Unsafe at work: Thai experts sound the alarm on Mental Health Day

[newermonkey]

Correct me if I am wrong in thinking a crime has to be committed before one can become guilty of said crime. What about all the fictional books, movies, fictional stories written? are all the authors guilty?

OMG this world is becoming just as George Orwell predicted in his writings, (Perhaps he should have been locked up before people started to follow the plot)

[newermonkey]

As far as I know its not illegal to be a pedophile here its only illegal if said pedophile molests children under age 15.

Some countries in the world its even illegal to be a gay but even then that person has to be caught having sex with same sex partner.

[USNret]

Correct me if I am wrong in thinking a crime has to be committed before one can become guilty of said crime. What about all the fictional books, movies, fictional stories written? are all the authors guilty? OMG this world is becoming just as George Orwell predicted in his writings, (Perhaps he should have been locked up before people started to follow the plot)

You are wrong; Joe got it right in post #30. For conspiracy to exist you have to plan the crime as a group, then take some positive step in the direction of actually committing the crime. There is wide latitude in proving that "extra step" and coming to Thailand alone is probably sufficient. Without this law, it would be impossible to stop any crime before it actually happened.

[oldsailor35]

Entrapment appears to be a favourite way to obtain convictions in America. I recently watched a program where scantily dressed Police women approached men offering sex and enticing them to a motel. When the money was handed over the male police would appear and arrest them. At this stage no sexual act had occurred, but the man would be guilty of procuring a woman for prostitution. How blatently unfair is this.

[itchybum]

Am I the only one confused by this? Did a crime actually take place or was only talked about?

Notwithstanding my thoughts on how pedophiles should be dealt with (which would earn me an instant ban if aired here), are we now heading down the road toward thought crimes?

Exactly....commiting the crime will become irrelevant..

Do you think that they should be allowed to abuse children before being arrested?

Not at all.

But have you ever thought about robbing a bank and getting away with it? After watching a movie, thought of a better way so you would not get caught?

I have.

Hope my IP addy is well hid.

[oldsailor35]

As far as I know its not illegal to be a pedophile here its only illegal if said pedophile molests children under age 15.

Some countries in the world its even illegal to be a gay but even then that person has to be caught having sex with same sex partner.

Well, you will certainly go to jail in Queensland if you are caught with under aged pornography on your computer. A friend of mine did 4 years for this.

[asupeartea]

An Aussie teacher buddy had trouble with a ring of pedophiles in the Australian school system. He reported the one ped and his friends, all the way up in the school system, had HIM blacklisted for pedophilia. It took him years in the courts to get his name cleared in exchange for silence on the ring of peds in the school system. OOOOppppssss! I let it slip

DISGUSTING

Perth Now - July 23, 2012

Former school teacher Mark Pendleton was due to be released in March 2011 after serving 11 years of a 16-year sentence for sexually assaulting 11 girls from 1995 to 2000, but he was ordered to remain behind bars to face the fresh charges.

Kenneth Bishop, a former British resident, is serving 16 years in jail after pleading guilty in 2002 to 44 counts of sexually penetrating girls aged 12 to 15.


http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/dpps-lapse-may-see-pedophile-freed/story-e6frg12l-1226433059516

Edited May 9, 2013 by asupeartea

[SteeleJoe]

Entrapment appears to be a favourite way to obtain convictions in America. I recently watched a program where scantily dressed Police women approached men offering sex and enticing them to a motel. When the money was handed over the male police would appear and arrest them. At this stage no sexual act had occurred, but the man would be guilty of procuring a woman for prostitution. How blatently unfair is this.

Offering sex FOR MONEY, yes? (Sorry about CAPS, but this app has no features to add emphasis).

That is the crime, I believe. As you say, 'procuring a woman for prostitution' - not 'having sex with a prostitute'.

[chickenslegs]

I believe most of us have "play planned" a robbery of a bank or gold vaults of some sort in our life.

I am NOT defending these individuals.

Did your 'play planning' involve getting together with other convicted bank robbers?

