U S: Six Dead In Santa Monica Shooting Rampage

[Ulysses G.]

It would be my gun of choice for self defence during a natural disaster when the police are stretched thin. I used an M16 in the miltary, so am familiar with the gun already, though it is not an automatic weapon.

As I said before, I am not necessarily against banning guns completely, but it has to apply to everyone - not just the law abiding. However, America has the right to bear arms in the constitution and that makes it a lot harder to forbid them than in olther countries.

Edited June 8, 2013 by Ulysses G.

[Morden]

Until they tighten up gun show loop holes, I guess we will never know. BTW, those loopholes put assault weapons and guns in the hands of criminals in case you didn't know. I mean xxxx, does common sense and people brains just blow out the window when guns are discussed. I wish we could IQ test all members of the NRA to fully appreciate the . . .

Let's at least get our facts straight, OK? California doesn't have a gun show loophole. Background checks are required. California doesn't allow high capacity "assault" type weapons.

Laws bind only the law abiding. Let's wait and see what the facts are, OK? Apparently there were two guys and who knows what motivated this?

Nothing precludes someone from buying a gun out of state. This is what the problem is. Some states have tough laws, and others do not.

In any case, the gunman is reported to have killed his father and brother. Hardly seems like anything other than a mentally ill male.

I am very sorry about the killings.

You are mistaken. A person may purchase a firearm only from a citizen or dealer in his own state. A Federally licensed gun dealer may transfer a gun to another Federally licensed dealer in another state, where then within that new state a citizen of that state may purchase the gun from that dealer in his state. All sales through dealers require background checks.

So, if I wanted to sell a gun to my best friend who lived in another state, I would have to go to a licensed dealer in my state and have him ship the gun to a dealer in my friend's state. Then my friend could go to that dealer in his state and pay the transfer and background check fees, fill out the Federal paperwork and get his gun. I would have to fill out paperwork with the dealer in my state, and pay him to ship to the new dealer in the other state.

In this case of California, no dealer would accept a gun which had a magazine which held more than 10 rounds because such magazines are illegal in California. That applies to rifles and handguns.

But a criminal would merely cross a State line and buy a gun privately.

[Angeledge777]

Just to let you know that California has the stricter gun control laws in the entire country. It haven't stopped the guy from shooting six people. Also, UK has the highest violent crimes homicides in the world and they have gun and knives control laws. Well, once you understand that you can't stop these crazy people from committing a crime, you understand why you need guns. Once the criminals starts following the laws, I'll be glad to dispose of my weapons.

[Morden]

Just to let you know that California has the stricter gun control laws in the entire country. It haven't stopped the guy from shooting six people. Also, UK has the highest violent crimes homicides in the world and they have gun and knives control laws. Well, once you understand that you can't stop these crazy people from committing a crime, you understand why you need guns. Once the criminals starts following the laws, I'll be glad to dispose of my weapons.

Show us the separate stats. for homicide and gun homicide and massacres, please.

from what I'm reading here, I'd be much safer in the UK than the US.

[CrisRMenumate]

Everyone arguing about gun control, what we need is people control... and everyone seems to have missed the obvious... he was a "Man in black"... wont the red shirts need him? has DSI identified him? how did he escape to California? puns aside, another senseless tragedy by idiots with guns and a general inability to solve whatever personal demons they have any other way than to take it out on others, usually innocent, sad and sadderer

[stoli]

But it happened in CALIFORNIA, which has some of the toughest gun laws in the entire United States! Can't keep a quitter from quitting, a loser from losing, or a madman from doing harm.

Until they tighten up gun show loop holes, I guess we will never know. BTW, those loopholes put assault weapons and guns in the hands of criminals in case you didn't know. I mean xxxx, does common sense and people brains just blow out the window when guns are discussed. I wish we could IQ test all members of the NRA to fully appreciate the . . .

Let's at least get our facts straight, OK? California doesn't have a gun show loophole. Background checks are required. California doesn't allow high capacity "assault" type weapons.

