Nsa Contractor Identifies Himself As Source

[SinglePot]

He is not at all surprised at how much he is being hunted.

The attention seeking is the game.

Mixed in with a dose of I am being victimised.

He doesn't give a monkeys toss about human rights and the US.

[Sing_Sling]

'up a gum tree' means 'in slight difficulty'.

Where? Never heard of it

be up a gum tree (British & Australian old-fashioned) also be up a tree (American old-fashioned)

to be in a very difficult situation

Usage notes: A small animal in Australia called a possum climbs up a gum tree when it is being chased.

If the insurance company won't pay for the damage, I'll be up a gum tree

I'm Australian and have never heard that expression

[simple1]

'up a gum tree' means 'in slight difficulty'.

Where? Never heard of it

be up a gum tree (British & Australian old-fashioned) also be up a tree (American old-fashioned)

to be in a very difficult situation

Usage notes: A small animal in Australia called a possum climbs up a gum tree when it is being chased.

If the insurance company won't pay for the damage, I'll be up a gum tree

I'm Australian and have never heard that expression

I'm an Australian citizen & know the expression and meaning, but never used in conversation. There again I'd never heard of "fair shake of the sauce bottle"until Rudd used it

Edited July 13, 2013 by simple1

[Sing_Sling]

be up a gum tree (British & Australian old-fashioned) also be up a tree (American old-fashioned)

to be in a very difficult situation

Usage notes: A small animal in Australia called a possum climbs up a gum tree when it is being chased.

If the insurance company won't pay for the damage, I'll be up a gum tree

I'm Australian and have never heard that expression

I'm an Australian citizen & know the expression and meaning, but never used in conversation. There again I'd never heard of "fair shake of the sauce bottle"until Rudd used it

Hmm, I've been living under a stone then, but I confess I'm not an ocker . . . as for 'fair shake of the sauce bottle' . . . Never heard of that either.

I'm not an Aussie

[Scott]

A nonsensical troll post has been removed. Continue posting completely unsubstantiated material and you will receive a suspension.

[jamhar]

I guess he's not in a hurry.

Russia 'has not received' Snowden asylum bid

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23300425

Trying to stay up with point and counterpoint

between the NSA and one of its former analysts is giving me a headache

[SinglePot]

'Outside the law'

On Friday, Mr Snowden said in a statement he formally accepted all offers of support or asylum he had already received "and all others that may be offered in the future"

But he added that the US and some European countries had "demonstrated a willingness to act outside the law".

Well, if that isn't hypocrisy I'm an ocker.

[jamhar]

Interesting point made in an article

We could be talking about whether accessing and monitoring citizen information and communications is constitutional, or whether we should continue to allow a secret court to authorize secret warrants using secret legal opinions.

But we’re not. We’re talking about you! And flight paths between Moscow and Venezuela, and how much of a jerk Glenn Greenwald is. We could at least be talking about whether the Obama administration is right that your leak jeopardized national security. But we’re not talking about that, Ed.

We’re talking about you. I can imagine you’d say, “Well, then stop! Just talk about something else.” But here’s the problem, even if your initial leak didn’t compromise national security, your new cloak-and-dagger game is having real and tangible geopolitical consequences. So, well, we have to talk about … you.

Link to article -melissa-harris-perry-edward-snowden

Edited July 14, 2013 by jamhar

[Scott]

Off-topic posts arguing about sources have been deleted as well as replies.

Stay on-topic.

[jamhar]

The "Snowden Effect" starting,

N.S.A. Leaks Revive Push in Russia to Control Net

"MOSCOW — Edward J. Snowden, the former National Security Agency contractor, fled the United States saying he did not want to live in a surveillance state.

But now the Russians are using his very presence here — on Friday Mr. Snowden said he intended to remain in Russia for some time while seeking asylum elsewhere — to push for tighter controls over the Internet...............

Link nsa-leaks-stir-plans-in-russia-to-control-net.

Edit

Just realized that "lovetotravel" posted the article and link first in the Snowded Asylum thread. My Apologies

Edited July 15, 2013 by jamhar

[jamhar]

An interesting article:

On the tiny Mediterranean island of Malta, two Italian hackers have been searching for bugs — not the island’s many beetle varieties, but secret flaws in computer code that governments pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to learn about and exploit.

