Sterilise Dogs, End The Meat Trade From Thailand: Soi Dog Foundation

[rametindallas]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

Skilled butcher? Are you kidding?

Dogs are beaten for hours with sticks and bats while they're still alive, to "soften" the meat. After which, the dogs are being skinned, often times while still alive. I suggest you research dog trade in SEA before make silly statements like the one above...

That was the practice in Tahiti as late as the 1950s. It has never been the method in SEA. Hours? Really? Does the dog have to be alive all that time for the meat to soften? Why don't those same people beat chickens and pigs for hours to tenderize them? How much harder is it to skin a live dog than a dead one? You must have a very low opinion of people in SEA to think they are foolish enough to waste time beating dogs and cruel enough to skin them alive. I think you are confused. I guarantee you cannot find one reference on the entire World Wide Web to support your malarkey. That's not value added and when you stir-fry or stew small pieces (as they do in SEA) it is very tender. By the way, what is so silly about putting the welfare of children above that of stray dogs?

[rametindallas]

Mankind's true moral test, its fundamental test (which lies deeply buried from view), consists of its attitude towards those who are at its mercy: animals.~Milan Kundera (1929-) ,The Unbearable Lightness of Being (1984) pt 7 ch.2

What about the neglected children? You have any quotes for them?

[Mosha]

Whats despicable about dog meat?even here in thailand people eat dog so what's the big deal? just can't get it.

Then breed them for the trade, don't steel family pets. Hell the planets over populated in areas where people are starving. Surely a food source there. Go Soilent Green.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Mosha

[rametindallas]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

What caring person would differentiate who to help, unless of course you consider animals being lesser being who do not deserve our help, in which case calling yourself "caring person" would be very delusional.

Those truly needed people, can always get off their backside and get a job, instead of waiting for handouts. There are millions of jobs out there and the whole industrial and service industry is crying out for workers.

How would you propose animals help themselves?

Thailand is a country of limited resources and IF priorities are a factor, yes, I think animal welfare is not equal to child welfare. Are you really considering an unwanted soi dog as equal in value to a human child? Can those children get off their backside and get a job? Sure they can. Would you rather a soi dog be fed and sheltered and the child miss and education because it had to get a job? In my world humans rate waaaaaay higher than any animal. I know people in Dallas that won't donate a dollar to the poor but will spend thousands to treat their pet at the Veterinarian. I find that sickening. Here at the animal shelters the unclaimed animals are euthanized after two weeks. Even in a rich country like the U.S. there is only so much money for strays. What about relatively poor Thailand? I would suggest you re-examine YOUR value system when put dogs as equal to human children.

[rametindallas]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

Quick death at hands of skilled butchers? Watch http://www.cinando.com/DefaultController.aspx?PageId=FicheFilm&IdF=160984&IdC=29068

Korea is not in SEA

[gaucho]

look as far as im concerned cull the <deleted> lot ok sick of being snapped at ...these do gooders r the problem ..if stray dogs r culled it would force people to look after their pets ...saw a dog attack the other day ...not pretty ...waiting to be flamed cheers

[harrycallahan]

Soy dogs, meat trade...

[canuckamuck]

From what I have seen there is a very low percentage of people in SEA that should be allowed to care for animals. But lets face it, they look at animals differently then we do. I think the very best solution would be a massive cull across the nation of any stray. And then a continued policy of sterilization of strays.

This will never happen of course. But this thread is about good intentions however idealistic and fruitless they may be.

I agree that the money would be better spent helping abandoned and orphaned children.

[jpinx]

In my village in Peru (when I lived there for almost 4 years) the local "council" had a programme of free sterilisation of all street animals - mostly cats and dogs. The locals knew to keep their pedigree mutts under control or they would not be worth much.

[lemoncake]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

What caring person would differentiate who to help, unless of course you consider animals being lesser being who do not deserve our help, in which case calling yourself "caring person" would be very delusional.

Those truly needed people, can always get off their backside and get a job, instead of waiting for handouts. There are millions of jobs out there and the whole industrial and service industry is crying out for workers.

How would you propose animals help themselves?

Thailand is a country of limited resources and IF priorities are a factor, yes, I think animal welfare is not equal to child welfare. Are you really considering an unwanted soi dog as equal in value to a human child? Can those children get off their backside and get a job? Sure they can. Would you rather a soi dog be fed and sheltered and the child miss and education because it had to get a job? In my world humans rate waaaaaay higher than any animal. I know people in Dallas that won't donate a dollar to the poor but will spend thousands to treat their pet at the Veterinarian. I find that sickening. Here at the animal shelters the unclaimed animals are euthanized after two weeks. Even in a rich country like the U.S. there is only so much money for strays. What about relatively poor Thailand? I would suggest you re-examine YOUR value system when put dogs as equal to human children.

Children can not, but their parents sure can.

Rich country like USA? You sure know what you talking about?

Relatively poor Thailand??? Have you actually been to Thailand or know its location on the map?

