Red-Shirts Have Mixed Feelings Over Constitution Court Verdict

[thaicbr]

The problem with the red shirts is simple.

When the Yellow shirts were instumental in ousting the corrupt caretaker government of Thaksin Shinawatra, they came late to the table in the role of Thaksin bodyguards and showed their thuggery in places like Chiang Mai and Khon Khen.

The Yellows continued to out manoevre and out smart them during the Samak and Somchai administrations and in reality it wasn't until groups of lawmakers switched sides and tilted the balance in the house to allow for Abhisit to take the helm that they started to get their act together.

True to their earlier form, they attempted to copy what the Yellows did - but violently. This culminated in the 2010 Rajaprasong violence where their whole raison d'etre was to force a violent coup d'etat, the very thing that they stood against.

That raison d'etre morphed once again. Abhisit offered them elections and they accepted. The man from Dubai wanted blood on the streets. The reds reneged. Bloodshed was unavoidable.

In the end Abhisit gallantly and honourably gave them elections, as he had pomised to do, once the country had calmed down.

Thaksin appointed his "clone" sister. Thought to be a novice and certainly proved to be a novice, the Red Shirts occupied the role of bodyguards once more. PTP made several election promises, most of which turned out to be lies. The novice selected a cabinet based on nepotism and the repayment of favours and duly screwed up the handling of the floods. Most election promises started to disappear down the toilet and the government looked shot to bits. The reds were not happy. Thaksin had showed his hand. They were pawns. They had been used. Go back to your rice farms.

Despite all the red shirt noise about justice for the dead of Rajaprasong, the PTP had paid the families of the dead and injured and made them sign away the right to persue claims against the Thai government. They were a spent force. Paid up by tax-payers money.

Thaksin and PTP needed something to get the reds back on board. They knew that a rewrite of the constitution would bring out the yellows and they knew that of the yellows came out, the reds would focus on that. That proved to be the case. Thida and Jatuporn and Korkeaw to name but a few could smell blood. They thought they were movong to the end game. Out smarted once again. All of the noise was just another loss of face to the red shirts.

So the red shirts have played the role of Thalsin bodyguard, violent Thaksin mercenaries, cannon fodder, bodyguards to the clone, wanna be Thaksin mercenaries, and once again rebels without a cause.

So, what for them now? They have the PTP government they fought for, the dead are paid up and forgotten, the PTP promises have floated down the pipes and are adrift somewhere of the straights of Malacca and the Constitution Court delivered a verdict.

Will they go back to their farms or will Thaksin still show them that he is in charge and thay are still pawns in the game? For some of their foul-mouthed "leaders" (depite being a "pro-democractic" organisation, they never held elections to see who would lead them.) jail time beckons. Jatuporn, Korkeaw and others are due some time behind bars. Will that be the rebels new cause?

The next thrilling episode awaits.

The problem with the Democrats and their elite backers is simple.

Upon realizing their political savvy was severely lacking, compared to the slick TRT machine, an evil plan was hatched deep in the recesses of the army barracks.

How dare this man empower the people! They must happily stay in the rice fields and send us their sons and daughters in return for a pittance. How dare he continue to reduce the military budget as a percentage of GDP year after year. We want our air balloons! For how else can we maintain our pervertedly privileged positions. Hence the systematic vilification of the most successful and effective PM the country has ever experienced began. This was their only chance, as they themselves were not bereft of ideas to help the masses , but in fact selfishly unwilling to grant them. So the witch hunt began. What could they pin on this man? While all embarrassingly standing squarely in front of their own amassed wealth they collective raised their fingers and pointed. LOOK, he is doing what every other Thai businessman is doing! LOOK, he is following the advice of his tax lawyers and accountants! LOOK, he is following current tax laws when selling his own company shares! LOOK, inevitably some government decisions are inadvertently affecting his massive business interests! And then they released their big weapon, like a submarine in shallow water, LOOK he is trying to bring down the monarchy and turn this blessed kingdom into a republic!

And so it began, and to this day we are still hearing the whinging, whining losers bleat on and on about the same old fictitious fantasy as the people grow more and more tired of hearing it.

There is no next episode, just tedious reruns of the old one.

A few problems with this post.

1st. Look he couldn't be selling his shares. That would be breaking the law as they have to disclose wealth.

2nd. Helping the poor. Piffle all he did was to enslave them to debt and hand outs.

3rd.education. he made the no fail rule. He made the no classification of students rule.

