Repatriation Assistance For Sick Brit

[richardjm65]

I know this is a long shot, but thought I'd see if you guys know of any organisation who might be able to assist in the repatriation to the UK for a very sick man. The story as I know it:-

1) The guy became sick about 4 - 5 months ago with a problem with his eyes, balance and, I suspect, mental processes. He has no money, and the UK family are unable/unwilling to assist. His visa expired back in June and was not renewed, probably because of a combination of lack of money and his inability to get to an immigration office. I believe he might be excused the overstay if his doctor can produce a letter stating the health situation. He has no medical insurance back-up. I reckon he's lost about a third of his body weight from not eating properly.

2) Though not officially married, he has three children who are not yet in their teens. In better times he took on a nice house and a shophouse, both of which have to be paid for and his partner is way behind with the payments to the bank.

3) She's unable to work as the children need care and he needs 24/7 attention.

4) He was taken to the British Embassy on Monday, his partner hoping for his emergency repatriation. The embassy said they were unable to help and would not even see him.

5) I'm not sure if he'd be allowed to fly, given his condition, and I believe that an escort would be required.

6) Even if that could be achieved, with no support back in the UK the only option that I can see would be to get himself sectioned, as he's long been out of the UK and probably would not be able to get emergency NHS treatment for what is a pre-existing condition. Having not lived in the UK for many years, I don't know the routine for getting sectioned.

It's a difficult situation - we've helped as much as we're able. I've suggested that his partner talks to the bank, offering the possibility of moving out of the house to the shophouse to reduce overheads and selling the house.

Any useful suggestions would be welcome. Other thoughts that occurred might be trying to interest one of the Brit newspapers or maybe the Salvation Army. Any ideas?

[beano2274]

Was he in the forces as SSAFA might assist?

Otherwise it is a bad situation for your friend, I believe that his overstay will need to be paid, he could have given his wife the authority to do his visa or extensions.

The Embassy are always like that, and the UK papers are not going to take the story on, I tried to get the German papers involved with the down and out that was roaming in Pattaya, but nothing ever happened.

Going to have to sell up and go home or stay here till the end.

Good luck in finding a situation that your friend can deal with and accept.

[Mario2008]

Yes, overstay will still be charged. Even when sick and with a doctors note. If one can't make it, one needs to send someone else to immigration.

He should needs 20,000 baht to pay for the overstay.

The Birtish Embassy will be of little help. They can assist in contacting family, but they will not pay for repatriation themselves. That is considered his own responsibility.

But first I would check if he is allowed to fly, as that will determine his options, and if he needs an escort or other facilities during travel.

[RabC]

Again if he is Ex Forces there is The British Leigion here in Thailand : http://rblthailand.com/

Also if Ex Forces as beano has said there is SSAFA who I believe have representation at the Embassy.

[steve187]

Richardjm65 is the man over 65 and entilted to a uk pension?

[crazykopite]

Very sad The worst scenario would be to dump him on the steps of the British Embassey and walk away ensuring his British passport was with him, they would have to do something then, even returning to the UK would not help as he would not be entitled to medical treatment for the 1st 6 months the poor fella seems to be in a no win situation.

[richardjm65]

Thanks for the replies so far. To answer a couple of queries, he never served in the military. He is not yet of pensionable age. It's a bit alarming that he would still be fined for a visa overstay, and since he has no money, the alternative would be to stick him in the immigration jail. And there he'd stay.

It looks as if his best option is to lie low until the end. The thought of dumping him at the embassy gates did occur, but I reckon he'd be picked up by the BIB and finish up in the immigration lock-up.

[Hedghog]

Maybe the Red Cross is worth a try.

Not sure of there presence in Thailand though.

The reason the Embassy won't assist as they lost so much money in the past,repatriating it citizens.

Will only contact relatives.

[Hedghog]

This is a very sad story.

But reiterates the need to have private medical care whilst living in a foreign country.

Best of luck in sourcing a solution.

[beano2274]

Thanks for the replies so far. To answer a couple of queries, he never served in the military. He is not yet of pensionable age. It's a bit alarming that he would still be fined for a visa overstay, and since he has no money, the alternative would be to stick him in the immigration jail. And there he'd stay.

It looks as if his best option is to lie low until the end. The thought of dumping him at the embassy gates did occur, but I reckon he'd be picked up by the BIB and finish up in the immigration lock-up.

If you left him the Embassy would suggest he goes to the IDC, so I would let him lie low till his time is up, or it will be a costly trip for his family and himself.

