Do Thai Girls have to

[muythai2013]

It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman have no choice but to work in a Bar.

Despite slave Woman, There is always a choice, you get a job even if the hours are long, the work tedious, the pay is low but you get by with your sanity and self respect intact.

Or you take what you at the time believe to be the easy, lazy road and sell your self, resulting in mental issues of various kinds in most if not all Bargirls, and lose you self respect.

The reality is almost all have opted for the easy road, kicking their morals to the curb, unfortunately they wind up broke anyway with more then a few issues.

Edited June 12, 2013 by muythai2013

[Cluey]

There is no reason to disrespect yourself just because you choose work that pays more because others prefer not to do it, or because it is dangerous.

For example garbage men in my home town make well over 100K USD per year - 144K with benefits, more with overtime - many even elite call-girls don't make that much.

The only "shame" that may come from doing sex work is due to the religious-cultural programming, and many people these days are learning to free themselves from that as much as they can - which for most of us is very little.

I think your observation about mental illness is not a causal one, or rather more likely the other way around, people with mental illness tend to gravitate toward roles society deems "outcast".

In other parts of the world there are sex workers organization that help them realize their role isn't an "immoral" one, help build up their pride.

And you're certainly wrong in claiming that it's easy work, most sex workers I know earn every penny they make, often do the work that others go to priests or psychologists for, sex is often the least important aspect. Not so true here with the language barriers I admit. . .

[muythai2013]

There is no reason to disrespect yourself just because you choose work that pays more because others prefer not to do it, or because it is dangerous.

For example garbage men in my home town make well over 100K USD per year - 144K with benefits, more with overtime - many even elite call-girls don't make that much.

The only "shame" that may come from doing sex work is due to the religious-cultural programming, and many people these days are learning to free themselves from that as much as they can - which for most of us is very little.

I think your observation about mental illness is not a causal one, or rather more likely the other way around, people with mental illness tend to gravitate toward roles society deems "outcast".

In other parts of the world there are sex workers organization that help them realize their role isn't an "immoral" one, help build up their pride.

And you're certainly wrong in claiming that it's easy work, most sex workers I know earn every penny they make, often do the work that others go to priests or psychologists for, sex is often the least important aspect. Not so true here with the language barriers I admit. . .

Rubbish, work with street people and see what bar work does to them.

[David48]

.

To the OP, I like some of your work ... you go to subjects beyond the mould.

But, as for this quote ...

It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite
living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman
have no choice but to work in a Bar.

Please don't speak on my behalf.

Regards

David48

.

[Cluey]

Rubbish, work with street people and see what bar work does to them.

-

Exactly my point, you're starting with a population already much more susceptible to all kinds of problems.

And just like with drug use, most of the associated social problems are a result of the prohibition. Legal and properly regulated, eventually social stigma eliminated or at least greatly reduced then sex workers won't be any more "traumatized" by their choice of trade than the garbage men, certainly less than our serving soldiers.

[krisb]

.

To the OP, I like some of your work ... you go to subjects beyond the mould.

But, as for this quote ...

It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite

living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman

have no choice but to work in a Bar.

Please don't speak on my behalf.

Regards

David48

.

Im with David on this one.

[muythai2013]

.

To the OP, I like some of your work ... you go to subjects beyond the mould.

But, as for this quote ...

It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite

living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman

have no choice but to work in a Bar.

Please don't speak on my behalf.

Regards

David48

.

.

To the OP, I like some of your work ... you go to subjects beyond the mould.

But, as for this quote ...

It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite

living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman

have no choice but to work in a Bar.

Please don't speak on my behalf.

Regards

David48

.

I wrote the majority, I did not write all.

The only way it could apply to you is if you class yourself as one of the majority rather then the minority as I did not write all and I did not write david, So your refering to something in my quote that's not actually there.

Edited June 12, 2013 by muythai2013

[muythai2013]

If I write the majority you can only be in the majority if it applies to you so you in fact place yourself there because I don't know you guys.

why did you not place yourself in the minority.

[theblether]

I had lunch a couple of hours ago.......the four ladies that work in the cafe are each in there own way gorgeous. Age range 20 - 34.

The owner worked for a major airline for years, she's seen it all. Her cousin ( 31 ) is a successful Bangkok photographer who was asked by her Mum to give her cousin a hand setting up the business, she gladly agreed.

