Thailand Loses Top Rice Exporter Title

[Chao Lao Beach]

Edited, Image to big to be polite.

Edited January 5, 2013 by Chao Lao Beach

[TheGhostWithin]

The next government to come to power will find the coffers empty, massive national debt and millions of tonnes of expired rice.

This is one of several strategies being played by Socialist governments to combat right wing governments. If right wing governments inherit a weak economy and have to pretty much start from zero, people begin to think "I wish we had those left wing red shirt folks, they would do more to help the poor". Next thing, they are back again. Sacrifice one term to remind the public that the right wingers are terrible people. In Thailand, this means losing the Top Rice exporter title, and threatening to force any motions through the system which may be against popular demand (Yingluck has just done this with the reconciliation bill).

The second part of this strategy is to sow the legal system up as much as possible so that when the right wingers get back in, they have their hands tied to make changes which would be positive for their way of governance. In the case of Thailand, it is about the rice pledging scheme, and about getting a certain fugitive back in the country to control the party on an official level.

[khunken]

The next government to come to power will find the coffers empty, massive national debt and millions of tonnes of expired rice.

This is one of several strategies being played by Socialist governments to combat right wing governments. If right wing governments inherit a weak economy and have to pretty much start from zero, people begin to think "I wish we had those left wing red shirt folks, they would do more to help the poor". Next thing, they are back again. Sacrifice one term to remind the public that the right wingers are terrible people. In Thailand, this means losing the Top Rice exporter title, and threatening to force any motions through the system which may be against popular demand (Yingluck has just done this with the reconciliation bill).

The second part of this strategy is to sow the legal system up as much as possible so that when the right wingers get back in, they have their hands tied to make changes which would be positive for their way of governance. In the case of Thailand, it is about the rice pledging scheme, and about getting a certain fugitive back in the country to control the party on an official level.

Except for your last sentence, the rest is total rubbish. Socialist or left-of-centre governments implement policies that they were elected for. They try to benefit the less well off, not always successfully to be sure. Right-wing governments also implement policies they were elected for but almost always skew it towards the better off. When there is a change of left to right or vice-versa, the new government always blames the old for screwing up the economy. Enough on that - back to topic.

Losing the number one rice exporter position doesn't mean much in itself. But what it does mean is failure to sell surplus rice (& lying about false sales) & having to store it in huge quantities. It deteriorates & loses its value & Thaksin's 'wait until the price rises' is just pie in the sky - a gamble with taxpayer's money that he always loved to do (remember Liverpool) but not with his own money.

On a final note, it is sheer folly to try and categorise Thai governments using western standards of left & right. No party here has a real ideology and the one with most money usually wins.

[fareastguy]

This article makes interesting reading too..

http://www channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp_asiapacific/view/1246014/1/.html.

the last sentence of this article makes no sense to me.. if the government can sell this rice to other countries how will that make a difference to the poor farmers who have already been paid ??

Unless she's going to make another donation after the final deal has been done ??

[waza]

There is a lot of talk of PTP/Thaksin, etc. benefiting financially (as opposed to politically) from the rice pledging policy. Examples include; #2; "Thaksin, the criminals rice pledging scheme may have netted him and his syncophants a fortune..." #8; "just wait till the red snouts have finished feeding at the trough... the only "good health" you will have then will be the toasts around the Shinawatra Banquet table"

Could someone please backup these claims with some evidence please? I thought posts were meant to be backed up by links, facts, quotes, etc.

This has been widely reported here and in other news sources. Google is your friend. Try "Thailand rice policy corruption". Read a few articles and then get back to us.

I'll help you a bit:

http://www.thaivisa....cases-thailand/

http://www.thaivisa....cheme-thailand/

http://www.thaivisa....thai-editorial/

http://thediplomat.c...-rice-exporter/

Back to you. None of these articles have any proof whatsoever of members of Peau Thai and/or Thaksin benefiting from the policy. Maybe you should read my original post and get back to me.

That may be true, but it isnt, however you cant deny that its self evident that the Thai treasury/public lost billions due to these schemes. EG: The product of a whole onion season was lost requiring the importation of replacement product.

Edited January 5, 2013 by waza

[MILT]

The next government to come to power will find the coffers empty, massive national debt and millions of tonnes of expired rice.

Well if the economic situation is as severe as you make up, then the chances are somewhere down the line this Government will have to deal with it. Whinge as you may its not as if any other party poses a viable alternative to the voting public so unless there is a coup the chances are you are going to spend the foreseeable future writing the same whining messages everyday for the next 10 years. For your health I would try and sit back and see where the country goes. According to a recent interview with Korn, the economy is in good health, but i expect you know more than him....................

He probably does know more than Korn, hell my dog probably knows more than Korn. The voting public needs to consider not being payed to vote, then I would take the term voting public, majority of voters and "a clear mandate" a little more serious.

