How Much Income Makes You Rich ..........?

[thehelmsman]

Rich is having enough money to live in Thailand full time. Poor is not.

Tell that to the offshore workers, im pretty sure they have more then you or me or most.

You got the point. The OP was trying to get his jollies by bragging about his seaman status vs teachers or others. I only pointed out that wealth is not having to worry about some old rummy jumping on your lady because of an off shore posting.

Otherwise there is no point to the post. I mean really how many, "how much money do you have in Thailand" posts have been written in the General Forum in the past 6 months?

There is so much more to success or the good life than money and after the plethora of nitwit postings in this forum about look at me mom I'm rich, someone had to tell the guy just what rich really is.

First of all "Nancy Boy" I want to thank you for giving me STATUS. I never knew I had it till you posted.

If you bothered to read correctly kelly you'd understand I merely meant the dollar amount which separates middle class from well off. After listening to Obama talk about the middle class during the debates I realized I didn't really know what middle class is. The politicians put a pretty high dollar amount to middle class - And I was somply wondering out loud what people thought that was.

People who say that money isn't everything - while I agree somewhat I also think that the people who choose that philosphy are poor people to make themselves feel better about themselves. Sort of like ugly people who say beauty is only skin deep.

Offshore people rarely speak of there income - no one wants other people to consider eating out of there rice bowl.

Anyway - I just wanted to clarifiy before this post goes to sleep. I get around internet every few days while working. As soon as my relief gets here I'll be on my way to Thailand for a few months.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

In the US, the average household makes USD $50,000 per year. Romney claims anything under $200,000 per year is middle class, which is 96% of the population.

Most agree that the cost of living for most people, especially at the lower end (and most especially for older sex maniacs) is much lower in Thailand than in the US.

The vast majority of westerners living and working in Thailand make under B100,000 per month, and would consider that a very comfortable salary, with the exception being those wanting to pay for a decent English-language education for their children.

Some retirees and full-package expats maintain their western standard of living, rate of expenditures and their back-home income expectations despite living here long-term, and tend to sneer at the rest of the expats described above.

Does this help answer your question?

Edited November 15, 2012 by BigJohnnyBKK

[GuestHouse]

A person making $X back in Farangland will be able to leverage their income with access to credit and mortgages. Un restricted access to a wide range of employment oportunities, legal rights to buy and sell real estate and, for those interested, access to life long education and training provide opportunities for increasing wealth.

The same individual with the same income in Thailand now has to pay cash for everything, has restricted employment opportunities, restricted rights to own realestate, little if any access to credit and very limited ongoing education and training opportunities.

$X income in Thailand does not buy the same lifestyle is not the same as $X back in Farangland.

Sure a lot of stuff is cheaper in the short term but the long term opportunity cost differences are significant to the point that for many moving to Thailand is a slow march to poverty as their capital runs out.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

A person making $X back in Farangland will be able to leverage their income with access to credit and mortgages. Un restricted access to a wide range of employment oportunities, legal rights to buy and sell real estate and, for those interested, access to life long education and training provide opportunities for increasing wealth.

You're talking as if people like the OP are cutting all ties, moving to Mars or something. Most people I know here maintain their home address and bank accounts, lines of credit etc. - although that's more of a danger to wealth accumulation than a help most of the time.

Choosing to restrict yourself to a single country is of course limiting, but that's as true back home as here.

And you're certainly not restricted from buying real estate anywhere but in Thailand, and once again I reckon that's a stupid move anyway, much better places to actually invest (I don't consider purchasing the home you live in as investment).

And lifelong learning and training is certainly not limited by where you live these days, I know a guy plowing his way through MIT's full IT degree programme, on track to complete it in 1/2 the time compared to doing it in in Boston.

It's a much smaller world these days than when we were growing up, where you hang your hat for a few years at a time won't bog you down either way if you don't let it. In fact many job seekers back home see this part of the world as where all the action is for the future, back home's way over the point of diminishing returns, soon to join the middle ranks of what used to be called the Third World while the Asian Tigers upward path has barely been touched by our financial "leadership's" incompetence, and no end of those trends in sight.

