Thailand's Cola Conflict: Est Vs. Pepsi

[fakename]

est = Estonia? hahahah

[Curt1591]

Tried est and will not do so again. It tastes like recycled buffalo water.

So you've tasted recycled buffalo water!

EST = Extra Sugar Thailand

Of course all ingrediants are subject to regular business practices; I tried it with Blend 285, I tried it with Sang Som, I tried it straight. I'll use Coke until Pepsi gets situated.

We aren't talking a vintage Napa Valley chardonnay ; it's freaking cola! It's carbonated water, sugar and some artificial flavorings!

What is truly amazing is that the contempt for all things Thai has many standing up for a huge, multi-national conglomerate, which, in many's opinion, has repugnant business tactics.

[kotsak]

Tried Est once out of curiosity.. Piss poor taste..

[iubito2001]

PepsiCo unveils Bt18.4bn plan for Thai investment

The company has appointed a global logistics firm - DHL - as its logistics and warehousing partner for Thailand. It also works with local distribution partners, which will handle production distribution and logistics in the five regions throughout the Kingdom and via the company's 50 distribution points.

http://www.nationmul...t-30193061.html

Well that's Samui off the list then. DHL do not know where Samui is. Anything sent via DHL to Samui ends up in the post from Bangkok. Last tracking schedule we had - Hong Kong - Cincinatti - Hong Kong - Bangkok - Phuket - Bangkok - Hong Kong - Bangkok - Phuket - Bangkok then EMS to Samui. Many such stories like this. Hopeless company.

I agree with you. DHL is hopeless. We tried a couple of times but each time they could not find Hua Hin. The Chinese DHL claimed it does not exist. I sent them a Google Map. Since we use EMS - which costs the same - it works (for imports from China).

[angsta]

Pepsi is very aggressive in it's business policies. They have acquired many companies by refusing to supply product if the sale wasn't made. Many US restaurant chains switched to Coke because of this.

Pepsi's business model won't fly in Thailand, where nationalism rules.

Which companies? You say many, I would like to hear the name of just one. Sorry mate but you are making this up.

The whole of Asia thinks it's the shits. Japan, Korea (x1000), Vietnam. I think Pepsi do pretty well in those places. Let us revisit this situation in 6 months. There will be no Est.

Well mate!

"Pepsico" goes far beyond the "refreshment" brands it publicizes. Its investments are varied

One that I have personal experience with is a chain in the US called Pioneer Chicken. In the 80's a friend owned a franchise. Pepsi demanded a controlling interest in the company, or they would pull their brand. Pioneer has since served up Coke.

I have no reason to believe that they have become less predatory.

PepsiCo owns among others Quaker, Lays (walkers) and Tropicana. I worked in the industry for a few years so I am aware of how they operate. They dropped most of the unhealthy foods ( for example KFC) about 10 years ago in a bid to re-brand in certain health aware markets.

Demanded controlling interest? I assume they could just purchase the shares on the stock market if they so desired. Nobody was holding a gun to anyone's head, I mean they could always turn to that other unknown Cola brand who's name escapes me?? Pioneer Chicken you say?? Hmmm.

Either way, in all Countries Pepsi works by leasing the product to a bottling and distribution company. This is how they operate in markets outside of the USA.

It's the choice of a new generation... this will not end well for Est.

[seajae]

Cant hack it, when it first appeared the shop owners were saying it is the new pepsi but it tastes nothing like it, makes you womder if EST distributors have lied to the shop owners and told them that it is pepsi but with different badging, that is what we are being told in Surat Thani by the various places we visit. Doesnt really bother me, I prefer coke anyway.

[pacovl46]

Coke all the way!!!

[wayned]

It's marketing 101. Increase your market share any way that you can and in Thailand you CAN be it repugnant business tactics or not!

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

Pepsico makes more money off its chips (crisps) than its beverages, especially here in Thailand. Unless someone can put a dent in that product line, I doubt Pepsi cares that much.

[harleyd61]

I tried it, tastes like sugarwater with a brown color

[Phatcharanan]

I tried water once...............it was kinda...........nice.

[Beetlejuice]

Pepsi, Coca Cola or EST, life changing decisions.

If Pepsi does disappear from the shelves, than this could be the end of life as we know it.

Edited December 27, 2012 by Beetlejuice

[rfukata]

Lets go back a little bit. Pepsi used this guy to do their bottling and distribution in Thailand for many years (20 to 30). They did it so well that Pepsi out sold Coke, one of the few markets in the world to do so. Pepsi however refused to consider a request from their Thai partner to decrease the price for their concentrate/royalties, which was squeezing the local companies margins. After the two parties couldn't agree to renew the contract last year, the Thai company announced that they will launch their own soda. Est will hurt Pepsi's market share in Thailand and Coke has already benefitted from Pepsi's move (they now have 55% of the market share). Est is cheaper is locally made and now is available at more places than Pepsi. What Est did was simple. They knew all the people who bought Pepsi in the past, they send out their trucks, off loaded Est, loaded the empty Pepsi bottles. Over night Pepsi disappeared and Est appeared. Pepsi made a mistake and will pay for it as it's not easy to regain lost market share. The arrogance of big companies is sometimes astounding.

besides the concentrate and margins squeeze, I think Sermsuk rationale was wanting to list his brand or have Pepsi acknowledge his soda on Pepsi's global brand but this obviously didn't mature.

