Condemned Police Officers, Two Others Freed On Bail: Thailand

[Joeb]

Beetlejuice - I find your comment almost as disturbing as the release of the policemen. I must assume from your statement that you know for a fact that all 2,800 of the people killed were guilty of drug offences. Or do you feel the old "needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few". It's OK with you that people who happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time, or people who had a bad relationship with a policeman or people who were part of a non-drug related business deal gone bad with a policeman's boss are killed. I would further assume that you would have no problem with a member of your family being killed by police even if you knew they were innocent of any drug charges. Hey, why not. Their death would help send a message to the drug runners. Unbelievable.

[Beetlejuice]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policeman are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

Not sure if your post is a troll. If not, as you know, extra judicial killing is a criminal offense. However, wouldn't you agree the criminal gangs are in control of Thailand; just a matter of the naming convention for the "gangs".

Depends on your point of view.

You appear to be one of those that like to put down Thailand as, being rotten to the core, run and enforced by those of criminal mentalities.

Thailand is still not a democracy in the true sense as compared to some Western nations, but Thai citizens still have relatively good statutory rights in what is basically a liberal minded society, if trying to equate with other countries in the region.

Oddly enough, and you may find this absolutely astonishing, I know many Government, local authority officials and police that are not corrupt and do they’re job to the letter, in strict accordance with the written laws.

Thailand still has many enemies that try to bring in outside influences and opinions, those who would put the country down. It is no wonder that the Thais are cautious of foreigners.

[Credo]

Whatever people think about the war on drugs, is superfluous. In this case, the victim was not expediently gunned down. He was tortured and hung. The police could have made better use of their time going after someone else.

Bail for these guys makes a mockery of the system and the country.

[simple1]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policeman are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

Not sure if your post is a troll. If not, as you know, extra judicial killing is a criminal offense. However, wouldn't you agree the criminal gangs are in control of Thailand; just a matter of the naming convention for the "gangs".

Depends on your point of view.

You appear to be one of those that like to put down Thailand as, being rotten to the core, run and enforced by those of criminal mentalities.

Thailand is still not a democracy in the true sense as compared to some Western nations, but Thai citizens still have relatively good statutory rights in what is basically a liberal minded society, if trying to equate with other countries in the region.

Oddly enough, and you may find this absolutely astonishing, I know many Government, local authority officials and police that are not corrupt and do they’re job to the letter, in strict accordance with the written laws.

Thailand still has many enemies that try to bring in outside influences and opinions, those who would put the country down. It is no wonder that the Thais are cautious of foreigners.

Sure there are good and decent people working in Thai government agencies;.my post is referring to those who are not.

[luckyman]

Could it be that those who wish to distance themselves from the killings in the war on drugs are afraid that those facing severe penalties may decide to give evidence regarding direct orders?

If the area commander is facing years inside, why wouldn't those further up the chain of command be eligible for the same penalties?

Could very well be indeed!

Besides the obvious reason, being that those free on bail would go after the witnesses, perhaps it's the other side around this time.

As in, within days after their 'release on bail' they themselves get killed instead, just to shut them up for good.

[GentlemanJim]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

Well, there are many posters who have written that they thought they could not be amazed by anything else in Thailand, then news of the bail comes along and they and I are shocked at such a decision. Then just as we think we have been amazed as much as can be, you come along calling these cops hero's.

I guess you also think that all the guards at the Nazi concentration camps who killed and tortured women and children were 'just doing their job'? Thankfully at the Nuremberg Trials it was firmly established that blindly following the orders of a superior when it meant the murder and torture of people, was no defence at all.

And by the way, you seem to be under some form of delusion. You think there was a staunch clampdown on drug cartels and the major drug dealers? The clampdown was on all the little men (just doing their job?), and many many innocent people were murdered in the process. The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

[Beetlejuice]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

Well, there are many posters who have written that they thought they could not be amazed by anything else in Thailand, then news of the bail comes along and they and I are shocked at such a decision. Then just as we think we have been amazed as much as can be, you come along calling these cops hero's.

I guess you also think that all the guards at the Nazi concentration camps who killed and tortured women and children were 'just doing their job'? Thankfully at the Nuremberg Trials it was firmly established that blindly following the orders of a superior when it meant the murder and torture of people, was no defence at all.

