desperately unhappy with their new lives in the south. Northerners have terrible trouble assimilating themselves. In my opinion, they would be far better off in Nakhon Nowhere - they would understand the way of life better.

[h90]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Why would you say this? Under international refugee conventions, Thailand should not return the North Koreans. The fact that the Chinese do so, only speaks to China's complete disregard for human rights and its lack of both compassion and morality. China's position is understandable though, since North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese. Thailand on the other hand needs to stay on good terms with South Korea, and the west. Unlike the situation with the Rohingyas, these countries would protest and Thailand would get a retaliatory smack if the refugees were deported. The reality is that it would have been difficult to get these people back to North Korea. It's much easier to dump the refugees from Myanmar and Laos. No one really cares about them and the protests from countries are somewhat hollow. Yes, the Thai government is to be commended for doing the right thing, but do we need to commend a government for being moral and complying with international refugee conventions? It's not as if Thailand is going to pick up the bill for these people. South Korea will provide the moneies necessary to care for the refugees.

Well China and North Korea allied. Thailand is doing exactly the same if the USA want to have someone. Well known example is Victor Bout, but there are a couple of other examples.

[ManInSurat]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Why would you say this? Under international refugee conventions, Thailand should not return the North Koreans. The fact that the Chinese do so, only speaks to China's complete disregard for human rights and its lack of both compassion and morality. China's position is understandable though, since North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese. Thailand on the other hand needs to stay on good terms with South Korea, and the west. Unlike the situation with the Rohingyas, these countries would protest and Thailand would get a retaliatory smack if the refugees were deported. The reality is that it would have been difficult to get these people back to North Korea. It's much easier to dump the refugees from Myanmar and Laos. No one really cares about them and the protests from countries are somewhat hollow. Yes, the Thai government is to be commended for doing the right thing, but do we need to commend a government for being moral and complying with international refugee conventions? It's not as if Thailand is going to pick up the bill for these people. South Korea will provide the moneies necessary to care for the refugees.

Well China and North Korea allied. Thailand is doing exactly the same if the USA want to have someone. Well known example is Victor Bout, but there are a couple of other examples.

The "Lord of War" and an impoverished rural people being brutally opressed by the most insular and draconian government in the world are the same are they?

Extradition for serious crimes and refugeeism are the same how exactly?

[h90]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Why would you say this? Under international refugee conventions, Thailand should not return the North Koreans. The fact that the Chinese do so, only speaks to China's complete disregard for human rights and its lack of both compassion and morality. China's position is understandable though, since North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese. Thailand on the other hand needs to stay on good terms with South Korea, and the west. Unlike the situation with the Rohingyas, these countries would protest and Thailand would get a retaliatory smack if the refugees were deported. The reality is that it would have been difficult to get these people back to North Korea. It's much easier to dump the refugees from Myanmar and Laos. No one really cares about them and the protests from countries are somewhat hollow. Yes, the Thai government is to be commended for doing the right thing, but do we need to commend a government for being moral and complying with international refugee conventions? It's not as if Thailand is going to pick up the bill for these people. South Korea will provide the moneies necessary to care for the refugees.

Well China and North Korea allied. Thailand is doing exactly the same if the USA want to have someone. Well known example is Victor Bout, but there are a couple of other examples.

The "Lord of War" and an impoverished rural people being brutally opressed by the most insular and draconian government in the world are the same are they?

Extradition for serious crimes and refugeeism are the same how exactly?

Only the USA claims that he is the "Lord of War" he did not comment any crime inside Thailand and per international law you can only extradite him to either his home country or a country where he committed crime.

Sure NK isn't a nice country, but our thinking is influenced what propaganda is telling us. What would you think about the USA when you hear NK propaganda about the US president is proud to select victims to be killed without trial, even own citizen and that without any proof that they did something wrong.

I really don't know for NK, but it happens that I know some people from Iran (one is Atheist and Manager of a big state enterprise) and the difference between real life in Iran and what the propaganda makes us believe couldn't be bigger. For NK it might or might not be the same.