Laws bind only the law abiding. Let's wait and see what the facts are, OK? Apparently there were two guys and who knows what motivated this?

But they can buy in Arizona, Texas or where ever at gun show and take it back to Cali. Correct. Haha, take the Otis test and let's put my theory to test!!!

No, you have to show residency in the state that you are purchasing the firearm. Before you get into a gun control debate, you really need to learn the laws, and not just believe in what someone wants you to believe. There are so many falsehoods put out by the anti-gun lobby that will not pass any test of being truthful.

[NeverSure]

The AR15 is one of the most common semi-automatic rifles in America. It's used for competition, sports shooting, target practice, and hunting. But it's only one of many semi-automatic rifles sold. But the media loves to demonize it because it looks like a fully-automatic M16. It isn't. An the media is simply fear-mongering.

Educate yourself: http://www.assaultweapon.info.

Also, gun advocates are generally individuals with conservative values: like the love of family. We have immense compassion for the victims of gun related crimes. We arm ourselves so we (and our families) do not become victims of gun related crimes. And I reiterate...since 1993 gun related homicide in the United States has decreased 49%.

The AR15 and Bushmaster might be useful for target shooting but I doubt even that is they are no more than .22 rifles with fancy bits stuck on them. There are several hunting programmes on the box made in the USA. In none of them is anything other than a standard rifle used.

How is putting a gun within reach of your children 'love of family' when there are so many cases of siblings killing siblings whilst playing with Dad's loaded gun? if you really feel the need to protect yourself at home, and I fully understand that, then you should learn how to keep the thing safe. Carrying a loaded gun stuffed under your jacket in public is likely to cause more trouble than it might solve.

'Love of family' is not exclusive to gun toting Americans. Some other countries deal with that my taking action to minimise gun crime.

Gun homicide might have decreased but what about massacres involving guns that have no legitimate use outside of a gun club?

I can't even understand your first paragraph.

Bushmaster is only one manufacturer of AR-15's. If you are saying they are just .22's, you are mistaken. They are .224 caliber. A .22 is a small rim fire cartridge, but a .224 NATO round (5.56 NATO) is a much larger center fire cartridge that has a much bigger and heavier bullet that travels at three times the speed of the .22lr. It has far more range, and is legal and effective at killing deer in my state. If it's effective on Taliban, it's effective on deer.

It is a very viable hunting rifle and often used. It happens to be black which seems to freak people out.

What's this about having "no legitimate use outside of a gun club?" It would be my gun of choice for deer hunting as it's light weight and easy to carry.

Why do you need a semi-automatic for hunting. Do you pretend that deer are Taliban?

Don't you know that most modern firearms are semi-automatic? The press has managed to make that into a dirty word. All of my shotguns are semi-automatic including my fancy walnut stocked, hand carved bird guns. Many of the most expensive walnut and polished blued guns are semi-automatic. Some of the best come from Europe.

They aren't fully automatic machine guns. They are "auto loaders."

[dressedingreen]

As usual, one should ask 'who benefits'? Is what we see REALLY what we're seeing? The Boston bombing and this shooting (and a number of previous shootings) have a plethora of unanswered questions clouding the issues. I'm certainly not a NRA supporter, far from it. But my feeling is Americans (I'm not one) should hold onto their personal weapons into the foreseeable future. I believe they will need them. Their government, and the powerful elites behind it, is currently running amok on this planet and needs a docile, fearful and supportive citizenry nodding at its ongoing global domination agenda. Disarming them and keeping them in a continual cycle of fear is a very successful way of achieving such acquiescence.

DIG

Edited June 8, 2013 by dressedingreen

[Morden]

No, you have to show residency in the state that you are purchasing the firearm. Before you get into a gun control debate, you really need to learn the laws, and not just believe in what someone wants you to believe. There are so many falsehoods put out by the anti-gun lobby that will not pass any test of being truthful.

And what about private sales?

By the way, there's no anti-gun lobby of which I'm aware. It's a falsehood! But there is a gun control lobby. Most people advocate better controls on the types of gun, permits, private sales, the suitability of a person to have a gun and the enforcement of laws.