And by the way, you seem to be under some form of delusion. You think there was a staunch clampdown on drug cartels and the major drug dealers? The clampdown was on all the little men (just doing their job?), and many many innocent people were murdered in the process. The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

I was fully expecting this sort of response.

How can you compare drug dealers, murdering mafia gangs, suppliers of suffering and death with innocent victims of the Holocaust? And the law enforcers that have the dangerous thankless task of trying to curtail this scum with members of the Gestapo?

You say; The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

Don’t know. Who do you think they are?

Over to you.

Edited August 2, 2012 by Beetlejuice

[simple1]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

Well, there are many posters who have written that they thought they could not be amazed by anything else in Thailand, then news of the bail comes along and they and I are shocked at such a decision. Then just as we think we have been amazed as much as can be, you come along calling these cops hero's.

I guess you also think that all the guards at the Nazi concentration camps who killed and tortured women and children were 'just doing their job'? Thankfully at the Nuremberg Trials it was firmly established that blindly following the orders of a superior when it meant the murder and torture of people, was no defence at all.

And by the way, you seem to be under some form of delusion. You think there was a staunch clampdown on drug cartels and the major drug dealers? The clampdown was on all the little men (just doing their job?), and many many innocent people were murdered in the process. The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

I was fully expecting this sort of response.

How can you compare drug dealers, murdering mafia gangs, suppliers of suffering and death and the law enforcers that have the dangerous thankless task of trying to curtail this scum with members of the Gestapo and the innocent victims of the Holocaust?

You say; The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

Don’t know. Who do you think they are?

Over to you.

Let's take a fairly recent event when billions of cold tablets were being illegally imported into Thailand from South Korea and China for processing into YaBa/ICE. I understand that the tablets would have to be transported to the border area that is controlled by the police and military to the drug labs for processing. At the same time it was uncovered that Thai hospital staff (some in senior management positions) were selling millions of cold tablets to the "drug gangs". Some good guys for Thai enforcement agencies were correctly carrying out their job, others will say it was only uncovered because they were not getting a pay off. You cannot tell me that Thai staff in hospitals, enforcement & Customs were not involved with the illegal activities and would have to be at senior levels. As yet no arrests announced in the media other than some hospital staff being transferred.

If Thai enforcement agencies are not involved, please let us know who is controlling the activity.

Edited August 2, 2012 by simple1

[apetley]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

These policemen were not fall guys, they were not heroes they were guilty of murder simple as that.

For five of Thailands finest to have been found guilty then the evidence against them must have been so overwhelming it could not have been hushed up.

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

[scorecard]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

So I guess if your son or daughter (adult or child), wife, lovedone, was in the wrong place at the wrong time (could happen) and got gunned down in cold blood (murdered, assassinated, dead!) with no questions asked, then you would say 'never mind, it's all OK, I don't mind'!

Edited August 2, 2012 by scorecard

[GentlemanJim]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

Well, there are many posters who have written that they thought they could not be amazed by anything else in Thailand, then news of the bail comes along and they and I are shocked at such a decision. Then just as we think we have been amazed as much as can be, you come along calling these cops hero's.

I guess you also think that all the guards at the Nazi concentration camps who killed and tortured women and children were 'just doing their job'? Thankfully at the Nuremberg Trials it was firmly established that blindly following the orders of a superior when it meant the murder and torture of people, was no defence at all.

And by the way, you seem to be under some form of delusion. You think there was a staunch clampdown on drug cartels and the major drug dealers? The clampdown was on all the little men (just doing their job?), and many many innocent people were murdered in the process. The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

I was fully expecting this sort of response.

How can you compare drug dealers, murdering mafia gangs, suppliers of suffering and death with innocent victims of the Holocaust? And the law enforcers that have the dangerous thankless task of trying to curtail this scum with members of the Gestapo?

You say; The drug problem is worse than ever and the cartels and the big men remain, ....I wonder who they are?????

Don’t know. Who do you think they are?

Over to you.

Now then Mr Spin Doctor, just where did I say this?

How can you compare drug dealers, murdering mafia gangs, suppliers of suffering and death with innocent victims of the Holocaust?

??