It was the Democrats that gave the people access to FREE education. Study.books and uniform up to M3 (previously P6) so ensuring the ability to get better jobs (m3 pass is a requisite for many factory jobs)

Phua thai just stopped the free uniforms to pay for the crazy and inadequate tablets scheme.

Helping the poor requires long term plans and action something lacking from ALL Thaksin governments. Teach them to improve their lives and stop the reliance on hand outs.

There is a reason that Thailands agricultural community is falling behind their neighbors. Lack of investment and training.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

[h90]

birdpooguava

In Canada we have what is called the Canadian Mental health association.

birdpooguava is a prime example that propaganda works. The reds use a lot of what Joseph Goebbels taught and it works...

[Artist]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

[thaicbr]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

Artist. Do you disagree with what dolly says that a Thai with an education and no agenda will see through the Shinwatra clans deads.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

[Moruya]

The problem with the red shirts is simple.

When the Yellow shirts were instumental in ousting the corrupt caretaker government of Thaksin Shinawatra, they came late to the table in the role of Thaksin bodyguards and showed their thuggery in places like Chiang Mai and Khon Khen.

The Yellows continued to out manoevre and out smart them during the Samak and Somchai administrations and in reality it wasn't until groups of lawmakers switched sides and tilted the balance in the house to allow for Abhisit to take the helm that they started to get their act together.

True to their earlier form, they attempted to copy what the Yellows did - but violently. This culminated in the 2010 Rajaprasong violence where their whole raison d'etre was to force a violent coup d'etat, the very thing that they stood against.

That raison d'etre morphed once again. Abhisit offered them elections and they accepted. The man from Dubai wanted blood on the streets. The reds reneged. Bloodshed was unavoidable.

In the end Abhisit gallantly and honourably gave them elections, as he had pomised to do, once the country had calmed down.

Thaksin appointed his "clone" sister. Thought to be a novice and certainly proved to be a novice, the Red Shirts occupied the role of bodyguards once more. PTP made several election promises, most of which turned out to be lies. The novice selected a cabinet based on nepotism and the repayment of favours and duly screwed up the handling of the floods. Most election promises started to disappear down the toilet and the government looked shot to bits. The reds were not happy. Thaksin had showed his hand. They were pawns. They had been used. Go back to your rice farms.

Despite all the red shirt noise about justice for the dead of Rajaprasong, the PTP had paid the families of the dead and injured and made them sign away the right to persue claims against the Thai government. They were a spent force. Paid up by tax-payers money.

Thaksin and PTP needed something to get the reds back on board. They knew that a rewrite of the constitution would bring out the yellows and they knew that of the yellows came out, the reds would focus on that. That proved to be the case. Thida and Jatuporn and Korkeaw to name but a few could smell blood. They thought they were movong to the end game. Out smarted once again. All of the noise was just another loss of face to the red shirts.

So the red shirts have played the role of Thalsin bodyguard, violent Thaksin mercenaries, cannon fodder, bodyguards to the clone, wanna be Thaksin mercenaries, and once again rebels without a cause.

So, what for them now? They have the PTP government they fought for, the dead are paid up and forgotten, the PTP promises have floated down the pipes and are adrift somewhere of the straights of Malacca and the Constitution Court delivered a verdict.

Will they go back to their farms or will Thaksin still show them that he is in charge and thay are still pawns in the game? For some of their foul-mouthed "leaders" (depite being a "pro-democractic" organisation, they never held elections to see who would lead them.) jail time beckons. Jatuporn, Korkeaw and others are due some time behind bars. Will that be the rebels new cause?

The next thrilling episode awaits.

The problem with the Democrats and their elite backers is simple.

Upon realizing their political savvy was severely lacking, compared to the slick TRT machine, an evil plan was hatched deep in the recesses of the army barracks.

How dare this man empower the people! They must happily stay in the rice fields and send us their sons and daughters in return for a pittance. How dare he continue to reduce the military budget as a percentage of GDP year after year. We want our air balloons! For how else can we maintain our pervertedly privileged positions. Hence the systematic vilification of the most successful and effective PM the country has ever experienced began. This was their only chance, as they themselves were not bereft of ideas to help the masses , but in fact selfishly unwilling to grant them. So the witch hunt began. What could they pin on this man? While all embarrassingly standing squarely in front of their own amassed wealth they collective raised their fingers and pointed. LOOK, he is doing what every other Thai businessman is doing! LOOK, he is following the advice of his tax lawyers and accountants! LOOK, he is following current tax laws when selling his own company shares! LOOK, inevitably some government decisions are inadvertently affecting his massive business interests! And then they released their big weapon, like a submarine in shallow water, LOOK he is trying to bring down the monarchy and turn this blessed kingdom into a republic!