[mrtoad]

A few years ago, I tried to help out a SA national who was extremely ill that I knew. He was on a massive overstay, and needed urgent medical attention. I notified his embassy and got nothing, i notified his family and got nothing, I spent weeks taking food and sundries to him to help. I ended up with a 70,000 baht medical bill which I ended up paying, and never getting back. He got scooped up and sent to IDC and subsequently deported. Last year surprisingly he returned to Thailand. I got no thanks from anyone, so whilst it's an awful situation, you may end up getting burnt for doing a good deed. Notify the Tourist Police and The Embassy, and they can take care of it.

[tinfoilhat]

toad,

As far as i can see it, 70k (if you can afford it) is a small price to pay to hold your head high.

Even if you got burned in the end, you probably got more out if it than they did.

Edited January 8, 2013 by tinfoilhat

[CMTourist]

Thanks for the replies so far. To answer a couple of queries, he never served in the military. He is not yet of pensionable age. It's a bit alarming that he would still be fined for a visa overstay, and since he has no money, the alternative would be to stick him in the immigration jail. And there he'd stay.

It looks as if his best option is to lie low until the end. The thought of dumping him at the embassy gates did occur, but I reckon he'd be picked up by the BIB and finish up in the immigration lock-up.

If you left him the Embassy would suggest he goes to the IDC, so I would let him lie low till his time is up, or it will be a costly trip for his family and himself.

Only once you know what's wrong with him can you really make decisions or plans. Imagine if he has a simple inflamation in the brain and a cheap dose of steroid would make him completely healthy and it wasn't done to save a few hundred baht, or alternatively people stump up 100,000 Baht to send him to England only to find he has an untreatable tumor and dies a few weeks later on his own in a hostel

[TerryLH]

"It's a bit alarming that he would still be fined for a visa overstay,..."

Medical based extensions are provided, if eligible, to keep the person legal until they are able to travel, not to make them legal after the fact.

You might contact immigration and see if he could get an extension now, probably after paying the current overstay fine, to keep him legal going forward. That might save him a trip to IDC.

This is not a good situation to be in. Hope you find a solution soon.

Terry

[MrRealDeal]

Seems a little backwards to me ....... I would concentrate on getting him healthy here in Thailand and then worry about the repatration part , once he is healthy at least he has that and then may very well not even need to go back or at least is in a better condition for fighure out a way he can all by himself.

If it's not possible for him to regain his health going back home won't help anything aside from imigration issues , being sick and broke here or there doesn't change either of those things and it might just be better to be sick and broke where your wife and kids are.

Seems to me like what would make everything easier is to kick start the bisness and make it profitable again , easier said than done I know , but a money stream would go a long way to increasing the choices available.

So I would worry about his health , the shop , and imigration in that order instead of the other way around.

I think your on the right track when you are looking for financial changes as part of the solutiuon.

Edited January 8, 2013 by MrRealDeal

[loong]

As far as i understand it, if he returns to the UK and declares that his intention is to repatriate, he will receive NHS treatment, but for an existing condition, it's a grey area.

One thing for sure, he will receive treatment from the NHS and if he is not entitled to free treatment he will receive a bill. He will not be refused treatment if he is unable to pay.

That's all well and good, but the main problem here is getting him to the UK.

Sorry, I have no answers

[Soutpeel]

Unless the OP wants to front the cash himself to clear the overstay and get him back to the Uk cant see what else he can do other than inform the BE of the situation the guy is in, not that they will do anything other and try and contact his relatives in the UK.

I really hope our more senior TV members who are living in Thailand without medical insurance or a "get-out" plan/provision are reading this and taking heed of this sad situation....it could be you, get a plan in place...

[mrtoad]

toad,

As far as i can see it, 70k (if you can afford it) is a small price to pay to hold your head high.

Even if you got burned in the end, you probably got more out if it than they did.

Agreed, I know it was the right thing, but it poised me off no end to see that no one else gave a shit. It's pretty sad really. Would I do it again, maybe unlikely, but I would always try and do something.

[MrRealDeal]

My guess is this "poor guy" has a different opinion about his situation then the people trying to "help" him ..... I would guess at some point as the OP indicates he had plenty of money and things were fine and he made a decision to do what he did on purpose , let the money run out and be broke and sick in Thailand instead of broke and sick in the UK , the story has an element of other people wanting to unburden themselves because of his problems as much as an element of actually wanting to help him.