The victim of the 5 policemen was an innocent young man, who was not shot by accident in a running street battle, but callously tortured and slowly strung up by his neck to die. he was not a mafia member or a murderous drug runner. He was murdered, and the courts have sentenced his murderers accordingly. Your statement that the murderers are heroes is as offensive as your trying to spin my words to imply I was comparing drug mafioso to holocaust victims,

Lets be perfectly clear, YOU stated that the police were heroes and that they were just fall guys for the people further up the chain. Even though the police committed murder and extrajudicial killings (which are illegal), you seem to think thats ok because the guys further up the chain issued the orders, ergo, the police were just doing their jobs. I explained that, that was the same defence that was used at the Nuremberg Trials, by Nazi concentration camp guards who claimed, 'they were just following orders'. It was deemed at the trial that the claim to be following an order which they knew was not legal and resulted in death and murder of innocents was not acceptable. The legal decision has been used as a precedent since then. You see there is/was no comparison of drug mafioso with holocaust victims. You are claiming the police actions of stringing up an innocent young man are heroic, and that in itself is gravely offensive.

Edited August 2, 2012 by GentlemanJim

[Joeb]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

So I guess if your son or daughter (adult or child), wife, lovedone, was in the wrong place at the wrong time (could happen) and got gunned down in cold blood (murdered, assassinated, dead!) with no questions asked, then you would say 'never mind, it's all OK, I don't mind'!

He is unlikely to answer, as he didn't reply to my post which said basically the same thing. Apparantly, drugs are evil > the ends justify the means > hanging an innocent teenager makes you a hero

[scorecard]

Further, dear beetlejuice...

There is a case to say (which doesn't change what gentlemanjim has shared) that the higher level police in the era being discussed here feared to object / feared to blow the whistle and say 'this is wrong', 'this is immoral', 'this is crime against humanity'.

All because one man had got away with destroying the checks and balances, had succeeded in intimidating the media, had successed in bullying both the police, the military, and many areas of the public service, and getting numerous members of his family and close cronies into numerous strategic and powerful (control) positions, all flouting the relevant laws and protocols.

The same man who knew very well that he was breaking a serious and important law about good governance (or in other words, abuse of power) when he signed the documents to approve (on behalf of the state / the common wealth of Thailand) the sale of land to his wife.

He, and his then wife, knew very well that they were breaking important laws / doing something which was highly immoral / doing something which was totally totally inappropriate in terms of being role models. They weren't concerned about any of this - they just wanted to us etheir power to get their sticky fingers on prime real estate at basement prices, and screw the rest of society.

Added to this the high ranking officials who attended the signing of these documents knew very well that what they were witnessing something which was illegal and immoral. not one of them spoke out.

Why? Intimidaton, fear, and people who are selected for positions who have no capability and no morals comes to mind.

[maidu]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

At first, I thought this was a troll piece, but from subsequent responses by the writer, it's clear it's not.

I think the writer, if he needs a job, should contact mr. Thaksin. He's perfect for the job: apologizing for extrajudicial murders, and justifying anything a corrupt cop and court system can dish out. Thaksin would love him. Starting salary; $5,000/day, and completely above the law, no matter what law he might ever break in Thailand - guaranteed.

[nurofiend]

Kiattisak, who was found hanged in his cell, was one of an estimated 2,800 people killed during the crackdown on drug trafficking in 2003-2004.

That’s 2800 less chances of drugs being brought into the system and becoming available to vulnerable young people.

The Staunch clamp down on drug dealers and drug cartels was all part of the Taksin regime at the time, a policy that I totally agreed with. Otherwise if left unchecked, than Thailand could become another Mexico, in control of criminal gangs.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals. These men are being used as fall guys to pacify the do gooders and world opinion plus to add more bad marks against Taksin. This is purely political and to help Thailand save face against it`s critics.

I do hope that these policemen are treated with leniency and not put to death in order to sweep under the carpet what were the policies of the Government during that period.

As far as I’m concerned these policemen are heroes, not criminals.

that's disgusting.

even if i agreed with your draconian views on punishment for drug offences, and i thought the bib should have been allowed to snuff these guys out, there were still people who had nothing to with drugs murdered in cold blood...

so even if i agreed that they should murder the drug dealers, the problem is when this is allowed to be the status quo within the police force, then lots of innocents will be killed... as was proven.

what about the story of an old man who had been caught with a small bit of weed, so he went to the police station, where the cops told him we'll drop this charge if you admit to using meth (?) so he declined and paid his fine for the weed instead...

he and his wife were shot dead on their motorbike on the way home from the police station.

and afaik their son got down on his knees in front of thaksin to beg him to investigate their killings.

