Air India Cabin Crew Fly Bangkok-Delhi Plane While Pilots Have A Nap

[roamer]

Absolute rubbish to even suggest that BOTH pilots left the cockpit to take a nap. Overcrowding a cockpit by cabin crew does happen, and not just at Air India . I don't believe a word of this.

I tend to agree and why would cabin crew enter the vacant cockpit (or was the navigator still present), even locate the autopilot button and then shut it off. Or was this payback as a sense of being pissed off at sleeping pilots. Too many questions at this point to believe the stupidity of the act. Similarly why suspend the cabin crew? They 'appear' to have got the pilots back in the chair.

Everyone involved, crew wise, should be suspended, until it's 'sorted'! And seems to me that the cabin crew didn't 'locate' the auto-pilot or they wouldn't have turned it off, knowing what it was.. maybe even 'larking', suddenly in charge of a plane they thought was 'flying itself'.. just like the kids of the Russian Captain were allowed to do some years back, when the boy pushing the controls to one side for over 30 seconds automatically disengaged the auto-pilot and no-one realised until too late!!! Sadly everyone on board that flight were killed, so this incident, with clearly similar potential for such tragic consequences turned out fortuitous in the extreme that it didn't result otherwise than it did!!! As for your statement, 'Too many questions to believe the stupidity of the act'?.. sorry but that is ZERO basis for not believing the lengths to which human error AND stupidity can extend (example as per aforementioned)!!! In fact there'd be very few accidents, air, road or anywhere else if it weren't for such stupidity and, basically, the abject failure of too many to just do the normal, sensible, smart thing, or like in this case.. the job you were trained to do, man!!! ('absolute rubbish that both pilots would leave the cockpit to take a nap'? .. obviously Carib is ex or current airline or such.. sticking by colleagues across the sea?.. because regardless of the still to be properly established events of this incident, such things do and have happened with terrifying regularity - we can only hope to truly learn from such incidents - and keep our fingers crossed!!? - in regard to the future!!! Simple, if disturbing, FACT!)

There is no navigator on modern airliners. The A-321 is a two pilot cockpit design. There is a "jumpseat" for observers but it is not normally used except for check-rides. I am not an Airbus pilot, but on Boeing and most all other airline type aircraft there is an autopilot disconnect button on the yoke (control wheel) I would wait for an official report of the incident before believing the story as told. I have seen and heard many stories in my 38 year flying career, but if this turns out to be true it is the winner. As I recall the Russian pilots remained in the cockpit while the kids were at the controls.

Well said. Think there is a rush to judgement here,.

[bobfish]

Absolute rubbish to even suggest that BOTH pilots left the cockpit to take a nap. Overcrowding a cockpit by cabin crew does happen, and not just at Air India . I don't believe a word of this.

I tend to agree and why would cabin crew enter the vacant cockpit (or was the navigator still present), even locate the autopilot button and then shut it off. Or was this payback as a sense of being pissed off at sleeping pilots. Too many questions at this point to believe the stupidity of the act. Similarly why suspend the cabin crew? They 'appear' to have got the pilots back in the chair.

Everyone involved, crew wise, should be suspended, until it's 'sorted'! And seems to me that the cabin crew didn't 'locate' the auto-pilot or they wouldn't have turned it off, knowing what it was.. maybe even 'larking', suddenly in charge of a plane they thought was 'flying itself'.. just like the kids of the Russian Captain were allowed to do some years back, when the boy pushing the controls to one side for over 30 seconds automatically disengaged the auto-pilot and no-one realised until too late!!! Sadly everyone on board that flight were killed, so this incident, with clearly similar potential for such tragic consequences turned out fortuitous in the extreme that it didn't result otherwise than it did!!! As for your statement, 'Too many questions to believe the stupidity of the act'?.. sorry but that is ZERO basis for not believing the lengths to which human error AND stupidity can extend (example as per aforementioned)!!! In fact there'd be very few accidents, air, road or anywhere else if it weren't for such stupidity and, basically, the abject failure of too many to just do the normal, sensible, smart thing, or like in this case.. the job you were trained to do, man!!! ('absolute rubbish that both pilots would leave the cockpit to take a nap'? .. obviously Carib is ex or current airline or such.. sticking by colleagues across the sea?.. because regardless of the still to be properly established events of this incident, such things do and have happened with terrifying regularity - we can only hope to truly learn from such incidents - and keep our fingers crossed!!? - in regard to the future!!! Simple, if disturbing, FACT!)