And so it began, and to this day we are still hearing the whinging, whining losers bleat on and on about the same old fictitious fantasy as the people grow more and more tired of hearing it.

There is no next episode, just tedious reruns of the old one.

Allow me to offer a more adult response to your post.

What the poor and working class of this country need is education, opportunity and investment.

Education is a joke unless you have the money to put your kids in a private school.

Opportunities are far too few. There are some factories for sure but whilst it's an improvement it's a small one.

Investment again is poor. 2000 schools without electricity is a crime.

The question is who will improve the lot of the poor and working class? The Dems were marginally better than the PTP. The PTP has an agenda that really does not much apart from waste money.

Is Thaksin the man? No.

They need an honest hero and he doesnt exist in the current ranks

My personal belief is that the sheep need the dogs to keep the wolves at bay.

[kerryk]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

Artist. Do you disagree with what dolly says that a Thai with an education and no agenda will see through the Shinwatra clans deads.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

It is quite obvious the people posting on this forum who are anti red shirts have little on no education. Seems the opposite of Thai people.

[Skywalker69]

birdpooguava

In Canada we have what is called the Canadian Mental health association.

birdpooguava is a prime example that propaganda works. The reds use a lot of what Joseph Goebbels taught and it works...

Not on me, it doesn´t.

[hellodolly]

The problem with the red shirts is simple.

When the Yellow shirts were instumental in ousting the corrupt caretaker government of Thaksin Shinawatra, they came late to the table in the role of Thaksin bodyguards and showed their thuggery in places like Chiang Mai and Khon Khen.

The Yellows continued to out manoevre and out smart them during the Samak and Somchai administrations and in reality it wasn't until groups of lawmakers switched sides and tilted the balance in the house to allow for Abhisit to take the helm that they started to get their act together.

True to their earlier form, they attempted to copy what the Yellows did - but violently. This culminated in the 2010 Rajaprasong violence where their whole raison d'etre was to force a violent coup d'etat, the very thing that they stood against.

That raison d'etre morphed once again. Abhisit offered them elections and they accepted. The man from Dubai wanted blood on the streets. The reds reneged. Bloodshed was unavoidable.

In the end Abhisit gallantly and honourably gave them elections, as he had pomised to do, once the country had calmed down.

Thaksin appointed his "clone" sister. Thought to be a novice and certainly proved to be a novice, the Red Shirts occupied the role of bodyguards once more. PTP made several election promises, most of which turned out to be lies. The novice selected a cabinet based on nepotism and the repayment of favours and duly screwed up the handling of the floods. Most election promises started to disappear down the toilet and the government looked shot to bits. The reds were not happy. Thaksin had showed his hand. They were pawns. They had been used. Go back to your rice farms.

Despite all the red shirt noise about justice for the dead of Rajaprasong, the PTP had paid the families of the dead and injured and made them sign away the right to persue claims against the Thai government. They were a spent force. Paid up by tax-payers money.

Thaksin and PTP needed something to get the reds back on board. They knew that a rewrite of the constitution would bring out the yellows and they knew that of the yellows came out, the reds would focus on that. That proved to be the case. Thida and Jatuporn and Korkeaw to name but a few could smell blood. They thought they were movong to the end game. Out smarted once again. All of the noise was just another loss of face to the red shirts.

So the red shirts have played the role of Thalsin bodyguard, violent Thaksin mercenaries, cannon fodder, bodyguards to the clone, wanna be Thaksin mercenaries, and once again rebels without a cause.

So, what for them now? They have the PTP government they fought for, the dead are paid up and forgotten, the PTP promises have floated down the pipes and are adrift somewhere of the straights of Malacca and the Constitution Court delivered a verdict.

Will they go back to their farms or will Thaksin still show them that he is in charge and thay are still pawns in the game? For some of their foul-mouthed "leaders" (depite being a "pro-democractic" organisation, they never held elections to see who would lead them.) jail time beckons. Jatuporn, Korkeaw and others are due some time behind bars. Will that be the rebels new cause?

The next thrilling episode awaits.

The problem with the Democrats and their elite backers is simple.

Upon realizing their political savvy was severely lacking, compared to the slick TRT machine, an evil plan was hatched deep in the recesses of the army barracks.

