Problems With New Drive Shaft

[Khonwan]

Thanks again for your input, guys. All good ideas but as Arthur says, coil spring problems must surely also show up whilst driving in 2-wheel drive. I’ve just taken it for some more tight turns around my house (rough dirt tracks). The problem is now much worse (already!). By alternatively sitting in the passenger seat and driver seat with my wife, plus walking/running alongside whilst she was driving, we determined that the sound is coming from the front right hand side. It is now obvious whether turning right or left and in both forward and reverse motion. It ONLY happens in 4-wheel drive. Also now occasionally hearing 2-3 clunks driving out of a turn.

Cv joint?

WarpSpeed, the shop does have a fully computerised wheel alignment centre – I’ve used it a couple of times many years ago. I wasn’t present during the repair so can’t say whether they did use this facility this time but I assume perhaps that they did not. I’ll follow up on this.

Hi Lickey – the clunking was experienced two days BEFORE the steering rack was changed (after Toyota said it needed to be changed).

As I understand it, the leak was at the steering rack itself, which necessitated its replacement…apparently.

[Khonwan]

Arthur, just to clarify: I have two separate issues. The alignment issue refers to the apparent lack of stability experienced after the steering rack replacement (similar to that which I have experienced when numpties have inflated my tyres to between 65 and 75psi without using a gauge). The second and, I believe rightly or wrongly, separate issue is the clunking which has been experienced just before and since the rack was changed.

[transam]

What puzzles me is the drive shafts are turning even in 2x4, which means the joints in the hubs are still working, though not under drive power. I think it's internal hardware.

Probably be wrong again .

[Khonwan]

By the way, just remembered another useful piece of info: I pointed out the cv boots to the mechanic when the truck was jacked up (since I believed this to be the problem) but he said the boots looked in good condition (and they do).

[Khonwan]

Yes, I understand your point, Transam. Hmmmm!

[WarpSpeed]

What puzzles me is the drive shafts are turning even in 2x4, which means the joints in the hubs are still working, though not under drive power. I think it's internal hardware.

Probably be wrong again .

Nope, that's the purpose of the transfer case it disengages the drive of the axles then they only "float" so not being under load they are not likely to click when at full lock if in 2WD.

That issue is more and more sounding like a CV but I still would not discount the upper front bearings or bushings on the shock towers or even spring seats as load driving in 4X4 mode is still going to make more noise in those cases then 2WD mode (wheels pulling VS being pushed).. It is also possible that the reason for increasing noise is due to it being displaced during the repair and or damaged more then it was prior and now it's getting more damaged so making more noise.

Edited March 15, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[Khonwan]

Thanks for this clarification, WarpSpeed. I'll have all these points examined by the mechanic, probably tomorrow. As an additional piece of info, I just tried it in 4wd slow, minutes ago, and still got the clunking as expected. So clunking in 4wd normal and low, but no clunking in 2wd.

[transam]

OK, another theory

The front axle has a limited slip diff, the same as the rear BUT there are various types of LSD, Clutch (Which l think is in the rear), cone and Locker. Locker was used by Ford for us serious drag race folk and other stuff, l never worked on one but it is very effective but very crude. Metal ''lobes'' would slip into slots totally locking stuff so you never had one wheel spin on launch in a straight line, BUT, if you were in a tight turn these lobes would come out of the slots and locate in the next one making an audible ''clonk' or multiple clonks during the maneuver.

Soooo, when Toyota say do not use 4x4 on dry blacktop it really points to a Locker type design and NOT clutch. My thoughts are that on full steering lock you are getting the Locker design noise. Perhaps whatever keeps the locker ''locked'' has weakened off a tad, in which case you have nothing to worry about and as you do not have any other noise it to points towards my theory.

Think Spoonman knows more of this Locker design than me and will let us know.

[Jitar]

Toyota say not to use 4WD on grippy surfaces to avoid windup between front and rear axles so it does suggest a LSD. All part time 4WD systems have this limitation. I don't think Vigo's have an LSD at the front but could be wrong.