For myself, I think EST copied Pepsi in their bottling colors as well as few elements in the taste (sort of reminds me of a Pepsi taste in the

late 60's to early 70's). As far as Market share goes, its just temporary due in part of a favorable distribution and existing customers base for

EST.

Retail pricing for EST, 1 liter for 20baht, no deal here, I rather buy a Pepsi Max or Coke Zero 1.25 liter for 23 baht.

Mid to long range plan: Pepsi will outsell & offset EST easily, Pepsi's competition is Coca-cola and EST competes with Big Cola for the

3rd. spot.

[Plastic Brontosaurus]

I did notice that here in CM it is hard to find Pepsi these days in many places. At Seven I often can't find it at all, at Tops they only have the big bottles not the small ones or the cans, and last time I looked at Tesco Express they did not have it either. Coke and Est readily available everywhere. Not sure if Pepsi are having issues with their logistics, or some people are receiving tea money to keep certain brands in hiding, so other brands get purchased?

[rickb]

I think Pepsi is making more of a strategic move to capture the overall ASEAN market. It's my understanding that's why they have invested so much in a new bottling plant in Rayong producing their product in plastic bottles only. That way the product can be distributed inside and outside of Thailand since there is no worry about the bottles being returned. I also think that once the Rayong Pepsi plant ramps up it's production, the sales of EST will slack off considerably. Since the beginning of November, we have been selling EST instead of Pepsi in our minimart. Sales have been very good. But I think it's mostly due to curiosity about the taste of the new product and the lack of anything else being offered for sale (note, we do not sell Coke, except for the small 10 baht disposable bottles). Just last week we started selling Pepsi and EST in one liter bottles, selling EST at 20 baht and Pepsi at 25 baht per liter plastic bottle. The Pepsi bottles nearly sold out as soon as they were put on the shelf and the EST bottles are now selling very slowly. Sales of the glass bottled EST are also slowing down some. And today we just started selling the 12 baht size of Pepsi in plastic bottles So, IMO, Pepsi will soon take back much of the market share they had when they were partners with Sermsuk Bottling Co. and Sermsuk's dreams of glory will be short lived.

Edited December 27, 2012 by rickb

[Konini]

Our local Tesco Express and 7-11's hardly ever have Pepsi and I've only seen Pepsi Max there once in 3 years. I prefer Pepsi Max to Coke Zero, but a lot of the time there's no Coke Zero either. When I'm tempted to just buy Coke instead, I get a picture in my head of a TV presenter from a few years ago holding up a glass with sugar in it - the same amount or equivalent in a bottle of soft drink. That turns me off straight away.

PepsiCo will never win if their product isn't on the shelves.

[hellodolly]

Pepsi attempted to buy out Serm Suk. The Serm Suk board of directors thought Pepsi's offer was too low, and they rallied the stock holders to vote down the acquisition by a very slim margin. They then went to ThaiBev and asked them to buy a significant share in the company.

Pepsi was left high and dry without a bottler, so they built their own facility in Rayong. However, they also were left without a distributor, so they signed on with DHL for that. There are many doubts that DHL can service the vast number of small food and drink stands that accounted for a huge percentage of the Pepsi market.

Pepsi was also left without a bottle supplier (ThaiBev had been the supplier.) Bottles accounted for 47% of Pepsi's market, according to information put out by Sern Suk.

WIth regards to some of the above comments, Sern Suk did not break any contract with Pepsi. The remained working together until the contract they had expired. And Pepsi is not using SIngha for distribution.

Here in Chiang Mai no problem getting Pepsi Max in the bigger stores particular in the 1.45 liter bottles.

Hard to find in the smaller stores as they have not yet developed a fully integrated distribution system.

[hellodolly]

I think Pepsi is making more of a strategic move to capture the overall ASEAN market. It's my understanding that's why they have invested so much in a new bottling plant in Rayong producing their product in plastic bottles only. That way the product can be distributed inside and outside of Thailand since there is no worry about the bottles being returned. I also think that once the Rayong Pepsi plant ramps up it's production, the sales of EST will slack off considerably. Since the beginning of November, we have been selling EST instead of Pepsi in our minimart. Sales have been very good. But I think it's mostly due to curiosity about the taste of the new product and the lack of anything else being offered for sale (note, we do not sell Coke, except for the small 10 baht disposable bottles). Just last week we started selling Pepsi and EST in one liter bottles, selling EST at 20 baht and Pepsi at 25 baht per liter plastic bottle. The Pepsi bottles nearly sold out as soon as they were put on the shelf and the EST bottles are now selling very slowly. Sales of the glass bottled EST are also slowing down some. And today we just started selling the 12 baht size of Pepsi in plastic bottles So, IMO, Pepsi will soon take back much of the market share they had when they were partners with Sermsuk Bottling Co. and Sermsuk's dreams of glory will be short lived.