How dare this man empower the people! They must happily stay in the rice fields and send us their sons and daughters in return for a pittance. How dare he continue to reduce the military budget as a percentage of GDP year after year. We want our air balloons! For how else can we maintain our pervertedly privileged positions. Hence the systematic vilification of the most successful and effective PM the country has ever experienced began. This was their only chance, as they themselves were not bereft of ideas to help the masses , but in fact selfishly unwilling to grant them. So the witch hunt began. What could they pin on this man? While all embarrassingly standing squarely in front of their own amassed wealth they collective raised their fingers and pointed. LOOK, he is doing what every other Thai businessman is doing! LOOK, he is following the advice of his tax lawyers and accountants! LOOK, he is following current tax laws when selling his own company shares! LOOK, inevitably some government decisions are inadvertently affecting his massive business interests! And then they released their big weapon, like a submarine in shallow water, LOOK he is trying to bring down the monarchy and turn this blessed kingdom into a republic!

And so it began, and to this day we are still hearing the whinging, whining losers bleat on and on about the same old fictitious fantasy as the people grow more and more tired of hearing it.

There is no next episode, just tedious reruns of the old one.

Allow me to offer a more adult response to your post.

What the poor and working class of this country need is education, opportunity and investment.

Education is a joke unless you have the money to put your kids in a private school.

Opportunities are far too few. There are some factories for sure but whilst it's an improvement it's a small one.

Investment again is poor. 2000 schools without electricity is a crime.

The question is who will improve the lot of the poor and working class? The Dems were marginally better than the PTP. The PTP has an agenda that really does not much apart from waste money.

Is Thaksin the man? No.

They need an honest hero and he doesnt exist in the current ranks

My personal belief is that the sheep need the dogs to keep the wolves at bay.

I do believe that Abhist is the man. But he needs a different kind of backing than he has been given in the past and some that has been with him all along.

I am not saying he needs the mindless backing like the PT has but a backing of honest people open to new ideas that do not put money in there pockets.

I know that human nature does not allow such a thing but it does allow for improvement. And along with improvements comes new horizons.

[Artist]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

Artist. Do you disagree with what dolly says that a Thai with an education and no agenda will see through the Shinwatra clans deads.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

The slightly patronising colonial phrase "a Thai with an education" is key here. The slightly illiterate phrase "Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education" is bordering on offensive.

"A Thai with an education" is more likely to come from the middle-class or rich segment of society in the first place and consequently more likely to see through the Shinawatra clan's deeds or did you mean deads?

I don't think that education makes people more rational or wise. You are just as likely to be an educated extremist as an ignorant one.

The standard of education in rural Issan is appalling, my wife was working on a construction site in Bangkok at the age of 12 and she is intellectually capable of achieving a first class degree.

In the short to medium term people will learn by experience, and its likely to be a painful experience. Look at what happened when the poor rural majority became empowered in the countries around Thailand.

In the medium to long term, smart phones will be Thailand's salvation. (I think....) and education.

[drdoom6996]

The problem with the red shirts is simple.

When the Yellow shirts were instumental in ousting the corrupt caretaker government of Thaksin Shinawatra, they came late to the table in the role of Thaksin bodyguards and showed their thuggery in places like Chiang Mai and Khon Khen.

The Yellows continued to out manoevre and out smart them during the Samak and Somchai administrations and in reality it wasn't until groups of lawmakers switched sides and tilted the balance in the house to allow for Abhisit to take the helm that they started to get their act together.

True to their earlier form, they attempted to copy what the Yellows did - but violently. This culminated in the 2010 Rajaprasong violence where their whole raison d'etre was to force a violent coup d'etat, the very thing that they stood against.

That raison d'etre morphed once again. Abhisit offered them elections and they accepted. The man from Dubai wanted blood on the streets. The reds reneged. Bloodshed was unavoidable.

In the end Abhisit gallantly and honourably gave them elections, as he had pomised to do, once the country had calmed down.

Thaksin appointed his "clone" sister. Thought to be a novice and certainly proved to be a novice, the Red Shirts occupied the role of bodyguards once more. PTP made several election promises, most of which turned out to be lies. The novice selected a cabinet based on nepotism and the repayment of favours and duly screwed up the handling of the floods. Most election promises started to disappear down the toilet and the government looked shot to bits. The reds were not happy. Thaksin had showed his hand. They were pawns. They had been used. Go back to your rice farms.

Despite all the red shirt noise about justice for the dead of Rajaprasong, the PTP had paid the families of the dead and injured and made them sign away the right to persue claims against the Thai government. They were a spent force. Paid up by tax-payers money.