[scorecard]

There is a lot of talk of PTP/Thaksin, etc. benefiting financially (as opposed to politically) from the rice pledging policy. Examples include; #2; "Thaksin, the criminals rice pledging scheme may have netted him and his syncophants a fortune..." #8; "just wait till the red snouts have finished feeding at the trough... the only "good health" you will have then will be the toasts around the Shinawatra Banquet table"

Could someone please backup these claims with some evidence please? I thought posts were meant to be backed up by links, facts, quotes, etc.

This has been widely reported here and in other news sources. Google is your friend. Try "Thailand rice policy corruption". Read a few articles and then get back to us.

I'll help you a bit:

http://www.thaivisa....cases-thailand/

http://www.thaivisa....cheme-thailand/

http://www.thaivisa....thai-editorial/

http://thediplomat.c...-rice-exporter/

Back to you. None of these articles have any proof whatsoever of members of Peau Thai and/or Thaksin benefiting from the policy. Maybe you should read my original post and get back to me.

Be realistic:

1. These clowns know more tricks about moving money around than most of us would dream up in three lifetimes. Most of us would automatically think it all goes through the mainstream banking system. The reality is that there are other ways including a big cache in the mattress if needed. Case in point, the politician who claimed a few months back that several million Baht cash was stolen from his house. Investigators claim there was something like 18 million Baht cash hidden in his house.

2. You really think they are going to leave a crumb trail which can easily be found? I suspect they are a lot more cunning that this.

Edited January 5, 2013 by scorecard

[abq2020]

Not to fear. In the coming year or two a new title will be won: Top Rice Dumper.

[Ricardo]

Thaksin must be some kind of a god or something if half the things attributed to him are true. One Thai woman told me he controlled the Internet.

Perhaps she meant that MICT control the internet, here in Thailand, and that the former-PM controls the MICT along with the rest of the government ?

[Moruya]

In what company would any employee be able to make such stupid decisions that allowed the company to pay more for a product than they can sell it for, lose so much marketshare that they fell from number 1 to number 3 within 1 year, and still stuffed the warehouse with products with a limited shelf life?

Then make up "phantom" deals that they can't prove and then say they are going to do exactly the same thing next year?

To call the PTP clowns would be an insult to clowns everywhere.

You wont think they are clowns when they hand out 5 million ton of rice to the poor...just before the next election. Thaksin to clever for some farang

There won't be enough money left to deliver it.

[Moruya]

There is a lot of talk of PTP/Thaksin, etc. benefiting financially (as opposed to politically) from the rice pledging policy. Examples include; #2; "Thaksin, the criminals rice pledging scheme may have netted him and his syncophants a fortune..." #8; "just wait till the red snouts have finished feeding at the trough... the only "good health" you will have then will be the toasts around the Shinawatra Banquet table"

Could someone please backup these claims with some evidence please? I thought posts were meant to be backed up by links, facts, quotes, etc.

Were you asleep when the Dems brought all this up in Parliament including Arisman's wife being a major beneficiary?

So what the opposition party state, is now known as reliable evidence...... here was I thinking the opposition party MAY have a vested interest in overstating or embellishing some things.

I expect there is major corruption, but other than here say no one has actually provided any proper evidence of it.

#55 Ozmick

I am not sure on the grand scheme of things how much a few thousand rai rent of rice fields would really budge TS's bank balance that much! You are probably right in what you say, but I am pretty sure nearly every policy from the beginning of time in Thailand which revolves around land rents, motorway construction, new town construction, there will be politicians benefiting from selling or renting the land. I would also wager heavily for every PTP politician benefiting in the way you describe, there will also be land owned by politicians of other parties as well. It does not make it right, but it is what it is in Thailand, and has been forever.

I didn't see anyone denying it or running to the defamation courts

[Ricardo]

Thaksin, the criminals rice pledging scheme may have netted him and his syncophants a fortune but it has caused Thailand and the PTP government a massive loss of face and the Thai treasury a massive financial loss so far. The bad news is, its not over yet. With another year of this bad policy to go, one wonders how the PTP will spin this to their advantage.

Lost me with the Thaksin bit is he a rice farmer? As he isn't in the country I am wondering about the benefit he gets? Help appreciated.

The clue may lie in posts #73 & 79, but one must try to be discreet, nor to say anything which might be misunderstood or mistaken or actionable, in accordance with forum rules.

In his interview in Der Spiegel (15th June 2011), the reporter comments that "things seem to be going well for you here in Dubai", Thaksin responds by describing his investments in gold mines in Uganda, and in platinum and coal in South Africa & Zimbabwe & Tanzania. He continues to say that "I'm a newcomer as far as minerals are concerned, so the African continent is ideal."

However in response to the suggestion that "You speculate in commodities ... " he says only "I missed Thailand greatly in the first year. In the meantime, I have lots of friends who visit me here, friends and relatives. They bring me sausages from Chiang Mai and curry from Chonburi. That's how I can get by. Nevertheless I would like to be in Thailand ... ".