Edited June 8, 2013 by Morden

[Credo]

I am wondering what kind of gun I should buy to protect myself against the AR-15 type guns? It needs to be rather portable, since I might need to have it quite handy while driving a car.

[Morden]

The AR15 is one of the most common semi-automatic rifles in America. It's used for competition, sports shooting, target practice, and hunting. But it's only one of many semi-automatic rifles sold. But the media loves to demonize it because it looks like a fully-automatic M16. It isn't. An the media is simply fear-mongering.

Educate yourself: http://www.assaultweapon.info.

Also, gun advocates are generally individuals with conservative values: like the love of family. We have immense compassion for the victims of gun related crimes. We arm ourselves so we (and our families) do not become victims of gun related crimes. And I reiterate...since 1993 gun related homicide in the United States has decreased 49%.

The AR15 and Bushmaster might be useful for target shooting but I doubt even that is they are no more than .22 rifles with fancy bits stuck on them. There are several hunting programmes on the box made in the USA. In none of them is anything other than a standard rifle used.

How is putting a gun within reach of your children 'love of family' when there are so many cases of siblings killing siblings whilst playing with Dad's loaded gun? if you really feel the need to protect yourself at home, and I fully understand that, then you should learn how to keep the thing safe. Carrying a loaded gun stuffed under your jacket in public is likely to cause more trouble than it might solve.

'Love of family' is not exclusive to gun toting Americans. Some other countries deal with that my taking action to minimise gun crime.

Gun homicide might have decreased but what about massacres involving guns that have no legitimate use outside of a gun club?

Why do you need a semi-automatic for hunting. Do you pretend that deer are Taliban?

Don't you know that most modern firearms are semi-automatic? The press has managed to make that into a dirty word. All of my shotguns are semi-automatic including my fancy walnut stocked, hand carved bird guns. Many of the most expensive walnut and polished blued guns are semi-automatic. Some of the best come from Europe.

They aren't fully automatic machine guns. They are "auto loaders."

And how many rounds do the mags. hold?

I agree that some of the best guns come from Europe. Much recommended to me is the CZ .22 range - bolt action and auto loader but certainly not a semi-automatic like the AR15.

[Angeledge777]

Just to let you know that California has the stricter gun control laws in the entire country. It haven't stopped the guy from shooting six people. Also, UK has the highest violent crimes homicides in the world and they have gun and knives control laws. Well, once you understand that you can't stop these crazy people from committing a crime, you understand why you need guns. Once the criminals starts following the laws, I'll be glad to dispose of my weapons.

Show us the separate stats. for homicide and gun homicide and massacres, please.

from what I'm reading here, I'd be much safer in the UK than the US.

Why is that relevant wether the crime has been commited by a knife, a spoon or a gun? What is relevant is the ratio per capita of violent crime rate.

Sadly, UK do have the highest crime rate per capita. That means that even without guns (as you have gun control laws), the criminals uses other weapons to commit their crimes. You would feel safer in the UK than the US? Fine, but I can't wait to see the day a muslim will be able to butcher a soldier in the middle of the street, during the day and in front of everyone in Texas. Also add that the state of Vermont has the lowest crime rate in the US and have absolutely no gun laws.

Fact is that criminals will never comply to the laws, they don't care about it. The only people complying to the laws are the honnest citizen, those who will never shoot anybody for nothing. Gun control laws works, they remove everybody the right to defend themselves against somebody with an illegal gun, a knife or any other weapons that can be used for a murder.

Also, knowing that everyone around you bear a gun, do you think the criminal wants to try to arm anybody? He knows he is going to have 10 guns behind the head before he can shoot a bullet.

This said, look at all the gun crimes in the US. They all have a point in common, they have been perpetrated where there is strict gun laws. Chicago is the most dangerous city in the US with very strict gun laws. Again, the criminals refused to comply to them.

