Resident Farangs In Isaan. How Many Speak The Language?

[Jezz]

Just wondering how many resident farangs in Isaan speak the local language. In my case, even after seven years in the country, I've tried and failed - partly due to advancing age that makes absorbing new information difficult, and partly due to a minor inner ear problem that makes hearing conversation clearly when there are other noises around difficult. Well that's my excuse so I'll stick to it! Apart from the obvious stock words and phrases, all else is beyond me. My missus has reasonable English and acts as my translator when ever required - which is daily. On occasions I feel frustrated at not knowing what is being said around me, or not being able to join in conversations. On the other hand, we get by without any real problems, but I know I'm missing out on sharing a lot of talk and local life in general. Any thoughts or comments? (pleasant ones preferably!)

[Squigy]

I call it selective hearing. Only hear what I want to hear. Most of the 'ninh tah" is about other ppl and money and of course where and what to eat. That's about Issan talk. Not much else. So I wouldn't worry too much.

[Jezz]

I call it selective hearing.

I knew that one would come up! Often it's better to say you don't hear.

[jamescollister]

Can ask for what I want, but the Thais don't listen and just look blank. This is not just a Thai thing, immigration asked me do I speak Thai. I said a little bit, he then went on in Thai, said don't understand, he went to English. After I walked away realized I understood every thing he said, but was not listening.

Problem here is the people speak Lao and an old type of Lao, every thing gets mixed together which makes it even more confusing. Just gave up, if I want something can look it up on the net.

Don't have conversations with the locals, weather, rice and rubber that's about it.

Last time anyone came to talk about any thing real, was when a bunch of village heads came asking if there would be trouble now that US troops had killed the US President. Took a while before I realized Osama not Obama.

Time before that, were the British going to invade, <deleted> are you on about. The army has taken over and a British fleet is in Phuket. Strange ideas at times. Jim

[Jezz]

Problem here is the people speak Lao and an old type of Lao, every thing gets mixed together which makes it even more confusing. Just gave up, if I want something can look it up on the net.

Jim, I've followed many of your posts with great interest. You strike me as a man who speaks his mind, and that I like. It would be great if more of us Isaanites spoke openly about issues we face on an ongoing basis, rather than snipe away at whimsical things.

[richardjm65]

In Bangkok, I made some effort to learn Thai at AUA. Then in '97 we moved up-country and I realised that my acquired 50% Thai language skills had dropped to about 20%. That was due to the fact that where we live there's local dialect which includes Central Thai, Lao, Khymer, and mixtures of all. Since then, I havn't really worked at any of the languages. As Jim says, Your up-country conversations are going to be fairly limited in any event, and therefore tend to be repetitive and boring, given the limitations on both sides.

I also noticed that lots of locals would switch dialects if they particularly wanted to exclude the foreigner - and why shouldn't they - what the hell would he know about growing rice or tending buffalos? Even conversations with those who did speak reasonable English, or with whom I could use my limited Thai could not be called inspiring. I've learned to keep things simple, and rely on either my wife or other foreigners for conversation with any meaning.

I can't share the Thai gossip and don't really want to - it's generally pretty parochial and deals with events which mean something to them but little to me. That said, I think I've been partially accepted as part of their landscape and so, when an opinion is required from me, with the help of my wife and a convivial beer or two, we manage to make do.

I'd like to be better at the languages - but am not certain that my life would be that much enhanced. But then I've never been a talker - rather more a listener, and I do enjoy checking with my wife to see if my interpretations of village events come anywhere close to the mark. Usually, they don't!

[Gary A]

I'm actually envious of farangs who are fluent in Thai. Unfortunately. I have no ear for the subtle tones. I will never be fluent and I know it. After many years here, I know enough Thai to get by but still Thais who are not used to Thai speaking farangs normally have no idea what you are talking about. My Thai wife enables me to say that I don't understand whether I do or not. I used to laugh at a farang friend of mine who "thought" he was fluent. He would get very angry and tell the Thais that they didn't even know how to speak their own language.

[jamescollister]

Problem here is the people speak Lao and an old type of Lao, every thing gets mixed together which makes it even more confusing. Just gave up, if I want something can look it up on the net.

Jim, I've followed many of your posts with great interest. You strike me as a man who speaks his mind, and that I like. It would be great if more of us Isaanites spoke openly about issues we face on an ongoing basis, rather than snipe away at whimsical things.

