Ten Killed In Sukhothai Head-On Road Crash

[Artisi]

Tragic!

Woodcaulk, it would be a nice idea to know the statistics you are after, but truth is, it is difficult to get honest figures just on the actual road deaths, never mind sub categories.

I am faced with a real dichotomy at the moment. In two weeks time my 5 year olds class are going on a visit to a toy factory (wooden toys). It is only about 10 kms away, but I just don't trust the bus drivers here. No seat belts, no driver safety regulations. Help what do I do? I don't want her to miss it, I don't want her to miss the camaraderie with her little friends, but I also don't want her going on a bus with the type of guy who takes yabba to stay awake. Does she go, take the day off 'sick' or do I take her in the safety of our motor behind the bus? I never ever thought like this with my children in the UK! What have you folks done here in the past?

Huh?

And what don't you understand, seems it was quite clear to everyone else - Huh?

[noob7]

Up country near Utradit one time a bus full of passengers passed me going up a hill and continued on the wrong side of the road passing an unbroken line of traffic. Suddenly a 10 wheel truck with trailer came the opposite way and the bus could not get back into our line of traffic.

How could that happen? Did the bus try to pass a bigger Truck?

If not, usually the big once 'can go always back into their line' of traffic!

You only need to check on motorcycle accidents. Got kicked from the bike, cause the cardriver was scared, a meter distance to the meridian line wasn't enough, but couldn't wait to pass, till no ongoing traffic, anymore.

Lucky, neither the truck, nor the bus was speeding, methinks!

[DocN]

TEN people die, whenTWO pick- ups collide???

'nuff said!

R.I.P.

[LaoPo]

Tragic!

Woodcaulk, it would be a nice idea to know the statistics you are after, but truth is, it is difficult to get honest figures just on the actual road deaths, never mind sub categories.

I am faced with a real dichotomy at the moment. In two weeks time my 5 year olds class are going on a visit to a toy factory (wooden toys). It is only about 10 kms away, but I just don't trust the bus drivers here. No seat belts, no driver safety regulations. Help what do I do? I don't want her to miss it, I don't want her to miss the camaraderie with her little friends, but I also don't want her going on a bus with the type of guy who takes yabba to stay awake. Does she go, take the day off 'sick' or do I take her in the safety of our motor behind the bus? I never ever thought like this with my children in the UK! What have you folks done here in the past?

Huh?

And what don't you understand, seems it was quite clear to everyone else - Huh?

I'm not everyone else...

And, as explained later, never heard of the expression before.

Thanks for the tip from an infallible though

[OzMick]

These drivers care nothing for the lives of others. I was forced off the road this morning on my motorcycle when a pickup coming from the opposite direction pulled out to overtake a couple of songthaews while flashing his lights at me. There were no other vehicles following along behind me. He just had no patience and no ettiquette.

Do you have a Thai licence; are you familiar with Thai road rules? If you were you might understand this situation more clearly.

[redcardave]

Tragic!

Woodcaulk, it would be a nice idea to know the statistics you are after, but truth is, it is difficult to get honest figures just on the actual road deaths, never mind sub categories.

I am faced with a real dichotomy at the moment. In two weeks time my 5 year olds class are going on a visit to a toy factory (wooden toys). It is only about 10 kms away, but I just don't trust the bus drivers here. No seat belts, no driver safety regulations. Help what do I do? I don't want her to miss it, I don't want her to miss the camaraderie with her little friends, but I also don't want her going on a bus with the type of guy who takes yabba to stay awake. Does she go, take the day off 'sick' or do I take her in the safety of our motor behind the bus? I never ever thought like this with my children in the UK! What have you folks done here in the past?

Take her your self

[NoshowJones]

Shows the dangers of people travelling in the back of pickups. Looking at the other vehicle where the passenger area seems to be not badly crushed I wonder if the driver was wearing a seatbelt.

Valid question,I think. Even if the engine became a visitor inside, the seatbelt and/or no airbag is probably the reason for loosing his life.

The picture looks a bit to me, that the green one is totally on the wrong side of the road.

I wonder, why these pictures are never taken from a useful angle!

Wife told me one of the trucks was doing the usual crazy overtake on the wrong side of the road. Didn't look and goodnight.

She told you which one? Was it the 'loaded' one?

Does anyone know how many on avg. die each year in LOS riding in the back of a pickup truck as a percentage of the overall road fatalities?

oops! You mean, a statistic, which shows truck/pick up people transports are so dangerous, that they should ban it?