Source:

http://warnewsupdates.blogspot.com/2012/12/what-country-has-most-violent-crime.html?m=1

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

[TexasRanger]

Sadly, despite being armed most people who commit massacres in the US do so unchallenged. Love the right to bear arms but nowhere to be seen when someone shoots up the mall.

[NeverSure]

No, you have to show residency in the state that you are purchasing the firearm. Before you get into a gun control debate, you really need to learn the laws, and not just believe in what someone wants you to believe. There are so many falsehoods put out by the anti-gun lobby that will not pass any test of being truthful.

And what about private sales?

By the way, there's no anti-gun lobby of which I'm aware. It's a falsehood! But there is a gun control lobby. Most people advocate better controls on the types of gun, permits, private sales, the suitability of a person to have a gun and the enforcement of laws.

Private sales are the same. You commit a Federal crime if you sell to a private citizen who isn't a resident of your state.

As for anti gun lobbies there are several. One prominent one is the Brady Campaign. Regardless of what they call themselves, they are anti-gun.

[JulesMad]

But it happened in CALIFORNIA, which has some of the toughest gun laws in the entire United States! Can't keep a quitter from quitting, a loser from losing, or a madman from doing harm.

The highest gun crime is in the cities and states with the toughest gun laws; LA, California; Chicago, IL; New York, NY. States that encourage gun ownership and concealed/open carry have the lowest gun crime rates. Armed citizens are a deterrent to violent criminals. Also, since 1993 the incidence of gun related homicide is down -- 49%. And even Illinois, a state with one of the most strict gun control laws has just recently legislated to allow concealed carry by citizens.

As for the NRA blaming the victims for not carrying, that is simply a stupid statement. However, we do blame over-zealous politicians who make it difficult for the average, citizen to own (and carry) a firearm for self-protection. Gun ownership by law-abiding citizens deters crime, especially violent gun related crime.

If you aren't an American who was brought up around guns and the gun culture, you'll never understand. And if you're a non-American, we really don't care what you think, although you're welcome to your opinion.

I am a non-American (and proud of it!). I am NOT brought up around guns and gun culture. I have never seen a gun doing something good (except killing people!)

And I am very much aware, that you (as an American) don't really care what I (and other non-Americans) think. That is also WHY I can NOT give my honest opinion, because you Americans use guns to proof your own opinion (when you don't like another person's opinion).

I am very sad that 6 people have died in yet another shooting rampage. Again!!! California or another province, that does not really matter.... This is all due to your own laws, so with respect to the dead, som nam na

[NeverSure]

Sadly, despite being armed most people who commit massacres in the US do so unchallenged. Love the right to bear arms but nowhere to be seen when someone shoots up the mall.

Most Americans don't carry a gun. By far most don't. Many have a license to carry one simply because it's handy for transporting. All of the laws about how you can carry a gun, even in your car change if you have a license. This is handy when going hunting or fishing or even to the range.

Most Americans who have a gun have it to protect their homes. They use them about 2.5 million times a year, and about 200,000 women avoid being sexually abused each year by having a gun. Usually no shots are fired. The mere presence of the gun is the persuader.

Guns are used 80 times as often for defense as they are for committing crimes. Please read this.

[Angeledge777]

Those saying that gun kills people, try this. Put the gun in front of your window and tell me, at the end of the day, how many persons it killed. Are forks responsible of obesity? Are cars responsible of the drunk driving or the driver is responsible?

Guns, like other things, are inanimate objects. They are tools, they have no feelings and are not responsible for anything. People using it are responsible. This said, I am glad that most of the pro-gun laws admitted they never even holded one. If guns were responsible of murders, I would be dead since a very loooong time...

[OzMick]

An AR-15 doesn't have to be modified - it will accept a larger capacity magazine, and standard for the M-16 is 30 rounds. I'm sure larger capacity magazines would be available for most rifles with a removable magazine.

A simple modification to the trigger sear will enable full auto, and I would assume that conversion kits would be available though likely illegal. Converting my Ozarmy issue SLR 7.62 was as simple as slipping a paper match (included in every ration pack) under the sear.