These people were not 'play planning' they were serious. If their plans had not been interrupted they would have gone on to assault many children.

Correct me if I am wrong in thinking a crime has to be committed before one can become guilty of said crime. What about all the fictional books, movies, fictional stories written? are all the authors guilty?

OMG this world is becoming just as George Orwell predicted in his writings, (Perhaps he should have been locked up before people started to follow the plot)

This group of paedophiles were not writing a work of fiction - they were planning to set up a situation which would enable the grooming and sexual assault of children.

[asupeartea]

It is basically rape or child rape we are talking about with peds. Rape is usually NOT a sexual crime but a violent crime so cutting off their 'nads might not have any effect.

Chainarong I can relate to people slipping up but I think that Paedos should have there Testes surgically removed therefore they have lower drive to commit the crime. Also I think it would deter some of them. Personally if I ran a country if the crime could be proved by several children who did not know each other I would impose the death sentence, these people do not change merely try and control themself if at all. They do not deserve to live in society or waste tax payers money.

[axact]

Discussing the plot in prison & then writing to women in Thailand.... I can see why they like children, they seem to have the same IQ as a 5 year old !

I think in the UK the crime would be 'intent'

[Ragzilb]

IF there should ever be death penalty, it should be for people like them

[ozziebloke]

As an Australian living in Thailand, I am not only disgusted, but ashamed to hear about this coming from Australians. Those sick people should stay in Australian prisons, and never come out, especially not be able to come into Thailand. Idiots anyway if they believe they could get in with their criminal record.

Why couldn't they?

I do not recall ever being asked about a crim history on the plane over my first time, not that I have one.

Plenty of crims come to thailand with open arms.

I think that these criminals would be refused a passport by the Australian authorities in the first instance.

[cMe2]

State prosecutor Tom Scutt said the Pendleton had been planning to engage in sexual activity while in Asia.
Pendleton's history of offending, included the possession of 50,000 child porn images and offending against girls aged four
to six years of age.

• The court heard that a previous judge had ruled a "catalogue"
• of Pendleton before the offences for which he was convicted.
• A report prepared for the court in previous years had described
• Pendleton as a "fixated paedophile with a chronic interest in
• pre-pubescent females

Defence lawyer David McKenzie argued that the evidence against his
client relating to the alleged conspiracy had not indicated a real plan
but could be

• seen as part of Pendleton's "fantasies".

Justice McKechnie acknowledged in his ruling that the material could be
either an indication of a real intention to go to South East Asia or

• be "fantasies of a middle-aged paedophile".

The judge also emphasised that the fresh charge was not yet proven, but
went on to rule there was a reasonable grounds on which Pendleton

• could be deemed at an unacceptable risk of reoffending if released from jail
• A date has yet to be fixed for the dangerous sex offender hearing.

[rct99q]

This is the dilemma society has been unable to deal with. Whose rights take priority?

The victims (in this case unknown children in Northern Thailand)

The perpetrators (in this case 3 known persons in Australia)

Each should be protected equally but as per their definition = Unfortunate Victim, known criminal = the law protects those that are known and unjustly punishes those unknown victims by not protecting them.

My children have the right not to be assaulted but it can not be guaranteed because we do not have the right to prevent people like these guys before they assault my or other children again in the future. Can they be locked up for thought crimes? These were more than just thoughts in their heads. They expressed them out loud to other witnesses.

Fortunately there are a few more safer children sleeping in a bed tonight as opposed to being sexually molested over and over again by these guys. But these are just my thoughts.

[diarmuidOGW]

If they were planning a new spree after doing 11 years of a 16 year stretch,is it fair to assume that 11 years is too short a sentence?

Personally I think its far too short and 25 years should be mandatory for child abuse,per case.

[Jingthing]

When I read the headline, I thought it was about making sex toy dolls for pedos in Thailand, you know, like blow up dolls of youngins.

No worries though. Sex toys are strictly verboten in Thailand!

[transam]

When I read the headline, I thought it was about making sex toy dolls for pedos in Thailand, you know, like blow up dolls of youngins.

No worries though. Sex toys are strictly verboten in Thailand!