WarpSpeed's suggestion about worn suspension bushes is worth a check. When the truck is in 4WD the load on the front wishbone change back and forth so a bit of wear from rough roads can make a clunking noise as well as upset the front end alignment.

[Kwasaki]

My Vigo ( or the wife's I should say ) made a knocking noise when 4x4 was engaged on pavement as said they are a part-time system, I would still use it on pavement but would dis-engage when coming to a stop to make tighter turns.

Did not make a noise when sliding around in the slushy mud.

Get all the things suggested checked out, my guess is wheel alignment if your tyres are at the 29 psi.

Hope you come back with update.

Edited March 15, 2013 by Kwasaki

[Khonwan]

Kwasaki, from day 1 there always was a slight noise and obvious resistance when doing a U-turn on dry surfaced roads, where I had forgoten to disengage 4wd, but this clunking is not that. It sounds like something is going to come apart. I also have a 1yo 4x4 Pajero Sport but this has never shown any resistance or noise whilst U-turning on dry surfaced roads.

I will let you all know what the mechanic says. Still very happy to read any further ideas in the meantime.

Edit: I keep my front tyres at 30 (they squeal at 29) and back tyres at 30-45 depending on load.

Edited March 15, 2013 by Khonwan

[Kwasaki]

Kwasaki, from day 1 there always was a slight noise and obvious resistance when doing a U-turn on dry surfaced roads, where I had forgoten to disengage 4wd, but this clunking is not that. It sounds like something is going to come apart. I also have a 1yo 4x4 Pajero Sport but this has never shown any resistance or noise whilst U-turning on dry surfaced roads.

I will let you all know what the mechanic says. Still very happy to read any further ideas in the meantime.

Edit: I keep my front tyres at 30 (they squeal at 29) and back tyres at 30-45 depending on load.

Well !! let us know, as said so many things it could be, from a collaped front wheel bearing to your mechanic guy not tightening the wheel nuts before going to lunch.

[Jitar]

The Pajero Sport has a constant or full time 4WD system with center diff so you can drive in 4WD (4H) on any surface.

That is why there is no noise when turning sharp. The center diff locks in 4HL and low range so these should be used only on loose or slippery surfaces.

Fortuner is similar and also has a center diff but the Vigo is part time 4WD with no center diff.

[transam]

I still think l am on the right track.

[Khonwan]

Jitar, unless I’m misunderstanding something (highly possible given my track record on this thread!), Fortuna is constant 4x4 but Pajero is not: my Pajero has a 4L, 4H, and 2H selector similar to my Vigo.

[Jitar]

The terminology and some subtleties varies with different brands but constant, full time, all wheel drive etc are effectively similar. The important thing is a center diff distributes torque between front and rear axles and allows for different axle speeds on a hard surface. This makes the 4WD system useful on normal roads as well as off road.

The Pajero Super Select system is unusual in that it allows 2WD or constant 4WD. With the 4WD lever in 4H, the drive goes to both front and rear axles via the center differential in the transfer case. This is similar to a Fortuner or later model Land Rovers except they do not have a 2WD option. The 4L position locks the center diff for off road work so the drive is similar to a part time 4WD like the Vigo.

The Pajero or the Fortuner drive very nicely in 4WD on the highway, especially if it is a bit wet.

[Khonwan]

Thanks for that explanation, Jitar. I must admit that I'm very fond of the Pajero. I normally select 4H on wet surfaced roads, and dry or wet dirt/grit/laterite roads/tracks. It is very rare that I'm required to use 4L but it does happen on the farm sometimes. I select 2H otherwise as I believe it to consume less fuel.

[Jitar]

No worries. Personally I doubt 2WD saves much fuel, I checked my PJS fuel consumption for a few tanks of highway driving in 2WD and 4H and could not get a clear difference, but who knows.