[Jim walker]

I am sure many of the people on TV who are going on about comparing
animals with children and how the money donations would be better spent on
saving children rather than dogs have all made substantial donations to the
many various and admirable children’s charities in Thailand, and I respect them
for that me I favour animals and have donated money to Soi Dog for years and
will keep doing for the foreseeable future and I also donate to many animal
charities in my home country to try and alleviate the suffering of vulnerable
animals, most children have loving parents to care for them and look after them
animals don’t, so keep up the magnificent sterilisation programme Soi Dog.

[Robby nz]

I guess the only meat you have ever seen is on your plate.

All meat bruise the same, including you and I, have you never had a bruise and seen the color, well that color goes deep into the meat.

No I wont watch the video because I have seen doctored videos before that have set out to show what the makers want people to believe.

If someone has made a video showing dogs being beaten then you should be complaining to the makers because they have done it to try make you believe what they want you to believe.

[Wombat6]

In most civilized countries, the local authority has a Ranger/dog catcher that rounds up strays/unwanted dogs. If a pet is unknowingly collected, the owner has a certain time to claim the dog from the local Pound., The licensing or an information chip can be inserted under the dogs skin to quickly identify it. Unclaimed dogs are euthanized humanely. Dogs do not appear to be high on the list of being "mans best friend" in Thailand. If this system was introduced, the dog meat traders would lose the supply source here in Thailand and there would be less Rabies and crap on the streets etc.

[mjnaus]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

Skilled butcher? Are you kidding?

Dogs are beaten for hours with sticks and bats while they're still alive, to "soften" the meat. After which, the dogs are being skinned, often times while still alive. I suggest you research dog trade in SEA before make silly statements like the one above...

That was the practice in Tahiti as late as the 1950s. It has never been the method in SEA. Hours? Really? Does the dog have to be alive all that time for the meat to soften? Why don't those same people beat chickens and pigs for hours to tenderize them? How much harder is it to skin a live dog than a dead one? You must have a very low opinion of people in SEA to think they are foolish enough to waste time beating dogs and cruel enough to skin them alive. I think you are confused. I guarantee you cannot find one reference on the entire World Wide Web to support your malarkey. That's not value added and when you stir-fry or stew small pieces (as they do in SEA) it is very tender. By the way, what is so silly about putting the welfare of children above that of stray dogs?

If you're too lazy to actually read through the thread and look at links submitted by other posters, or do the research yourself (they have this new internet thingy nowadays, it's called Google and it gives you heaps of info on pretty much anything, give it a spin!), I certainly won't go and try to convince you that this actually still happens, both the torturing and live skinning.

I would also much rather live in a world where people wouldn't have time to beat the living shit out of defenceless dogs or where nobody would be cruel enough to skin them alive. Too bad for me my eyes are wide open...

[tamesisfwp]

I live in a village at the back of Nakhon Phanom and the next village over from Ho Chi Minh Village where the shelter is situated. We never have a police presence here and if sought they fail to turn up. Just a few doors away from me is a newly built house with an aerial that GCHQ / NSA would be proud to be the owner of. The broadband reception in the village courtesy of this aerial is AMAZING but especially so for the lady who lives perhaps 150 metres away by crow's flight and 400 metres by road.

On certain nights lads go off in trucks and on motorbikes and usually armed with personal firearms tucked under their jackets. There is a core team of employees and many casuals on the nights of operation - perhaps I am wrong and they coincide with Arsenal playing at home - NOT. It is an open secret of the village and there seems to be a compromise in place that nothing disappears locally.

When large consignments are seized as near to BKK as actually having their postcode for some reason they are shipped to one of three reception centres along the Mekong for treatment and dealing with. I applaud the small groups of volunteers who come to make sure the seized animals are clean and vaccinated. Of course there are many high hundreds of dogs there and one night they are shipped to other centres. The despatching centre has a receipt for the dogs out but there is confusion as to where their actual final destination is. Has a clever fixer actually arranged with the authorities to offer a "safe haven" for these dogs. How convenient that the safe haven is over 500 km closer to their intended destination - is that their actual destination? I suggest the answer is yes. Someone is doing very nicely and has defrayed their costs by having the authorities ship the "rescued" dogs 500 plus km closer to their final destination. The Mighty Mekong is ever so busy by night in both directions and it is the same folk behind the two way trade.

Nice business if you can get it and they certainly have it big time.

Just tonight driving through my village we had three dogs race out and growl at us. Perhaps Mrs BIG might do a favour and do a local just once in a while.

We have devoted pets of our dogs but they are well trained and loving. The semi feral hounds that snap routinely certainly test pour patience.

In summary, we have well organised gangs enjoying official disinterest and indeed contractual relations with the authorities to further their despicable trade.

[surangw]

Sterilise the dealers would be more effective

[Sayonarax]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

Quick death? If only if you knew what you was talking about.

Thais don't eat soi dog numpty and second of all the dogs are illegally exported from the country.

Learn some facts then shoot straight.

[kimamey]

I am all for taking care of stray animals until a home is found but when you are dealing with a few thousand unwanted dogs you have to be realistic and humanely end their lives.

Spend your resources on animals that do have a chance to being adopted but in Thailand most soi dogs will never have a home.

These dogs are not pets but pests,many people are feeding them but not really taking care of all their needs.