Don't think so. Would mean, anyone would need to enforce law. Not the strongest point of the job description for the BiB's!

The authorities would be wasting their time banning passengers on pickups. Thai people don't bother with the law where driving, vehicles and roads are concerned. The only time the BIB bother is when it's tea money time.

[NoshowJones]

These drivers care nothing for the lives of others. I was forced off the road this morning on my motorcycle when a pickup coming from the opposite direction pulled out to overtake a couple of songthaews while flashing his lights at me. There were no other vehicles following along behind me. He just had no patience and no ettiquette.

That sums up the typical Thai driver.

[FlamingBull]

Speed kills is the message I try to convey at least for one week each year. Far be it for me, to stop speeding drivers who toss me tea-money and speed off.

[Artisi]

Tragic!

Woodcaulk, it would be a nice idea to know the statistics you are after, but truth is, it is difficult to get honest figures just on the actual road deaths, never mind sub categories.

I am faced with a real dichotomy at the moment. In two weeks time my 5 year olds class are going on a visit to a toy factory (wooden toys). It is only about 10 kms away, but I just don't trust the bus drivers here. No seat belts, no driver safety regulations. Help what do I do? I don't want her to miss it, I don't want her to miss the camaraderie with her little friends, but I also don't want her going on a bus with the type of guy who takes yabba to stay awake. Does she go, take the day off 'sick' or do I take her in the safety of our motor behind the bus? I never ever thought like this with my children in the UK! What have you folks done here in the past?

Huh?

And what don't you understand, seems it was quite clear to everyone else - Huh?

I'm not everyone else...

And, as explained later, never heard of the expression before.

Thanks for the tip from an infallible though

Nobody is infallible and I would never pretend to be. however, the "Huh?" comment was a little curt and to me a little out of place and not really expected from someone like yourself.

[SOTIRIOS]

...I've seen so many 'company vehicles' (pickups) ....bombing along with abandon...total recklessness, actually....

(...and usually with passengers to impress....)

....what a shame...

[Andre0720]

Well, must be more to this story. >Difficult to believe.

Two vehicles, traveling at a reasonable speed, in a country where people drive with an overwhelming fear, fear of getting speeding tickets, fear of getting tickets for not wearing helmets, fear of overtaking another vehicle, fear of undertaking a vehicle, fear of missing a red light, fear....

I hope they find out how such an accident can happen.

And remedy to it.... Sure they can...

[seajae]

maybe if the govt realized that people that drive cars need to know what the road laws are this wouldnt happen. As long as they just hand out a licence to anyone without knowing what responsibilities they have when they drive this will just keep on happening. Most of the drivers are so arrogant(not willing to loose face) that they simply expect everyone else to move off the road for them, I find they get a real shock when I simply stay where I am and smile and tell them what I think of them. These idiots are their own worst enemies and until they are forced to obey the road laws by the ones that are supposed to be enforcing it they will just keep doing it.

Edited January 16, 2013 by metisdead
: Font

[Lucie]

What we have here is a failure to communicate. (on your behalf I think).

He said ""IN" the safety of our "motor"" (British usage for a car). He did not say "on the back" of anything.

I understood it to mean he would be following the bus to the school, carrying his daughter in his own car..

Yes, you could be right here but I never heard the expression before"..or do I take her in the safety of our motor behind the bus?" meaning a car.

Sorry if I misunderstood writer GentlemanJim.

But, to give some advise to GentlemanJim, yes, bring her in a car with some of her friends (following the bus) to the "10 minutes away" toy factory location.

On the other hand, if one does not trust a/the Thai driver, what kind of life lies ahead for you, the child and her mother?....

I mean, ONE or BOTH cars, causing the 10 people killed today could have make the fatal mistake and such a fatal mistake could also happen to YOUR car, if you're driving your little girl to school or elsewhere.

It does NOT have to be YOUR fault.

The 'in' could refer to the word 'safety' rather than to the word 'car' so an understandable confusion.

I understand GentlemanJim's dilemma. I often have to use buses and of course there's the taxis. Many driven badly, seatbelts hidden behind the rear seat. Plus as LaoPo says it doesn't have to be your fault. I think the idea of taking your daughter and a friend is your best option.