Thaksin and PTP needed something to get the reds back on board. They knew that a rewrite of the constitution would bring out the yellows and they knew that of the yellows came out, the reds would focus on that. That proved to be the case. Thida and Jatuporn and Korkeaw to name but a few could smell blood. They thought they were movong to the end game. Out smarted once again. All of the noise was just another loss of face to the red shirts.

So the red shirts have played the role of Thalsin bodyguard, violent Thaksin mercenaries, cannon fodder, bodyguards to the clone, wanna be Thaksin mercenaries, and once again rebels without a cause.

So, what for them now? They have the PTP government they fought for, the dead are paid up and forgotten, the PTP promises have floated down the pipes and are adrift somewhere of the straights of Malacca and the Constitution Court delivered a verdict.

Will they go back to their farms or will Thaksin still show them that he is in charge and thay are still pawns in the game? For some of their foul-mouthed "leaders" (depite being a "pro-democractic" organisation, they never held elections to see who would lead them.) jail time beckons. Jatuporn, Korkeaw and others are due some time behind bars. Will that be the rebels new cause?

The next thrilling episode awaits.

Excellent summary.

+1

[thaicbr]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

Artist. Do you disagree with what dolly says that a Thai with an education and no agenda will see through the Shinwatra clans deads.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

It is quite obvious the people posting on this forum who are anti red shirts have little on no education. Seems the opposite of Thai people.

Hahahahaha kerry you are such a laugh:D:D:D

Why would you come to that conclusion?

sent from my Wellcom A90+

[tlansford]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

Artist. Do you disagree with what dolly says that a Thai with an education and no agenda will see through the Shinwatra clans deads.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

The slightly patronising colonial phrase "a Thai with an education" is key here. The slightly illiterate phrase "Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education" is bordering on offensive.

"A Thai with an education" is more likely to come from the middle-class or rich segment of society in the first place and consequently more likely to see through the Shinawatra clan's deeds or did you mean deads?

I don't think that education makes people more rational or wise. You are just as likely to be an educated extremist as an ignorant one.

The standard of education in rural Issan is appalling, my wife was working on a construction site in Bangkok at the age of 12 and she is intellectually capable of achieving a first class degree.

In the short to medium term people will learn by experience, and its likely to be a painful experience. Look at what happened when the poor rural majority became empowered in the countries around Thailand.

In the medium to long term, smart phones will be Thailand's salvation. (I think....) and education.

"I don't think that education makes people more rational or wise. You are just as likely to be an educated extremist as an ignorant one."

all too true.

nor does a lack of education make you ignorant.

[thaicbr]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

Artist. Do you disagree with what dolly says that a Thai with an education and no agenda will see through the Shinwatra clans deads.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

The slightly patronising colonial phrase "a Thai with an education" is key here. The slightly illiterate phrase "Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education" is bordering on offensive.

"A Thai with an education" is more likely to come from the middle-class or rich segment of society in the first place and consequently more likely to see through the Shinawatra clan's deeds or did you mean deads?

I don't think that education makes people more rational or wise. You are just as likely to be an educated extremist as an ignorant one.

The standard of education in rural Issan is appalling, my wife was working on a construction site in Bangkok at the age of 12 and she is intellectually capable of achieving a first class degree.

In the short to medium term people will learn by experience, and its likely to be a painful experience. Look at what happened when the poor rural majority became empowered in the countries around Thailand.

In the medium to long term, smart phones will be Thailand's salvation. (I think....) and education.

Ok so you disagreed then agreed. Great.

People with a decent education tend to be more open to differing ideas. But yes I agree about educated extremist. Pol pot was a good regional example.

Possibly the current Red leadership is another.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

[thaicbr]

"I don't think that education makes people more rational or wise. You are just as likely to be an educated extremist as an ignorant one."

all too true.

nor does a lack of education make you ignorant"

So Thailand has got it right then. Dont provide a decent education then no problems with educated extremists or ignorant extremists. Bloody marvelous

sent from my Wellcom A90+

sent from my Wellcom A90+

[kerryk]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

[h90]

birdpooguava

In Canada we have what is called the Canadian Mental health association.

birdpooguava is a prime example that propaganda works. The reds use a lot of what Joseph Goebbels taught and it works...

Not on me, it doesn´t.

of that few exceptions the black shirts will take care once our dear leader is back.

And I am in trouble because my wife put all red or reddish clothes in the trash bin years ago.....

[h90]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

I guess you don't know one single red shirt. Because the PAD or Peoples Alliance for Democracy most important thing is to bring Democracy. They are discussing a lot how get rid of the vote buying and corruption. By the way the Democrats win a lot elections....as you may noticed they won the election for Bangkok governor.

