Loan Sharks

[khunPer]

khunPer, on 14 Apr 2013 - 16:10, said:

However, maximum interest rate on private loans is by law 15% pro annum. Banks and registered loan providers can charge more, around 25% p.a. or more is normal.

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While the other guy says 5% per month is allowed (APR=80), so which is it?

15% p.a. by law – ask any Thai lawyer

[Morden]

My information is that the legal maximum is 2% per month. However, the private market, taking a bigger risk than the banks for one reason or another, charges more and no-one bats an eyelid.

[khunPer]

My information is that the legal maximum is 2% per month. However, the private market, taking a bigger risk than the banks for one reason or another, charges more and no-one bats an eyelid.

2% a month is cheap, but not legal. However cheaper than many legal 28% pa Credit Card loans.

[FunFon]

>> While the other guy says 5% per month is allowed (APR=80), so which is it?

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15% p.a. by law – ask any Thai lawyer

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Well that's truly a joke then isn't it.

Edited April 15, 2013 by FunFon

[khunPer]

>> While the other guy says 5% per month is allowed (APR=80), so which is it?

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15% p.a. by law – ask any Thai lawyer

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Well that's truly a joke then isn't it.

Sorry, Not a joke.

[FunFon]

>> While the other guy says 5% per month is allowed (APR=80), so which is it?

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15% p.a. by law – ask any Thai lawyer

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Well that's truly a joke then isn't it.

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Sorry, Not a joke.

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You may have misunderstood.

I simply meant this was yet another example of a farcical Thai law, due to the huge discrepancy between it and reality.

Most likely only enforced to eliminate those criminals not paying enough corruption money to the BiB mafia.

[boone57]

If she borrowed the money and agreed to the interest, what's the big deal? She should make good on the debt. If she is your GF and not just another sausage-casing why not just square the debt and be done with it?

I just got this fantastic idea! You said 60,000B ($2000) is no big deal to you. Well it is to me and it would really help me out of a bind. You would be a hero in our family forever and many many thanks in advance. I don't even want her to know I posted about this so I am giving you my bank info Daniel Tyler, acc # 980-6-57204-1 Krung Thai Bank. Man your the greatest, thank the lord for big fish.

Sincerely

Daniel

Read The Post.

He never said Baht 60,000.- is "no big deal" - he said the girlfriend took the Loan and agreed to the interest rate, implying that it's too late to bleat now about an unfair Interest rate.

Patrick

He implied that he has has deep pockets "what's the big deal" "why not just square the dept and be done with it?". You read the post, nobody said anything about bleat about an unfair interest rate. I simply asked if it was legal,which it is not according to the replies, and if the police was a viable option. So how long have you been Dave's sausage casing?

[boone57]

Is it not possible that the girl is telling the truth, that the guy genuinely cares for her and is just looking for some advice about what the options are!

Why does everyone assume its a gambling debt and that she is up to no good and he's stupid??

Hey! stop making sense.Thank you, good post.

[Pormax]

Many Thai people borrow money either from loan sharks, family or friends, it is a way of life for them.

In my village in Isaan I would estimate that 75% or more of the households borrow money and pay monthly interest at between 2 and 5%. When the rice crop is sold (if the have rice land, some don't) the initial loan is re-paid but within a couple of months the loans are taken out again. Many also have loans from banks but use their rice land as security. In Rayong I know someone (a Thai) who borrows money at 10% then lends it to others at 15%. She is not short of takers. Very risky as far as I am concerned as she asks for nothing as security. But there again many don't have anything to offer as security.

Yes, one can critisise and say the people who charge such extortionate high interest rates are wrong, and people who pay these interest rates are stupid, but if that is what people have to pay to survive (until they win the lottery) they will keep on doing it.

Not a great way to live but as my wife told me and as shown on Thai TV just a couple of hours ago, there are gangs in Pattaya and Bangkok who charge 20% for ONE day. When I first came to Thailand some of the 'working ' ladies in Pattaya were paying their co-workers 20% a day to borrow money until they manage to get their next customer.

Unfortunately in many circunstances loans are taken out to cover gambling losses.

