Falkland Islanders Vote To Remain British

[transam]

Again:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17045169

Both sides have some good arguments, he says, and if it ever went to court, it is far from clear who would win.

"International law does not overwhelmingly favour either Argentina or the UK

Thus, in such a scenario NEGOTIATION is the most civilized and FAIR solution.

And talk about what ?

[Jingthing]

Peaceful transition to Argentinian ownership along with residency rights and generous compensation for all current residents, natch.

Maybe it could be a slow 50 year plan along with Argentine cooperation and shared ownership of natural resources in the meantime.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Jingthing

[transam]

Peaceful transition to Argentinian ownership along with residency rights and generous compensation for all current residents, natch.

Maybe it could be a slow 50 year plan along with Argentine cooperation and shared ownership of natural resources in the meantime.

And why should Brit folk want to do that. ?

If the Indians where you come from offered you terms to bugger off, what would you or your ''countrymen'' say ?

[7by7]

Peaceful transition to Argentinian ownership along with residency rights and generous compensation for all current residents, natch.

Maybe it could be a slow 50 year plan along with Argentine cooperation and shared ownership of natural resources in the meantime.

So by 'negotiation' what you really mean is give Argentina everything it wants whilst at the same time depriving the islanders of their democratic right to self determination.

How is that negotiation?

How can anyone who cares anything about democracy have any truck with that?

[Morakot]

The good thing about this referendum is that we now have certainty of the ratio of trolls in a given population: i.e. 3 to 2,841.

[chuckd]

Not all Yanks feel the Falklands should go to Argentina.

I, for one, believe the self determination vote counts and is of paramount importance..

To some of the earlier posters, I would say the American Indians have nothing to do with this topic.

[jamhar]

Again:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17045169

Both sides have some good arguments, he says, and if it ever went to court, it is far from clear who would win.

"International law does not overwhelmingly favour either Argentina or the UK

Thus, in such a scenario NEGOTIATION is the most civilized and FAIR solution.

JT, I don't see where negotiations plays a part in this.

Negotiations occur where to parties want a similar goal, just need to come to a agreement on terms.

In this case, The Brits are on the islands, and do not want to give it away.

The A's want it and tried to take it by force but were rebuffed.

Where does negotiations start? How would you recommending a starting position? Negotiate what?

A's: We want the Islands

B's: No.

Am i missing something?

From the little i know of the situation. and i admit its VERY little.

The As have 3 options

1) Get the international community to convince B's to give the islands to A's

2) Convince the inhabitants to vote to join the A's

3)Take it by force.

They tried #3 and failed

They are trying #1 now

IMO, #2 would be the easiest to do. Offer to buy the islands from the voting inhabitants. Or maybe offer the voting inhabitants a fraction of all the natural resource potential. Just thinking out of the box here. but it seems to me that the inhabitants are the most likely potential for a quick resolution. Instead, the A's announced that they didn't care about the wishes of the islanders. Good luck trying to win the trust of the islanders going forward.

The Announcement from the A's regarding the inhabitants of the islands is what convinced me that the A's were not really interested in a quick resolution. How do you not take in the wishes of people who have been on the island for 9 generations?

The A's have one main advantage. proximity. and with that they can run an endurance campaign. that may work But it will take a lot of time, And if i remember correctly, the brits can be damned stubborn (and i mean that that in the best possible way ). So good luck with that strategy.

[jamhar]

It was a typically British shambles - and no we couldn't do it again. We have no Vulcans or Victors left. We also have no merchant fleet left to commandeer.

"This gripping film tells the humorous yet heroic story of how a crumbling, Cold-War era Vulcan flew the then longest range bombing mission in history and how a WW2 vintage bomb changed the outcome of the Falklands War. On 30th April 1982, the RAF launched a secret mission; to bomb Port Stanley's runway, putting it out of action for Argentine fighter jets. The safety of the British Task Force depended on its success. But the RAF could only get a single Vulcan 8,000 miles south to the Falklands as just one bomber needed an aerial fleet of thirteen Victor tanker planes to refuel it throughout the 16 hour round-trip. From start to finish, the seemingly impossible mission was a comedy of errors, held together by sheer British pluck and ingenuity. On the brink of being scrapped, only three of the ageing nuclear bombers could be fitted out for war, one to fly the mission and two in reserve..."[/size]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTDYcuoOKkM

Thanks for the vid. super low data rate here so had to DL it first lol. I remember seeing the Vulcan in the Bond movie "thunderball" (one of my favorite movies of all time, if nothing else, for the bond girl "Domino" ). I thought then it was the prettiest plane ever. Shame to see it retired. Hopefully someone kept a few flying somewhere.

Back on point, Given the history of the Brits in combat, I'm surprised that the junta actually attempted to take the islands by force back then. Hopefully they have learned their lesson and wont try that again.

