Are Farangs Not To Blame For Bringing Thai Problems Upon Themselves

[David48]

We should start a support club.....for those that wish to remain ignorant...yet happy.

I'll captain it.

May be your happiness is due to ignorance

Captain my Captain ...

Ignorance is bliss!

.

Edited July 5, 2012 by David48

[travelmann]

As for talking, the vast majority of them have nothing really interesting to say. Yes, I do speak Thai. Their thoughts and ideas are generally quite small and limited. This is true for "educated" ones, too. Not just the farmers.

Just telling it like it is.

Well there are educated and educated.....These with university degree that can't count to ten and than there are these mostly Chinese-Thais who are REALLY educated. They have ideas and discuss about international politics etc etc, but you won't find them easily as they don't mix much with the normal population as they are bored of them.

You both have a good point, the bulk of the population appear ( note I said appear) to be like Paully says, I do have some friends who have a good education and they talk very much differently, most often working abroad for many years.

One worked for Thai air all his life the other en electrical engineer also worked in many European countries, they are really nice folk.

[PaullyW]

^^ Yes, in a country of 65+ million people, we will find a handful who are different, but, sadly, Thai culture is STRONG and they seem almost genetically predisposed to not being able to break the mould as it were. I've been to countries all over the world. Literally dozens upon dozens. And, I've found Thailand to be in a handful of countries that are so boring and inward focused and to almost completely lack intellectual curiosity esp about the world outside their country.

Has nothing to do with being a poor country either. Non of the African countries I've been to have been so bad. Most of the Central and South American countries I've been to and lived in have been better.

[cdnmatt]

^^ Yes, in a country of 65+ million people, we will find a handful who are different, but, sadly, Thai culture is STRONG and they seem almost genetically predisposed to not being able to break the mould as it were. I've been to countries all over the world. Literally dozens upon dozens. And, I've found Thailand to be in a handful of countries that are so boring and inward focused and to almost completely lack intellectual curiosity esp about the world outside their country.

Has nothing to do with being a poor country either. Non of the African countries I've been to have been so bad. Most of the Central and South American countries I've been to and lived in have been better.

So in other words the elites in Thailand have done their jobs well?

"No thinking! Just work, and do what we say!"

Edited July 5, 2012 by cdnmatt

[StreetCowboy]

Life can be very strange sometimes. My ex-neighbour, a Swiss guy who speak Thai more than fluently,hard working, married with a Thai Lady, 2 children including an adopted one, sharing ( paying ) drinks on a daily basis with the neighbourhood, left 2 yrs ago, after 15 yrs in LOS, totally disappointed.

Some other selfish foreigners, no wife, no clue about Thai language and culture, seem to be comfortable,harshly criticizing every aspect of our host country...Yet they seem to be reasonably happy with themselves.

Well, some questions just can't be answered, i guess.

A Swiss paying drinks on a daily basis for someone else.....

No way....more probable he was a KGB spy pretending to be Swiss.

I'm guessing you had to go undercover, to live amongst them, to become so familiar with their national characteristics. Did you have a Swiss role?

SC

[HardenedSoul]

How did this morph into yet another Thai-bashing thread?

[arch77778]

I started my post with "We" and i include myself.I cant speak a word of Thai .I am 76 and simply realise that if i made an effort to learn the language certain problems can be avoided.I would have liked to know the language and listen in to Thai gossip.

Thanks for the opinion of the members of this forum.

[samsiam]

We should start a support club.....for those that wish to remain ignorant...yet happy.

I'll captain it.

May be your happiness is due to ignorance

Thats what I meant...I think.

[kerryk]

How did this morph into yet another Thai-bashing thread?

Because of all the dummies who don't speak Thai.

If you had a poll asking those who speak Thai (not second hand knowledge of them) if they are problem free you would get 70% positive answers. Excluding those who are married to or know a lot of Chinese/Thai people of course.

[ripstanley]

^^ Yes, in a country of 65+ million people, we will find a handful who are different, but, sadly, Thai culture is STRONG and they seem almost genetically predisposed to not being able to break the mould as it were. I've been to countries all over the world. Literally dozens upon dozens. And, I've found Thailand to be in a handful of countries that are so boring and inward focused and to almost completely lack intellectual curiosity esp about the world outside their country.

Has nothing to do with being a poor country either. Non of the African countries I've been to have been so bad. Most of the Central and South American countries I've been to and lived in have been better.

