Atm's Lessons Learned

[ray23]

I always use Bangkok Banks ATM's since that is where I have an account. Twice three times now the machine has kept the card. The first tme at the main branch, the reaction of the staff come back on tuesday and we will give it to you. I dind't see it that way and stood my ground and got ti back wihtin ten minutes.

The Next time at big no sure what heappend that time I lost the card so three moths later adn many phone calls to the staes and a friend sending the card to me, I finally got a replacement. Must have cot me about 8K baht. So not something I take lightly.

Uesterday at the big C machines one has malfuction then comes back online to do buiness, With my card from America in it. So I called the business number of the Bank of Bangkok in Bangkok and learn that Thanachad branch ( not sure of the spelling it's the one by the Napoli Hotel) takes care of the ATM's at Big C. I'm told to go there and talk to the manager, I have had problems at that branch in the past and knew I was in trouble.

Sure enough I get there and the manger is in a meeting in Khan Kean. Explain the problem and am told to come back Tuesday, told them no I wanted the card returned immediately. No come back Tuesday, ask to speak to whoever w in charge, never was givin that information.

45 minutes later I still being told no, come back Tuesday. Told them you have my property and I want it back now. No come back Tuesday.

Called back to the main offices in Bangkok, lady gives me the song and dance up to manager. Fine the manager is not here, then you should talk to the person in charge. Tell her they won't tell me who is charge so I can talk to them. The next tactic was to just put me on hold for 20 minutes so I would give up and go away. This happened twice, the third time I called I asked to speak to a supervisor immediately. when he answered the phone with what I was going through I was very carefull to write his name down.

He went through a big song and dance telling me the ATM card belonged to an American Bank and they would not release it until the bank in America said to do so. What he really was saying you can make a lot of problems for yourself, if you keep pushing. So speaking his name specifically I said let me make sure that I understand what you are saying to me. After which he created a new threatening song and dance. Finally I said to him look the people at this branch have already said they will go get the ATM card but they don't have the "power" to do this. So why you don't you just tell them to go get it. Thi i not something I did the bank made a mistake not I and it was not up to me to fix, but up to the bank.

So then it was if the manager is not there there is soemone in charge talk to them. My reponse you are not listenting to what I am telling you, no one will tell me who i cahrge. You have come back on Tuesday iIdon't have the power to do that. OK give me the name and the phone number of the person who does ahve the power. Silence you could have heard a puin drop, then I can;t do that. o agian with the name let me make sure I understand you, you are refusing to help a customer of your bank?

The response let me talk to the people at the bank, we are still on my cell phone, as he refused to call the branch. A shot converation the man in Bangkok was given a phone number of the branch manager who was in Korat I would assume.

15 minuetes later I''m told they will go get my ATM card.

This didn't happen quickly but it did happen and I got my ATM card back.

So what did I learn never use the ATM's for Bank of Bangkok at Big C.

Always try to use an ATM where there is a functioning branch, because thay have easy access, to the machines at the branch. Doesn't mean you won't have problems, but it mihgt be an easier fix.

I felt sorry for the workers at the branch, they would have if they could have helped me immediately, but they would have been fired if they had. They caught heck from me, it was the only way I was going to get anything done.

I will probably look for a new Bank after I renew my annual just to confusung to make the change now I would end up with two letters to prove my deposits for the year. So with only a few months to go it is not worth it at the moment.

This is really the first major problem I have had with the bank. But one other aspect is bothering me when we financed our home Bank Of Bangkok wanted 50% down, this is with a three year track record of million in deposits. Even spoke to the manager who know me, he told me that even if he approaved Bangkok would not approve it. Financed the home with SCB 30% down. So maybe SCB would like to have my acount moer the Bank of Bangkok, worth finding out.

I do know one thing I don't enjoy arguing with people who are holding and using my money, when it's time for them to do something as trivil as this was.

So I hope I get lucky and machines stop eating my card

[lopburi3]

You have obviously had very bad luck. I have been using BBL atm's for the last ten years at least weekly and have never had any problem. But this is Bangkok. Guess maybe the electric power up there may cause more malfunctions.