I have recently managed to get the female members of my gf's family to wear seatbelts although I doubt the male ones will follow.

kimamey, I'm impressed that you've been able to get some people to wear seatbelts. I don't have any luck. But do you think they wear them when you're not there? It seems that seatbelts and motorcycle helmets are only worn to protect against being stopped by the police, rather than against injuries... Or in this case, to protect against the ranting of the farang...

[Buckaroo]

Two pickups and ten dead, no mention of how many survived or were injured. Most likely no seatbelt usage or roadcraft. I hope Darwinism has kicked in before the stupid genes of whichever driver was at fault were passed on.

[A Member]

What a horrible and tragic accident

May they all R.I.P.

The cabinet has voted to declare a day in March every year as "World Road Accident Victim Remembrance Day" as it will "definitely" promote road safety and show the world Thailand takes the matter seriously !! Do the people who come up with this sort of nonsense actually take it seriously themselves ?

[TomTao]

maybe if the govt realized that people that drive cars need to know what the road laws are this wouldnt happen. As long as they just hand out a licence to anyone without knowing what responsibilities they have when they drive this will just keep on happening. Most of the drivers are so arrogant(not willing to loose face) that they simply expect everyone else to move off the road for them, I find they get a real shock when I simply stay where I am and smile and tell them what I think of them. These idiots are their own worst enemies and until they are forced to obey the road laws by the ones that are supposed to be enforcing it they will just keep doing it.

Yes driver education is sorely lacking here, but the thing that magnifies the problem is the almost complete lack of enforcement of the trafic laws. The simple way of looking at it is like this, the laws aren't enforced, therefore they don't exist.

[simple1]

Two pickups and ten dead, no mention of how many survived or were injured. Most likely no seatbelt usage or roadcraft. I hope Darwinism has kicked in before the stupid genes of whichever driver was at fault were passed on.

In Thailand you often see up to 15+ people being conveyed to work in the back of a pickup. Sitting on the edge of the tray and standing, no passenger security whatsoever. I am surprised there are not more reports of similar incidents to the OP. When I have Thai passengers in my car I have to insist they use the seat belts, it's not normal practice in Thailand. Even want the children sitting on their laps in the front passenger seat, I can see they think I am being unreasonable when I say no.

Edited January 17, 2013 by simple1

[Soutpeel]

When I have Thai passengers in my car I have to insist they use the seat belts, it's not normal practice in Thailand.

same, I will just sit waiting until they put their belts on before we move..

[chooka]

When I have Thai passengers in my car I have to insist they use the seat belts, it's not normal practice in Thailand.

same, I will just sit waiting until they put their belts on before we move..

Dito Upsets my wife and her friends when have children in the car and I refuse to move if they are standing on the back seat. They even see nothing wrong with children jumping from the back seat to front seat whilst the car is being driven. I go ballistic if they take thier belts off and immeadiately stop the vehicle and refuse to move until they sit back down and belt up. Edited January 17, 2013 by chooka

[kimamey]

Its nice to see measured thoughtful responses on this thread, but I cant help wondering, in light of the other thread regarding the Range Rover fender bender and temper tantrum, and the subsequent hysterical responses from TV finest, what the responses might be if one of the vehicles was owned/driven by a perceived "Hi-So" in this tragic accident ?

I think the other case was about the guy's attitude more than the accident which wasn't serious. I agree that some of the comments on that were somewhat over the top and hysterical but I think you gave as good as you got.

This is a bit different as it involves loss of life in this particular incident and there are many others that occur due to the driving and application of the law here. Some of the consequences are more serious than others. As far as I know we don't know the cause of this crash although we do know that there are serious safety issues when seating people in the bed of a pickup as happened here.

One driver is dead so if he was at fault then there's not much can be done. If it was the other driver then they should be prosecuted, punished and prevented from driving according to the circumstances of their actions. If it were a 'Hi-So' then the same should apply. There are differences when there are fines involved of course. A 500,000 baht fine is different depending on your wealth. If the 'Hi-So' received a lower sentence due to their position or that of their family or because they could pay substantial compensation then that would, in my opinion be wrong

[kimamey]

The authorities would be wasting their time banning passengers on pickups. Thai people don't bother with the law where driving, vehicles and roads are concerned. The only time the BIB bother is when it's tea money time.

I think it's already banned but as you say ignored.

I've got a feeling there's something in the Buddhist religion about not doing the same thing just because you always have if it's not working.