From your post it appears that you do not like Thai society. Why do you not move on to a country that you do like their society?

[kerryk]

I started my post with "We" and i include myself.I cant speak a word of Thai .I am 76 and simply realise that if i made an effort to learn the language certain problems can be avoided.I would have liked to know the language and listen in to Thai gossip.

Thanks for the opinion of the members of this forum.

I started learning Thai at 60 and my teacher was a university professor who was 80. Go for it.

[travelmann]

How did this morph into yet another Thai-bashing thread?

Its easy any thread that tells a modicum of truth gets labelled "Thai Bashing"

[fletchsmile]

We are simply too lazy or cant be bothered.

Speak for yourself!

I read the first post. Your reply summed up my first reaction, so I couldn't help laughing...

Might as well quit while I'm ahead, and don't see much point reading past post #2

[gerry1011]

First off, anyone who calls themselves a "farang" is an idiot in my book; if you wanna be a step and fetch it go ahead and shuffle off to ya masser....

Second; why dont you go ask the westerners here who do speak Thai (and there are plenty of them) what problems they encounter, then compare.

What nonsense; not to mention wanton hubris

I am a farang who speaks fluently Thai.

I would not consider living in Thailand without being able to understand the people around me.

I must admit that I have a certain "gift" for languages, while others can learn other subjects much faster than me. Thai is not easy to learn but it is very far from being impossible (The secret of the pronunciation is in the writing. That is where to start).

It took me about two years (over 10 years back) to be fluent. Since then I made many local friends and acquaintances, and the fact that I can have a fluent conversartion with anyone here opened many doors in circles where other foreigners have much less chances to be accepted.

Another advantage of speaking and understanding Thai is that it eliminates a lot of misunderstandings due to translations, or due to certain ways of speaking and certain tones that foreigners might not interprete correctly.

Understanding the language greatly helps to understand how the society works, which in return makes it much easier to adapt to the different concepts on which the Thai society is based.

I would not say that Thailand is the paradise on earth, there are many problem here too, but I personally feel very confortable in the Thai society. If I am still here after all these years it is, for a big part, because of all the positive things that came with learning the language.

One of the greatest benefit of being able to fluently speak with, really understand, and feel good in the Thai society is that, little by little, you start to put a distance between yourself and most of the other farangs... which is to me the best way to avoid silly discussions (about politics, for example).

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

However, I must also admit that I find the lack of interest of the Thai people in learning English a bit unfortunate. I always say to my friends how nice it is to be able to speak other people's language. But maybe they don't care about understanding the farangs who don't speak Thai

Edited July 5, 2012 by gerry1011

[phl]

First off, anyone who calls themselves a "farang" is an idiot in my book; if you wanna be a step and fetch it go ahead and shuffle off to ya masser....

Second; why dont you go ask the westerners here who do speak Thai (and there are plenty of them) what problems they encounter, then compare.

What nonsense; not to mention wanton hubris

I am a farang who speaks fluently Thai.

I would not consider living in Thailand without being able to understand the people around me.

I must admit that I have a certain "gift" for languages, while others can learn other subjects much faster than me. Thai is not easy to learn but it is very far from being impossible (The secret of the pronunciation is in the writing. That is where to start).

It took me about two years (over 10 years back) to be fluent. Since then I made many local friends and acquaintances, and the fact that I can have a fluent conversartion with anyone here opened many doors in circles where other foreigners have much less chances to be accepted.

Another advantage of speaking and understanding Thai is that it eliminates a lot of misunderstandings due to translations, or due to certain ways of speaking and certain tones that foreigners might not interprete correctly.

Understanding the language greatly helps to understand how the society works, which in return makes it much easier to adapt to the different concepts on which the Thai society is based.

I would not say that Thailand is the paradise on earth, there are many problem here too, but I personally feel very confortable in the Thai society. If I am still here after all these years it is, for a big part, because of all the positive things that came with learning the language.

One of the greatest benefit of being able to fluently speak with, really understand, and feel good in the Thai society is that, little by little, you start to put a distance between yourself and most of the other farangs... which is to me the best way to avoid silly discussions (about politics, for example).

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I remember any.

However, I must also admit that I find the lack of interest of the Thai people in learning English a bit unfortunate. I always say to my friends how nice it is to be able to speak other people's language. But maybe they don't care about understanding the farangs who don't speak Thai

Very interesting read, but i must say i really love the self assessed statements of fluency in Thai.