Though not at all happy at handing over my rifles when the law was enacted in Oz, I accepted that in a democracy the will of the majority should be accepted.

[Emdog]

One bullet in the head can spoil your whole day, or weekend. I guess my dying thoughts would be something like "Well, I can feel good because I died supporting the right for "a well regulated militia", like the thugs that just shot me. I am an American. And let us not forget there are more gun homicides in total in Thailand than in USA.

[NeverSure]

Gun laws to be effective need to be FEDERAL. Duh. Thank you Australia for showing the way. Too bad the USA has become retarded in attempting such basic and helpful changes to save the lives of their OWN citizens.

The US is a republic of states. All powers not expressly given to the federal government in the constitution are reserved for the states. That's why laws vary state to state.

As for federal, it is bound by the constitution which demands that citizens be allowed to keep and bear arms. So are the states bound by that constitution.

This topic isn't about Australia.

[NeverSure]

One bullet in the head can spoil your whole day, or weekend. I guess my dying thoughts would be something like "Well, I can feel good because I died supporting the right for "a well regulated militia", like the thugs that just shot me. I am an American. And let us not forget there are more gun homicides in total in Thailand than in USA.

There are ten times as many gun murders per capita in Thailand as there are in the US. Yet many posting here are in the very dangerous Thailand and are so worried about the US, a place they'll probably never even see.

[fire and ice]

But it happened in CALIFORNIA, which has some of the toughest gun laws in the entire United States! Can't keep a quitter from quitting, a loser from losing, or a madman from doing harm.

Absurd point, it merely means Califirnia has only 99% the loosest gun laws int he world. As oppsoed to certain other states whch are 100% the loosest.

IN reality the whole gun issue in the USA is a case of its hard to fix it now by chnagin laws etc as there are too mnay guns alreayd out there.

[Morden]

Just to let you know that California has the stricter gun control laws in the entire country. It haven't stopped the guy from shooting six people. Also, UK has the highest violent crimes homicides in the world and they have gun and knives control laws. Well, once you understand that you can't stop these crazy people from committing a crime, you understand why you need guns. Once the criminals starts following the laws, I'll be glad to dispose of my weapons.

Show us the separate stats. for homicide and gun homicide and massacres, please.

from what I'm reading here, I'd be much safer in the UK than the US.

Why is that relevant wether the crime has been commited by a knife, a spoon or a gun? What is relevant is the ratio per capita of violent crime rate.

Sadly, UK do have the highest crime rate per capita. That means that even without guns (as you have gun control laws), the criminals uses other weapons to commit their crimes. You would feel safer in the UK than the US? Fine, but I can't wait to see the day a muslim will be able to butcher a soldier in the middle of the street, during the day and in front of everyone in Texas. Also add that the state of Vermont has the lowest crime rate in the US and have absolutely no gun laws.

Fact is that criminals will never comply to the laws, they don't care about it. The only people complying to the laws are the honnest citizen, those who will never shoot anybody for nothing. Gun control laws works, they remove everybody the right to defend themselves against somebody with an illegal gun, a knife or any other weapons that can be used for a murder.

Also, knowing that everyone around you bear a gun, do you think the criminal wants to try to arm anybody? He knows he is going to have 10 guns behind the head before he can shoot a bullet.

This said, look at all the gun crimes in the US. They all have a point in common, they have been perpetrated where there is strict gun laws. Chicago is the most dangerous city in the US with very strict gun laws. Again, the criminals refused to comply to them.

Source:

http://warnewsupdates.blogspot.com/2012/12/what-country-has-most-violent-crime.html?m=1

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

If you want to argue about the different methods used for killing people, then stats. are relevant! You can apply that to comparison of deaths in the US and elsewhere in the West caused by Muslims if you wish.

Yes, I would feel safer in the UK than in the US. I have lived in one for many years and visited the other several times. Violent crime is not widespread in the UK as it seems to be in the US.