Why TV users have to ridicule and be so negative to the OP i don't know. We don't know the full facts and don't know him or his girlfriend or why she found it necessary to take out the loan. Her story true or not that is up to the OP to find out not for us to judge.

[boone57]

People who get involved with loan sharks are the lowest forms of life imo...that of course includes, loansharks..

I wouldn't touch them with a bargepole....

...by the way..Pakistanis? Isn't there any law in this land..or is it reserved for the farang only?

Agreed, loan sharks are the lowest of the low. Imagine charging more interest than the legal limit. "Take your stinking paws off me you damn dirty ape". As for the people who get taken advantage of, I would not agree they are the lowest lifefoms but perhapes lowest in their math class.

Thanks for your opinion.

Cheers primate

[boone57]

Let me guess...

You gf has no money and her family are sick?

Maybe need books for younger sister brothers wife's family?

Dear oh dear

Farang making himself look very silly again.

Her younger sisters brother would also be her brother. Silly I guess is an appropriate word. Whatever it's good to see a light hearded reply. Thank you and I enjoyed reading your post. Don't go changing.

Cheers

[boone57]

If she borrowed the money and agreed to the interest, what's the big deal? She should make good on the debt. If she is your GF and not just another sausage-casing why not just square the debt and be done with it?

I just got this fantastic idea! You said 60,000B ($2000) is no big deal to you. Well it is to me and it would really help me out of a bind. You would be a hero in our family forever and many many thanks in advance. I don't even want her to know I posted about this so I am giving you my bank info Daniel Tyler, acc # 980-6-57204-1 Krung Thai Bank. Man your the greatest, thank the lord for big fish.

Sincerely

Daniel

MoganDave,

Please can I also have B60,000 as I have numerous debts that require paying, I will go to the temple and make merit ion your behalf, simply send a PM for my account details.

Thanks in advance for your generosity!!!

Hey you have no right to ask that of my Dave. He never shot his mouth off over any post you made.

[Keith67]

khunPer, on 14 Apr 2013 - 16:10, said:

However, maximum interest rate on private loans is by law 15% pro annum. Banks and registered loan providers can charge more, around 25% p.a. or more is normal.

-

While the other guy says 5% per month is allowed (APR=80), so which is it?

15% p.a. by law – ask any Thai lawyer

If you take a local villiage loan agreement to the police because they are charging you 20% per anum you will probably get laughed out of the station, go to a local police station in a town or villiage out of a tourist area and ask them what the legal rate is, they will tell you B5 per B100 borrowed, trust me i've done it.

[Keith67]

Just a bit of fun Morden, don't take offense please, I did cite my "sources" previously

No problem.

I am genuinely curious about this market. Your WAG is possibly accurate enough. The bikers are into small loans to people with no valuable assets. The need to borrow THB10,000 paints the picture. That must swing the proportion of the total their way, people with assets being less numerous.

We see several bikers turn up daily to the food stalls across the road from my wife's restaurant. The borrowers aren't happy to see them. One day, an old lady there couldn't pay. A call was made and the lender turned up in an old BMW and issued threats. By next morning, the old lady had disappeared. That part of the private lending market is nasty.

Usually B10-20,000 is the initial loan but the way people get into trouble is, they make regular payments and a trust is built more money is then offered and regularly taken increasing the daily payment, this continues until non-payment is inevitable, remember these bikers only see their customers for very short periods so do not really have any idea of the financial stability of the borrower.

[boone57]

If she borrowed the money and agreed to the interest, what's the big deal? She should make good on the debt. If she is your GF and not just another sausage-casing why not just square the debt and be done with it?

I just got this fantastic idea! You said 60,000B ($2000) is no big deal to you. Well it is to me and it would really help me out of a bind. You would be a hero in our family forever and many many thanks in advance. I don't even want her to know I posted about this so I am giving you my bank info Daniel Tyler, acc # 980-6-57204-1 Krung Thai Bank. Man your the greatest, thank the lord for big fish.