My guess is he was "taken" to an embassy begrudginly because he doesn't really even want to go back to the UK ..... why would he ? Maybe they solve all his medical issues he is still old , broke and away from his family with no way to return ..... My bet would be if you asked him if he wants to be well but broke and homeless in the UK or even sick but with his loved ones here he would chose the latter. Wouldn't you ? That of course pretty much depends on his age and the extent of the solvability of the medical issues , but any way you slice it going back to the UK would mean he would be broke with what seems like no family support and likely very few prospects for gainfull employment.

Might not be the choice I would make, or the choice the people wanting to help him would make for him, but my guess is it's a choice he made intentionally and isn't especially sorry about either.

The reason I take this position is so far their is nothing in the story that would indicate his medical problems are not just normal every day problems people come across that could be taken care of here in Thailand or more to the point that sending him to the UK is really necessary, or would accomplish anything more than unburdening those around him as opposed to getting treatment here. If people were really trying to help him they would be taking him to the Doctor not to the Airport.

Edited January 8, 2013 by MrRealDeal

[harryfrompattaya]

toad,

As far as i can see it, 70k (if you can afford it) is a small price to pay to hold your head high.

Even if you got burned in the end, you probably got more out if it than they did.

Pm me maybe we both pay for ticket home

[MAJIC]

Very sad The worst scenario would be to dump him on the steps of the British Embassey and walk away ensuring his British passport was with him, they would have to do something then, even returning to the UK would not help as he would not be entitled to medical treatment for the 1st 6 months the poor fella seems to be in a no win situation.

If he could get to the UK and to an Accident & Emergency close to the Airport,even if his Escort could call an Ambulance,I believe he would not be turned away,just because he has been out of the Country for a long while,the adverse Publicity would be enough to get him admitted. Whether he is fit enough to fly,would need a sympathetic Doctors Letter.

[MAJIC]

As far as i understand it, if he returns to the UK and declares that his intention is to repatriate, he will receive NHS treatment, but for an existing condition, it's a grey area.

One thing for sure, he will receive treatment from the NHS and if he is not entitled to free treatment he will receive a bill. He will not be refused treatment if he is unable to pay.

That's all well and good, but the main problem here is getting him to the UK.

Sorry, I have no answers

Agreed the NHS will most definately treat him,whether he would have to pay or not,is of secondary importance. Could be £5 a month or nothing,whatever,if it saves his life. As you say the main part would be: getting him in good enough shape to take a direct flight to the UK,perhaps a Thai Doctor could advise on that possibility?

[MAJIC]

My guess is this "poor guy" has a different opinion about his situation then the people trying to "help" him ..... I would guess at some point as the OP indicates he had plenty of money and things were fine and he made a decision to do what he did on purpose , let the money run out and be broke and sick in Thailand instead of broke and sick in the UK , the story has an element of other people wanting to unburden themselves because of his problems as much as an element of actually wanting to help him.

My guess is he was "taken" to an embassy begrudginly because he doesn't really even want to go back to the UK ..... why would he ? Maybe they solve all his medical issues he is still old , broke and away from his family with no way to return ..... My bet would be if you asked him if he wants to be well but broke and homeless in the UK or even sick but with his loved ones here he would chose the latter. Wouldn't you ? That of course pretty much depends on his age and the extent of the solvability of the medical issues , but any way you slice it going back to the UK would mean he would be broke with what seems like no family support and likely very few prospects for gainfull employment.

Might not be the choice I would make, or the choice the people wanting to help him would make for him, but my guess is it's a choice he made intentionally and isn't especially sorry about either.

The reason I take this position is so far their is nothing in the story that would indicate his medical problems are not just normal every day problems people come across that could be taken care of here in Thailand or more to the point that sending him to the UK is really necessary, or would accomplish anything more than unburdening those around him as opposed to getting treatment here. If people were really trying to help him they would be taking him to the Doctor not to the Airport.

A good point! a Doctors Diagnosis and immediate Prognosis should be paramount!

Edited January 8, 2013 by MAJIC

[endure]

Very sad The worst scenario would be to dump him on the steps of the British Embassey and walk away ensuring his British passport was with him, they would have to do something then, even returning to the UK would not help as he would not be entitled to medical treatment for the 1st 6 months the poor fella seems to be in a no win situation.

If he could get to the UK and to an Accident & Emergency close to the Airport,even if his Escort could call an Ambulance,I believe he would not be turned away,just because he has been out of the Country for a long while,the adverse Publicity would be enough to get him admitted. Whether he is fit enough to fly,would need a sympathetic Doctors Letter.

Nobody gets turned away from A&E no matter where they come from or what nationality they are. They may have to pay for any treatment after that but I suspect that nobody will ask this guy for payment.