[GuestHouse]

^ In percentage terms.

How many farangs in Thailand are growing their capital/assets v those that are spending down their capital/assets?

[BlackPuddingBertha]

Dickens was, indeed, spot on about income and happiness, and was most concise.

However the question here is slightly different, though I suspect that Dickens knew the answer also.

"How much income makes you rich?"

Income does not make you rich. Capital makes you rich.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

^ In percentage terms.

How many farangs in Thailand are growing their capital/assets v those that are spending down their capital/assets?

But that's its function in the world economy 8-)

No matter how low your answer, don't put the blame on the place but the person, we all have to take responsibility for our choices.

Kind of hard to be driven by ambition when your plumbing's getting drained nice and good ten times a week. . .

[lovelomsak]

I have no idea what rich is. I personally consider myself not rich. I do have things like sailboats,cars ,motorcycles,travel,buy everything cash,spend sometimes like water and still only use less than 1/5 of my alotted spending allowance I gave myself before retiring.It has came to the point where money is more a problem than a blessing,i own way too much and use everything a little just a waste.. I actually feel poor because I see money as a none identity and give it little value. It actually bores me.I feel richer when the gf is excited about getting 60 ,7/11 stamps for her to save for her next prize. I now more than ever think money is a poor yardstick to measure riches.

[KarenBravo]

The OP quite obviously is talking about money when he mentions rich.

Quite predictably all the cash poor people chime in with the "I'm rich too because I define the word different". Not what this thread is about at all.

For me, money = freedom. The more freedom you have, the less stress and worry is in your life and the more choices you have.

Better to be rich and unhappy than poor and unhappy.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

It has came to the point where money is more a problem than a blessing, i own way too much and use everything a little just a waste.. I actually feel poor because I see money as a none identity and give it little value. It actually bores me. I now more than ever think money is a poor yardstick to measure riches.

I can help you with that problem 8-)

Seriously, there are many many incredibly fulfilling things you can use your money for that will give you much more satisfaction than just spending it on yourself.

Get out there and use your talents, skills, experience and brains - not just your money - put time and energy, passion into it - to give a chance to some of those willing and able to benefit from it who otherwise wouldn't have one.

We weren't put on this Earth to settle for ease, comfort, "fun", the good is the enemy of the best.

Life's too short, to keep letting it get to you like that, it's not too late to seize control again you don't realize how lucky you are!

[BigJohnnyBKK]

For me, money = freedom

It can also be a major trap. I know lots of people that have incredible freedom as a result of stopping their obsession with money.

Better to be rich and unhappy than poor and unhappy.

But better to be happy, rich or poor.

[geriatrickid]

Note: I just typed "Why do the Britsh have" into Google - which automaticaly offered to complete my search query with "have bad teeth" and then retuned 2,740,000 results.

You don't really think anyone really believes you do you? Click on the picture to check.

I get the same ranking of auto-complete results, but 244 million pages. Of course Google knows I'm a yank so maybe that explains it.

why do the british have such ugly teeth? About 62,300,000 results (0.52 seconds)

How Much Income Makes You Rich ? About 75,900,000 results (0.32 seconds)

why are expats in thailand stupid? About 9,280,000 results (0.31 seconds)

am I handsome? About 136,000,000 results (0.66 seconds)

[geriatrickid]

But better to be happy, rich or poor.

I have never met an impoverished man that was happy.

How can one be happy if the rent cannot be paid, medical bills not covered, or if there is no money for food or clothing?

Happiness is not a trait of those that are trying to survive.

[poanoi]

Perhaps not, but i was more happy when catching happy hour prices at various gogo bars made a difference

[BigJohnnyBKK]

why do the british have such ugly teeth? About 62,300,000 results (0.52 seconds)

Strange, my first autocomplete on "why do the british" comes up with

"why do the british have bad teeth" and as I said over 240 million hits

[BigJohnnyBKK]

I have never met an impoverished man that was happy.