The cook is a delightful wee thing that slaves away all day making delicious food in a small business, the twenty year old is comically cute, and is the long term girlfriend of a friend of mine who works in the hotel.

In microcosm, this is my Thailand, full of women getting on with making an honest living. I love it.

[pattayadingo]

I know fine well that people have a choice, so I do not fall into the category....

"have convinced themselves that Thai Woman have no choice but to work in a Bar."

7/11, BigC, Tesco, the water / electric companies, banks, shops, the family farm / shop / business, factories, to name but a few options they have available to them.

Some decide early on to sell themselves, even as students.

In one place up North there were two main 'shops' if you would call them that, from where the students plied their trade. There were no customers allowed inside. It was all done over the phone.

There were no bars with ladies for sale like in Chiang Mai, Pattaya, BKK or Phuket. Yet many of the ladies working in the bars - mainly frequented by Thai people - had a regular man who paid them for sex. That is how they could afford a better life as students.

There are many many towns in Thailand where they do not have bars with ladies for sale so I presume you are talking about tourists in the main who go to certain cities for their sexual fulfilment.

We all have a choice in this life, but some are given less choice, a few are forced ito that type of work.

[Wavefloater]

"It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman have no choice but to work in a Bar."

Really, I don't see that at all. I would certainly challenge that it's true. I think a very large number of members are involved with Thais who don't work in bars. Also, the vast majority of members know that a very small proportion of Thai women work in bars, and particularly as sex workers, and they're intelligent enough to see the numbers just don't make any sense to back up your assertion.

"Despite slave Woman, There is always a choice, you get a job even if the hours are long, the work tedious, the pay is low but you get by with your sanity and self respect intact."

Unfortunately, there's not always a choice. You make it sound like getting a job is easy and that everybody should conform to your opinion of what is acceptable employment. Some people choose to work in bars without feeling that they've compromised their self-respect. In other situations, girls (and boys possibly) are basically forced by their parents to go to Pattaya, Phuket, Bangkok etc. and make quick money for the family. Perhaps you did a job most of your life that was tedious with low pay and feel that everybody else should do the same?

"Or you take what you at the time believe to be the easy, lazy road and sell your self, resulting in mental issues of various kinds in most if not all Bargirls, and lose you self respect."

Once again, you're deciding for these people that they don't have self-respect and that they're lazy. Perhaps that's spurred on by a very conservative upbringing with a narrower perspective of life than others. Would you believe that some of the people who work in the sex industry actually enjoy their job and take pride in it?

"The reality is almost all have opted for the easy road, kicking their morals to the curb, unfortunately they wind up broke anyway with more then a few issues."

You present yourself as a bit of an expert on the subject, and it seems to be one that has significant importance for you, so I'm really curious as to why you have made your post. Do you want us to know that you're a concerned expert, or are you so worried about these people that you want us to offer suggestions about how to stop the oldest profession in the world? I just can't see anything positive or even worthwhile in it.

(BTW, I noticed that many new posts were made while I was composing this, so forgive me if these points have been covered already,)

Edited June 12, 2013 by Wavefloater

[muythai2013]

I had lunch a couple of hours ago.......the four ladies that work in the cafe are each in there own way gorgeous. Age range 20 - 34.

The owner worked for a major airline for years, she's seen it all. Her cousin ( 31 ) is a successful Bangkok photographer who was asked by her Mum to give her cousin a hand setting up the business, she gladly agreed.

The cook is a delightful wee thing that slaves away all day making delicious food in a small business, the twenty year old is comically cute, and is the long term girlfriend of a friend of mine who works in the hotel.

In microcosm, this is my Thailand, full of women getting on with making an honest living. I love it.

Bingo, see, It can be done.

There is work if you want it, I bet those girls were happier to.

[transam]

In my head l have a very sad story of a family member, mum of 2, drunk husband and a blind father having to go down south to do ''that'' work to take care of them all. Sad stuff. .

[Cluey]

People prefer to see sex workers as victims rather than face the fact that it's a perfectly valid choice.

Most of the girls going with farang do so from choice not true necessity, but the difference in income and lifestyle certainly makes it a very logical choice doesn't it, especially given that most of them have a kid up at Yai's that needs funding.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

A very small percentage of the Thai sex workers work from bars.

Many Thai girls who aren't sex workers do work in bars.