There is no navigator on modern airliners. The A-321 is a two pilot cockpit design. There is a "jumpseat" for observers but it is not normally used except for check-rides. I am not an Airbus pilot, but on Boeing and most all other airline type aircraft there is an autopilot disconnect button on the yoke (control wheel) I would wait for an official report of the incident before believing the story as told. I have seen and heard many stories in my 38 year flying career, but if this turns out to be true it is the winner. As I recall the Russian pilots remained in the cockpit while the kids were at the controls.

Well said x 2 Oxpilot.!!

"Airmchair" experts:

On the Airbus:

Autopilot disengage: press the red button on either of the sidesticks. [hint - use your thumb]

Result: Autopilot disconnect message and an aural reminder. The aircraft will not deviate, in the short term, from its present path/trajectory until a control input is made to sidestick/rudder.

Autopilot [re] engage: press either of the 2 square pushbuttons in the centre of the glareshield. [hint - use your index finger]

Result: a non-event.

[Jane Doe]

Pilots - overpaid bus-drivers in the sky...

[Credo]

Pilots - overpaid bus-drivers in the sky...

But much better educated and seldom leave the scene of the crash.

[Sayonarax]

BYE BYE Air India. Just resting on the controls can disengage the auto-pilot.

Why suspend the whole cabin crew? Cause the HEAD Cabin crew member should of went off there tit when the two pilots started kicking back in business class.

[Sayonarax]

Pilots - overpaid bus-drivers in the sky...

Id like to see you fly a commercial airplane. Oh wait your just an under paid teacher?

[Sayonarax]

Absolute rubbish to even suggest that BOTH pilots left the cockpit to take a nap. Overcrowding a cockpit by cabin crew does happen, and not just at Air India . I don't believe a word of this.

I tend to agree and why would cabin crew enter the vacant cockpit (or was the navigator still present), even locate the autopilot button and then shut it off. Or was this payback as a sense of being pissed off at sleeping pilots. Too many questions at this point to believe the stupidity of the act. Similarly why suspend the cabin crew? They 'appear' to have got the pilots back in the chair.

Everyone involved, crew wise, should be suspended, until it's 'sorted'! And seems to me that the cabin crew didn't 'locate' the auto-pilot or they wouldn't have turned it off, knowing what it was.. maybe even 'larking', suddenly in charge of a plane they thought was 'flying itself'.. just like the kids of the Russian Captain were allowed to do some years back, when the boy pushing the controls to one side for over 30 seconds automatically disengaged the auto-pilot and no-one realised until too late!!! Sadly everyone on board that flight were killed, so this incident, with clearly similar potential for such tragic consequences turned out fortuitous in the extreme that it didn't result otherwise than it did!!! As for your statement, 'Too many questions to believe the stupidity of the act'?.. sorry but that is ZERO basis for not believing the lengths to which human error AND stupidity can extend (example as per aforementioned)!!! In fact there'd be very few accidents, air, road or anywhere else if it weren't for such stupidity and, basically, the abject failure of too many to just do the normal, sensible, smart thing, or like in this case.. the job you were trained to do, man!!! ('absolute rubbish that both pilots would leave the cockpit to take a nap'? .. obviously Carib is ex or current airline or such.. sticking by colleagues across the sea?.. because regardless of the still to be properly established events of this incident, such things do and have happened with terrifying regularity - we can only hope to truly learn from such incidents - and keep our fingers crossed!!? - in regard to the future!!! Simple, if disturbing, FACT!)

There is no navigator on modern airliners. The A-321 is a two pilot cockpit design. There is a "jumpseat" for observers but it is not normally used except for check-rides. I am not an Airbus pilot, but on Boeing and most all other airline type aircraft there is an autopilot disconnect button on the yoke (control wheel) I would wait for an official report of the incident before believing the story as told. I have seen and heard many stories in my 38 year flying career, but if this turns out to be true it is the winner. As I recall the Russian pilots remained in the cockpit while the kids were at the controls.