[robertson468]

The problem with the Democrats and their elite backers is simple.

Upon realizing their political savvy was severely lacking, compared to the slick TRT machine, an evil plan was hatched deep in the recesses of the army barracks.

How dare this man empower the people! They must happily stay in the rice fields and send us their sons and daughters in return for a pittance. How dare he continue to reduce the military budget as a percentage of GDP year after year. We want our air balloons! For how else can we maintain our pervertedly privileged positions. Hence the systematic vilification of the most successful and effective PM the country has ever experienced began. This was their only chance, as they themselves were not bereft of ideas to help the masses , but in fact selfishly unwilling to grant them. So the witch hunt began. What could they pin on this man? While all embarrassingly standing squarely in front of their own amassed wealth they collective raised their fingers and pointed. LOOK, he is doing what every other Thai businessman is doing! LOOK, he is following the advice of his tax lawyers and accountants! LOOK, he is following current tax laws when selling his own company shares! LOOK, inevitably some government decisions are inadvertently affecting his massive business interests! And then they released their big weapon, like a submarine in shallow water, LOOK he is trying to bring down the monarchy and turn this blessed kingdom into a republic!

And so it began, and to this day we are still hearing the whinging, whining losers bleat on and on about the same old fictitious fantasy as the people grow more and more tired of hearing it.

There is no next episode, just tedious reruns of the old one.

Don't be ridiculous, Thaksin only spoke about helping the poor but didn't do anything. He was corrupt and he let 3000 people being killed. He did not follow the laws he made some laws specific for his purpose. Some he even reversed after his business. And for the rumor that he want to bring down the monarchy....his own son told when drunk, that he is the son from the future first president of Thailand.

HIS SON, not the democrats told that.

This whole debate is full of half-truths and misunderstandings. Thaksin did a lot for the poor and the people in Issan love him for good reason. They see him as providing the rural majority with power after being exploited for decades (centuries?) by the rich and powerful in Bangkok. NE Thailand was the last bastion of Communism in Thailand for good reason, they have been exploited by endemic corruption.

Of course Thaksin wants a Republic with himself as President, increasingly I hear anti King rumours which suggested to me that the people of Issan also want a Republic. This is very depressing to me as the people's love of the King has always been one of the beautiful aspects of this country. Of course the people don't understand that they would be simply replacing one power structure with another and life would not get better. For most people life is actually pretty good anyway.

To reach complete power, Thaksin had to dispense with a few democratic controls. He systematically used his wealth and power to take over independent news media. He actually sacked the Auditor General and replaced her with his own, who I assume would not have investigated some areas too carefully. The extraordinary thing was that the King had to approve the new Auditor General so Thaksin sent the documents to the King but as far as I know never got them back. So there were two Auditors General neither of whom was legally constituted.

There is a strong parallel for Thaksin not long ago and not far away. Marcos in the Philippines came in as a popular reforming President who helped reduce the power of the rich and improve the lot of the poor. Unfortunately he stayed too long, far too long.

Both sides are right, I can't see a lasting compromise. There are no easy solutions. I cry for you Thailand.

An insightful and unbiased comment - I too cry for this lovely Country and the many innocents who just want to get on with their lives, without this "damocles sword" hanging over their heads.

[tlansford]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

I guess you don't know one single red shirt. Because the PAD or Peoples Alliance for Democracy most important thing is to bring Democracy. They are discussing a lot how get rid of the vote buying and corruption. By the way the Democrats win a lot elections....as you may noticed they won the election for Bangkok governor.

If the PAD want democracy, then why were they calling for the military to step in during this spring's demonstrations ? If they want democracy, then why was their protesting in 2008 to overthrow an elected government?

Regardless of the violence on both sides, listening to what the 2 groups were calling for is black and white - PAD calling for military intervention and the UDD calling for elections. Clearly both are playing to their respective strengths.

[rubl]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

'all the yellow shirts I know'.

None so blind ... ...

[h90]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

I guess you don't know one single red shirt. Because the PAD or Peoples Alliance for Democracy most important thing is to bring Democracy. They are discussing a lot how get rid of the vote buying and corruption. By the way the Democrats win a lot elections....as you may noticed they won the election for Bangkok governor.

If the PAD want democracy, then why were they calling for the military to step in during this spring's demonstrations ? If they want democracy, then why was their protesting in 2008 to overthrow an elected government?