How can one be happy if the rent cannot be paid, medical bills not covered, or if there is no money for food or clothing?

Happiness is not a trait of those that are trying to survive.

Then you really haven't spent much time with many impoverished people. Or maybe the poor people you know have been acting unhappy about it in the hope that you'll give them a hand? I don't know but that's definitely not my experience.

These things only cause you stress if you decide that they should, if you keep telling yourself "this isn't the way it's supposed to be!" as if you've got some right to have more than most on this planet.

I have been in exactly that position many times in my life, some months am these days, but am one of the happiest people I know.

And I also know many many truly wealthy people and can honestly say most of them sure seem pretty miserable to me.

People are about as happy as they decide to be.

“To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded.”

Ralph Waldo Emerson

Edited November 16, 2012 by BigJohnnyBKK

[KarenBravo]

Being rich does not disqualify you from finding true happiness.

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Being rich does not disqualify you from finding true happiness.

Nope and if you keep things in perspective - realize that your wealth doesn't in itself bring real joy - it's possible that you can use it as the means to that end, in combination with the other more relevant qualities of life.

However it's a very small percentage of people who devote their lives attempting to acquire "security" who actually feel secure enough within themselves and their community to then change direction so radically and start to focus on contribution instead of acquisition.

Of course some people actually make a lot of money in the process of bettering the world, or at things that at least do no harm and they truly love to do for their own sake, would do for free, and hence are more "play" than work

Now those are the ones worth envying!

Edited November 16, 2012 by BigJohnnyBKK

[thaibeachlovers]

But better to be happy, rich or poor.

I have never met an impoverished man that was happy.

How can one be happy if the rent cannot be paid, medical bills not covered, or if there is no money for food or clothing?

Happiness is not a trait of those that are trying to survive.

Very true. How many people would be happy if they had broken teeth that they could not afford to have fixed, for instance.

Utopia would be living in a perfect world where your body is perfectly healthy, but who among us are that fortunate?

[BigJohnnyBKK]

Very true. How many people would be happy if they had broken teeth that they could not afford to have fixed, for instance.

How did you know? All four quarters, hardly any molars left and two toward the front as well top and bottom.

You don't have to smile in public to be happy. . .

[nietzche]

There is a Chinese saying that goes something like this..."It does not matter how much money you make each month. What matters is how much money you have left after each month."

My friend recently returned to the U.S. after a 6 month stay in Thailand while he was between jobs. He is currently earning $95,000/year over there.

Was talking on the phone the other day, and he told me that he can't save s**t!

Was a similar situation for myself. So as the other guy said "it's not about what you earn, so much as what you can save".

I earn a lot less here in Thailand, but save a whole lot more.

If you cut out all of those bad habits (boozing every night, women, etc.) you will see you bank account grow quite rapidly

[cooked]

It' easy. When you have enough, you are rich. Many people that I regard as very well off indeed don't have enough.

[nietzche]

In talking about these issues here, I figure for long-term residents in the not-too-outrageous levels, baht-per-month pretty well translates to dollars-per-year for overall relative standard of living. For me anyway, where labor-intensive local inputs far outweigh imported goods.

IOW I consider a 100,000 baht a month lifestyle here to be comparable - actually superior - to a USD $100K per annum one back home, even though it actually translates to around 40K.

But what I really love about Thailand isn't even available over there though so in the end it's apples to oranges innit.

I agree.

Aside from Bangkok, I usually find that the equivalent per month in Thai baht, is the equivalent to a annual amount in dollars per year in terms of lifestyle:

For example: 90,000 baht/month = $90,000 /year (equivalent lifestyle).

I personally think that if you are single in Thailand and have income of over 60 - 70k/month you are living quite comfortably (unless you live in Pattaya and visit the beer bars every night )

[qdinthailand]

If you can make a last minute flight reservation to fly off to another country (a personal expense, not business expense), any time you want, and not consider the cost, then you are rich.

Otherwise, you are not.