Third guy is Navigator/Engineer

[Sayonarax]

What an hysterical lot you are, surprised some of you ever boarded a flight in the first place. Sometimes it might be better when pilots leave the cockpit, sure the flight attendants on Thai Airways on TG 261 into Surat Thani in 1998 would have been a better choice than the pilot deciding going in for a third attempt at landing on a rainy windswept night with poor visibility, 101 people dead.

And in response to a comment, No the navigator never left the cockpit in the Air India episode, problem with getting desoldered...duh!!

Not sure what era your living in, but a commercial plane only has a Pilot and a Co-pilot. In the modern era we use GPS navigation..

[lomatopo]

One of my favs....

Northwest Airlines Pilots Miss Airport by 150 Miles

By SCOTT MAYEROWITZ

Oct. 22, 2009

Two pilots of a Northwest Airlines flight Wednesday were apparently so distracted that they missed their airport and kept flying for 150 miles before landing the plane and its 147 passengers safely.

For one hour and 18 minutes, the pilots -- flying at 37,000 feet above sea level -- were radio silent as air traffic controllers at times tried to reach the cockpit, according to a news release from the National Transportation Safety Board.

As the event unfolded, concern was high among air traffic controllers, who repeatedly attempted to establish contact during the incident, using multiple methods, the air traffic controllers union told ABC News. Eventually, controllers asked other planes in the air to attempt to contact the Northwest plane, a method that the union said ultimately proved successful.

The pilots of the Airbus A320 told the FBI and airport police that they were in a heated discussion over airline policy and they lost awareness of the situation, the Federal Aviation Administration said.

http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/northwest-airlines-pilots-miss-airport-150-miles/story?id=8892976

[Sayonarax]

Here are some reports of equally silly behaviour (including being drunk)

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-01-08/bottle-to-throttle-a-short-history-of-drunk-pilots

So does that mean we also shouldn't fly American Eagles or Thompson Airwards. Or how about this one where 1 in 5 pilots admit to falling asleep in the cockpit. Or better yet how about an air traffic controller sleeping on the job?

In fact if you look hard enough you will see that Airlines operating in America have a terrible track record when it comes to safety and emergency landings.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-1374355/Pilots-admit-falling-asleep-cockpit.html

"

• Friday April 1 - Southwest Airlines Flight 812 made an emergency landing in Arizona 18 minutes after take off when a five-foot hole ripped through the plane.
• Saturday April 2 - Southwest Airlines cancel 300 flights.
• American Airlines Flight 883 jet forced to make an emergency landing in New York due to decompression in the cabin.
• Sunday April 3 - Southwest Airlines cancel further 300 flights and announce inspections on 79 aircraft.
• Monday April 4 - Southwest Airlines Flight was forced to make an emergency landing at Los Angeles after a burning electrical smell in the cabin. Up to 175 more Southwest flights expected to be cancelled throughout the day.
• American Airlines jet lands with minimal instruments and a smoke-filled cockpit
• Tuesday April 5 - Southwest confirm cracks found in five more planes
• A Boeing 737-700 flight to Denver forced to land again shortly after take off due to a fault in the wing
• Wednesday April 6 - Second air traffic controller found asleep on the job

Just to mix things up here is an Air New Zealand pilot who nodded off during a flight.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21628746

And also a Dutch pilot who was locked out of the cockpit because the co pilot was asleep.

http://news.yahoo.com/dont-alarmed-airline-pilots-falling-asleep-wheel-135145466.html

And for the grande finale here is that one we were all talking about last year... Air France pilot who crashed in the Atlantic killing around 230 on board. He didn't get enough sleep the night before.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2293750/Pilot-Air-France-plane-crashed-killing-228-people-slept-just-ONE-HOUR-flight.html

Yes pilots are human too.. planes crash.

If you knew anything about flying you might be dangerous..

[EyesWideOpen]

As I said , the cockpit voice recordings will straighten all this out in short order. Not sure if there is video recording of the cockpit as well, maybe a Airbus pilot poster here could confirm that. If Air India does NOT release the recordings, then you can safely assume the worst, that in fact there were stewardesses flying the plane.

[SeaVisionBurma]

There is no navigator on modern airliners. The A-321 is a two pilot cockpit design. There is a "jumpseat" for observers but it is not normally used except for check-rides. I am not an Airbus pilot, but on Boeing and most all other airline type aircraft there is an autopilot disconnect button on the yoke (control wheel) I would wait for an official report of the incident before believing the story as told. I have seen and heard many stories in my 38 year flying career, but if this turns out to be true it is the winner. As I recall the Russian pilots remained in the cockpit while the kids were at the controls.