[Thinkingofachange]

It is a pity that in all probability they will be desperately unhappy with their new lives in the south. Northerners have terrible trouble assimilating themselves. In my opinion, they would be far better off in Nakhon Nowhere - they would understand the way of life better.

This is bull. I worked with North Korean refugees for two years. They assimilate in South Korea VERY well and are very happy there--except, of course, for the memories of what happened to them in the North and the thoughts of family members they left behind.

[ManInSurat]

Only the USA claims that he is the "Lord of War" he did not comment any crime inside Thailand and per international law you can only extradite him to either his home country or a country where he committed crime.

Sure NK isn't a nice country, but our thinking is influenced what propaganda is telling us. What would you think about the USA when you hear NK propaganda about the US president is proud to select victims to be killed without trial, even own citizen and that without any proof that they did something wrong.

I really don't know for NK, but it happens that I know some people from Iran (one is Atheist and Manager of a big state enterprise) and the difference between real life in Iran and what the propaganda makes us believe couldn't be bigger. For NK it might or might not be the same.

I've read accounts from people who have lived in a North Korean gulag for 10 years. Specifically "The Aquariums of Pyongyang" by Kang Chol-Hwan as well as other reading. I've done a lot of reasearch on the place. You only have to see a satellite photograph of DPRK at night to make this point. There's nowhere in the world as densely populated as North Korea that is totally black at night. No electrical light, where there should be.

That's just one of a thousand examples I could give. They have no internet access, mobile phones, everything they see and hear is manipulated for them to be indoctrinated into the largest cult in the world. There's no other description for it. It's also the only hereditary communist country to have ever existed. They don't just go after dissenters, they go after their entire families too.

The only good thing I have to say about DPRK is that they allegedly have the highest literacy rate in the world. Something like 99%. Only really so they can be sure that all their citizens are indoctrinated as young and as quickly as possible.

No foreign journalists, doctors, government empoyees are ever allowed to be alone in that country. Anywhere. Ever. For any reason. Everything that's ever been seen of DPKR is only what their government allows you to see. There's some images somewhere from a Swedish eye doctor that managed to sneak some photos of real DPKR and it's like looking into a world from 100 years ago. There is evidence to back this up, not to mention the plethora of satellite photos available to be found from Google to back all this up.

You do realise Jong-Il is alleged to be responsible for the death of over 2 million of his own people through starvation in the world's only case of starvation (out of wartime) in a country that can easily feed itself, that I can think of. That's one tenth of the population.

For you to say that it's all propaganda in the face of all of this is really very laughable. Now onto your point about Iran...

Iran? What the country that allows female drivers, unpoliced internet use and smartphones? I know Iran has its fair share of problems and their government can be brutal but I know they do have moderates there and those voices do get heard or I wouldn't know about them.

Extradition and dealing with refugees are not the same thing, however you want to try and spin it. It's a very irrelevant comparison.

As for Russia's standpoint on Bout, taken from Wikipedia....

"On 18 November 2010, shortly after Bout's extradition to the United States, Russian President Medvedev's aide Sergei Eduardovich Prikhodko claimed that Russia had "nothing to hide" in Bout's criminal case stating, "it is in our interest that the investigation ... be brought to completion, and [bout] should answer all the questions the American justice system has."

Russia are whiter than white too, aren't they? I still laugh when I hear about Putin's 107% ballot victory in Chechnya. Now that IS impressive!

I've lived and worked with a Russian for 6 years and it was he who brought this to my attention.

You drawing a comparison to these two incidents is totally ridiculous, I don't change that perspective in any way and there's nothing you can say to make me change my mind.

Edited June 22, 2012 by ManInSurat

[baboon]

It is a pity that in all probability they will be desperately unhappy with their new lives in the south. Northerners have terrible trouble assimilating themselves. In my opinion, they would be far better off in Nakhon Nowhere - they would understand the way of life better.

This is bull. I worked with North Korean refugees for two years. They assimilate in South Korea VERY well and are very happy there--except, of course, for the memories of what happened to them in the North and the thoughts of family members they left behind.

Fair enough; if you say so. Barbara Demick, Tim Beal, Kang Chol-Hwan and Shin Dong-hyuk must have the wrong end of the stick.