................

Israel, Britain, Russia, India and Brazil are some of the biggest spenders. North Korea is in the market, as are some Middle Eastern intelligence services. Countries in the Asian Pacific, including Malaysia and Singapore, are buying, too, according to the Center for Strategic and International Studies in Washington.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/14/world/europe/nations-buying-as-hackers-sell-computer-flaws.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_ae_20130714&_r=0

From the other thread.

Very interesting article. Thanks for the share.

[SinglePot]

"There is a big difference between a whistleblower and someone who gives up top secret information that is classified information. Edward Snowden is same as Benidict Arnold and he should be shot between the eyes.

I would be very concerned if my home country USA did not do everything possible to protect me. We do not need another 9/11. If you do not think China or Russia are not doing the same then you live in a very small world."

Quote from a citizen who says he is "Proud to be American" July 2013.

I can hear this voice loud and clear.

[lannarebirth]

How the Snowden Leaks Are Leveling the Oversight Playing Field

"We are overseen by everybody," NSA Chief Keith Alexander lamented last year, reiterating, as he likes to do, that the agency's surveillance is subservient to all three branches of government. Congress passes the laws, the judiciary evaluates them, and the executive branch implements them.

RELATED: A Former Judge on the Secret Privacy Court Says He Quit Over Surveillance

Except that Congress is generally kept in the dark on details. And except that courts have been stymied in assessing the constitutionality of the behavior behavior. Both thanks to the stinginess of Barack Obama's executive branch that runs the show. Now, thanks to Snowden, that's shifting.

http://news.yahoo.com/snowden-leaks-leveling-oversight-playing-field-201333351.html

All of the linked articles within the quoted article are pretty good and show maybe a shift in thinking with regards to surveillance is occurring.

[F430murci]

How the Snowden Leaks Are Leveling the Oversight Playing Field

"We are overseen by everybody," NSA Chief Keith Alexander lamented last year, reiterating, as he likes to do, that the agency's surveillance is subservient to all three branches of government. Congress passes the laws, the judiciary evaluates them, and the executive branch implements them.

RELATED: A Former Judge on the Secret Privacy Court Says He Quit Over Surveillance

Except that Congress is generally kept in the dark on details. And except that courts have been stymied in assessing the constitutionality of the behavior behavior. Both thanks to the stinginess of Barack Obama's executive branch that runs the show. Now, thanks to Snowden, that's shifting.

http://news.yahoo.com/snowden-leaks-leveling-oversight-playing-field-201333351.html

All of the linked articles within the quoted article are pretty good and show maybe a shift in thinking with regards to surveillance is occurring.

He quit in 2005 when Bush was doing warrantless wire taps and Bush was allegedly doing them without warrant domestically. This article also confirms everything was made legal under Bush's watch.

Now I don't particular like Obama right now and I hate 4th Amendment erosion, but you cannot blame Bama for continuing surveillance programs already in place. If he stopped and we had another twin towers episode, the <deleted> would hit the fan for him stopping and we would never hear the end of the conservative uproar.

The bigger issue is legality. Your article confirms the legality. That a judge quit because he thought it was a n erosion of the 4th amendment is honorable. That, however, does not mean its illegal.

I would love to see the law change, the 4th amend returned to status quo per 2001 and Roberts and Alito not on the Supreme Court. Alas, does not matter what I want. The reality is we are living with another Bush gift that keeps on giving.

Edited July 16, 2013 by F430murci

[mania]

but you cannot blame Bama for continuing surveillance programs already in place. If he stopped and we had another twin towers episode, the <deleted> would hit the fan for him stopping and we would never hear the end of the conservative uproar.

I know you didn't mean to make that sound as insane as it does

[jamhar]

How the Snowden Leaks Are Leveling the Oversight Playing Field

"We are overseen by everybody," NSA Chief Keith Alexander lamented last year, reiterating, as he likes to do, that the agency's surveillance is subservient to all three branches of government. Congress passes the laws, the judiciary evaluates them, and the executive branch implements them.