Some of your honest citizens are rather careless with their guns, aren't they? How many kids have got hold of Dad's gun and killed their brothers or sisters this year in the US?

Anyway, this thread is about yet another massacre in the US.

[NeverSure]

But it happened in CALIFORNIA, which has some of the toughest gun laws in the entire United States! Can't keep a quitter from quitting, a loser from losing, or a madman from doing harm.

Absurd point, it merely means Califirnia has only 99% the loosest gun laws int he world. As oppsoed to certain other states whch are 100% the loosest.

IN reality the whole gun issue in the USA is a case of its hard to fix it now by chnagin laws etc as there are too mnay guns alreayd out there.

No, it isn't hard to fix because there are so many guns out there. It is impossible to change because it is a different culture. The people want it that way. There was a recent gun registration bill in the US Senate which failed to pass because the senators wanted to be reelected.

It is the culture of the US which was born in violence, lived with violence and wants to be sure to protect itself. It will not be overrun by another country. It will not be overrun by terrorists. It will not be overrun by home invaders. It's something that people who aren't Americans can't and won't understand but they don't need to because it's none of their business.

It's that simple. Some of us think that people who are willing to be in their homes or about town when there are terrorists among them, and have no way to defend themselves are crazy. Some of us think they will rue the day they allowed that to happen as their terrorist population grows.

But that's none of my business.

[Morden]

Those saying that gun kills people, try this. Put the gun in front of your window and tell me, at the end of the day, how many persons it killed. Are forks responsible of obesity? Are cars responsible of the drunk driving or the driver is responsible?

Guns, like other things, are inanimate objects. They are tools, they have no feelings and are not responsible for anything. People using it are responsible. This said, I am glad that most of the pro-gun laws admitted they never even holded one. If guns were responsible of murders, I would be dead since a very loooong time...

That's an old, tired and false argument. Stationery cars don't often kill people but they have to meet safety laws and drivers need to have a licence. People with guns kill and the laws related to who and what surely need to be changed. Or is the right to own crazy guns more important than people's lives?

[Angeledge777]

Those saying that gun kills people, try this. Put the gun in front of your window and tell me, at the end of the day, how many persons it killed. Are forks responsible of obesity? Are cars responsible of the drunk driving or the driver is responsible?

Guns, like other things, are inanimate objects. They are tools, they have no feelings and are not responsible for anything. People using it are responsible. This said, I am glad that most of the pro-gun laws admitted they never even holded one. If guns were responsible of murders, I would be dead since a very loooong time...

That's an old, tired and false argument. Stationery cars don't often kill people but they have to meet safety laws and drivers need to have a licence. People with guns kill and the laws related to who and what surely need to be changed. Or is the right to own crazy guns more important than people's lives?

Your statement doesn't make any sense. What you want is good people to have guns so they can fight back when bad people use them for bad purposes. At the moment, only criminals own guns, is that what you prefers?

Wether it's an old and tireing argument, it still an unanswered argument. Once somebody can answer properly how a tool can become a killer, this argument is up-to-date and valid.

[Angeledge777]

Just to let you know that California has the stricter gun control laws in the entire country. It haven't stopped the guy from shooting six people. Also, UK has the highest violent crimes homicides in the world and they have gun and knives control laws. Well, once you understand that you can't stop these crazy people from committing a crime, you understand why you need guns. Once the criminals starts following the laws, I'll be glad to dispose of my weapons.

Show us the separate stats. for homicide and gun homicide and massacres, please.

from what I'm reading here, I'd be much safer in the UK than the US.

Why is that relevant wether the crime has been commited by a knife, a spoon or a gun? What is relevant is the ratio per capita of violent crime rate.

Sadly, UK do have the highest crime rate per capita. That means that even without guns (as you have gun control laws), the criminals uses other weapons to commit their crimes. You would feel safer in the UK than the US? Fine, but I can't wait to see the day a muslim will be able to butcher a soldier in the middle of the street, during the day and in front of everyone in Texas. Also add that the state of Vermont has the lowest crime rate in the US and have absolutely no gun laws.