Sincerely

Daniel

I'd hate to ever be in the position were 60,000 baht was a big deal. If she's a keeper tell her this is a one time only deal and pay the debt then take it out of her allowance. If you don't give her an allowance that's probably the reason you've been told this story.

Awesome! Another high roller. Two grand USD a just parking ticket to you. Like a sausage casing stuck to the bottom of your shoe. Thanks for chiming in but it's already been taken care of. Mogandave is on top of it. You two should get together if you dont already know him, talk about how you made your first million and what not. He actually has not paid yet because he propably doesn't want to get wet walking to the ATM. He may be talking out his ass cause his mouth knows better but I don't think so. He has over one thousands posts at this forum and I am sure his reputation is worth more than ditching on a parking ticket. Again many thanks.

[FunFon]

2% monthly comes to 27% APR if principle isn't paid down.

So it seems the 5% monthly/80% APR figure is the "de facto" limit, below which isn't actually prosecuted in practice even though it's in theory illegal.

[Keith67]

2% monthly comes to 27% APR if principle isn't paid down.

So it seems the 5% monthly/80% APR figure is the "de facto" limit, below which isn't actually prosecuted in practice even though it's in theory illegal.

These loans are not your run of the mill bank loans, the monthly or weekly payments do not incude any reduction in the amount borrowed, you borrow B10,000 pay B500 per month for 5 years the amount you now owe is B10,000.

Edited April 15, 2013 by Keith67

[FunFon]

These loans are not your run of the mill bank loans, the monthly or weekly payments do not incude any reduction in the amount borrowed, you borrow B10,000 pay B500 per month for 5 years the amount you now owe is B10,000.

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Yes, I stated that the calculation assumed no reduction in principle.

For simple (not compounded) interest then of course the conversion is just X 12 months.

2% -> 24% APR

5% -> 60% APR

Edited April 15, 2013 by FunFon

[boone57]

DLock, on 12 Apr 2013 - 15:59, said:

5% per month is not unusual.

Extortionate, but not unusual.

Don't get involved. This is very normal for Thai's...and don't even consider paying it back on her behalf.

Pay it back on her behalf if you want - why not?

We only know a fraction of the story, so saying pay it off or not pay it off is irrelevant.

The OP has disappeared so I guess we will never know.

But giving Thai's the easy way out is like giving them approval to do it again. They don't learn.

Sorry to disappear, I just have so many irons in the fire right now. I already have Mogandave paying it for me. He is a super cool guy and I don't want to waist my friends money so please tell me why I should not just pay the dept and be done with it? I really appreciate your posts, especially when you guys don't even know me.

[Keith67]

DLock, on 12 Apr 2013 - 15:59, said:

5% per month is not unusual.

Extortionate, but not unusual.

Don't get involved. This is very normal for Thai's...and don't even consider paying it back on her behalf.

Pay it back on her behalf if you want - why not?

We only know a fraction of the story, so saying pay it off or not pay it off is irrelevant.

The OP has disappeared so I guess we will never know.

But giving Thai's the easy way out is like giving them approval to do it again. They don't learn.

Sorry to disappear, I just have so many irons in the fire right now. I already have Mogandave paying it for me. He is a super cool guy and I don't want to waist my friends money so please tell me why I should not just pay the dept and be done with it? I really appreciate your posts, especially when you guys don't even know me.

If you pay back the debt if full that is the end of it, the only down

side is if you g/f sees this as your weakness, make it clear it is a 1

off occurance, if you dont pay in full i doubt very much you will

recieve the papers your g/f put up as collaterol. Even the village

lenders are not alone when it comes to non-payment.

Edited April 15, 2013 by Keith67

[FunFon]

It's less dangerous than walking up to the edge of a live volcano and throwing your money inside.

The danger is further sacrifices will continue to be required down the road with little value received by anyone but the scammers.

But that's your lookout, maybe you can easily afford it, it's a genuine story, just a once-off and who knows you'll live happily ever after, anything is possible.

I think at this point you have the information you need to make your own decision, which only you can make as to whether it's a waist of money (sic).

[mogandave]

If she borrowed the money and agreed to the interest, what's the big deal? She should make good on the debt. If she is your GF and not just another sausage-casing why not just square the debt and be done with it?