Third guy is Navigator/Engineer

There is no 'third guy' in an two crew cockpit, such as an Airbus A320.

[guru]

Standard cockpit voice recorders only record the last 30 minutes whilst the most modern type record the last 2 hours before overwriting. How long into the flight did this incident occur? Flight data recorders record the last 25 hours so i don't quite understand why cockpit voice recorders are only designed for a maximum of 2 hours capacity. Cockpit chatter earlier in the flight may prove useful in accident investigations and random checks by airlines could improve flight crew standards.

[EyesWideOpen]

Standard cockpit voice recorders only record the last 30 minutes whilst the most modern type record the last 2 hours before overwriting. How long into the flight did this incident occur? Flight data recorders record the last 25 hours so i don't quite understand why cockpit voice recorders are only designed for a maximum of 2 hours capacity. Cockpit chatter earlier in the flight may prove useful in accident investigations and random checks by airlines could improve flight crew standards.

You are correct . Very strange, given the fact a single small thumb drive could hold the recordings of many flights. Also interesting that pilots have been fighting have video recordings done in the cockpit.

[SeaVisionBurma]

A couple of derogatory and over the top posts have been removed

[Sing_Sling]

Luckily they had a Caucasian autopilot (being an Airbus)

[ratcatcher]

I wonder if one of the flight attendants was a previous Cathay Pacific employee?

Reminds me of the old United Airlines Ads.

And, since this thread has degenerated into speculation on what went on up at the pointed end, they don't call it the "cockpit" for nothing.

[metisdead]

An off topic bashing post has been removed.

[balo]

I dont believe a word of this story .

We have strict laws up in the air and the pilots knows it, especially since this was an international flight.

Edited May 5, 2013 by balo

[Chao Lao Beach]

How could the crew be hung over, smelly Indian people are not allowed into bars in racist Bangkok ......................

Edit, before I get flamed, this is sarcasism......

Edited May 5, 2013 by Chao Lao Beach

[ratcatcher]

How could the crew be hung over, smelly Indian people are not allowed into bars in racist Bangkok ......................

Edit, before I get flamed, this is sarcasism......

Sarcasism.................................sounds contagious.

[surangw]

As I said , the cockpit voice recordings will straighten all this out in short order. Not sure if there is video recording of the cockpit as well, maybe a Airbus pilot poster here could confirm that. If Air India does NOT release the recordings, then you can safely assume the worst, that in fact there were stewardesses flying the plane.

or no tape due to a"malfunction"

[EyesWideOpen]

The fact is that all four people involved in this matter have been suspended by the airline, so that clearly shows that SOMETHING happened that was not within ordinary operations. Air India is presently in damage control mode, I will be fascinated to see what they say later on...

[Rajab Al Zarahni]

If there had been any real danger the pilots could have ejaculated.

[NCFC]

Clearly the air hostesses required a knob off which to hang their handbags.

[Sayonarax]

There is no navigator on modern airliners. The A-321 is a two pilot cockpit design. There is a "jumpseat" for observers but it is not normally used except for check-rides. I am not an Airbus pilot, but on Boeing and most all other airline type aircraft there is an autopilot disconnect button on the yoke (control wheel) I would wait for an official report of the incident before believing the story as told. I have seen and heard many stories in my 38 year flying career, but if this turns out to be true it is the winner. As I recall the Russian pilots remained in the cockpit while the kids were at the controls.

Third guy is Navigator/Engineer

There is no 'third guy' in an two crew cockpit, such as an Airbus A320.

I was speaking in terms of what the third guy does or did.. i never said they still have them.

[skippybangkok]

As I said , the cockpit voice recordings will straighten all this out in short order. Not sure if there is video recording of the cockpit as well, maybe a Airbus pilot poster here could confirm that. If Air India does NOT release the recordings, then you can safely assume the worst, that in fact there were stewardesses flying the plane.

Errrr.... there is an erase capability too

[guru]

Whilst there is an erase button, I think India's dept of aviation requires the deactivation of the erase facility.

Also, even if erased the recordings can be recovered.