Edited March 14, 2013 by jamhar

[transam]

It was a typically British shambles - and no we couldn't do it again. We have no Vulcans or Victors left. We also have no merchant fleet left to commandeer.

"This gripping film tells the humorous yet heroic story of how a crumbling, Cold-War era Vulcan flew the then longest range bombing mission in history and how a WW2 vintage bomb changed the outcome of the Falklands War. On 30th April 1982, the RAF launched a secret mission; to bomb Port Stanley's runway, putting it out of action for Argentine fighter jets. The safety of the British Task Force depended on its success. But the RAF could only get a single Vulcan 8,000 miles south to the Falklands as just one bomber needed an aerial fleet of thirteen Victor tanker planes to refuel it throughout the 16 hour round-trip. From start to finish, the seemingly impossible mission was a comedy of errors, held together by sheer British pluck and ingenuity. On the brink of being scrapped, only three of the ageing nuclear bombers could be fitted out for war, one to fly the mission and two in reserve..."[/size]

Thanks for the vid. super low data rate here so had to DL it first lol. I remember seeing the Vulcan in the Bond movie "thunderball" (one of my favorite movies of all time, if nothing else, for the bond girl "Domino" ). I thought then it was the prettiest plane ever. Shame to see it retired. Hopefully someone kept a few flying somewhere.

Back on point, Given the history of the Brits in combat, I'm surprised that the junta actually attempted to take the islands by force back then. Hopefully they have learned their lesson and wont try that again.

It was a foolish decision by those who would not face a gun. a foolish decision by those who do not understand the Brits. End of story.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Scott

[Mosha]

OT but we were fishing near York. This loud roar started. Then this Vulcan just seemed to appear from the earth almost climbing vertically. Awesome sight.

[RabC]

So the new Pope has already said his bit about the Falklands before his appointment. I wonder now he is Gods Rep on Earth if his diplomacy will improve?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/9928855/Pope-Francis-branded-Britain-usurpers-over-Falklands-conflict.html

Also the UK has a tradition of ignoring Popes (Henry VIII)

Edited March 14, 2013 by RabC

[laislica]

e might have a problem there, if the argies did invade again we wont have aircover, without aircover we would get hammered. Too many fighting men are involved in wars we cant win, that idiot in number 10 has practically neutered the military and i think we would seriously struggle to retake the islands now. Absolutely no offense to the military but their ability to do anything is now very limited.

It's only a matter of time. Look at a map.

And if they invade again so will we kick their ass again its been British for 180+ years almost as long as America has been America

Quite right.

Have a read at Vulcan 603, a blow by blow of how "the" Vulcan got to Stanley and managed to bomb the airfield.

It was pure luck, nothing else and it could not be done again.

The book is a super read and when I read it I really couldn't put it down.

Haven't you lot ever heard of RAF Mount Pleasant?

Nope, I hadn't heard of it.

Thanks for the update.

[chooka]

Don't get your panties in a twist. Brazil is on Argentina's side and Brazil is a rapidly emerging superpower. I don't believe in the LONG RUN those islands will remain British. Could be 100 years though so it's a safe prediction. (We won't know.)

If Messi and Tevez can be persuaded to play for England then we will give them back the Falklands

who and what do Play?

[bigbamboo]

e might have a problem there, if the argies did invade again we wont have aircover, without aircover we would get hammered. Too many fighting men are involved in wars we cant win, that idiot in number 10 has practically neutered the military and i think we would seriously struggle to retake the islands now. Absolutely no offense to the military but their ability to do anything is now very limited.

It's only a matter of time. Look at a map.

And if they invade again so will we kick their ass again its been British for 180+ years almost as long as America has been America

Quite right.

Have a read at Vulcan 603, a blow by blow of how "the" Vulcan got to Stanley and managed to bomb the airfield.

It was pure luck, nothing else and it could not be done again.

The book is a super read and when I read it I really couldn't put it down.

Haven't you lot ever heard of RAF Mount Pleasant?

Nope, I hadn't heard of it.

Thanks for the update.

Mount Pleasant is the RAF air base and (I kid you not) where the catholics go to celebrate mass.

[endure]

the ss canberra, the same ship that bought a little pommie family to australia, used for a noble purpose at that time of need.

The Canberra cruises where the QE2 refuses

[Jingthing]

So the new Pope has already said his bit about the Falklands before his appointment. I wonder now he is Gods Rep on Earth if his diplomacy will improve?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/9928855/Pope-Francis-branded-Britain-usurpers-over-Falklands-conflict.html

Also the UK has a tradition of ignoring Popes (Henry VIII)

Oh, please what do you expect from an Argentinian? They mostly feel that way.

[RabC]

the ss canberra, the same ship that bought a little pommie family to australia, used for a noble purpose at that time of need.

The Canberra cruises where the QE2 refuses

Politically loosing the QEII would have been like loosing a capital ship and the reasoning behind keeping her out of San Carlos Water is fully justified.