MY neighbor claims to speak fluent Thai, not knowing my level of Thai and let me tell you the only thing he knows in Thai is how to count to 10, say hello, good bye and ask for the price.

If you have indeed mastered the language, good on you!

I have spent 4 years at school learning and can read, however i do not consider myself fluent, nor good, nor even reasonable.

But i guess we have different opinions of our own achievements and ability's

[gerry1011]

First off, anyone who calls themselves a "farang" is an idiot in my book; if you wanna be a step and fetch it go ahead and shuffle off to ya masser....

Second; why dont you go ask the westerners here who do speak Thai (and there are plenty of them) what problems they encounter, then compare.

What nonsense; not to mention wanton hubris

I am a farang who speaks fluently Thai.

I would not consider living in Thailand without being able to understand the people around me.

I must admit that I have a certain "gift" for languages, while others can learn other subjects much faster than me. Thai is not easy to learn but it is very far from being impossible (The secret of the pronunciation is in the writing. That is where to start).

It took me about two years (over 10 years back) to be fluent. Since then I made many local friends and acquaintances, and the fact that I can have a fluent conversartion with anyone here opened many doors in circles where other foreigners have much less chances to be accepted.

Another advantage of speaking and understanding Thai is that it eliminates a lot of misunderstandings due to translations, or due to certain ways of speaking and certain tones that foreigners might not interprete correctly.

Understanding the language greatly helps to understand how the society works, which in return makes it much easier to adapt to the different concepts on which the Thai society is based.

I would not say that Thailand is the paradise on earth, there are many problem here too, but I personally feel very confortable in the Thai society. If I am still here after all these years it is, for a big part, because of all the positive things that came with learning the language.

One of the greatest benefit of being able to fluently speak with, really understand, and feel good in the Thai society is that, little by little, you start to put a distance between yourself and most of the other farangs... which is to me the best way to avoid silly discussions (about politics, for example).

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I remember any.

However, I must also admit that I find the lack of interest of the Thai people in learning English a bit unfortunate. I always say to my friends how nice it is to be able to speak other people's language. But maybe they don't care about understanding the farangs who don't speak Thai

Very interesting read, but i must say i really love the self assessed statements of fluency in Thai.

MY neighbor claims to speak fluent Thai, not knowing my level of Thai and let me tell you the only thing he knows in Thai is how to count to 10, say hello, good bye and ask for the price.

If you have indeed mastered the language, good on you!

I have spent 4 years at school learning and can read, however i do not consider myself fluent, nor good, nor even reasonable.

But i guess we have different opinions of our own achievements and ability's

We are all different. Some are better in math or science, some are better at languages.

Don't give up your Thai courses !

[kerryk]

How did this morph into yet another Thai-bashing thread?

Its easy any thread that tells a modicum of truth gets labelled "Thai Bashing"

People who don't know how to speak Thai bashing Thailand because they don't understand it. Pretty simple to me. The only Thai people who don't want Western people learning Thai are bar girls and not even all of them.

[Kwasaki]

OP your post is Nonsense !! not as simple as that, just another self opinionated view.

Edited July 5, 2012 by Kwasaki

[kerryk]

OP your post is Nonsense !! not as simple as that, just another self opinionated view.

Your post is nonsense too!! Not as simple as that. Just another self opinionated view.

So?

If you want any respect explain what you are talking about.

I bet 7 out of 10 people who post on this forum who speak Thai have few if any problems.

Your turn.

[PaullyW]

^^ Yes, in a country of 65+ million people, we will find a handful who are different, but, sadly, Thai culture is STRONG and they seem almost genetically predisposed to not being able to break the mould as it were. I've been to countries all over the world. Literally dozens upon dozens. And, I've found Thailand to be in a handful of countries that are so boring and inward focused and to almost completely lack intellectual curiosity esp about the world outside their country.

Has nothing to do with being a poor country either. Non of the African countries I've been to have been so bad. Most of the Central and South American countries I've been to and lived in have been better.

From your post it appears that you do not like Thai society. Why do you not move on to a country that you do like their society?

Because I profit wonderfully here.

[PaullyW]

First off, anyone who calls themselves a "farang" is an idiot in my book; if you wanna be a step and fetch it go ahead and shuffle off to ya masser....

Second; why dont you go ask the westerners here who do speak Thai (and there are plenty of them) what problems they encounter, then compare.

What nonsense; not to mention wanton hubris

I am a farang who speaks fluently Thai.