Regardless of the violence on both sides, listening to what the 2 groups were calling for is black and white - PAD calling for military intervention and the UDD calling for elections. Clearly both are playing to their respective strengths.

Because an army intervention seems for many the only way to restore Democracy.

A wannabe Dictator who buy votes to bring all kinds of relatives into key positions isn't Democracy.

One relative got Army boss (can't recall which)

One brother in law got Premier

Sister got Premier

brother in law got Police boss

Either the have some special gene that makes them better than the rest of Thailand or he just undermines all organizations with putting relatives there. Which is total undemocratic as it ends the separation of power.

Beside that he (or brother or sister) are only in power because of vote buying and not because of democratic elections.

The cry for military intervention is only because he bribed already other independent bodies like the election commission for example.

[Moruya]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

I guess you don't know one single red shirt. Because the PAD or Peoples Alliance for Democracy most important thing is to bring Democracy. They are discussing a lot how get rid of the vote buying and corruption. By the way the Democrats win a lot elections....as you may noticed they won the election for Bangkok governor.

If the PAD want democracy, then why were they calling for the military to step in during this spring's demonstrations ? If they want democracy, then why was their protesting in 2008 to overthrow an elected government?

Regardless of the violence on both sides, listening to what the 2 groups were calling for is black and white - PAD calling for military intervention and the UDD calling for elections. Clearly both are playing to their respective strengths.

Because an army intervention seems for many the only way to restore Democracy.

A wannabe Dictator who buy votes to bring all kinds of relatives into key positions isn't Democracy.

One relative got Army boss (can't recall which)

One brother in law got Premier

Sister got Premier

brother in law got Police boss

Either the have some special gene that makes them better than the rest of Thailand or he just undermines all organizations with putting relatives there. Which is total undemocratic as it ends the separation of power.

Beside that he (or brother or sister) are only in power because of vote buying and not because of democratic elections.

The cry for military intervention is only because he bribed already other independent bodies like the election commission for example.

That paragraph is as close as it gets to the truth.

[brit1984]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

I guess you don't know one single red shirt. Because the PAD or Peoples Alliance for Democracy most important thing is to bring Democracy. They are discussing a lot how get rid of the vote buying and corruption. By the way the Democrats win a lot elections....as you may noticed they won the election for Bangkok governor.

If the PAD want democracy, then why were they calling for the military to step in during this spring's demonstrations ? If they want democracy, then why was their protesting in 2008 to overthrow an elected government?

Regardless of the violence on both sides, listening to what the 2 groups were calling for is black and white - PAD calling for military intervention and the UDD calling for elections. Clearly both are playing to their respective strengths.

Because an army intervention seems for many the only way to restore Democracy.

A wannabe Dictator who buy votes to bring all kinds of relatives into key positions isn't Democracy.

One relative got Army boss (can't recall which)

One brother in law got Premier

Sister got Premier

brother in law got Police boss

Either the have some special gene that makes them better than the rest of Thailand or he just undermines all organizations with putting relatives there. Which is total undemocratic as it ends the separation of power.

Beside that he (or brother or sister) are only in power because of vote buying and not because of democratic elections.

The cry for military intervention is only because he bribed already other independent bodies like the election commission for example.

Two wrongs don't make a right, and the alternative to the (albeit imperfect) status quo, involves many people dying and massive destabilisation of the Thai economy and society.

Sent from iPhone; please forgive any typos or violations of forum rules

Edited July 14, 2012 by brit1984

[khunken]

Thansford & co:

All I hear about the red shirts is elections, as though they are the be all & end all of democracy. Now it is fairly common knowledge (if you have lived here for some time) that vote buying & intimidation does occur. No one really knows how much it affects an election result but it does have at least some effect.

What the red shirts & their sympathisers (such as you) never mention is what checks & balances should apply. Certainly what the most loud-mouthed red shirt leaders spout is to ignore or do away with those checks on the legislature. It is certainly impossible to run a democracy with a totally corrupt & biased police force.

Many of Thaksin's pronouncements when he was in power left no doubt that (a) he is no democrat, ( he can't take criticism & © he wanted (& still wants) to rule totally. We'll leave corruption out for the moment.

[thaicbr]

I don't agree. All the yellow shirts I know don't want free elections and freedom of the press nor do the yellow keyboard warriors on Thai Visa. They all don't think the majority of the Thai people are ready for freedom. They all want to tell the Thai people what is good for them. Because they know best even though the democratic party has not won an election in 20 years.

I'm lucky. I personally know no yellow shirts ( as in they do not broadcast)

red shirts I know about 2 one is my gf's dad ( red shirt tv only) .