There new bottling plant can produce more Pepsi than the old one. The only problem facing them now is distribution to small stores.

[BobTH]

I prefer a diet cola also; I like diet pepsi, pepsi max, or diet coke (coke light here). I do not care for for coke zero or pepsi one. I did try the EST last week and I really didn't think it was too bad. I see some say it has rootbeer in it, I kind of tasted a vanilla flavor in it but it really didn't taste all that sugary like regular coke or pepsi; at least it didn't leave the after taste I get with coke or pepsi.

I do not drink diet soda straight, I mix it about half with soda water and a twist of lime. You should try it sometime; it is very refreshing.

Edited December 27, 2012 by BobTH

[Curt1591]

Personally, I was pleased to find that the little shack behind our moo baan sells RC!

That's possibly the "unknown cola brand" our expert can't recall.

[vijer]

Well if it is overly sweet the Thai's will love it.

[vijer]

Yes Thai business ethics are very low, and Pepsi can't sue for any infringement. Pepsi would have a better chance of suing if EST slandered them, slander is taken 10,000 times more seriously in Thailand than any breach of contract or trademark infringement.

[MichelBangkok]

It is horrible (the taste of Est) They are squeezing the mom and pop shops they supply. stock Pepsi and we will not deliver anything anymore is what these shops are told I was told by the owner of the store in my condo downstairs.

In my years in Thailand this is the 4th time I've seen this done. Pizza Company (Pizza Hut), Chang (Carlsberg). True (Orange) and now Est. It is clear Thai business partners will copy any foreign brands product and then boot out the foreign partner.

W

Totally in agreement - worked with TA Orange, then True Move, during the building of their network 10 years ago and it was to get France Telecom out as quick as feasible using any tactics available...

The Carlsberg saga is also quite colorful with a very similar taste (pun intended).

Producers of Est are following the same pattern, although they took quite a longer time than True or Chang to get to this break point.

Nevertheless Est (Execrable Squalid Taste) is awful so PEPSI shall recover their lost market share when fully operational (production and distribution) during this coming year.

Crocodiles against alligators at work - no tears ! This is story is far from over...

[khunken]

<deleted> to them all - drink beer.

[chooka]

But still no word or indications of what happened to all the Pepsi and Pepsi max.

Ok so they broke the contract and Pepsi is not leaving Thailand soooo where is all the Pepsi ?

Not a smart move by Pepsi to leave the shelves empty for a while as many may switch brands

we noticed that also in Big C no pepsi on the shelves. found a couple of bottles in Tesco but not much around. Still plenty of Coke on the shelves. Doesn't Coka Cola hold the major market share? Edited December 27, 2012 by chooka

[tw25rw]

I tried EST.. It was ok. Tasted like cheap supermarket cola. No idea what root beer tastes like.

Prefer Pepsi, but it will do if there is nothing else.

[chooka]

I did notice that here in CM it is hard to find Pepsi these days in many places. At Seven I often can't find it at all, at Tops they only have the big bottles not the small ones or the cans, and last time I looked at Tesco Express they did not have it either. Coke and Est readily available everywhere. Not sure if Pepsi are having issues with their logistics, or some people are receiving tea money to keep certain brands in hiding, so other brands get purchased?

With the Major Supermarkets, don't the major brands rent the shelf space to place thier products?

[stoneyboy]

I have to ask why they named it Est,is it aimed at the German expat community.

Is their slogan Est is die best.

[spirit47]

Since last year flooding, Pepsi was availabe a few months without problems, now it's a problem to buy Pepsi since a few months again. Especially cans and sixpacks.

Now Est is everywhere, but it taste like the other copies, ugly. Haha, if the will fill it in Pepsi bottles, I will taste the different...I only drink a few can in the month, I'am fat enough...

[lemoncake]

But still no word or indications of what happened to all the Pepsi and Pepsi max.

Ok so they broke the contract and Pepsi is not leaving Thailand soooo where is all the Pepsi ?

Not a smart move by Pepsi to leave the shelves empty for a while as many may switch brands

we noticed that also in Big C no pepsi on the shelves. found a couple of bottles in Tesco but not much around. Still plenty of Coke on the shelves. Doesn't Coka Cola hold the major market share?

they will if pepsi does not get back on the shelves soon