Some might find his apparent inability to respond, to the suggestion that he might trade commodities, strange. Perhaps he didn't understand the question ? It would be rash, and I would never wish to suggest, that he might indeed speculate in commodities, such as rice-futures. But what prompted the reporter's question ?

In his interview with Bloomberg (24th September 2012), he is quoted as saying "If we manipulate the mechanism for two years, three years, then things will be moving naturally", and that the rice-purchase program should be extended for several more years. "We do not just throw away the money", he is quoted as saying, and he gives hard-figures on rice-stocks currently on-hand, and names countries to whom rice-exports "will keep reserves down".

Unfortunately the PTP-led coalition-government seems less-willing to confirm the details of government-to-government export-deals, whether tonnages or delivery-dates or prices or indeed the countries involved. And then there's the curious case referred to in post #80.

Some might note, though I myself do not, the repeated use of the word "We", when discussing Thai-government policy, or they might wonder at his close knowledge of figures which the government itself seems reluctant to discuss/disclose ? No doubt purely for reasons of commercial-confidentiality.

I would thoroughly recommend anyone, who is interested in Thailand's loss of it's number-one exporter title, to read both those articles, for more on the background to current-affairs.

Edited January 6, 2013 by Ricardo

[Buchholz]

Singaporeans buying less Thai rice

Singapore consumers are losing their loyalty to Thai rice, with more of them acquiring a taste for cheaper grains from Myanmar and Vietnam.

Figures from the Ministry of Trade and Industry (MTI) show that from January to November last year, only 115,504 tonnes of Thai rice were consumed here. They made up 35.4 per cent of total imports, which was down from 52.8 per cent in 2010 and 62.1 per cent in 2009.

Major rice importers said Thai rice imports are likely to be at their lowest-ever level.

Continued:

http://www.asianewsn...rice-41378.html

The Straits Times - Jan. 14, 2013

[OzMick]

There is a lot of talk of PTP/Thaksin, etc. benefiting financially (as opposed to politically) from the rice pledging policy. Examples include; #2; "Thaksin, the criminals rice pledging scheme may have netted him and his syncophants a fortune..." #8; "just wait till the red snouts have finished feeding at the trough... the only "good health" you will have then will be the toasts around the Shinawatra Banquet table"

Could someone please backup these claims with some evidence please? I thought posts were meant to be backed up by links, facts, quotes, etc.

Were you asleep when the Dems brought all this up in Parliament including Arisman's wife being a major beneficiary?

So what the opposition party state, is now known as reliable evidence...... here was I thinking the opposition party MAY have a vested interest in overstating or embellishing some things.

I expect there is major corruption, but other than here say no one has actually provided any proper evidence of it.

#55 Ozmick

I am not sure on the grand scheme of things how much a few thousand rai rent of rice fields would really budge TS's bank balance that much! You are probably right in what you say, but I am pretty sure nearly every policy from the beginning of time in Thailand which revolves around land rents, motorway construction, new town construction, there will be politicians benefiting from selling or renting the land. I would also wager heavily for every PTP politician benefiting in the way you describe, there will also be land owned by politicians of other parties as well. It does not make it right, but it is what it is in Thailand, and has been forever.

Sorry to be slow, I missed your reply. A thousand baht or so per rai for a few thousand rai turns into millions of baht of corruptly obtained taxpayer funds, but that's alright because he's really rich? Corruption is OK because everybody here does it, and our big campaign against it is just a farce anyway?

May I point out that benefiting from a government policy is not a crime. The crime is voting for that policy when there is a clear conflict of interest, made worse when that policy is continued without change when it is obvious that it is a failure in its stated aims and that corruption is occurring on a massive scale.

Probably silly of me to hope for change and a better chance for my children.

[Buchholz]

Final official figures are in now for 2012 for rice exportation.

India is the world leader with 10.3 million tons.

Vietnam is second with 8 million tons.

Thailand has dropped to third with 6.73 million tons (plunging down 37% from last year and its lowest export total in 12 years).

.

[Buchholz]

India Rice exports up at 75 lakh tonnes during April-Dec ‘12

Rice exports were at 74.67 lakh tonnes during April-December 2012 against 71.75 lakh tonnes in the full fiscal year of 2011-12, Parliament was informed on Wednesday.

“As the export price of Indian rice was more competitive than the Thai rice, India has displaced Thailand from the position of top exporter of rice during 2011-12,” Minister of State Commerce and Industry D Purandeswari said in a written reply to the Rajya Sabha.

She said that export performance of both the countries in coming years would depend upon quantum of production of rice in India and Thailand as also the overall global supply scenario and other nuances of internal trade in agricultural commodities.

Continued:

http://www.thehindubusinessline.com/industry-and-economy/agri-biz/rice-exports-up-at-75-lakh-tonnes-during-aprildec-12/article4504823.ece?homepage=true&ref=wl_home

Hindu Businessline - March 13, 2013

* lakh = 100,000

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