RELATED: A Former Judge on the Secret Privacy Court Says He Quit Over Surveillance

Except that Congress is generally kept in the dark on details. And except that courts have been stymied in assessing the constitutionality of the behavior behavior. Both thanks to the stinginess of Barack Obama's executive branch that runs the show. Now, thanks to Snowden, that's shifting.

http://news.yahoo.com/snowden-leaks-leveling-oversight-playing-field-201333351.html

All of the linked articles within the quoted article are pretty good and show maybe a shift in thinking with regards to surveillance is occurring.

He quit in 2005 when Bush was doing warrantless wire taps and Bush was allegedly doing them without warrant domestically. This article also confirms everything was made legal under Bush's watch.

Now I don't particular like Obama right now and I hate 4th Amendment erosion, but you cannot blame Bama for continuing surveillance programs already in place. If he stopped and we had another twin towers episode, the <deleted> would hit the fan for him stopping and we would never hear the end of the conservative uproar.

The bigger issue is legality. Your article confirms the legality. That a judge quit because he thought it was a n erosion of the 4th amendment is honorable. That, however, does not mean its illegal.

I would love to see the law change, the 4th amend returned to status quo per 2001 and Roberts and Alito not on the Supreme Court. Alas, does not matter what I want. The reality is we are living with another Bush gift that keeps on giving.

Just a point to bring up. I "liked" F430's post. It shows an attempt at neutral thinking, and brings up some good points. I dont always agree with F430 , and I dont agree with all of this post, but i do like it.

PS to TV'ers..... You dont have to agree with someone post to see its value!

Also, Theres bound to be fallout from the snowden fiasco. Thats what we do with fiasco's, we learn, correct our mistakes and move on. We get better. Hopefully the NSA, and others charged with the protecting the US will get better also. Else we'll have more attacks on US soil.

I'm off my soapbox now.

[SinglePot]

And I see you posted this today at 9.11 am.

Good post. we listen and try to learn.

[jamhar]

Thanks SP

There is a small silver lining in this Snowden debacle for the NSA, and i do mean tiny!

Up to now, the NSA have shouldered the responsibility of doing surveillance on communication and internet traffic, but with increasing muddy authorization to do so. Needless to say, much of that is under scrutiny now, and they should have a more clearer direction going forward......... until the next attack on US soil, when the question of "why didnt we know"? will be asked.

NSA spying under fire: 'You've got a problem'

http://news.yahoo.com/nsa-spying-under-fire-youve-got-problem-164530431.html

[F430murci]

but you cannot blame Bama for continuing surveillance programs already in place. If he stopped and we had another twin towers episode, the <deleted> would hit the fan for him stopping and we would never hear the end of the conservative uproar.

I know you didn't mean to make that sound as insane as it does

Haha, I still think it makes sense.

Conservatives are in favor of Patriot Act programs. If Bama stopped and we had huge incident, do you not think everyone would be saying he failed to do what was in his power to stop the attack.

Heck, I might even think that. Truth is, he is weak and more concerned about perceived civil rights injustices and entitlement programs than national security and global affairs. I am starting to think that he just leaves that stuff including conflicts over seas status quo as it would take too much effort to fix and he prefers to devote his time and efforts on personal agendas.

At least that is how it seems to me after the last couple of months. I am so disenchanted by recent developments and let down in the hopes I had regarding his second term that I no longer know what to believe.

Edited July 17, 2013 by F430murci

[F430murci]

Too funny.

Bama is looking to appoint Ray Kelly as head of Department of Homeland Security.

Ray Kelly criticized Bus for not doing enough warrantless wire taps and kept a controversial database of millions of people.

Ray Kelly has one of if not the the largest racial profiling police programs in the country.

I guess Bama is really a huge advocate of secret courts, FISA, Patriot Act and warrantless wire taps after all.

[F430murci]

Private Companies tracking your cars. No privacy anywhere.

http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/19/19548772-license-plate-data-not-just-for-cops-private-companies-are-tracking-your-car?lite

[jamhar]

Its actually pretty easy to have privacy.

Give up electronics and go to a simpler way of life.

We give people (private and government) all the tools to track and monitor

we like features like being able to locate our friends and kids using GPS and google maps

then we are shocked when others track us! The NERVE!

Private companies are probably the biggest culprits. Their bottom line depends on it.

Want more privicy? You know what to do.

[F430murci]

Its actually pretty easy to have privacy.

Give up electronics and go to a simpler way of life.