[Beetlejuice]

Worldwide the authorities are at war with drugs. But as some posters have rightly pointed out, they are slowly losing the battle with the drug syndicates and to these criminal gangs. Most of the present anti drug supply and possession procedures has been a total failure and out dated.

Drugs can now be obtained easier and cheaper than ever before, the demand is increasing and has created an illicit international trade controlled by violent criminal gang entrepreneurs. These mafia gangs are involved in the business of suffering and death that is worth billions of dollars worldwide per year.

It is obvious that more extreme measures to combat the drug mafia cartels are required. I’m sure many will agree that South America is a prime example of what can happen if these drug gangs start to take control and the situation gets out of hand.

Drug possessors and users are as bad as the dealers, because it is they that are fuelling the trade. If there is no demand, then the dealers go out of business.

If drug suppliers and possessors are apprehended than they become pwned, and whatever is their fate, than so what? As long as they are put out of circulation is all that matters, because in the long term, it will save lives.

The solution is simple; don`t do drugs, in any shape or form, because the majority point of view is; drugs are not wanted here.

[MAJIC]

As the police have now been sentenced the family no longer has access to the Witness Protection Program. Now that the convicted are out on bail, let's hope for the sake of the family this is immediately re-instated.

It would seem a Major Basic Point has been missed here,the witnesses it seems, are no longer in need of protection,because the the case has been tried.and the guilty are now back on the streets,.......words fail me.

Edited August 2, 2012 by MAJIC

[daboyz1]

Where do a few of you come from even in the states a murder defendant can be granted bail as well as a convicted murder awaiting appeal. This is more likely granted to someone of influence kind of the same as Thailand.

I know some who was accused of murder and they were locked up for a month awaiting the second bail hearing as the first was sandbagged by the district attorney. The bail amount was reduced 500,000dollars from 1 million when friends of the charged testified to his sterling character. Eventually the DA dropped the murder charge for lack of evidence but the ddefendant had to plead to a lesser charge of destroying evidence and it was finished as time served. The system is not perfect at home or in Thailand.

Bolded above is 100% wrong. Please cite a case.

[daboyz1]

Where do a few of you come from even in the states a murder defendant can be granted bail as well as a convicted murder awaiting appeal. This is more likely granted to someone of influence kind of the same as Thailand.

I know some who was accused of murder and they were locked up for a month awaiting the second bail hearing as the first was sandbagged by the district attorney. The bail amount was reduced 500,000dollars from 1 million when friends of the charged testified to his sterling character. Eventually the DA dropped the murder charge for lack of evidence but the ddefendant had to plead to a lesser charge of destroying evidence and it was finished as time served. The system is not perfect at home or in Thailand.

Exactly - this is similar to that famous footballer in the uSA who got off with murder.

Not at all similar. Not even close actually. After he was charged and arrested, he was refused bail. He had a trial and was found not guilty. No bail was ever granted.

[apetley]

Worldwide the authorities are at war with drugs. But as some posters have rightly pointed out, they are slowly losing the battle with the drug syndicates and to these criminal gangs. Most of the present anti drug supply and possession procedures has been a total failure and out dated.

Drugs can now be obtained easier and cheaper than ever before, the demand is increasing and has created an illicit international trade controlled by violent criminal gang entrepreneurs. These mafia gangs are involved in the business of suffering and death that is worth billions of dollars worldwide per year.

It is obvious that more extreme measures to combat the drug mafia cartels are required. Im sure many will agree that South America is a prime example of what can happen if these drug gangs start to take control and the situation gets out of hand.

Drug possessors and users are as bad as the dealers, because it is they that are fuelling the trade. If there is no demand, then the dealers go out of business.

If drug suppliers and possessors are apprehended than they become pwned, and whatever is their fate, than so what? As long as they are put out of circulation is all that matters, because in the long term, it will save lives.

The solution is simple; don`t do drugs, in any shape or form, because the majority point of view is; drugs are not wanted here.

The problem starts when Thailands own drug dealing mafia, the police, become judge, jury and executioner.

And what about those wrongly accused to settle old scores or grudges. Where are the checks and balances to ensure justice?

You have a twisted set of values if yoy think people should be brutally executed on mere suspicion, callousness or malicious lie.

Who knows, maybe someone who has taken a dislike to you sometime could have said you dealt drugs. You'd be perfectly happy when a rogue cop puts a bullet in your head, right?