I just got this fantastic idea! You said 60,000B ($2000) is no big deal to you. Well it is to me and it would really help me out of a bind. You would be a hero in our family forever and many many thanks in advance. I don't even want her to know I posted about this so I am giving you my bank info Daniel Tyler, acc # 980-6-57204-1 Krung Thai Bank. Man your the greatest, thank the lord for big fish.

Sincerely

Daniel

I'd hate to ever be in the position were 60,000 baht was a big deal. If she's a keeper tell her this is a one time only deal and pay the debt then take it out of her allowance. If you don't give her an allowance that's probably the reason you've been told this story.

Awesome! Another high roller. Two grand USD a just parking ticket to you. Like a sausage casing stuck to the bottom of your shoe. Thanks for chiming in but it's already been taken care of. Mogandave is on top of it. You two should get together if you dont already know him, talk about how you made your first million and what not. He actually has not paid yet because he propably doesn't want to get wet walking to the ATM. He may be talking out his ass cause his mouth knows better but I don't think so. He has over one thousands posts at this forum and I am sure his reputation is worth more than ditching on a parking ticket. Again many thanks.

You sound like a real bad-ass. Why not go sell your wolf-tickets to the loan shark that's been taking advantage of your girlfriend?

I never said $2K was nothing to me. What I said was that if my GF owed $2K to a loan shark, if I really cared about her, I would pay it off.

You lefties crack me up.

[mogandave]

Oh, I consider $2k a significant amount, I just consider a woman I love more significant.

I also think people that enter into an agreement ought to make good on it.

[Keith67]

If she borrowed the money and agreed to the interest, what's the big deal? She should make good on the debt. If she is your GF and not just another sausage-casing why not just square the debt and be done with it?

I just got this fantastic idea! You said 60,000B ($2000) is no big deal to you. Well it is to me and it would really help me out of a bind. You would be a hero in our family forever and many many thanks in advance. I don't even want her to know I posted about this so I am giving you my bank info Daniel Tyler, acc # 980-6-57204-1 Krung Thai Bank. Man your the greatest, thank the lord for big fish.

Sincerely

Daniel

Read The Post.

He never said Baht 60,000.- is "no big deal" - he said the girlfriend took the Loan and agreed to the interest rate, implying that it's too late to bleat now about an unfair Interest rate.

Patrick

Also he was corrected on page 1 for that comment....

[Goong Chae Nam Pla]

If it was my girlfriend and I cared about her, then I would clear the debt on two conditions, that she marries you and has to do everything you say, including no longer borrow from loan sharks.

Thats would be a good deal around me thinks.

I take it that you're single then?

[khunPer]

khunPer, on 14 Apr 2013 - 16:10, said:

However, maximum interest rate on private loans is by law 15% pro annum. Banks and registered loan providers can charge more, around 25% p.a. or more is normal.

-

While the other guy says 5% per month is allowed (APR=80), so which is it?

15% p.a. by law – ask any Thai lawyer

If you take a local villiage loan agreement to the police because they are charging you 20% per anum you will probably get laughed out of the station, go to a local police station in a town or villiage out of a tourist area and ask them what the legal rate is, they will tell you B5 per B100 borrowed, trust me i've done it.

I’m not saying you can find someone who will lend you money at 15 % pa – just what the Law states. When you borrow for 2, 5 or 10 % a month – or more – and stop paying, they may NOT take you to lawyer and Court, they may find other ways to “collect” the outstanding.

[boone57]

Be very careful my friend. As other posters have said, these boys on motorbikes (usually 150cc CBRs) are working for somebody bigger. Mr 'Big' will always be giving the law a cut. Whether 'Mr Big' be a woman or not, he/she will always have many 'mafia noi' at her disposal. These guys take whatever they want, if they can't take anything, they will break, BONES!

So I would say don't got to the B.I.B. Get a final settlement offer, pay it or go hiding somewhere else for a while.

It's a loan racket, they make money making loans, not breaking bones. Pay the money back and you're done with them.

