Paying A Fortune For British Visas And Citizenship

[DonW]

An interesting post on another thread between EnglishinSiam and 7by7 about visa fees.

What do you all think about the changing fees structure?

englishinsiam, on 2012-10-14 08:33:11, said:

Just seems ludicrous you pay a fortune for that then got to pay loads again for Citizenship.

:

7by7

Agree totally.

When my wife and daughter applied for settlement in September 2000 the fee for a settlement visa was, if memory serves, £270 and a visit visa was £60.

I asked an ECO, you could talk to them in those days, why a settlement visa was over four times more expensive than a visit. She explained that the cost of a settlement visa included the cost of any future in UK LTR applications; FLR if required and ILR. This seemed reasonable.

Then Messrs Blair and Brown decided that visa, LTR and naturalisation applications should make a profit and introduced fees for LTR applications without reducing the initial visa fee and increased most visa fees and naturalisation fees. They also introduced a system whereby all fees are increased once a year above inflation.

Despite vociferous opposition from both the Tories and LibDems at the time, the coalition has continued with this policy.

I should stress that I firmly believe that visa, LTR and citizenship applicants should pay the full cost of processing their applications. However the government's own figures show that for nearly all applications the fee is way above cost.

The tables in Charging for Immigration and Nationality Services 2012-13 show the unit cost. For example:

Settlement visa: unit cost, £391; fee from April 2012, £826.

ILR by post: unit cost, £255; fee from April 2012, £991.

ILR at PEO: unit cost, £255; fee from April 2012, £1377.

Naturalisation (Spouse): unit cost, £181; fee from April 2012, £851 (includes £80 toward cost of citizenship ceremony).

To be fair, 6 month visit visa fees are actually below the unit cost. Unit cost, £140; fee from April 2012, £78.

Edited October 14, 2012 by DonW

[chiang mai]

Soft targets

[DonW]

I personally have no issue in paying for visa and citizenship fees. England is the best country in the world, in my opinion, seems like a small price to pay to be a fully fledged member of a great nation.

[Briggsy]

Most will make that back and more off the social in no time.

[Naam]

I personally have no issue in paying for visa and citizenship fees. England is the best country in the world, in my opinion, seems like a small price to pay to be a fully fledged member of a great nation.

[DonW]

Did you manage to read the post correctly this time?

[samran]

I personally have no issue in paying for visa and citizenship fees. England is the best country in the world, in my opinion, seems like a small price to pay to be a fully fledged member of a great nation.

England England über alles?

[Naam]

I personally have no issue in paying for visa and citizenship fees. England is the best country in the world, in my opinion, seems like a small price to pay to be a fully fledged member of a great nation.

England England über alles?

[7by7]

Most will make that back and more off the social in no time.

Another person ignorant of the UK immigration rules.

People in the UK under immigration control are banned from receiving nearly all public funds except those they have contributed to via NICs. This goes for their British spouse/partner, too, who whilst he/she may claim public funds in his/her own right may not claim any extra due to their immigrant spouse/partner living with them. This includes access to social housing.

Immigrants flooding the UK and being paid vast amounts of government money whilst being given council houses is a myth based upon propaganda put about by the likes of the BNP. I am saddened that members here give credence to such lies.

Once someone has ILR then they may claim any and all public funds to which they would be entitled were they British; but under the new rules that means living in the UK for at least 5 years first.

[Briggsy]

The poster refers to the cost of gaining citizenship.

Once gained and even prior to that, subject to length of time in the country, the new Brit/ILR holder has the right to claim benefits a,k.a. public funds.

Just out of interest what happens when an ILR holder loses his or her job, but has not resided in the UK for 5 years?

[gamini]

And yet so many TV posters complain about the paltry visa fees in Thailand!!

[7by7]

The poster refers to the cost of gaining citizenship.

Once gained and even prior to that, subject to length of time in the country, the new Brit/ILR holder has the right to claim benefits a,k.a. public funds.

Just out of interest what happens when an ILR holder loses his or her job, but has not resided in the UK for 5 years?

I should clarify that the residential qualification for ILR for those who applied for their initial settlement visa before 9/7/12 is 2 years; but was changed for those applying for their initial settlement visa on or after 9/7/12 to 5 years.

Length of time has nothing to do with access to public funds, it is immigration status that counts. Until someone has ILR they are banned from claiming most public funds except those they have contributed to via NICs.