[transam]

So the new Pope has already said his bit about the Falklands before his appointment. I wonder now he is Gods Rep on Earth if his diplomacy will improve?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/9928855/Pope-Francis-branded-Britain-usurpers-over-Falklands-conflict.html

Also the UK has a tradition of ignoring Popes (Henry VIII)

Oh, please what do you expect from an Argentinian? They mostly feel that way.

Any religious bloke will have noooooooooooooooooo effect what so ever regarding the Falklands. In fact they can sign this old fellow up to do my stuff.

[7by7]

So the new Pope has already said his bit about the Falklands before his appointment. I wonder now he is Gods Rep on Earth if his diplomacy will improve?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/the-pope/9928855/Pope-Francis-branded-Britain-usurpers-over-Falklands-conflict.html

Also the UK has a tradition of ignoring Popes (Henry VIII)

Oh, please what do you expect from an Argentinian? They mostly feel that way.

Doesn't make them right, though.

Given that the Argentinians like ignore the results of votes, will they refuse to recognise the new pope?

Or is it only votes that go against them they choose to ignore?

[laislica]

It was a typically British shambles - and no we couldn't do it again. We have no Vulcans or Victors left. We also have no merchant fleet left to commandeer.

"This gripping film tells the humorous yet heroic story of how a crumbling, Cold-War era Vulcan flew the then longest range bombing mission in history and how a WW2 vintage bomb changed the outcome of the Falklands War. On 30th April 1982, the RAF launched a secret mission; to bomb Port Stanley's runway, putting it out of action for Argentine fighter jets. The safety of the British Task Force depended on its success. But the RAF could only get a single Vulcan 8,000 miles south to the Falklands as just one bomber needed an aerial fleet of thirteen Victor tanker planes to refuel it throughout the 16 hour round-trip. From start to finish, the seemingly impossible mission was a comedy of errors, held together by sheer British pluck and ingenuity. On the brink of being scrapped, only three of the ageing nuclear bombers could be fitted out for war, one to fly the mission and two in reserve..."

Super video thanks, the book was better even though this video was fantastic

Edited March 14, 2013 by Scott

[chooka]

Argentina can have Tasmania if they want we aren't using it and they don't even have a footy team in the National competition. The inhabitants are a little inbred but I am sure the argies can find some use for them.

[Mosha]

The new pope should stick to finding out what happened to the priests who disappeared in Argentina.

[cdnvic]

I think the Argies should bribe the islanders with wine. They are making superb Malbecs and Torrontés these days.

[endure]

the ss canberra, the same ship that bought a little pommie family to australia, used for a noble purpose at that time of need.

The Canberra cruises where the QE2 refuses

Politically loosing the QEII would have been like loosing a capital ship and the reasoning behind keeping her out of San Carlos Water is fully justified.

I was sailing with P&O at the time and had a friend who was an RO on the Canberra. I also had another friend on one of the BP tankers that were down there but which never seem to get mentioned.

[transam]

I think the Argies should bribe the islanders with wine. They are making superb Malbecs and Torrontés these days.

Naaaaaaaaaaaaaah, never work, now a good strong bitter beer might sway things, but when we have sobered up

[Chicog]

Y'all would be crowing if Pope Francis was for the islands being British ...

We do have a history of paying some attention to transvestites, but that's normally in Panto season.

[RabC]

the ss canberra, the same ship that bought a little pommie family to australia, used for a noble purpose at that time of need.

The Canberra cruises where the QE2 refuses

Politically loosing the QEII would have been like loosing a capital ship and the reasoning behind keeping her out of San Carlos Water is fully justified.

I was sailing with P&O at the time and had a friend who was an RO on the Canberra. I also had another friend on one of the BP tankers that were down there but which never seem to get mentioned.

I am ex RN so fully appreciate all the merchant that were involved in the conflict both RFA and full Merchant Navy. Tankers to cruise liners, ferries to container ships.

[kevin2008]

Very emotive issue, considering the number of pages....the Brits will eventually sell them out, irrespective of their wishes and it will be done behind closed doors for the sake of political convenience or whatever. Thats the reality. I suppose they will have to wait first for Maggie to kick the bucket.

Edited March 14, 2013 by kevin2008

[Mosha]

Very emotive issue, considering the number of pages....the Brits will eventually sell them out, irrespective of their wishes and it will be done behind closed doors for the sake of political convenience or whatever. Thats the reality. I suppose they will have to wait first for Maggie to kick the bucket.

Maggie was the last British PM to have balls. Ronald (The President's Brain is missing) Reagan asked her to go to the UN. She told him to mind his own business. I wish the PMs after had also been less enamoured of the USA.

Edited March 14, 2013 by Mosha

[transam]

Very emotive issue, considering the number of pages....the Brits will eventually sell them out, irrespective of their wishes and it will be done behind closed doors for the sake of political convenience or whatever. Thats the reality. I suppose they will have to wait first for Maggie to kick the bucket.

Crap.