Think you will find that some who write about life in Issan have spent a few weeks here. Over the years on this site and meeting other farangs who live here think I know who is real and who is an internet tourist. I listen to those who really know and take notice of advice posted. As in the farming forum there are some who are real, maybe not full time residents and there are some who are dreamers. Jim

[TommoPhysicist]

Whenever I say the locals aren't worth talking with, I get a good kicking.

How come you guys are getting away with it?

PS I'm 100% fake.

PPS I'm not in Issan, but there appear to be no foreigners in Nan.

Edited December 1, 2012 by TommoPhysicist

[zzaa09]

The reality is that only a minute few [Farang residents] care to understand or learn the language.

That's probably wht most are always frustrated, angst, suspiscious, anti-social, and certainly don't care for those around them [less, care for the society at large].

Typical and sad.

[Michael Hare]

There are many resident farangs in Isaan who speak Thai very well. A lot even read and write. This language ability is more prevalent with those farangs who came here in their 20s (myself included) and have worked here for many years. In my own situation, I would not be able to conduct my research, do business and lecture without speaking Thai. It is such an advantage being able to talk to tradesmen, government officials, police, shopkeepers etc, without one another misunderstanding what is required. I know that learning Thai is very difficult, and in my case it required lots of hard work for years on end. It did not come easy. For those of you who have come here at an older age learning Thai will maybe prove extremely difficult. All I can say is to learn a few new words every day. It is such a joy to be able to communicate with all the people around you.

[Jezz]

most are always frustrated, angst, suspiscious, anti-social, and certainly don't care for those around them [less, care for the society at large].

Typical and sad.

Occasionally frustrated, yes. Angst, suspicious, anti-social, don't care for those around, or care for society at large, wrong. A big no. Typical and sad? Come on! Get a life.

[jamescollister]

There are many resident farangs in Isaan who speak Thai very well. A lot even read and write. This language ability is more prevalent with those farangs who came here in their 20s (myself included) and have worked here for many years. In my own situation, I would not be able to conduct my research, do business and lecture without speaking Thai. It is such an advantage being able to talk to tradesmen, government officials, police, shopkeepers etc, without one another misunderstanding what is required. I know that learning Thai is very difficult, and in my case it required lots of hard work for years on end. It did not come easy. For those of you who have come here at an older age learning Thai will maybe prove extremely difficult. All I can say is to learn a few new words every day. It is such a joy to be able to communicate with all the people around you.

Wife, Thai was send to BKK at 7 years old to live with the single unmarried Aunt, so she could attend a good school. We got married and lived in OZ. When we got round to the village wedding in Issan, I kept asking what's happening. She said how would I know they all speak Lao. Jim

[thrilled]

ya learn thai then ya move to an issan area,then your lost.ya can't win.I use one of those translation things on my phone.Ya just do what ya can.

[Lickey]

I wonder if one day they would say that we care, Like a Puppett on a string,

The need to have to talk is a good indication of insecurity, in old age, meditation and yoga is better than trying to learn a complicated lanuage,

6 years now, i know sweet FA issan, and i really dont want to learn, its enough learning the culture,

Anybody who can speak the Issan/Lao lanuage, well done, but they will still talk behind your back or go into a like rhyming slang so youve lost anyway,

Best way, Stiff upper lip, just keep smiling, specially if a thai buys you a beer,,,

[Squigy]

I also have found out that the villagers around me don't know how to speak Thai (whatever that is) but speak a mixture of Isaan/Thia/Lao and a bit of local dialect as well. It becomes hard to follow and I too have given up trying to follow.

[xen]

I can relate to the hearing thing with tones etc and the difficulty with speaking tonal, but i do a good impersonation of a stand up comedian the way the Thais laugh when i speak Thai and stuff it up.

I also find i can listen to Thai conversations but as my ears are in the process of hearing my brain is scrambling to keep up with the translation into my brain language so at the beginning of the sentence i can understand most of the words but at the after a few sentences i am about half a sentence behind and so it compounds.

.

[bunnydrops]

I learn a little everyday, but as others have said---they speak Lao, or where I am Korat, They understand me some since Thai is what they hear on TV, but I understand little of what they say. I do better in Bangkok. My wife's mother forces me to speak my limited Thai with her. But she speaks Lao with a mouthful of betelnut:(

[krisb]

Issans easier than Thai, it doesnt use so many tones like Thai.

Once you understand why they use the word "bor", then thats a good start.