We give people (private and government) all the tools to track and monitor

we like features like being able to locate our friends and kids using GPS and google maps

then we are shocked when others track us! The NERVE!

Private companies are probably the biggest culprits. Their bottom line depends on it.

Want more privicy? You know what to do.

Haha, crazy dudes in Montana have been on to something.

No Facebook (I stopped using when everyone's posting location started showing up), no google, no cars with GPS, built in the last 10 years or ultra expensive, no cell phones, no land lines or utilities (skip trace), no credit cards, no bank cards and no scanning your Kroger card for that discount. Oh, and them we got CCTV. I give up, just don't pick your nose so you don't end up in Spike's America's most embarrassing moments.

[jamhar]

Actually i was thinking something similar

Dont tell those damned preppers were on to something!

Actually, i'm been trending back to "old school"

not for privacy sake, but more for simplicity sakes, stuff i can work on.

I like older cars, (what i would give for a '72 dodge coronet!), older bikes (old single speed beach cruizer), older solid furniture

but i have to admit

have to have, AC, highspeed Wifi, Ipad, Fast PC with double digit TB of disc space.

And a microwave! (hey, i'm a bachalore!)

oh and a wall sized LCD TV For golf

Edited July 19, 2013 by jamhar

[SinglePot]

Actually i was thinking something similar

Dont tell those damned preppers were on to something!

Actually, i'm been trending back to "old school"

not for privacy sake, but more for simplicity sakes, stuff i can work on.

I like older cars, (what i would give for a '72 dodge coronet!), older bikes (old single speed beach cruizer), older solid furniture

but i have to admit

have to have, AC, highspeed Wifi, Ipad, Fast PC with double digit TB of disc space.

And a microwave! (hey, i'm a bachalore!)

oh and a wall sized LCD TV For golf

Not so sure about the 72 Dodge Coronet, but the rest of this post seems to make sense.

[F430murci]

Any thoughts here?

http://news.yahoo.com/former-secret-court-judge-offers-modest-proposal-increased-150100157.html

[mania]

Any thoughts here?

http://news.yahoo.com/former-secret-court-judge-offers-modest-proposal-increased-150100157.html

Seems like a simple request that should have gone without saying.

From the article

What Carr proposes echoes a proposal from another former FISC judge: give the public a voice to counter the government's proposals.

How could it be anything less?

The mess we see these days is due to the lack of voice given to the actual employers of this government.

When we employed them we did not give them unlimited powers to rule over us. We elect them to REPRESENT us

[Credo]

The US should be quite glad about Snowden being in Russia. They really haven't been too generous with providing him with a platform from which to express his views.

I think Mr. Snowden is going to live to regret his decision. He has done nothing to do to protect the freedoms he wishes to restore and he has now deprived himself of the ability to pursue his aims.

As he sits effectively silenced, the intelligence community is revamping it's strategy so that by the time his information is available, it will be irrelevant.

[mania]

The US should be quite glad about Snowden being in Russia. They really haven't been too generous with providing him with a platform from which to express his views.

I think Mr. Snowden is going to live to regret his decision. He has done nothing to do to protect the freedoms he wishes to restore and he has now deprived himself of the ability to pursue his aims.

As he sits effectively silenced, the intelligence community is revamping it's strategy so that by the time his information is available, it will be irrelevant.

Yes I mentioned something similar in one of these threads.

Meaning in some ways I wonder if Snowden should have done anything at all given the lack of outrage.

You see more outrage over the NSA from other countries than the one with the supposed history of freedom & rights.

But I know a person like Snowden votes his conscious not what may be popular or make him popular.

He still sees a Constitution & a History of hard won rights & liberties. When he saw them being trampled he spoke out

as a real patriot would.

He knew he could not do so within the controlled area so had to do it the way he did.

Whether it harvests any couch potatoes is yet to be seen.

If not then the citizens of the USA can rest assured they have the government they deserve.

They may sleep well in the false security of having traded hard won liberties & rights for perceived temporary

security

[SinglePot]

US House votes to continue NSA's phone surveillance

"Have we forgot what happened on September 11?

Mike Rogers

House intelligence committee chairman

"Divided opinion in the US about the snooping was highlighted by a CBS News poll on Wednesday.

The survey found that 67% of Americans opposed the government's collection of phone records, but 52% said it was necessary to counter terrorism."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23445231