[kimamey]

kimamey, I'm impressed that you've been able to get some people to wear seatbelts. I don't have any luck. But do you think they wear them when you're not there? It seems that seatbelts and motorcycle helmets are only worn to protect against being stopped by the police, rather than against injuries... Or in this case, to protect against the ranting of the farang...

I'm not sure what made the difference to be honest. I've been coming here for about 5 years now but only for about 3 weeks at a time until May last year when I came for 3 months. I returned in December for a 7 month stay. The first times it was with a hire car and was mostly just the 2 of us or my gf's brother in law's pickup. We didn't get our own car (Honda Jazz) until June last year, about a month before I left but I'd already thought our own car might be the time to do it.When I returned and the time came to get her sister and mother in the back I just said I thought they should wear them and they did. I was surprised when I had to take them in the sister's car as it's bigger and there were 3 in the back when they all belted up.

Some time ago I'd shown my gf some YouTube videos of what happens when someone unbelted in the back crashes into a belted front seat passenger. I went not for the safety of the person in the back but of the belted person whose skull or body could be crushed whilst wearing a belt in the front. This would normally be myself and my gf. This is a common approach in road safety as well as things like anti smoking and drinking campaigns. I'm not sure if it was the potential damage to her or myself that was the most telling.

I do know that I've decided I should be able to ride a motorbike whilst here. I never have before in the UK. I want to get some proper training in the UK when I go back. I ran out of time when I was there last. I do at least have some road sense fro over 40 years of car driving so that should help. It certainly does whilst driving the car. She is to say the least not keen on the idea due to the fact that, as she says, 'it's very dangerous riding a bike in Thailand'. Maybe she's seen the contradiction, who knows.

I also mentioned that bearing in mind the risk of death or injury to the owners of the car that it was rather rude not to wear a seatbelt. I think that the fact that I seem to be well liked by her family might have had a bearing on their behaviour as well.

I have got her to tell some of her friends as well which worked for a while but there are times when it can be difficult. My gf works in civil government, part of the Ministry of Labour, and we had to give a lift to a woman who used to be her boss but has now retired. Bearing in mind hierarchy involved I decided not to push it for a short journey. I suppose I'm lucky I've never had to rant as I leave the explaining for my gf to do. I'm afraid I'm not as brave as Simple1, Soutpeel or Chooka. Well done to them.

I only took GCE exams at school in the UK but I'm amazed at the amount of people with degrees or studying for them that don't seem to understand the effects of alcohol on reaction times whilst driving or the effects of inertia in the same scenario.

Oh and some of the appalling English spelling and grammar on this forum by English speakers....................... I'm ranting now aren't I?

Edited January 17, 2013 by kimamey

[FarangTalk]

I think it's already banned but as you say ignored.

Wouldn't think that is the case as there's tens of thousands of converted pick-ups being used as songtaews or 'Baht buses' in Thailand.

It is also legal in Singapore, provided the passengers are seated in the back, the rear is covered and a maximum passenger limit is displayed on the rear of the vehicle.

[kimamey]

I think it's already banned but as you say ignored.

Wouldn't think that is the case as there's tens of thousands of converted pick-ups being used as songtaews or 'Baht buses' in Thailand.

It is also legal in Singapore, provided the passengers are seated in the back, the rear is covered and a maximum passenger limit is displayed on the rear of the vehicle.

This is just something I read a little while ago so I don't know if it's true. I think the buses may be different in that they're covered and have seating. I realise that's not much different but maybe someone else will clarify the law for us.

[kimamey]

I think it's already banned but as you say ignored.

Wouldn't think that is the case as there's tens of thousands of converted pick-ups being used as songtaews or 'Baht buses' in Thailand.

It is also legal in Singapore, provided the passengers are seated in the back, the rear is covered and a maximum passenger limit is displayed on the rear of the vehicle.

That's just what I read a while back so don't know if it's true. I think buses may be different as they're covered and have seats. I know it doesn't make much difference to safety but laws are often like that.

[Hans Sierhuis]

Sad stuff

[BirdsandBooze]

These drivers care nothing for the lives of others. I was forced off the road this morning on my motorcycle when a pickup coming from the opposite direction pulled out to overtake a couple of songthaews while flashing his lights at me. There were no other vehicles following along behind me. He just had no patience and no ettiquette.

Do you have a Thai licence; are you familiar with Thai road rules? If you were you might understand this situation more clearly.

I have Thai licences and have ridden on and driven on Thai roads for many years. Go and pester someone else.