If you switch between 2H and 4H on a hard grippy surface, it is a good idea to checking the indicator light for the front axle has changed to the correct status before doing and sharp turns.

[Ace of Pop]

Kwasaki, from day 1 there always was a slight noise and obvious resistance when doing a U-turn on dry surfaced roads, where I had forgoten to disengage 4wd, but this clunking is not that. It sounds like something is going to come apart. I also have a 1yo 4x4 Pajero Sport but this has never shown any resistance or noise whilst U-turning on dry surfaced roads.

I will let you all know what the mechanic says. Still very happy to read any further ideas in the meantime.

Edit: I keep my front tyres at 30 (they squeal at 29) and back tyres at 30-45 depending on load.

29 or 30 makes a diiference.? Best one Yet.

[Khonwan]

^ Yes!

[transam]

My Vigo 4x4, 30 rear, 32 front. NEVER had a squeal unless on tiles.

[Ace of Pop]

^ Yes!

. I love You, more perception than Lewis Hamilton, Mercedes needs You.

[Ace of Pop]

My Vigo 4x4, 30 rear, 32 front. NEVER had a squeal unless on tiles.

I cant get my Car in the Shower. So cant comment.

[transam]

My Vigo 4x4, 30 rear, 32 front. NEVER had a squeal unless on tiles.

I cant get my Car in the Shower. So cant comment.

Hey, we DON'T want to know about your stuff with your truck. This is a family forum. ...

[Woodsie888]

My Vigo 4x4, 30 rear, 32 front. NEVER had a squeal unless on tiles.

I cant get my Car in the Shower. So cant comment.

You are very funny and make me laugh

Edited March 15, 2013 by Woodsie888

[WarpSpeed]

OK, another theory

The front axle has a limited slip diff, the same as the rear BUT there are various types of LSD, Clutch (Which l think is in the rear), cone and Locker. Locker was used by Ford for us serious drag race folk and other stuff, l never worked on one but it is very effective but very crude. Metal ''lobes'' would slip into slots totally locking stuff so you never had one wheel spin on launch in a straight line, BUT, if you were in a tight turn these lobes would come out of the slots and locate in the next one making an audible ''clonk' or multiple clonks during the maneuver.

Soooo, when Toyota say do not use 4x4 on dry blacktop it really points to a Locker type design and NOT clutch. My thoughts are that on full steering lock you are getting the Locker design noise. Perhaps whatever keeps the locker ''locked'' has weakened off a tad, in which case you have nothing to worry about and as you do not have any other noise it to points towards my theory.

Think Spoonman knows more of this Locker design than me and will let us know.

Yes, plausible, again all possible..

[WarpSpeed]

Kwasaki, from day 1 there always was a slight noise and obvious resistance when doing a U-turn on dry surfaced roads, where I had forgoten to disengage 4wd, but this clunking is not that. It sounds like something is going to come apart. I also have a 1yo 4x4 Pajero Sport but this has never shown any resistance or noise whilst U-turning on dry surfaced roads.

I will let you all know what the mechanic says. Still very happy to read any further ideas in the meantime.

Edit: I keep my front tyres at 30 (they squeal at 29) and back tyres at 30-45 depending on load.

29 or 30 makes a diiference.? Best one Yet.

Not going to go off on another topic here AGAIN, but since your poking at the OP I've got his back against those less informed as yes it seriously does.. Especially with large wide tires and high sidewalls..

Edited March 15, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[BSJ]

I've got Bridgy's fitted to my pick-up and never run them at less than 35psi. 29 or 30 is a bit low.

[WarpSpeed]

I've got Bridgy's fitted to my pick-up and never run them at less than 35psi. 29 or 30 is a bit low.

Oh! You started it now ...For the record I agree.

Edited March 15, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[transam]

I've got Bridgy's fitted to my pick-up and never run them at less than 35psi. 29 or 30 is a bit low.

Oh! You started it now ...For the record I agree.

So Toyota (or other) with ALL their testing are wrong.