Other thais I know or are acquainted with plenty.

They just want the governments to run the country for the benefit of the people (not person)

They do not really care who as long as the country works and prices are ok. Same as most other countries.

be they yellow or red they are a minority.

sent from my Wellcom A90+

[kerryk]

Thansford & co:

All I hear about the red shirts is elections, as though they are the be all & end all of democracy. Now it is fairly common knowledge (if you have lived here for some time) that vote buying & intimidation does occur. No one really knows how much it affects an election result but it does have at least some effect.

What the red shirts & their sympathisers (such as you) never mention is what checks & balances should apply. Certainly what the most loud-mouthed red shirt leaders spout is to ignore or do away with those checks on the legislature. It is certainly impossible to run a democracy with a totally corrupt & biased police force.

Many of Thaksin's pronouncements when he was in power left no doubt that (a) he is no democrat, ( he can't take criticism & © he wanted (& still wants) to rule totally. We'll leave corruption out for the moment.

Are you using the words Red Shirts and current democratically elected government interchangeably?

[BigC]

I remember reading in several places that the 1997 Constitution was considered the most fair and clear Constitution so far.

During the yellow shirt troubles, a Thai business manager I with worked with said so.

What was the argument again for not re-instating that Constitution? Something to do with not being able to indict Thaksin?

The red shirt propagandistas claiming the Constitution Court does not have jurisdiction over the charter amendments strikes me as ridiculous.

As any statement made by them usually do.

This whole countries plitics are just about the business of 1 man amd we all know who that is/ Why doesn''t he be a man do his 2years get his head down.. shit up buy allthe fancy stuff inside.. i am sure with his billions he can have a more confortable 2 years than the average prisoner.

he couldstrike a deal with everyone that if he does his 2 years then they shall stop trying to findnew charges to charge him with or he shall not come bakc to go to jail or he may never leave. Just charge him with everything right now. punished by 2 years a plus banned from politics.

In a simplisic way from an outside point.

Whilst Taksin was in power.Before the yellow banned started. Thailand was peacefull. What the hell happened !!

now prices have goneup whilst the economy else where is in reuins. Thai people's cost of living has gone up with the minimum wage.

There is still terrosime in the South even now Taksin has gone.

Looking at tourist areas over the next few high seasons shall show how badly toursime has been effectived. if people do not have money and jobs in the West then they shall not be coming here on holiday where prices are rising.

Even Japan is in fiancial crisis.

AQuie a few Chinease about. I hope they can make up for a decline in Westerners. oh and Russians.

Maybe it is just changing i dunno.

Problem with Russians and the Chinease. No offence is that they are not used to travelling outside their own countries/ They have been imporisoned in their own countries for years. So they might have trouble working things out at first.

[hellodolly]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

I see you don't charge you fall into the spouting nonsense category.

[BigC]

Thansford & co:

All I hear about the red shirts is elections, as though they are the be all & end all of democracy. Now it is fairly common knowledge (if you have lived here for some time) that vote buying & intimidation does occur. No one really knows how much it affects an election result but it does have at least some effect.

What the red shirts & their sympathisers (such as you) never mention is what checks & balances should apply. Certainly what the most loud-mouthed red shirt leaders spout is to ignore or do away with those checks on the legislature. It is certainly impossible to run a democracy with a totally corrupt & biased police force.

Many of Thaksin's pronouncements when he was in power left no doubt that (a) he is no democrat, ( he can't take criticism & © he wanted (& still wants) to rule totally. We'll leave corruption out for the moment.

Leave corruption out and put Chewitt in charge. Neither reds or yellows can doubt him as he is neither red nor yellow. Politics here are a joke already. changing all the laws just for 1 man, Pathetic.

Thai Army should step in and out all polictians linked to reds and yellows which puts chewitt in the front seat.

Lets face it reds and yellows are both un affically terrorists and are not good for the country

[BigC]

No need of confusion.

Al the red shirts have to do is get a real education.

They will soon realize that the people they follow now have no use for them other than as a weapon.

Education = problem solved no more red shirts.

Unless they are corrupt and see a chance to make a illegal baht there.

Or possibly see a chance to make a lot of money just by spouting nonsense.

Are you expecting to make a lot of money then?

I see you don't charge you fall into the spouting nonsense category.

yes lets just get an education. like you can just get it off a shelf. Education is a big thing out here because it is expensive.

you must be rich because you are spouting nonsense Helloboy

Edited July 14, 2012 by BigC