[culicine]

So much that I wouldn't bother discussing the issue on Thaivisa

[nietzche]

In the US, the average household makes USD $50,000 per year. Romney claims anything under $200,000 per year is middle class, which is 96% of the population.

Most agree that the cost of living for most people, especially at the lower end (and most especially for older sex maniacs) is much lower in Thailand than in the US.

The vast majority of westerners living and working in Thailand make under B100,000 per month, and would consider that a very comfortable salary, with the exception being those wanting to pay for a decent English-language education for their children.

Some retirees and full-package expats maintain their western standard of living, rate of expenditures and their back-home income expectations despite living here long-term, and tend to sneer at the rest of the expats described above.

Does this help answer your question?

Most retirees I have me here don't really do very well. Don't know how much a typical continental European pension is, but they definitely seem to do better than their U.K. counterparts.

In the U.S. currently, if you pay the maximum social security payments and take late retirement (69 or 70) your monthly pension will be just $2,700/month.

People who have money retire to places like Florida, Las Vegas, the Caribbean, etc.

Those who don't retire to places like Thailand & Mexico.

Edited November 16, 2012 by nietzche

[BigJohnnyBKK]

In the U.S. currently, if you pay the maximum social security payments and take late retirement (69 or 70) your monthly pension will be just $2,700/month.

No one but the eating-dog-food desperate even consider the social security in their planning, most people I know that old haven't bothered accepting it's such an embarrassment to take any government welfare money.

Everyone's taught from puberty that you're on your own have to save yourself through the various IRA type private schemes, or just plain savings and investment; anything else would be considered socialistic and evil.

That's why we get such a chuckle out of Brits and Euros discussing petty rule changes, as if their governments are going to be able to afford to fund such luxuries at all in the future, completely unrealistic to depend on bureaucrats in a "democracy" for your future security.

[Naam]

I have never met an impoverished man that was happy.

How can one be happy if the rent cannot be paid, medical bills not covered, or if there is no money for food or clothing?

Happiness is not a trait of those that are trying to survive.

Then you really haven't spent much time with many impoverished people. Or maybe the poor people you know have been acting unhappy about it in the hope that you'll give them a hand? I don't know but that's definitely not my experience.

These things only cause you stress if you decide that they should, if you keep telling yourself "this isn't the way it's supposed to be!" as if you've got some right to have more than most on this planet.

I have been in exactly that position many times in my life, some months am these days, but am one of the happiest people I know.

And I also know many many truly wealthy people and can honestly say most of them sure seem pretty miserable to me.

People are about as happy as they decide to be.

“To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty; to find the best in others; to leave the world a bit better; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded.”

Ralph Waldo Emerson

hmmm... i have strong doubts that impoverished people laugh often and much

[nietzche]

In the U.S. currently, if you pay the maximum social security payments and take late retirement (69 or 70) your monthly pension will be just $2,700/month.

No one but the eating-dog-food desperate even consider the social security in their planning, most people I know that old haven't bothered accepting it's such an embarrassment to take any government welfare money.

Everyone's taught from puberty that you're on your own have to save yourself through the various IRA type private schemes, or just plain savings and investment; anything else would be considered socialistic and evil.

That's why we get such a chuckle out of Brits and Euros discussing petty rule changes, as if their governments are going to be able to afford to fund such luxuries at all in the future, completely unrealistic to depend on bureaucrats in a "democracy" for your future security.

SS should not be your sole source of retirement income.

You must bear in mind that we pay into this all of our lives. Why would you not take it? It's your money.

Your retirement should come from multiple sources: SS, 401k, other investments, and the equity you have in your home. Lot of Europeans here living off a government pension only.

I would never trust my government for my welfare. That's the difference between Americans and the Euro's.

[Naam]

If you can make a last minute flight reservation to fly off to another country (a personal expense, not business expense), any time you want, and not consider the cost, then you are rich.

Otherwise, you are not.

my definition of rich is: if that last minute flight reservation is for an 8-seater private Learjet which you buy after the flight.