[richardjm65]

most are always frustrated, angst, suspiscious, anti-social, and certainly don't care for those around them [less, care for the society at large].

Typical and sad.

Occasionally frustrated, yes. Angst, suspicious, anti-social, don't care for those around, or care for society at large, wrong. A big no. Typical and sad? Come on! Get a life.

Come now, Jezz, there are some who revel in the high life, playing and re-playing Leonard Cohen songs at slower speeds to wring the deepest meaning from them.

On second thoughts, though, Leonard Cohen songs might be a little too up-beat and frivolous.

Edited December 2, 2012 by richardjm65

[SlyAnimal]

There are many resident farangs in Isaan who speak Thai very well. A lot even read and write. This language ability is more prevalent with those farangs who came here in their 20s (myself included) and have worked here for many years.

/agree

Most farang I've talked to who work in Isaan, can speak at least enough Thai to have a basic conversation. Most of the guys who came at a younger age, can speak a lot of Thai even though they've only been here for a couple of years, and some can also read/write as well.

For myself, I can read/write, not very well mind you (As my gf says, "Now you're at a Prattom 1 or 2 level"), and unfortunately my range of vocab isn't very wide, because I have gotten lazy over the past year, since once I could say 80% of what I needed to say, I stopped actively learning. Now I just pickup a few new words now and then.

I can't speak any Isaan, only about 5-10 words or there abouts, which is a pain, as my gf's friends and family always chat away in Isaan so I miss most of the conversation. Although, even when they chat away in Thai, I still often miss a lot of the conversation lol, half the time I'm not even listening because I assume they'll be speaking Isaan so just "switch off" and go into la la land instead.

[Jezz]

Re: richardjm65 @#20

Your description of Leonard Cohen being played at even slower speeds conjures up a comical image. Last time that name crossed my mind was when I started wondering what it must be like to be old at forty. These days I can't remember how old I was when I wondered about that.

Still, no time for reminiscing - I've a got a village gig to play tonight.

[sirchai]

I used to live in my wife's village for about a year, when I settled down in "Isaan." There're so many different dialects in lower northeast that it's almost impossible to speak "Isaan" perfectly.

Let's say you speak Sisaket slang and you're driving to Mukdahan. They wouldn't understand you there. Soop Buri becomes Soop Jaa.

Good to know the difference between Mai Phen Rai and Bo Phen Jang,. Bai Sai, Maa and Sao baht. Always the same questions, where do you come from? Can you drink white whiskey? How long have you been living here? Oh, your Thai is very good,

Then after many years of trying to speak Thai, you won't really know if you speak some words in Thai, or in Laos. Penn Jang?

[fatfather]

I'm far away of speaking fluently Thai but a small talk works and I can order what I like. I told my wife to teach me Thai (ten years ago), but it ended up with Thai-Lao-Khmen mix. Never mind, its funny that Thais in Bangkok or other metropols of Thailand smile and call me "banok" country boy. Interesting that I picked up a dialect. I love it.

Fatfather

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[richardjm65]

I'm far away of speaking fluently Thai but a small talk works and I can order what I like. I told my wife to teach me Thai (ten years ago), but it ended up with Thai-Lao-Khmen mix. Never mind, its funny that Thais in Bangkok or other metropols of Thailand smile and call me "banok" country boy. Interesting that I picked up a dialect. I love it.

Fatfather

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I know, fatfather, that English is not your first language, but you hit on the most important thing - that when we make our often pathetic attempts to communicate with our up-country friends, we must be prepared for our efforts to evoke amusement. Our inability to master tonal language is largely responsible, and perhaps the most important thing is that we must expect laughter as a result of our efforts. Of course we may feel embarrassment and shyness, but if it can still be fun, then not all is lost.

After 6 or 9 months in Singapore I became almost fluent in Malay, mainly because the language was not a tonal one and it used our own alphabet. How you read it, therefore, was how you spoke it. Sadly, a year after leaving Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia, the language ability faded also - perhaps it would revive if I were to find myself in those territories again.

When I first came to Thailand, I met an old Englishman, much respected as a businessman. He had found, over the years, that though he could read, write and speak fluent Central Thai, it served him well to conceal his ability with the Thai language. This, he explained, meant that when negotiating a business contract, the Thais with whom he was dealing, would switch from English to Thai to discuss controversial points within the proposed contract. Whilst they conferred he, listening, was able to prepare a suitable response. That gave him a small tactical advantage.