Sent from my GT-I9003 using Thaivisa Connect App

Edited August 3, 2012 by apetley

[masterbiker49]

The story, as usual from this source, lacks numerous relevant details.

By the law of Thailand, do they still have the right of appeal to a higher court?

If they do, then they must be given that opportunity, but bail?

Can a judge make a personal decision on bail with no reference to anything other than his own whims? Somehow I doubt that. Surely there is some properly formed structured analysis which must be followed and must be documented for court records: 1). Whether the person is likely to flee, 2). Whether the person is likley to intimidate others, especially the family concerned here, 3), 4) For some offences surely there is no chance of bail.

If the answers to 1. and 2., are NO, then surely there is a structured system of deciding the amount of bail, not just based on the whims of one man.

The story also mentions that this out of control gang of cops (something like 20 in total) have a very scaly track record, surely that would be enough to indicate they are a risk. And lets' not forget the cops are a closed brotherhood, they protect their own no matter what they have done.

Was the bail money actually paid before they were released? Or was it promised to be paid, or did someone say they will some land deeds next week? Again no details in the news piece.

What must this feel like for the family who have gone through hell in terms of the loss of a young family member, and the fact that he was strung up and died from his neck being stretched - a horrid way to die. If I was the father or mother I would be having graphic nightmares on this aspect alone, forever.

The family have also gone through hell for many years in their quest for justice, probably scared all the time that someone will take rogue action (violence) to punish them / to frighten them off .

On one hand another court has just charged a large group of people with serious offences in regard to disrespect for the court (which really means disrespect for the law) and harrassment of the judges of the same court.

One of the most serious problems in this country is lack of respect for the law, along with an attitude that the law can be twisted, ignored, paid off, and more. And many of the leaders of this wonderful country (leaders for decades in fact) are the worst offenders.

One court tries to gain some respect for the law, another court makes a laughing stock of the law.

Underlying all of this, in the Kalasin case (in any case), is one of the most serious tenants of the law; the law must be done and must be seen to be done, And justice must be given to those who are victims.

All depends on how much baht they can get thier hands on.

[simple1]

As the police have now been sentenced the family no longer has access to the Witness Protection Program. Now that the convicted are out on bail, let's hope for the sake of the family this is immediately re-instated.

It would seem a Major Basic Point has been missed here,the witnesses it seems, are no longer in need of protection,because the the case has been tried.and the guilty are now back on the streets,.......words fail me.

There is an article in today's Bangkok Post quoting the family's request for reinstatement of Witness Protection as well as requesting ongoing support from Human rights organisations.

[simple1]

Worldwide the authorities are at war with drugs. But as some posters have rightly pointed out, they are slowly losing the battle with the drug syndicates and to these criminal gangs. Most of the present anti drug supply and possession procedures has been a total failure and out dated.

Drugs can now be obtained easier and cheaper than ever before, the demand is increasing and has created an illicit international trade controlled by violent criminal gang entrepreneurs. These mafia gangs are involved in the business of suffering and death that is worth billions of dollars worldwide per year.

It is obvious that more extreme measures to combat the drug mafia cartels are required. I’m sure many will agree that South America is a prime example of what can happen if these drug gangs start to take control and the situation gets out of hand.

Drug possessors and users are as bad as the dealers, because it is they that are fuelling the trade. If there is no demand, then the dealers go out of business.

If drug suppliers and possessors are apprehended than they become pwned, and whatever is their fate, than so what? As long as they are put out of circulation is all that matters, because in the long term, it will save lives.

The solution is simple; don`t do drugs, in any shape or form, because the majority point of view is; drugs are not wanted here.

The "don't do drugs" mantra, worldwide, this has been a complete failure. Where their has been some limited success is with education and rehabilitation policies for drug users. You keep repeating that unlawful killing is OK, but again this has been a complete failure in controlling the illegal drug supply. The so called drug kingpins, at least in Thailand, seem to be untouchable. You infer you have knowledge of the Royal Thai Police and illegal drugs industry in Thailand, but avoid direct questions. So either put up or shut up.

[maidu]

Worldwide the authorities are at war with drugs. But as some posters have rightly pointed out, they are slowly losing the battle with the drug syndicates and to these criminal gangs. Most of the present anti drug supply and possession procedures has been a total failure and out dated.