I would not consider living in Thailand without being able to understand the people around me.

I must admit that I have a certain "gift" for languages, while others can learn other subjects much faster than me. Thai is not easy to learn but it is very far from being impossible (The secret of the pronunciation is in the writing. That is where to start).

It took me about two years (over 10 years back) to be fluent. Since then I made many local friends and acquaintances, and the fact that I can have a fluent conversartion with anyone here opened many doors in circles where other foreigners have much less chances to be accepted.

Another advantage of speaking and understanding Thai is that it eliminates a lot of misunderstandings due to translations, or due to certain ways of speaking and certain tones that foreigners might not interprete correctly.

Understanding the language greatly helps to understand how the society works, which in return makes it much easier to adapt to the different concepts on which the Thai society is based.

I would not say that Thailand is the paradise on earth, there are many problem here too, but I personally feel very confortable in the Thai society. If I am still here after all these years it is, for a big part, because of all the positive things that came with learning the language.

One of the greatest benefit of being able to fluently speak with, really understand, and feel good in the Thai society is that, little by little, you start to put a distance between yourself and most of the other farangs... which is to me the best way to avoid silly discussions (about politics, for example).

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

However, I must also admit that I find the lack of interest of the Thai people in learning English a bit unfortunate. I always say to my friends how nice it is to be able to speak other people's language. But maybe they don't care about understanding the farangs who don't speak Thai

From your writing style, you remind me quite strongly of an Asian. Are you Asian or "Farang"?

[gerry1011]

First off, anyone who calls themselves a "farang" is an idiot in my book; if you wanna be a step and fetch it go ahead and shuffle off to ya masser....

Second; why dont you go ask the westerners here who do speak Thai (and there are plenty of them) what problems they encounter, then compare.

What nonsense; not to mention wanton hubris

I am a farang who speaks fluently Thai.

I would not consider living in Thailand without being able to understand the people around me.

I must admit that I have a certain "gift" for languages, while others can learn other subjects much faster than me. Thai is not easy to learn but it is very far from being impossible (The secret of the pronunciation is in the writing. That is where to start).

It took me about two years (over 10 years back) to be fluent. Since then I made many local friends and acquaintances, and the fact that I can have a fluent conversartion with anyone here opened many doors in circles where other foreigners have much less chances to be accepted.

Another advantage of speaking and understanding Thai is that it eliminates a lot of misunderstandings due to translations, or due to certain ways of speaking and certain tones that foreigners might not interprete correctly.

Understanding the language greatly helps to understand how the society works, which in return makes it much easier to adapt to the different concepts on which the Thai society is based.

I would not say that Thailand is the paradise on earth, there are many problem here too, but I personally feel very confortable in the Thai society. If I am still here after all these years it is, for a big part, because of all the positive things that came with learning the language.

One of the greatest benefit of being able to fluently speak with, really understand, and feel good in the Thai society is that, little by little, you start to put a distance between yourself and most of the other farangs... which is to me the best way to avoid silly discussions (about politics, for example).

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

However, I must also admit that I find the lack of interest of the Thai people in learning English a bit unfortunate. I always say to my friends how nice it is to be able to speak other people's language. But maybe they don't care about understanding the farangs who don't speak Thai

From your writing style, you remind me quite strongly of an Asian. Are you Asian or "Farang"?

Farang (as stated in the first sentence of my reply, and which I allowed myself to emphasize, since I don't really care to find myself in Kilgore Trout's "idiots' book" ).

Edited July 5, 2012 by gerry1011

[PaullyW]

First off, anyone who calls themselves a "farang" is an idiot in my book; if you wanna be a step and fetch it go ahead and shuffle off to ya masser....

Second; why dont you go ask the westerners here who do speak Thai (and there are plenty of them) what problems they encounter, then compare.

What nonsense; not to mention wanton hubris

I am a farang who speaks fluently Thai.

I would not consider living in Thailand without being able to understand the people around me.

I must admit that I have a certain "gift" for languages, while others can learn other subjects much faster than me. Thai is not easy to learn but it is very far from being impossible (The secret of the pronunciation is in the writing. That is where to start).

It took me about two years (over 10 years back) to be fluent. Since then I made many local friends and acquaintances, and the fact that I can have a fluent conversartion with anyone here opened many doors in circles where other foreigners have much less chances to be accepted.

Another advantage of speaking and understanding Thai is that it eliminates a lot of misunderstandings due to translations, or due to certain ways of speaking and certain tones that foreigners might not interprete correctly.