I have stopped using my US cards except for point of sale as prefer using wire transfer and then a local atm card for Baht now that most US banks charge a higher foreign exchange fee.

[ray23]

You have obviously had very bad luck. I have been using BBL atm's for the last ten years at least weekly and have never had any problem. But this is Bangkok. Guess maybe the electric power up there may cause more malfunctions.

I have stopped using my US cards except for point of sale as prefer using wire transfer and then a local atm card for Baht now that most US banks charge a higher foreign exchange fee.

Yes it was definetly a bad Karma day, which can happen. Power fluctuation could have been the most recent problem although I don't think so. Computer hic hup I think. But if I ony use ATM's where there are branches operating when I can I think it will resolve the problem. Or at least gettign the card back quickly is more likely. It's not a big deal if it's Bangkok Bank card. I can still access money from that acccount. But the American card is a very big deal.

I have the account with Bangkok Bank for over three years and as long as I don't ask for service there has never been a problem. But when I do, I have always gone through the song and dance routine. Wanted to add my wife to my account, no you have you open a new account. Because of immigration documents needed, I had no desire to do that. Finally took a trip to the managers office and then a very rude lady who was the only one in the branch who spoke english to get it done. I got it done exactly the way I requested. You know the one that couldn't be done, so we could a credit for a new account.

Frankly I think this is a very bad way to do business. The policy seems to be with farrangs put your money in here, then go away and don't bother us.

I'm not putting the Bank down maybe this is just how things are done here, I have no idea, not having a different bank account then this one, in country I have nothing to judge it against.

To be honest I think I have always like smaller banks, simply because they seem to be moe service and cutomre friendly. Thats a safe bet in the states a they are federally insured in amounts beyond what I will be depositing, don't know about here.

[samran]

As you state, within any organisation there is only a handful of people that are actually allowed to make a decision. Everyone below them defers to them, and can't do anything until the paperwork is sorted.

Shame really, as most bank workers in my experience are really great.

Just as a point of comparison, if it helps, Thai banks are a billion times better than British Banks.

[Heng]

No issues with Bangkok Bank atms using about 3-4 different US bank atms and 2 Nevis bank atms for the last 7 years. I try to only use main branch (not subbranch) atms (where I'm sure no one could set up a card cloner on the machine for one thing), where the machines and their ups's should be better maintained.

Sounds like quite hassle though. Probably would have just let my bank send me another one to my Texas address. One phone call, no irritation required.

[ray23]

No issues with Bangkok Bank atms using about 3-4 different US bank atms and 2 Nevis bank atms for the last 7 years. I try to only use main branch (not subbranch) atms (where I'm sure no one could set up a card cloner on the machine for one thing), where the machines and their ups's should be better maintained.

Sounds like quite hassle though. Probably would have just let my bank send me another one to my Texas address. One phone call, no irritation required.

Yes that was the slotution, but with mailing times involved it can be a very lenghty process

[lopburi3]

I am not sure a US bank would be happy to issue a second card. Mine refused but as wife is a joint account holder issued one in her name when I was using US cards here and wanted to be sure to have a spare.

We have had experience with about 5 banks here and none are really what I would call customer friendly. From the 50 steps you have to climb to get into the lobby to the automatic "no can do" attitude to anything out of the ordinary. I do not believe it is a farang thing (except for the language problems) as they will ignore Thai and watch there TV rather than serve the customer more often than not. It has never been a highly competitive business and they have all provided about the same service. One thing I will say for Bangkok Bank is that the staff are usually busy. Others can have no customers but still try to ignore you.

[Martin]

I had had nearly ten years of living 'up-country' and got used to everybody in the local branch being personally welcoming and in the city main bank being very helpful.

Then I went to work in Bangkok for six months and found what a (comparatively) miserable lot they are down there.

I came to the conclusion that it results from the more crappy, stressful life they have in the big city.

I say 'comparatively', because the Bangkokians were still far, far more relaxed and nicer to deal with than most people in a British bank.

The British banks seem to be horrible employers to work for now, and it is taking its toll on the employees, and the service that the customer gets.

[Mighty Mouse]

Ray, I may be wrong, but from reading your post I got the impression that you were rather agressive with those to whom you spoke on the phone.