Drugs can now be obtained easier and cheaper than ever before, the demand is increasing and has created an illicit international trade controlled by violent criminal gang entrepreneurs. These mafia gangs are involved in the business of suffering and death that is worth billions of dollars worldwide per year.

It is obvious that more extreme measures to combat the drug mafia cartels are required. I’m sure many will agree that South America is a prime example of what can happen if these drug gangs start to take control and the situation gets out of hand.

Drug possessors and users are as bad as the dealers, because it is they that are fuelling the trade. If there is no demand, then the dealers go out of business.

If drug suppliers and possessors are apprehended than they become pwned, and whatever is their fate, than so what? As long as they are put out of circulation is all that matters, because in the long term, it will save lives.

The solution is simple; don`t do drugs, in any shape or form, because the majority point of view is; drugs are not wanted here.

pop quiz:

>>> Are alcoholic drinks recreational drugs? yes? no?

>>> Do some drunks cause grievous harm yes? no?

>>> Is a wife beating worse than sitting with headphones listening to music? yes? no?

>>> Do insurance rates go up for everyone because of drunks? yes? no?

>>> Would you disallow a drunk driver from driving your daughter home from school? yes? no?

>>> Will more booze be sold if other drugs are illegal? yes? no?

>>> Are hospitals packed with patients with alcohol related problems? yes? no?

>>> Do politicians drink booze?

>>> Do police drink booze?

>>> Do alcohol dealers devote tens of billions of dollars annually to promo campaigns?

If you answered 'yes' to any of the above questions. then you can see why alcoholic drinks are as, or more harmful than other types of recreational drugs - particularly when looked at in sum of the harm they cause. Then, Beetlejuice's entire troll-like argument reeks of bias. One added question; Is Beetlejuice involved with the sale of recreational drugs known as alcoholic drinks?

Edited August 3, 2012 by maidu

[edwinchester]

Worldwide the authorities are at war with drugs. But as some posters have rightly pointed out, they are slowly losing the battle with the drug syndicates and to these criminal gangs. Most of the present anti drug supply and possession procedures has been a total failure and out dated.

Drugs can now be obtained easier and cheaper than ever before, the demand is increasing and has created an illicit international trade controlled by violent criminal gang entrepreneurs. These mafia gangs are involved in the business of suffering and death that is worth billions of dollars worldwide per year.

It is obvious that more extreme measures to combat the drug mafia cartels are required. I’m sure many will agree that South America is a prime example of what can happen if these drug gangs start to take control and the situation gets out of hand.

Drug possessors and users are as bad as the dealers, because it is they that are fuelling the trade. If there is no demand, then the dealers go out of business.

If drug suppliers and possessors are apprehended than they become pwned, and whatever is their fate, than so what? As long as they are put out of circulation is all that matters, because in the long term, it will save lives.

The solution is simple; don`t do drugs, in any shape or form, because the majority point of view is; drugs are not wanted here.

I wonder what your opinion is on those wrongly accused either by mistake or malicious intent who were killed by the police? Were their executuoners heroes? Were their killers justified to pump a bullet in their heads on what amounted to heresay? Or is it easier to say you can't make an omlette without breaking a few eggs?

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[scorecard]

Worldwide the authorities are at war with drugs. But as some posters have rightly pointed out, they are slowly losing the battle with the drug syndicates and to these criminal gangs. Most of the present anti drug supply and possession procedures has been a total failure and out dated.

Drugs can now be obtained easier and cheaper than ever before, the demand is increasing and has created an illicit international trade controlled by violent criminal gang entrepreneurs. These mafia gangs are involved in the business of suffering and death that is worth billions of dollars worldwide per year.

It is obvious that more extreme measures to combat the drug mafia cartels are required. Im sure many will agree that South America is a prime example of what can happen if these drug gangs start to take control and the situation gets out of hand.

Drug possessors and users are as bad as the dealers, because it is they that are fuelling the trade. If there is no demand, then the dealers go out of business.

If drug suppliers and possessors are apprehended than they become pwned, and whatever is their fate, than so what? As long as they are put out of circulation is all that matters, because in the long term, it will save lives.

The solution is simple; don`t do drugs, in any shape or form, because the majority point of view is; drugs are not wanted here.

The problem starts when Thailands own drug dealing mafia, the police, become judge, jury and executioner.

And what about those wrongly accused to settle old scores or grudges. Where are the checks and balances to ensure justice?