So if someone loses their job before receiving ILR they should have been paying NICs when working and therefore would receive the appropriate amount of JSA based upon the NICs previously made by them. But they wouldn't get any extra in the form of income support etc.

[Briggsy]

Many years ago, I was one of many Brits and Irish who worked in the Netherlands.

The holy grail for many amongst us was the GAK, one of the Netherlands unemployment insurance schemes. Get 26 weeks' contributions in and you were able to get 70% of your salary for 6 months. Needless to say, many took advantage of the generous welfare system.

[DonW]

The poster refers to the cost of gaining citizenship.

Once gained and even prior to that, subject to length of time in the country, the new Brit/ILR holder has the right to claim benefits a,k.a. public funds.

Just out of interest what happens when an ILR holder loses his or her job, but has not resided in the UK for 5 years?

They can claim after 2 years when they get ILR, this has recently changed now its 5, I think.

They come, work for 2 years then strat doing cash jobs. A chap I know renovates properties, all he used are Poles and Romanians on cash jobs. Its trerrible how they are all abusing the system.

[7by7]

EEA nationals do not come under the immigration rules and so the visa and LTR fees wont apply to them. Also, they could not apply for ILR after two years under the old rules nor will they be able to apply for ILR after 5 years under the new. They can, however, apply for permanent residence after 5 years.

Obviously the naturalisation fees will apply, should they wish to become British once qualified. Which would be after they have held PR for at least 1 year; i.e. a minimum of 6 years after first moving to live in the UK.

EEA freedom of movement rules mean that any EEA national, including British citizens of course, has the right to live in another EEA country if they are exercising an economic treaty right; student, job seeker, employed, self employed or living on independent means such as a pension. Job seekers, including those who had a job but lost it for some reason, are restricted to a maximum of three months after which they must leave unless they have found a job, although the UK does not enforce this rule as strictly as some other states.

Access to state benefits whilst living in another EEA state is restricted until the EEA national has permanent residence in that state.

A chap I know renovates properties, all he used are Poles and Romanians on cash jobs. Its trerrible how they are all abusing the system.

Unless your acquaintance is registered with HMRC under the Construction Industry Scheme and those working for him are similarly registered and also registered as self employed and completing an SA return each year, what you describe is illegal.

As you have said elsewhere

.....I report immigrants when I see them cheating the system.....

you have presumably already reported these people to HMRC?

[transam]

Most will make that back and more off the social in no time.

Another person ignorant of the UK immigration rules.

People in the UK under immigration control are banned from receiving nearly all public funds except those they have contributed to via NICs. This goes for their British spouse/partner, too, who whilst he/she may claim public funds in his/her own right may not claim any extra due to their immigrant spouse/partner living with them. This includes access to social housing.

Immigrants flooding the UK and being paid vast amounts of government money whilst being given council houses is a myth based upon propaganda put about by the likes of the BNP. I am saddened that members here give credence to such lies.

Once someone has ILR then they may claim any and all public funds to which they would be entitled were they British; but under the new rules that means living in the UK for at least 5 years first.

[DonW]

A chap I know renovates properties, all he used are Poles and Romanians on cash jobs. Its trerrible how they are all abusing the system.

Unless your acquaintance is registered with HMRC under the Construction Industry Scheme and those working for him are similarly registered and also registered as self employed and completing an SA return each year, what you describe is illegal.

As you have said elsewhere

I report immigrants when I see them cheating the system you have presumably already reported these people to HMRC?

Yes, I have indeed reported them and scores of others.

You are retired, aren't you. Lots of time on your hands now I guess.

[bobrussell]

A chap I know renovates properties, all he used are Poles and Romanians on cash jobs. Its trerrible how they are all abusing the system.

Unless your acquaintance is registered with HMRC under the Construction Industry Scheme and those working for him are similarly registered and also registered as self employed and completing an SA return each year, what you describe is illegal.

As you have said elsewhere

I report immigrants when I see them cheating the system you have presumably already reported these people to HMRC?

Yes, I have indeed reported them and scores of others.

You are retired, aren't you. Lots of time on your hands now I guess.

Don't know how much time 7by7 has on his hands but fortunately is a fountain of reliable knowledge for which many ThaiVisa members have reason to be grateful!

[MAJIC]

Most will make that back and more off the social in no time.

Another person ignorant of the UK immigration rules.

People in the UK under immigration control are banned from receiving nearly all public funds except those they have contributed to via NICs. This goes for their British spouse/partner, too, who whilst he/she may claim public funds in his/her own right may not claim any extra due to their immigrant spouse/partner living with them. This includes access to social housing.