It would seem that the people who did speak with you didn't have the authority to issue instructions for the ATM to be opened and your card returned.

I'm not a banking expert (and I'll be guided by those who are) but surely there would be a standard procedure in place for establishing the identity of the card owner before handing it over to someone claiming to be the owner.

Again, it seems that only the 'manager' had the authority and he was unavailable because of his attendance at a meeting. Your demands for your card's immediate return seemed unreasonable.

The big question in my mind is 'Why did the machine eat your card?' Was it because of an error that you made in keying in your PIN number?

You state that this has happened to you on a number of occasions in the past so why do you continue to use ATM's in Thailand if they are faulty? Perhaps the fault lies with you.

Anybody who has ever walked into a bank in Thailand will know just how busy they are. For someone to phone a busy branch and demand that the manager drop everything to help them immediately, really needs a reality check.

I hope that I haven't mis-understood you but I suggest that you initiate plan "B" as an alternative way of obtaining your money from Thai banking institutes.

[GuestHouse]

When my UK ATM card was 'swallowed' by a machine at the Kasikorn Bank, I asked for it to be returned, they told me that bank regulations do not allow this and that it must be returned to the UK issuing bank.

I got a receipt, faxed the receipt to my UK bank and received a replacement card within the week.

No strutting around the bank upsetting the staff, no demanding hassle. Simple good manners and following procedure.

There is more to Karma that what happens to you.

[ray23]

When my UK ATM card was 'swallowed' by a machine at the Kasikorn Bank, I asked for it to be returned, they told me that bank regulations do not allow this and that it must be returned to the UK issuing bank.

I got a receipt, faxed the receipt to my UK bank and received a replacement card within the week.

No strutting around the bank upsetting the staff, no demanding hassle. Simple good manners and following procedure.

There is more to Karma that what happens to you.

Well you both have valid points, but you would also have been waiting till Tuesday for the card. As you put it there was no strutting around until nothing else worked, I didn't come to Thailand yesterday. According to the managers in bangkok, the manager at the local branch was supposed to leave someone in charge he didn't. If I had been directed to a person in charge I would have waited patiently for him or her to reslove the matter.

As to clearance from the bank you are correct, if it a visa or M/c on it. Mine is a simple debit card and that is not required.

Once the decesion was made I sat gracefully for three hours until I recieved the card.

I live here I'm not a tourist, I know how to conduct myself and always look for a Mia Bpen Lia way to handle things, I wasn't given one.

I don't know who is right or wrong and agree that you have valid points but I had the card within four hours not five days.

It's easy to second guess things and a another to handle them.

I will seek a bank that I can develop a personal reltionship with and transfer the funds.

In the interim I have agood idea of how to avoid the problem in the future and I will. I don't like arguing and fighting even when I win

[Sophon]

When my UK ATM card was 'swallowed' by a machine at the Kasikorn Bank, I asked for it to be returned, they told me that bank regulations do not allow this and that it must be returned to the UK issuing bank.

I got a receipt, faxed the receipt to my UK bank and received a replacement card within the week.

No strutting around the bank upsetting the staff, no demanding hassle. Simple good manners and following procedure.

There is more to Karma that what happens to you.

That is quite true. The card is not "your property" it's the property of the issuing bank. If the bank has been "swallowed" on the request of the issuing bank (e.g. because of wrongly entered PIN code), the card has to be returned to the issuing bank.

However, it sounds like the OP's card was swallowed because of a local technical error. In that case it would be OK to give the card back to the card holder. You would need the help of the people working at the bank for this, but that means that someone would have to go "beyond the call of duty", so if were in the position I would make a point out of being very polite. If I were on the other side of the equation, I would definitely not feel helpful if someone were being abusive and would probably stick to the company line of "can not do".

Sophon

[ray23]

When my UK ATM card was 'swallowed' by a machine at the Kasikorn Bank, I asked for it to be returned, they told me that bank regulations do not allow this and that it must be returned to the UK issuing bank.

I got a receipt, faxed the receipt to my UK bank and received a replacement card within the week.

No strutting around the bank upsetting the staff, no demanding hassle. Simple good manners and following procedure.