[Nisa]

Interesting but sad ...

http://www.voanews.com/content/north-korean-refugees-seek-freedom-via-thailand-136370353/150081.html

Edited June 22, 2012 by Nisa

[chainarong]

I hope they can find a new life.

Australia welcomes boat people with open arms.

I beg to differ, the Australian Government welcomes boat people , very few of the population do

[Thinkingofachange]

It is a pity that in all probability they will be desperately unhappy with their new lives in the south. Northerners have terrible trouble assimilating themselves. In my opinion, they would be far better off in Nakhon Nowhere - they would understand the way of life better.

This is bull. I worked with North Korean refugees for two years. They assimilate in South Korea VERY well and are very happy there--except, of course, for the memories of what happened to them in the North and the thoughts of family members they left behind.

Fair enough; if you say so. Barbara Demick, Tim Beal, Kang Chol-Hwan and Shin Dong-hyuk must have the wrong end of the stick.

None of the authors you mention suggest that they are "desperately unhappy". Of course it isn't easy to assimilate, but it's far easier than staying in North Korea.

[baboon]

It is a pity that in all probability they will be desperately unhappy with their new lives in the south. Northerners have terrible trouble assimilating themselves. In my opinion, they would be far better off in Nakhon Nowhere - they would understand the way of life better.

This is bull. I worked with North Korean refugees for two years. They assimilate in South Korea VERY well and are very happy there--except, of course, for the memories of what happened to them in the North and the thoughts of family members they left behind.

Fair enough; if you say so. Barbara Demick, Tim Beal, Kang Chol-Hwan and Shin Dong-hyuk must have the wrong end of the stick.

None of the authors you mention suggest that they are "desperately unhappy". Of course it isn't easy to assimilate, but it's far easier than staying in North Korea.

"A poll conducted by a South Korean daily in September on 100 defectors showed 69 percent would prefer emigrating to western countries such as the U.S, Canada and Australia over stayig in the South. Thirty-three percent of those surveyed said they would return to North Korea if they could." One of the above authors. I do not know the September of which year in the above quote.

[supaprik]

"An immigration officer confirmed the arrests, explaining they will be fined or jailed in lieu of money, and sent to a holding centre in Bangkok to wait to see if another country will accept them."

You have to love this quote....

Meaning that, If you had money you would not be arrested?......

Wish them well though for sure....

[noitom]

Asian nations show very little by way of humanitarian behavior. Hard to say which one is more selfish and self absorbed.

[crocken]

I hope they can find a new life.

Australia welcomes boat people with open arms.

I beg to differ, the Australian Government welcomes boat people , very few of the population do

i think he is pulling your leg....

[h90]

Only the USA claims that he is the "Lord of War" he did not comment any crime inside Thailand and per international law you can only extradite him to either his home country or a country where he committed crime.

Sure NK isn't a nice country, but our thinking is influenced what propaganda is telling us. What would you think about the USA when you hear NK propaganda about the US president is proud to select victims to be killed without trial, even own citizen and that without any proof that they did something wrong.

I really don't know for NK, but it happens that I know some people from Iran (one is Atheist and Manager of a big state enterprise) and the difference between real life in Iran and what the propaganda makes us believe couldn't be bigger. For NK it might or might not be the same.

I've read accounts from people who have lived in a North Korean gulag for 10 years. Specifically "The Aquariums of Pyongyang" by Kang Chol-Hwan as well as other reading. I've done a lot of reasearch on the place. You only have to see a satellite photograph of DPRK at night to make this point. There's nowhere in the world as densely populated as North Korea that is totally black at night. No electrical light, where there should be.

That's just one of a thousand examples I could give. They have no internet access, mobile phones, everything they see and hear is manipulated for them to be indoctrinated into the largest cult in the world. There's no other description for it. It's also the only hereditary communist country to have ever existed. They don't just go after dissenters, they go after their entire families too.

The only good thing I have to say about DPRK is that they allegedly have the highest literacy rate in the world. Something like 99%. Only really so they can be sure that all their citizens are indoctrinated as young and as quickly as possible.