Thought you were a yank. ?

[Jingthing]

When I read the headline, I thought it was about making sex toy dolls for pedos in Thailand, you know, like blow up dolls of youngins.

No worries though. Sex toys are strictly verboten in Thailand!

Thought you were a yank. ?

And what does that have to do with the price of a bagel in Bogota?

[SgtPepper]

Am I the only one confused by this? Did a crime actually take place or was only talked about?

_

Notwithstanding my thoughts on how pedophiles should be dealt with (which would earn me an instant ban if aired here), are we now heading down the road toward thought crimes?

"It is a crime to conspire with others to commit a crime.

[Scott]

An earlier poster mentioned this, but it seems to be overlooked. The Australian gov't would most likely NOT issue these people with a passport. Once they are released, they may still be under the jurisdiction of the court--probation or some such thing--and should not be allowed to travel.

There situation is also a little different with regard to conspiracy, intent and entrapment. They are serving time for sexual offenses against children. Their discussions would be viewed differently, legally, just like a couple of bank robbers discussing a future heist would be dealt with differently than a bar room discussion between two people with no criminal record.

[vijer]

Yeah, I have a bit of a problem with entrapment.

All for them bieng locked away in hell for a day over their lifespan, but, that show in the US which setup people chatting online and then meeting up with possible underage sex offenders, is pushing the limits.

From the view that who is to know if that person would actually go through with it, have second thoughts and say sorry, changed my mind etc. Instead his life is ruined forever.

It's a fine line for sure.

Really? You obviously didn't watch the Dateline show very closely, the women acting as bait would be talking in chat rooms when the guys would start talking to the girls. The guys would start asking questions to find out if the girls were open to the idea of older men. The online chatting usually went on for a few weeks before the guys started talking in very explicit language. Then the guys asked to meet the girls in person. The girls didn't do the soliciting. Then the guys showed up, with condoms, alcohol, drugs, sex toys. You think the guys didn't plan on going through with it?

When I was 25 a 16 year old girl started chatting with me on a chat site, she wanted to get together, as soon as I found out how old she was I told her not to contact me any more. That is what someone in their right mind does, they don't start talking about opening a kids toy business and using the uneducated parents kids.

[itchybum]

As an Australian living in Thailand, I am not only disgusted, but ashamed to hear about this coming from Australians. Those sick people should stay in Australian prisons, and never come out, especially not be able to come into Thailand. Idiots anyway if they believe they could get in with their criminal record.

Why couldn't they?

I do not recall ever being asked about a crim history on the plane over my first time, not that I have one.

Plenty of crims come to thailand with open arms.

I think that these criminals would be refused a passport by the Australian authorities in the first instance.

That would be good if so.

[itchybum]

Yeah, I have a bit of a problem with entrapment.

All for them bieng locked away in hell for a day over their lifespan, but, that show in the US which setup people chatting online and then meeting up with possible underage sex offenders, is pushing the limits.

From the view that who is to know if that person would actually go through with it, have second thoughts and say sorry, changed my mind etc. Instead his life is ruined forever.

It's a fine line for sure.

Really? You obviously didn't watch the Dateline show very closely, the women acting as bait would be talking in chat rooms when the guys would start talking to the girls. The guys would start asking questions to find out if the girls were open to the idea of older men. The online chatting usually went on for a few weeks before the guys started talking in very explicit language. Then the guys asked to meet the girls in person. The girls didn't do the soliciting. Then the guys showed up, with condoms, alcohol, drugs, sex toys. You think the guys didn't plan on going through with it?

When I was 25 a 16 year old girl started chatting with me on a chat site, she wanted to get together, as soon as I found out how old she was I told her not to contact me any more. That is what someone in their right mind does, they don't start talking about opening a kids toy business and using the uneducated parents kids.

You are right, the intent is there and I agree with you on all of it.

I am just saying, the carry on behind the keyboard is one thing, actually doing it is another. If they solicit photos, that is another step, but not what I am talking about.

What of the guys that would not actually go through with it, have second thoughts in the heat of the moment etc.