You have a twisted set of values if yoy think people should be brutally executed on mere suspicion, callousness or malicious lie.

Who knows, maybe someone who has taken a dislike to you sometime could have said you dealt drugs. You'd be perfectly happy when a rogue cop puts a bullet in your head, right?

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And beetlejuice:

- In the paymasters war on drugs, not one drug kingpin was touched. Not one senior police officer and not one scaly politician was touched, and there is plenty of anecdotal evidence over decades that they are a sizeable part of the system of drug kingpins.

- The police (proven by survey, many times, many decades) are the most corrupt gov't agency in this country. Just a small example just a couple of weeks ago when the 'vibrating answer machine' was discovered at a police entrance test, and somebody (bravely) blew the whistle*. The entrance candidates had paid hefty fees to gain access to the ' answer machine'. Many candidates admitted they had paid 350,000Baht. A very costly exercise to get a job which pays extremely low wages, even in higher ranks. Doesn't add up.

*My Thai colleagues tell me this 'machine' is not new, it's been around for many years (along with other expensive entrance test scams). There can be no doubt that the police seniors already knew. These are the no values / no ethics people who are entrusted and paid to protect us.

also, there are many cops out of control / they have protection within their own brotherhood from nasty ruthless and very powerful people. Their on the ground police commanders can't control these people and don't even try.

- During the paymasters 'war on drugs' blacklists of people were hastily prepared (to meet the paymasters KPIs). In many areas these blacklists quickly became public resulting in many (publicized) incidents of people pleading for their names to be removed, and the police admitting that there were manay many mistakes in these lists.

But you would give these people / any cops, carte blanche to shoot on sight, no questions will be asked!

- There is strong suggestion that the paymasters war on drugs which was was announced as 'ridding Thailand of drugs' with the unspoken message that it was 'for Thailand' was in fact not true. Many folks have indicated that his reason for the drugs war was in fact different - there was a serious drug related problem close to home.

- Bottom line for you - shoot them all (including children) - just bad luck if they are not connected.

Edited August 3, 2012 by scorecard

[jerrysteve]

Someone has their brains in their arse. These people will be out of the country by the time role call comes around; if they aren't long gone

already by now.

But whether just is ever served by the powers that be, eventually there karma (Newtons 3rd Law of Motion) will come around

and kick their <deleted> straight to hell. They will suffer.

The bottom line is that the people who set them free on bail will suffer the same fate.

Further, the powers that be who let them go free are as guilty as if they them selves committed those murders themselves.

If you do not think they are all connected, think again.

[jerrysteve]

What goes around comes around; sooner or later.

I think all of us can testify to that in one way or the other.

[maidu]

Someone has their brains in their arse. These people will be out of the country by the time role call comes around; if they aren't long gone.

They don't have to flee the country. They just need to run out in to the rice field (like bus drivers do, after fatal crashes), and get a fake ID soon after. Pity that the crime witnesses will suffer mental anguish (at best) or painful death because jurists did the wrong thing.

[Thai at Heart]

Someone has their brains in their arse. These people will be out of the country by the time role call comes around; if they aren't long gone

already by now.

But whether just is ever served by the powers that be, eventually there karma (Newtons 3rd Law of Motion) will come around

and kick their <deleted> straight to hell. They will suffer.

The bottom line is that the people who set them free on bail will suffer the same fate.

Further, the powers that be who let them go free are as guilty as if they them selves committed those murders themselves.

If you do not think they are all connected, think again.

when judgements are made like this, don't be surprised if the average somchai eventually says, i well sort it, and the court, all out for myself. I have no real problem with a law that protects judges from criticism if they make learned judgements and the right of appeal is swift and fair.

However, how can this decision be above criticism, above debate above "the people". If there is no way to have this judgement challenged by a higher court very quickly the system needs change.

Strangely, would i disapprove if this judge wad held to public account and ridicule? Not at all. It is a judgement that endangers the witnesses and general public.

So, judges and courts are above criticism. It is to be respected no matter. Very difficult to achieve if judgements like this keep coming I fear. It is this lack of perceived justice that is one of the major gripes of the poor. The system denigrates itself with decisions like this, you the people must respect the system, but the system us patently wrong. It is an insult to even a child when injustice is so obvious.

So what is average Joe to do. Change the system, obvious and inevitable really.

Edited August 3, 2012 by Thai at Heart