There is more to Karma that what happens to you.

That is quite true. The card is not "your property" it's the property of the issuing bank. If the bank has been "swallowed" on the request of the issuing bank (e.g. because of wrongly entered PIN code), the card has to be returned to the issuing bank.

However, it sounds like the OP's card was swallowed because of a local technical error. In that case it would be OK to give the card back to the card holder. You would need the help of the people working at the bank for this, but that means that someone would have to go "beyond the call of duty", so if were in the position I would make a point out of being very polite. If I were on the other side of the equation, I would definitely not feel helpful if someone were being abusive and would probably stick to the company line of "can not do".

Sophon

Your very right Sophoon and when polite doesn't work?

[Heng]

I don't like arguing and fighting even when I win.

What did you win?

[ray23]

I have my ATM card

[Sophon]

When my UK ATM card was 'swallowed' by a machine at the Kasikorn Bank, I asked for it to be returned, they told me that bank regulations do not allow this and that it must be returned to the UK issuing bank.

I got a receipt, faxed the receipt to my UK bank and received a replacement card within the week.

No strutting around the bank upsetting the staff, no demanding hassle. Simple good manners and following procedure.

There is more to Karma that what happens to you.

That is quite true. The card is not "your property" it's the property of the issuing bank. If the bank has been "swallowed" on the request of the issuing bank (e.g. because of wrongly entered PIN code), the card has to be returned to the issuing bank.

However, it sounds like the OP's card was swallowed because of a local technical error. In that case it would be OK to give the card back to the card holder. You would need the help of the people working at the bank for this, but that means that someone would have to go "beyond the call of duty", so if were in the position I would make a point out of being very polite. If I were on the other side of the equation, I would definitely not feel helpful if someone were being abusive and would probably stick to the company line of "can not do".

Sophon

Your very right Sophoon and when polite doesn't work?

Then accept it and get your bank/credit company back home to send you a new card.

The bank employees have some rules to follow, and there are reasons for (at least some of) these rules. For instance there are security implications conncted to opening the ATM and extract your card during normal opening hours (the cash will be exposed).

Since the incident you described appearantly happened because of a power or system failure, you might be able to persuade them, that their bank was at least partially resposible for the card being swallowed, and that it would be fair if they did what they could to get it back to you. A compromise could be that they extracted it over night, and that you could come get it the next day. Being abusive (I don't know if you were or not, only you know that) would ensure that I for one would certainly not help someone to get their card back, if I were working at the bank.

Sophon

[Heng]

At the expense of your own health though. Sounds like your blood pressure and perhaps stress levels may have gone up through that kind of ordeal, unless I'm misreading your post and you went about it in a Cool Cat Stevens sort of way. Health at the expense of a piece of plastic which you would have gotten back anyway doesn't sound like a win to me.

[englishoak]

just get another account with a seconed card .................. backup

[samran]

just get another account with a seconed card .................. backup

and have them linked via internet banking, so you can shuffle money between the two.

[ray23]

just get another account with a seconed card .................. backup

and have them linked via internet banking, so you can shuffle money between the two.

Yes strees levels were high not over a piece of plastics, no access to fund, without high fees involved for three months yes that is stressful. Having had to repalce a ATM card from the states, took me just abouth that long the last tiem. Not a good thing.

What did do worng lets see I placed my card into an ATM machine and it went off line. I had this happen at another branch operation before and was met with come back on Tuesday explained that it was an American ATM card and was handed it in ten minutes, so I knew it could be done. Where everything went wrong was the Branch Manager was in a meeting in another town. He failed to follow bank proceedures and appoint someone to make minor decesions in matters such a these. My fault maybe I don't really see it that way and never will.

I was very careful not to blame anyone is the branch about the problem but I expressed my anger at the bank and told the employees just that. They understood my frustration and really wanted to help. Once the Ok was given at least six people volunteered to go get the card. I had three who congradulated me for calling Bangkok. Something tells me this was not the most popular manager around.

I would say off hand that I have exibited very poor writing skills based on the reponses. Now that is my fault.

There are times in life when you are wrong and you should humbly accept what is coming there are other times that you are right and you need to stand up for yourself. In Thailand or any where else.