Immigrants flooding the UK and being paid vast amounts of government money whilst being given council houses is a myth based upon propaganda put about by the likes of the BNP. I am saddened that members here give credence to such lies.

Once someone has ILR then they may claim any and all public funds to which they would be entitled were they British; but under the new rules that means living in the UK for at least 5 years first.

The Myth you mentioned includes,the one that states: Political Asylum Seekers,are given Coucil Houses and Social Security Funds,which is also not true.

[DonW]

It may have changed now but when me and my mum / Dad / Brothers arrived, we were given a council house to live in.

[MAJIC]

While I agree that Visas and Citizenship fees are vastly overpriced,but there are big advantages,such as the Settlement Visa entitles a Spouse to free Health Care,under our NHS scheme,which had the Sponsor needed to pay for Private Health Care (such as BUPA) would be far in excess of the Visa cost. And also the Spouse would be entitled to free English Language lessons after one year in the UK,and free lessons can be ongoing.

The same applies to ILR fees,which allows the Sponsor to claim certain Benefits not available on a Settlement Visa,which the rules seem to have changed recently.

And finally Citizenship gives the newly Naturalised person,exactlly the same rights and privileges of an indigenous British person,of course I have to admit being more than a bit peeved myself having to payout large sums,which seem to be constantly going up.

But let's look on the bright side,you only pay the fees once,and the overall picture,considering the lifetime future gains,these annoying fees, are but a P**s in the Ocean.

Edited October 15, 2012 by MAJIC

[MAJIC]

It may have changed now but when me and my mum / Dad / Brothers arrived, we were given a council house to live in.

Well that's Sad,you should have got one each!

[DonW]

we didnt stay in it long.

[DonW]

While I agree that Visas and Citizenship fees are vastly overpriced,but there are big advantages,such as the Settlement Visa entitles a Spouse to free Health Care,under our NHS scheme,which had the Sponsor needed to pay for Private Health Care (such as BUPA) would be far in excess of the Visa cost. And also the Spouse would be entitled to free English Language lessons after one year in the UK,and free lessons can be ongoing.

The same applies to ILR fees,which allows the Sponsor to claim certain Benefits not available on a Settlement Visa,which the rules seem to have changed recently.

And finally Citizenship gives the newly Naturalised person,exactlly the same rights and privileges of an indigenous British person,of course I have to admit being more than a bit peeved myself having to payout large sums,which seem to be constantly going up.

But let's look on the bright side,you only pay the fees once,and the overall picture,considering the lifetime future gains,these annoying fees, are but a P**s in the Ocean.

All true. But, English lessons are means tested and are not free to all.

[MAJIC]

While I agree that Visas and Citizenship fees are vastly overpriced,but there are big advantages,such as the Settlement Visa entitles a Spouse to free Health Care,under our NHS scheme,which had the Sponsor needed to pay for Private Health Care (such as BUPA) would be far in excess of the Visa cost. And also the Spouse would be entitled to free English Language lessons after one year in the UK,and free lessons can be ongoing.

The same applies to ILR fees,which allows the Sponsor to claim certain Benefits not available on a Settlement Visa,which the rules seem to have changed recently.

And finally Citizenship gives the newly Naturalised person,exactlly the same rights and privileges of an indigenous British person,of course I have to admit being more than a bit peeved myself having to payout large sums,which seem to be constantly going up.

But let's look on the bright side,you only pay the fees once,and the overall picture,considering the lifetime future gains,these annoying fees, are but a P**s in the Ocean.

All true. But, English lessons are means tested and are not free to all.

Free to the less affluent then! Personally I paid for my wifes College Esol English Lessons,on principal!

[Time Traveller]

And yet so many TV posters complain about the paltry visa fees in Thailand!!

The UK fees seems cheap compared to the 191000 baht for Thai PR

[DonW]

especially when PR offers little

[Waterloo]

Further

to the ops original post see attached documents taken straight from the Border Agencies own web sight covering there statement on this subject

Border Agency Statement on Fee's.pdf

ia-cost-recovery-fee.pdf

[Waterloo]

When the Wife and I started this process some 4 years ago we had put up with indignity of asking the border agencie permission to marry, they called it a certificate of approval at the time & the cost exceeded £1000 when you processed the paper work they required.

The courts eventually forced them to abandon the policey, but they went done swinging, I think it took 3 court cases in the end

[7by7]

How on Earth did you manage to spend over £1000 obtaining a CoA?