Are Believers Judged Less Stringently Than Monks?

[nokia]

Drunk monks should be disrobed, say angry residents

Chiang Mai Mail.

Nopniwat Krailerg

Chang Moi residents complained to police on January 2 that a noisy party was being held at the house of a monk at Wat Chai Sri Phum, in Tambon Chang Moi.

Pol Capt Manas Theudee, deputy inspector at Muang police station, led a team of officers to the front of the temple where they heard music coming from the house of deputy abbot Pornchai Sanyapasathuno. Four monks, including Pornchai, together with a novice and two male housekeepers were dancing, and beer cans were scattered on the ground.

Officers checked the refrigerator and found 10 more cans of beer, and confiscated them, together with a karaoke stereo system, which would have to be considered entertainment from hel_l. The abbot was then informed. Following this, the abbot had a meeting with the temple committee and the monks concerned, and probation was agreed as it was a first time transgression.

Local inhabitants have criticized this decision heavily, saying that it was improper behavior, and the media has also covered the event extensively. One survey revealed that 95 percent of the people wanted the monks disrobed.

Pornchai has since left the monkhood of his own accord, and has gone into karaoke training.

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This is certainly a bad example but does being a buddhist means to give up singing(karaoke),

drinking,eating expensive food, tv, and other forms of entertaintment, follow the 8 precepts and live a austere or ascetic life?

newbie to Thai culture

[Abandon]

If memory serves, drinking alcahol is only a minor offense for monks. There are only 4 offenses which entail disrobing, which includes a ban on re-ordination.

So the abbot was lilely quite right. But in this day and age .... hard to have sympathy for the monks involved. If they want to live like that they should be laypeople. Indeed, even lay Buddhists are supposed to refrain from drink.

It is rather tame though. In Canada there has been systematic sexual abuse of orphans and students in monastic schools. Ireland has had its share - did you see the movie the Magdalene Sisters ? In the UK there is an open movement by Catholic priests to openly decleare their common law wives.

In Thailand a monk has a couple of beers, or goes to sing in a karaoke bar (another story) and the press is all over it.

The fact that such stories make news shows the healthy state of Buddhism in my opinion.

[nokia]

I think the better aspects of buddhist beliefs is karma/doing merit, and non-violence/peace which some other religions do not advocate.

Magdalene Sisters smacks of sadism, cruelty and extreme legalism, under the guise of religion.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely?

Although monks take vows of renunciation for the period of monkhood, shouldnt sympathy be given when they commit a misdemeanour or non-violence offence because they are flesh & blood like us and have to suppress their desires. I think the abbot was forgiving to call it a first time trangression and wanted to close the case but not the local people.

LOS is 99.5% buddhist but i wonder how many are core devoted followers of buddhist teachings and how many are followers of popular buddhism.

Assuming only the core followers are closer to nirvana because they follow the 8 precepts, live an ascetic lifestyle & other buddhist teachings, then it's scary to think how many followers of popular buddhism will make it as a human in the 'next rebirth' rather as an animal... Are the 12 animals of the chinese zodiac possible rebirth candidates or it includes the full spectrum of the animal kingdom, from elephant, to ant, maggot to bacteria?

[Abandon]

Priest's holy smokes

An Orthodox priest has been arrested by police in Bulgaria for selling cannabis joints to parishioners.

The drugs were allegedly offered by Father Kiril Papudov, said to be the most popular of the priests working around the villages of Kladenci and Borovichene.

He was caught by undercover drug squad officers who say they found 128oz of high quality cannabis in the his home.

and this one:

A Romanian priest has been fined and could be defrocked after he was caught playing poker in a pub.

Vasile Mihaila, 40, parish priest for Negoesti village in Gorj county, was caught in the act by police during a routine search.

The priest and other two men were each fined £200 for gambling illegally in an unauthorised place.

A police spokesman told Gazeta de Sud: "There were nine men at the table playing poker but only three of them had money in front of their seats. I was stoned when I heard one of them was a priest."

Orthodox church officials said they have opened their own investigation but add the priest could be defrocked for "activities incompatible with the service of a clergyman".

Edited January 27, 2006 by Abandon

[Abandon]

Nun 'bribed cop to beat drink-drive rap'

A Polish nun has been accused of bribing a policeman after she was caught drink-driving for the third time.

Prosecutors are investigating Sister Malgozata Lato, from Jelenia Gora, after a local newspaper reported that her ticket had been cancelled.

The paper claimed she had paid a policeman £500 to escape prosecution.

Sister Lato, a member of the local Benedictine convent, reportedly said she feared public humiliation if her fellow nuns found out about her wild nights out.

[camerata]

Although monks take vows of renunciation for the period of monkhood, shouldnt sympathy be given when they commit a misdemeanour or non-violence offence because they are flesh & blood like us and have to suppress their desires. I think the abbot was forgiving to call it a first time trangression and wanted to close the case but not the local people.

One of the monks was a deputy abbot, so this type of behaviour is something of a disgrace for him. The fact that he disrobed to become a karaoke singer is a good indication that this was not his first transgression. I don't think Thais have many role models to look up to these days, but monks are definitely at the top of the list and so people expect them to behave accordingly.

Assuming only the core followers are closer to nirvana because they follow the 8 precepts, live an ascetic lifestyle & other buddhist teachings, then it's scary to think how many followers of popular buddhism will make it as a human in the 'next rebirth' rather as an animal...

Well, that's their business, but monks should be guiding them, not singing karaoke.

Are the 12 animals of the chinese zodiac possible rebirth candidates or it includes the full spectrum of the animal kingdom, from elephant, to ant, maggot to bacteria?

Any sentient being, I would think.

[robitusson]

If memory serves, drinking alcahol is only a minor offense for monks. There are only 4 offenses which entail disrobing, which includes a ban on re-ordination.

So the abbot was lilely quite right. But in this day and age .... hard to have sympathy for the monks involved. If they want to live like that they should be laypeople. Indeed, even lay Buddhists are supposed to refrain from drink.

It is rather tame though. In Canada there has been systematic sexual abuse of orphans and students in monastic schools. Ireland has had its share - did you see the movie the Magdalene Sisters ? In the UK there is an open movement by Catholic priests to openly decleare their common law wives.

In Thailand a monk has a couple of beers, or goes to sing in a karaoke bar (another story) and the press is all over it.

The fact that such stories make news shows the healthy state of Buddhism in my opinion.

Some religions will always look favourable when compared with others. Just because monks aren't abusing people to the same extent (that we know of) as the Catholic church it doesn't mean their behaviour is acceptable. Drinking and partying are not suitable practises for monks and should not taken lightly,

yours,

Ayatollah Robitusson.

[Abandon]

lol

[robitusson]

There was an abbott selling yaa-baa out of his monastry about a year ago I remember.

[meadish_sweetball]

They are all people just like us all, albeit in saffron robes...

Try to imagine going through your entire puberty in saffron robes like some street kids do. It is hardly strange they sometimes stray, as we all do.

[jdinasia]

my teacher (Thai language ... not Dhamma etc) is a very conservative young Thai woman ...

She ways there are monks in Thailand ... worthy of all respect ... and great monks that are respected by all the other monks for thier obvious enlightenment ... then there are the guys in orange at Pantip.