[BlackJack]

yes they look British to me

the average Aussie now looks not British

[Travel2003]

I believe most of us have "play planned" a robbery of a bank or gold vaults of some sort in our life.

I am NOT defending these individuals.

Did your 'play planning' involve getting together with other convicted bank robbers?

These people were not 'play planning' they were serious. If their plans had not been interrupted they would have gone on to assault many children.

>Correct me if I am wrong in thinking a crime has to be committed before one can become guilty of said crime. What about all the fictional books, movies, fictional stories written? are all the authors guilty?

OMG this world is becoming just as George Orwell predicted in his writings, (Perhaps he should have been locked up before people started to follow the plot)

This group of paedophiles were not writing a work of fiction - they were planning to set up a situation which would enable the grooming and sexual assault of children.

If the authorities can prove they indeed planned to do something criminal, go ahead and prosecute them.

If they can not prove it, well then what?

I tell you what. it was just a bloody plan, fantasy or not.

Good the planning was stopped of course.

Again, I am NOT advocating for these men.

[NomadJoe]

Entrapment appears to be a favourite way to obtain convictions in America. I recently watched a program where scantily dressed Police women approached men offering sex and enticing them to a motel. When the money was handed over the male police would appear and arrest them. At this stage no sexual act had occurred, but the man would be guilty of procuring a woman for prostitution. How blatently unfair is this.

Entrapment, simply put, is if the idea to commit the crime is put in the head of the offender by police. A scantily clad woman walking down the street, even on a street known to be frequented by streetwalkers is not entrapment. The "john" must initiate for it to be a crime. If the UC initiates and starts making offers and he accepts, then that is entrapment.

[Travel2003]

I planned a crime one time that I should contact some professionals, and together we should kill everyone in the government.

Kind of scrapped the plan after 1 second, as it was in anger, and I realized how silly it was.

Bet that plan, no matter how well (or poorly) planned it was, would have landed me in prison in some countries.

Sure, I am the ONLY member on TV ever had plans to commit a crime.

[mad mary]

Yeah, I have a bit of a problem with entrapment.

All for them bieng locked away in hell for a day over their lifespan, but, that show in the US which setup people chatting online and then meeting up with possible underage sex offenders, is pushing the limits.

From the view that who is to know if that person would actually go through with it, have second thoughts and say sorry, changed my mind etc. Instead his life is ruined forever.

It's a fine line for sure.

Really? You obviously didn't watch the Dateline show very closely, the women acting as bait would be talking in chat rooms when the guys would start talking to the girls. The guys would start asking questions to find out if the girls were open to the idea of older men. The online chatting usually went on for a few weeks before the guys started talking in very explicit language. Then the guys asked to meet the girls in person. The girls didn't do the soliciting. Then the guys showed up, with condoms, alcohol, drugs, sex toys. You think the guys didn't plan on going through with it?

When I was 25 a 16 year old girl started chatting with me on a chat site, she wanted to get together, as soon as I found out how old she was I told her not to contact me any more. That is what someone in their right mind does, they don't start talking about opening a kids toy business and using the uneducated parents kids.

You are right, the intent is there and I agree with you on all of it.

I am just saying, the carry on behind the keyboard is one thing, actually doing it is another. If they solicit photos, that is another step, but not what I am talking about.

What of the guys that would not actually go through with it, have second thoughts in the heat of the moment etc.

"What of the guys that would not actually go through with it, have second thoughts in the heat of the moment etc."

So you are saying it's ok to 'groom' a child?

[itchybum]

I planned a crime one time that I should contact some professionals, and together we should kill everyone in the government.

Kind of scrapped the plan after 1 second, as it was in anger, and I realized how silly it was.

Bet that plan, no mater how well (or poorly) planned it was, would have landed me in prison in some countries.

Sure, I am the ONLY member on TV ever had plans to commit a crime.

Its all about acting upon it and putting it into action me thinks.

Not just thinking about it, otherwise all we boys would be in jail every time a photo of Angelina Jolie popped up.

Or Robblok for JT.