Understanding the language greatly helps to understand how the society works, which in return makes it much easier to adapt to the different concepts on which the Thai society is based.

I would not say that Thailand is the paradise on earth, there are many problem here too, but I personally feel very confortable in the Thai society. If I am still here after all these years it is, for a big part, because of all the positive things that came with learning the language.

One of the greatest benefit of being able to fluently speak with, really understand, and feel good in the Thai society is that, little by little, you start to put a distance between yourself and most of the other farangs... which is to me the best way to avoid silly discussions (about politics, for example).

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

However, I must also admit that I find the lack of interest of the Thai people in learning English a bit unfortunate. I always say to my friends how nice it is to be able to speak other people's language. But maybe they don't care about understanding the farangs who don't speak Thai

From your writing style, you remind me quite strongly of an Asian. Are you Asian or "Farang"?

Farang (as stated in the first sentence of my reply, and which I allowed myself to emphasize, since I don't really care to find myself in Kilgore Trout's "idiots' book" ).

What is your first language?

[TommoPhysicist]

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

The big problem is in deciding which language to learn, If you want to speak to those around you in their native language, it's unlikely to be Central Thai. And you can't take a course in Lanna, Laos, Southern, etc.

Edited July 5, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[gerry1011]

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

The big problem is in deciding which language to learn, If you want to speak to those around you in their native language, it's unlikely to be Central Thai.

You're right. If you live in a remote Lahu village all the way up in the mountain, you might prefer to learn Lahu rather than Thai, why not. You would probably feel better when able to converse in their language. If you already do it is excellent. The additional problem with these languages is that I am not sure there are books to help you.

By the way, Akha or Lahu is probably much easier to learn than Thai. Not sure about Hmong, Yao or southern dialects though...

Edited July 5, 2012 by gerry1011

[KhaoNiaw]

What problem did I encounter since I speak Thai? ... Well, I don't think I ever encountered any.

The big problem is in deciding which language to learn, If you want to speak to those around you in their native language, it's unlikely to be Central Thai. And you can't take a course in Lanna, Laos, Southern, etc.

Not really. Most people in any part of Thailand can handle standard Thai. Rubbish to say they can't. Most Thais are bilingual.

I agree with Gerry mostly. My Thai is good enough to earn from Thai-English translation and I think being fluent in Thai does open doors. I wouldn't be in my current position without being able to read, write and speak fluently. And it's much easier to make friends, function and feel comfortable with your life.

[maxme]

I think learning a language could break most cultural barriers wherever you might go, but in a society where you can't be accepted and where concepts such as ignorance, wealth and status is valued more than the basic human right fundamentalism among other important aspects of a society, it can be downright depressing to hear what Thaism really is from a native tongue. But if you are already aware of this and no what it means to integrate further then by all means...

The circle of friends I have procured here in this country, are all well educated and open minded people, all very sympathetic and curios to new experience.

However I would say that being inquisitive or open-minded isn't really part of their culture and therefor the culture doesn't really evolve. So the mainstream of Thais that didn't get the same chances or tried to achieve it, are the ones with the minds of a closed book. The ones who progress better are the ones who had been abroad for studies or work and have come back and found out how different everything looks.

I don't learn the Thai language because I want to integrate, I learn the Thai language so my friends and family can have a better understanding of who I am and make me understand who they are. There is no point trying to understand or cherish a selfish society with no evident feedback. We just do what we have to do to live on.

Edited July 5, 2012 by maxme

[brit1984]

If we all learn Thai it will be much easier to teach the Thai people about cricket.

Cricket will solve all Thailand's problems and the OP's hypothesis will be proved right.

Sent from iPhone; please forgive any typos or violations of forum rules

[maxme]

If we all learn Thai it will be much easier to teach the Thai people about cricket.

Cricket will solve all Thailand's problems and the OP's hypothesis will be proved right.

Sent from iPhone; please forgive any typos or violations of forum rules

Being a forever optimist does have its virtues....

Edited July 5, 2012 by maxme

[travelmann]

How did this morph into yet another Thai-bashing thread?

Its easy any thread that tells a modicum of truth gets labelled "Thai Bashing"

People who don't know how to speak Thai bashing Thailand because they don't understand it. Pretty simple to me. The only Thai people who don't want Western people learning Thai are bar girls and not even all of them.

Understand or accept? I dont accept it.