Fact is that criminals will never comply to the laws, they don't care about it. The only people complying to the laws are the honnest citizen, those who will never shoot anybody for nothing. Gun control laws works, they remove everybody the right to defend themselves against somebody with an illegal gun, a knife or any other weapons that can be used for a murder.

Also, knowing that everyone around you bear a gun, do you think the criminal wants to try to arm anybody? He knows he is going to have 10 guns behind the head before he can shoot a bullet.

This said, look at all the gun crimes in the US. They all have a point in common, they have been perpetrated where there is strict gun laws. Chicago is the most dangerous city in the US with very strict gun laws. Again, the criminals refused to comply to them.

Source:

http://warnewsupdates.blogspot.com/2012/12/what-country-has-most-violent-crime.html?m=1

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

If you want to argue about the different methods used for killing people, then stats. are relevant! You can apply that to comparison of deaths in the US and elsewhere in the West caused by Muslims if you wish.

Yes, I would feel safer in the UK than in the US. I have lived in one for many years and visited the other several times. Violent crime is not widespread in the UK as it seems to be in the US.

Some of your honest citizens are rather careless with their guns, aren't they? How many kids have got hold of Dad's gun and killed their brothers or sisters this year in the US?

Anyway, this thread is about yet another massacre in the US.

You're right. This thread is about yet another massacre in a state where they have strict gun control laws. The criminals are not stupid, they know where to go to commit these crimes unchallenged. New Jersey, Ney York, California and Illinois are those states with the highest crime rate and the stricter gun laws.

As for the way of killing somebody, it is irrelavant to know which tool they used to commit their crimes. What if I ask you which way would you prefere to be a victim, with a knife, a baseball bat or a gun? At the end, you don't want to be a victim or, at least, you would like to be able to defend yourself. A crime is as violent using a knife or a gun, that is the point. UK are number one in violent crime rate while US are 26th. Switzerland is the safest country in the world when everybody owns a gun. Why Switzerland is the safest country with so many guns? With your arguments, it is clear that everybody would shoot at each other. That's not the case and you know why? Because the criminal knows there are too many armed honnest people around him.

I went to both Houston and New York City. I even took a walk in Harlem. You know what? I feel a way safer in Houston than NYC. UK mmmmm... I wouldnt want to be the next man being butchered in the street while being watch by dozens of unarmed people that can't do anything except looking at me being killed.

[sstuff3]

Sad news. Heartfelt condolences to the families of the deceased.

Why is it that anytime a shooting happens in the US, it gets worldwide media attention and turns into an endless debate on gun control?? (Rhetorical question).

Gun control is not relevant to this or any other news story related to the use of guns. Furthermore, gun control in America is not the business of anyone except
the citizens of America. The Bill of Rights was written for a specific reason, should, and will be upheld, as this is the will of the majority of Americans.

Unfortunately, the reason it was included in the Bill of Rights seems more relevant today than at any time in recent history. For non-Americans to engage in debates regarding gun control in America is simply a waste of time and energy for all involved.

[Scott]

Off-topic, inflammatory and baiting posts have been deleted. Non-Americans are welcome to post their opinion and saying otherwise will result in action against you.

[simple1]

Sad news. Heartfelt condolences to the families of the deceased.

Why is it that anytime a shooting happens in the US, it gets worldwide media attention and turns into an endless debate on gun control?? (Rhetorical question).

Gun control is not relevant to this or any other news story related to the use of guns. Furthermore, gun control in America is not the business of anyone except

the citizens of America. The Bill of Rights was written for a specific reason, should, and will be upheld, as this is the will of the majority of Americans.

Unfortunately, the reason it was included in the Bill of Rights seems more relevant today than at any time in recent history. For non-Americans to engage in debates regarding gun control in America is simply a waste of time and energy for all involved.

Didn't know the US has a copywright on orginal thought. So you are saying that if a non US citizen had an epiphany that contributed to policy regards gun control, leading to a reduction in gun crime, it would be rejected?