I,m really thinking that mite be true. I have just heard the same story to many times from to many different sources about the men in black on motorcycles.

[boone57]

If she borrowed the money and agreed to the interest, what's the big deal? She should make good on the debt. If she is your GF and not just another sausage-casing why not just square the debt and be done with it?

I just got this fantastic idea! You said 60,000B ($2000) is no big deal to you. Well it is to me and it would really help me out of a bind. You would be a hero in our family forever and many many thanks in advance. I don't even want her to know I posted about this so I am giving you my bank info Daniel Tyler, acc # 980-6-57204-1 Krung Thai Bank. Man your the greatest, thank the lord for big fish.

Sincerely

Daniel

I'd hate to ever be in the position were 60,000 baht was a big deal. If she's a keeper tell her this is a one time only deal and pay the debt then take it out of her allowance. If you don't give her an allowance that's probably the reason you've been told this story.

Awesome! Another high roller. Two grand USD a just parking ticket to you. Like a sausage casing stuck to the bottom of your shoe. Thanks for chiming in but it's already been taken care of. Mogandave is on top of it. You two should get together if you dont already know him, talk about how you made your first million and what not. He actually has not paid yet because he propably doesn't want to get wet walking to the ATM. He may be talking out his ass cause his mouth knows better but I don't think so. He has over one thousands posts at this forum and I am sure his reputation is worth more than ditching on a parking ticket. Again many thanks.

You sound like a real bad-ass. Why not go sell your wolf-tickets to the loan shark that's been taking advantage of your girlfriend?

I never said $2K was nothing to me. What I said was that if my GF owed $2K to a loan shark, if I really cared about her, I would pay it off.

You lefties crack me up.

Your first response took two days and all it amounted to was frivol over wording, the old diversion tactic.

Now you have reduced yourself to double talk. Would your post apply if the amount in question was two million baht? Of course not and by the same token I would agree with the post if the amount was, say six thousand baht.

You sounded off as if sixty thousand baht was pocket change to you, belittling me and implying I was pathitic to even create the post, which BTW has gotten over one hundred replies last time I checked.

You know what would have been super funny at my expense? You should have agreed to pay it but not to me, but to my girlfriend. Hahaha. Then I would have been forced to decline based on the pride factor alone. Plus I had already stated that it was crucial that she not find out about the post airing our debacle on the internet. And Thai girls just don't leave their bank info lying around anyway. And there is no way I am going to get caught sifting through her stuff on account of your miserable hide.

Even if I did accept, you could have opted to flaked out at that point and been no worst off than you are now, exposed.

Granted, talk is cheap from a financial prospective, but it can put a hell of a dent in ones credentials.

Me! bad ass? Not hardly. I am fifty five years old and couldn't punch my way out of a wet paper bag. I can be annoyingly clever though.

I know you haven't asked but I wanted to offer some advise to assure you that I hold no animosity towards you.

Please don't talk arrogant, don't be boastful, don't ever talk condecending to others, and never refer to other human beings with degrading names(especially women). In general try not to hurt other peoples feelings in any way. It does not take a psychologist to realize the only reason people act in such a way is to feel better about them selves. But sadly enough, all it reveals is how pathitic, insecure, and unhappy the cynic is.

Thanks Dave, it's been fun, sort of. May peace follow you where ever you go.

[Blumpkin]

DLock, on 12 Apr 2013 - 15:59, said:

5% per month is not unusual.

Extortionate, but not unusual.

Don't get involved. This is very normal for Thai's...and don't even consider paying it back on her behalf.

Pay it back on her behalf if you want - why not?

We only know a fraction of the story, so saying pay it off or not pay it off is irrelevant.

The OP has disappeared so I guess we will never know.

But giving Thai's the easy way out is like giving them approval to do it again. They don't learn.

Sorry to disappear, I just have so many irons in the fire right now. I already have Mogandave paying it for me. He is a super cool guy and I don't want to waist my friends money so please tell me why I should not just pay the dept and be done with it? I really appreciate your posts, especially when you guys don't even know me.

You forgot to mention sausage casings in your post,is that your business,do you make sausage casings?

[boone57]

Case this.