Be kind to the dogs and put them out of their misery,there are just too many.

As far as people eating dog,i have no problem with that.Regulate the trade and it will be a lot better for the animals,it is not only Thailand not doing enough but what about the countries that let these animals pass into their territory.

Many tourist are also guilty of the problem,in high season they feed the nice little puppies but what happens when they leave?

Valid comment however Thailand do not humanely euthanize animals as contrary to Buddhist beliefs. As long as they die naturally the suffering is OK.

A good point but it just shows hypocrisy. I live in a rural area and go to the local market almost every day. There are always dead animals there. lots of them and I doubt they died of natural causes. I have heard the excuse 'I didn't kill it someone else did. I'm just eating it'. I don't think I need to bother explaining what's wrong with that blame shifting comment.

If you don't want dead meat then there's no problem either. Over the last couple of weeks there have been turtles lizards insects frogs and fish. Now I admit I don't have any evidence for this but I'm fairly certain that the people I saw buying them aren't taking them home to keep as pets.

The only thing that seems to be contrary to many Buddhists here is honesty.

[Carioca]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

Well said, and I have two stray dogs that I am feeding now.

[DRONGOH]

Whats despicable about dog meat?even here in thailand people eat dog so what's the big deal? just can't get it.

True, it's cultural. Vietnamese eat rats and just about everyting else, the French eat frogs, and so do I when in Cambdia. People still eat people. Wrong? Perhaps for you when you've been fed all your life MacS%@t. Dogs' meat is healthier than KFC, and in my bible, the F doesn't stand for FRIED.

[sonar6ca]

Good idea to control the dog population, the question is who the hell is going to pay for it?

Another idea, why not sterilize the dealers instead?

[chooka]

There is an Australian documentary on this on the Australia Network this week, I believe it might be wednesday night.

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed as well as a reply.

[belg]

get rid of the soi dogs in general, what purpose do they serve ? they keep breathing over and over

thai dog owner and responsibility, not in the dictionary

at least, some people might enjoy the food ...

[Cholorado]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

Quick death? So a little info for you in those restaurants that serve a menu of dog's, the diner gets to go into the back and pick the dog they want (much like we pick lobsters or crabs in a live aquarium of a seafood restaurant) In some cases the dogs are hung up and roasted alive with a flame torch because of the belief that the adrenaline that surges through the body as they are scorched alive gives the meat a tastier effect. As for smaller dogs and puppies they are sometimes thrown into a pot of boiling water ....alive. So is it better to die of starvation? I don't know buddy that's debatable.

[lemoncake]

get rid of the soi dogs in general, what purpose do they serve ? they keep breathing over and over

thai dog owner and responsibility, not in the dictionary

at least, some people might enjoy the food ...

Same could be said for a number of people, especially those residing in Thailand.

[sandrabbit]

Thai dog owners, or ex dog keepers, make me scream here in Rayong when they come from Bangkok etc and dump the dogs on the local beaches then drive home. There are absolutely lovely previously well looked after dogs dumped, come to Mae Rhum Phum beach Rayong to find your next dog as a few local expats have done. It's a weekly occurrence seeing new dogs at the mercy of the existing dumped soi dogs and as some people have pointed out farang don't help when our Thai partners feed the cute puppies, a puppy was dumped alone today and none of us will do anything as we'll end up with a dog rescue centre we don't want. I have been attacked so many times, but not injured yet, as I understand and kept dogs but I refuse to do the same as the Thai recyclers and just bend my head and ignore them. There are a number of dogs who might have a rat poison and paracetamol burger if they continue their aggression, there was a 10yr old child attacked by a pack of dogs about 2 weeks ago in broad daylight on a nearby beach. I love dogs but what happens here is disgusting, look after them or not have them and cull the feral soi dogs before children are killed.

[Keesters]

No money to take care of them. Better they starve in the 'safety' of an unfunded shelter (over 70% of those intercepted died of starvation) than provide protein to poor people, money or plastic buckets to those who don't want to take care of them, and deprive traders of a livelihood supplying a market. Is starvation a more merciful death than a quick death at the hands of a skilled butcher?

There are truly needy people, including children, who don't have enough to eat every day in Thailand. What caring person would donate to feed and vaccinate dogs that no one will ever adopt when there is so much need among the human population. Some people need to get their priorities straight. I can hardly wait to hear from those who value stray dogs more than human children.

Well said, and I have two stray dogs that I am feeding now.

And I hope you are keeping them inside your property as ANY responsible dog owner should.

[asiamaster]

Quote: "If your readers are able to offer one of the dogs a home, SDF will transport the dog to Bangkok with the support of Nok Air, and de-sex and vaccinate it free of charge."

This is not a good idea. Dogs do not belong in the concrete jungle. A farang lady friend of mine who lives in a village near Khon Kaen has a "dog home" - of course there is only so much she can do but SDF should focus on raising funds to support such centres up country. And yes sterilizing is the only solution but it will take time and money.

Uh. I think that was what the article was about. They are supporting shelters up north or are you saying they should only support shelters run by your friends?

No I'm just saying to leave them where they are (and support them there) instead of bringing them to Bangkok.