I personally find that it is sometimes better to play the dumb foreigner and listen, rather than attempt to show your language skills. I am reminded, once again, of a 'Nation' columnist who, some years ago, suggested that once the Thais heard you speak their language, their immediate response was to then find out exactly how fluent you actually were, rather than concentrate on the matter under discussion. Your limitations having been established, they felt able to regain command of the conversation.

I don't suggest that this is the case with our up-country friends, but listening does seem to make more sense than boasting one's skills. You have to be very, very good at the language to do that. Better to communicate, with a good laugh, at a lower level - especially up-country.

[diggledunc]

When I came to LoS 8 years ago a friend said learn Thai, Lao doesn't matter. Now I speak Thai live in Isan and struggle with Lao. I thought was my friend right. In Isan they speak Lao but so many people from here go to different parts of the country to work. Get a taxi from BKK to town and how often was the driver born in Isan. Go to bars and where are the girls from? Go to restaurants in BKK or Chiang Mai and where are many of the staff from? I have found that when I am in BKK and speak my limited Lao (and it is) that peoploe seem to warm to me better.

However well you speak Lao/Isan I think there are two rules. 1. Never let people (strangers) know how much you speak/understand. 2 If you do your selective hearing mode can be compromised.

A chap in Khon Kaen has written a very good book on learning Isan which comes with 4 hour CD. He told me it can be ordered online or can bought at Asia Books. Gives you the basics. Por gan iik der for more postings

[tullynagardy]

I also have found out that the villagers around me don't know how to speak Thai (whatever that is) but speak a mixture of Isaan/Thia/Lao and a bit of local dialect as well.

This is definetly true but, with a full generation of "Thaiification" now passed, the older generations that speak little Thai are dieing out. The younger generation, through social media, tv and schooling all speak good standard Thai. (allbeit often not as first choice)

I was genuinely shocked when I first met the In laws to be, a couple of years back, her mother spoke limited Thai, the Thai she did know was intertwined almost as slang with the Issan she spoke. She couldn`t hold a full conversation in Thai, even when I did pronounce my limited language skills well she wouldnt get it.

Its a case in point for me, as my soon to be wife will be coming to the UK with her young child from Issan. I am keen she talks only standard Thai with him and this is his second language as he gets older. With the way the Thai economy is growing, and ours shrinking, a fluent English speaker, with a UK education that speaks perfect Thai would have great opportunity in Bangkok for high paid work, perhaps better than the UK. If he speaks the same stuff his grandmum talks his opportunity will be limited.

[Briggsy]

I recently had an interesting conversation with my girlfriend (that's unusual in itself) in which she said she can identify fairly accurately where in Isaan the speaker comes from so you may well learn to "wao Udon" but then come unstuck in Ubon.

In addition, many Isaan villages are relatively recent (i.e. less than 100 years old) and they came about often due to migration from afar so the result is neighbouring villages in Isaan may well speak different dialects within the Thai-Lao continuum.

[jamescollister]

I recently had an interesting conversation with my girlfriend (that's unusual in itself) in which she said she can identify fairly accurately where in Isaan the speaker comes from so you may well learn to "wao Udon" but then come unstuck in Ubon.

In addition, many Isaan villages are relatively recent (i.e. less than 100 years old) and they came about often due to migration from afar so the result is neighbouring villages in Isaan may well speak different dialects within the Thai-Lao continuum.

Think what you say may be very true in some places. Where I am, smack up on the Lao land border,my understanding is many around here are ethnic Chinese from northern Vietnam. they came here about 200 years ago. Though they have inter married over the years you can see plainly 2 different peoples. Some very light skinned, others , Lao very dark, as well as height and facial features.

The very old speak a language that even the locals don't understand, at first I was told it is a secret language for blessings etc, but now I think it may be an old Chinese dialect mixed in with old Lao.

As said earlier the roads only came here 10 years ago, the place was cut off from the world for a very long time and old ways die hard. Jim

[humblefalang]

my self on and off for 7 years,

here for the last year,

i can understand quite a lot of(lao) speak some,

could do my life without the missus (i mean dont need translator)

when it comes to thai language i just dont get most if it.

i spend my time around farm work, get to chit chat a lot with other farmers too,

i really would l;ike to learm to read and writte that would be my ultimate goal.

im located near khon kaen,

some people do speak thai but most adress them selves to me in lao.