[MAJIC]

Very sad The worst scenario would be to dump him on the steps of the British Embassey and walk away ensuring his British passport was with him, they would have to do something then, even returning to the UK would not help as he would not be entitled to medical treatment for the 1st 6 months the poor fella seems to be in a no win situation.

If he could get to the UK and to an Accident & Emergency close to the Airport,even if his Escort could call an Ambulance,I believe he would not be turned away,just because he has been out of the Country for a long while,the adverse Publicity would be enough to get him admitted. Whether he is fit enough to fly,would need a sympathetic Doctors Letter.

Nobody gets turned away from A&E no matter where they come from or what nationality they are. They may have to pay for any treatment after that but I suspect that nobody will ask this guy for payment.

From personal experience I believe you are correct,but I hesitated to say no one will ask for payment,our Medical Staff are only interested in the Patients well being,the rest is left to the Accountants,which more often than not,the Bill never arrives.

[Rumpole]

As far as i understand it, if he returns to the UK and declares that his intention is to repatriate, he will receive NHS treatment, but for an existing condition, it's a grey area.

One thing for sure, he will receive treatment from the NHS and if he is not entitled to free treatment he will receive a bill. He will not be refused treatment if he is unable to pay.

He can declare that he has returned to the UK to take up permanent residence and he will receive free treatment on the NHS, the same as any other resident (I am pretty sure even for a pre-existing condition):

http://www.nhs.uk/ch...bCategoryID=162

This is however a "one shot chance". If he got better and then foolishly decided to return to Thailand to live, that option would never again be available to him. Posters are right though in that he will still receive treatment, regardless of his inability to pay. He may also get some kind of social/welfare assistance, despite the cut backs.

Ironically, if he was actually incarcerated in the IDC for a time and then deported, it is quite possible he could get financial help and moral support from the charity Prisoners Abroad on his return to the UK.

Edited January 8, 2013 by Rumpole

[MrRealDeal]

I still fail to see why everyone thinks he would be better off in the UK

For the price of the plane ticket he can get plenty of medical help here and still be with his loved ones , albiet broke and having imigration issues

For the price of a plane ticket he can get some welfare medial help and then be broke and homeless away from his loved ones.

Call me crazy but if I were him I would rather have all the people wanting to help me send me to a doctor and help me pay my imigration problems.

Maybe I should make a poll and ask people if you needed help because you were sick, would you rather get sent to a doctor and have someone help you pay off imigration and stay with your family or be given a one way ticket back to the UK with the clothes on your back and no money. ...... Seems pretty obvious to me what a person would want but I guess I could be wrong ...... again

[Chivas]

Very sad The worst scenario would be to dump him on the steps of the British Embassey and walk away ensuring his British passport was with him, they would have to do something then, even returning to the UK would not help as he would not be entitled to medical treatment for the 1st 6 months the poor fella seems to be in a no win situation.

If he could get to the UK and to an Accident & Emergency close to the Airport,even if his Escort could call an Ambulance,I believe he would not be turned away,just because he has been out of the Country for a long while,the adverse Publicity would be enough to get him admitted. Whether he is fit enough to fly,would need a sympathetic Doctors Letter.

He wont be turned away if he turns up at A & E in the Uk..........

He will be treated first and questions asked after (possibly).....Thats the way it works here.......

I would suggest absolutely NOT going the publicity route

[MAJIC]

Very sad The worst scenario would be to dump him on the steps of the British Embassey and walk away ensuring his British passport was with him, they would have to do something then, even returning to the UK would not help as he would not be entitled to medical treatment for the 1st 6 months the poor fella seems to be in a no win situation.

If he could get to the UK and to an Accident & Emergency close to the Airport,even if his Escort could call an Ambulance,I believe he would not be turned away,just because he has been out of the Country for a long while,the adverse Publicity would be enough to get him admitted. Whether he is fit enough to fly,would need a sympathetic Doctors Letter.

He wont be turned away if he turns up at A & E in the Uk..........

He will be treated first and questions asked after (possibly).....Thats the way it works here.......

I would suggest absolutely NOT going the publicity route

Agreed! and surely you missed my hypothetical point!

Edited January 8, 2013 by MAJIC

[roamer]

" The guy became sick about 4 - 5 months ago with a problem with his eyes, balance and, I suspect, mental processes."

In that case you would not be doing him any favours by putting him on a plane, far from it. Time to stop putting the cart in front of the horse and get a medical diagnosis.

Symptons such as you describe could include causes such as a minor stroke in which case a flight home could be his last flight.