No foreign journalists, doctors, government empoyees are ever allowed to be alone in that country. Anywhere. Ever. For any reason. Everything that's ever been seen of DPKR is only what their government allows you to see. There's some images somewhere from a Swedish eye doctor that managed to sneak some photos of real DPKR and it's like looking into a world from 100 years ago. There is evidence to back this up, not to mention the plethora of satellite photos available to be found from Google to back all this up.

You do realise Jong-Il is alleged to be responsible for the death of over 2 million of his own people through starvation in the world's only case of starvation (out of wartime) in a country that can easily feed itself, that I can think of. That's one tenth of the population.

For you to say that it's all propaganda in the face of all of this is really very laughable. Now onto your point about Iran...

Iran? What the country that allows female drivers, unpoliced internet use and smartphones? I know Iran has its fair share of problems and their government can be brutal but I know they do have moderates there and those voices do get heard or I wouldn't know about them.

Extradition and dealing with refugees are not the same thing, however you want to try and spin it. It's a very irrelevant comparison.

As for Russia's standpoint on Bout, taken from Wikipedia....

"On 18 November 2010, shortly after Bout's extradition to the United States, Russian President Medvedev's aide Sergei Eduardovich Prikhodko claimed that Russia had "nothing to hide" in Bout's criminal case stating, "it is in our interest that the investigation ... be brought to completion, and [bout] should answer all the questions the American justice system has."

Russia are whiter than white too, aren't they? I still laugh when I hear about Putin's 107% ballot victory in Chechnya. Now that IS impressive!

I've lived and worked with a Russian for 6 years and it was he who brought this to my attention.

You drawing a comparison to these two incidents is totally ridiculous, I don't change that perspective in any way and there's nothing you can say to make me change my mind.

First of all, I never said that North Korea is in any way good or successful. But the only fact is not having light in the night. Everything else can be believed or not. Read all the horror stories about Cuba.....99% were just not true. Read all the horror story about Gaddafi, 99 % are proven to be fake. Read the stories about Iraqs weapons of mass destruction and Uranium imports....100 % not true.

Now we have North Korea and everything we hear should be 100 % true? A lot people have been there on holidays already. All report that everything is controlled, you can't make freely photos, the country is poor, but no one say terrible scared people, no one saw starving people.

As well I recall East Germany....All the horror stories. They got a friend 3 times trying to escape to the west. He tells now the freedom isn't much better than the old system.

I am not sure if the North Korean refuges know how it is to stay in the slums in free Philippines or in Jakarta. Or even in New York in Winter. Or some South American, Cariban countries. In North Korea like every hardcore communist country you have housing, job and medical care, contraception.

If I would be a woman I would prefer NK over Saudi Arabia or now free Afghanistan or Iraq.

[kiniyow]

No more Koreans please..Golf courses are already Packed with Koreans...

[h90]

No more Koreans please..Golf courses are already Packed with Koreans...

But I guess the percentage of North Korean golf player is rather low. The world most famous NK golf player passed away already.

[pacovl46]

I find it ridiculous that they fine them here in Thailand considering they're from North Korea.

[Dork]

"Thai authorities will not repatriate them to North Korea."

A massive thumbs up to the Thais for this. Spot on.

Good job again Thai Gov't. 10/10!

Why would you say this? Under international refugee conventions, Thailand should not return the North Koreans. The fact that the Chinese do so, only speaks to China's complete disregard for human rights and its lack of both compassion and morality. China's position is understandable though, since North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese. Thailand on the other hand needs to stay on good terms with South Korea, and the west. Unlike the situation with the Rohingyas, these countries would protest and Thailand would get a retaliatory smack if the refugees were deported. The reality is that it would have been difficult to get these people back to North Korea. It's much easier to dump the refugees from Myanmar and Laos. No one really cares about them and the protests from countries are somewhat hollow. Yes, the Thai government is to be commended for doing the right thing, but do we need to commend a government for being moral and complying with international refugee conventions? It's not as if Thailand is going to pick up the bill for these people. South Korea will provide the moneies necessary to care for the refugees.

"North Korea is a quasi proxy state created by the Chinese"

Strange thing to say.