[muythai2013]

"It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman have no choice but to work in a Bar."

Really, I don't see that at all. I would certainly challenge that it's true. I think a very large number of members are involved with Thais who don't work in bars. Also, the vast majority of members know that a very small proportion of Thai women work in bars, and particularly as sex workers, and they're intelligent enough to see the numbers just don't make any sense to back up your assertion.

"Despite slave Woman, There is always a choice, you get a job even if the hours are long, the work tedious, the pay is low but you get by with your sanity and self respect intact."

Unfortunately, there's not always a choice. You make it sound like getting a job is easy and that everybody should conform to your opinion of what is acceptable employment. Some people choose to work in bars without feeling that they've compromised their self-respect. In other situations, girls (and boys possibly) are basically forced by their parents to go to Pattaya and make quick money for the family..

"Or you take what you at the time believe to be the easy, lazy road and sell your self, resulting in mental issues of various kinds in most if not all Bargirls, and lose you self respect."

Once again, you're deciding for these people that they don't have self-respect and that they're lazy. Perhaps that's spurred on by a very conservative upbringing with a narrower perspective of life than others. Would you believe that some of the people who work in the sex industry actually enjoy their job and take pride in it?

"The reality is almost all have opted for the easy road, kicking their morals to the curb, unfortunately they wind up broke anyway with more then a few issues."

You present yourself as a bit of an expert on the subject, and it seems to be one that has significant importance for you, so I'm really curious as to why you have made your post. Do you want us to know that you're a concerned expert, or are you so worried about these people that you want us to offer suggestions about how to stop the oldest profession in the world? I just can't see anything positive or even worthwhile in it.

(BTW, I noticed that many new posts were made while I was composing this, so forgive me if these points have been covered already,)

I never said any tv member is involved with bargirls, read it again please and read it properly as making wrong statements is not good.

I said many believe Bargirls have to do it, I dit not say they were in anyway associated with them.

[muythai2013]

A very small percentage of the Thai sex workers work from bars.

Many Thai girls who aren't sex workers do work in bars.

so would you like us to explain to you what we are talking about, everyone else seems to understand we are talking about sex workers not wait staff.

try to keep up.

[chrisinth]

"The reality is almost all have opted for the easy road, kicking their morals to the curb, unfortunately they wind up broke anyway with more then a few issues"

MT, trying to think this through but having problems............

In your view, how many girls work the bars compared to the female population (working age) of Thailand?

With those figures in mind, where is the reality mentioned above?

[Wavefloater]

"It has became very obvious that the vast majority of TV members despite living in Thailand somehow have convinced themselves that Thai Woman have no choice but to work in a Bar."

Really, I don't see that at all. I would certainly challenge that it's true. I think a very large number of members are involved with Thais who don't work in bars. Also, the vast majority of members know that a very small proportion of Thai women work in bars, and particularly as sex workers, and they're intelligent enough to see the numbers just don't make any sense to back up your assertion.

"Despite slave Woman, There is always a choice, you get a job even if the hours are long, the work tedious, the pay is low but you get by with your sanity and self respect intact."

Unfortunately, there's not always a choice. You make it sound like getting a job is easy and that everybody should conform to your opinion of what is acceptable employment. Some people choose to work in bars without feeling that they've compromised their self-respect. In other situations, girls (and boys possibly) are basically forced by their parents to go to Pattaya and make quick money for the family..

"Or you take what you at the time believe to be the easy, lazy road and sell your self, resulting in mental issues of various kinds in most if not all Bargirls, and lose you self respect."

Once again, you're deciding for these people that they don't have self-respect and that they're lazy. Perhaps that's spurred on by a very conservative upbringing with a narrower perspective of life than others. Would you believe that some of the people who work in the sex industry actually enjoy their job and take pride in it?

"The reality is almost all have opted for the easy road, kicking their morals to the curb, unfortunately they wind up broke anyway with more then a few issues."

You present yourself as a bit of an expert on the subject, and it seems to be one that has significant importance for you, so I'm really curious as to why you have made your post. Do you want us to know that you're a concerned expert, or are you so worried about these people that you want us to offer suggestions about how to stop the oldest profession in the world? I just can't see anything positive or even worthwhile in it.

(BTW, I noticed that many new posts were made while I was composing this, so forgive me if these points have been covered already,)

I never said any tv member is involved with bargirls, read it again please and read it properly as making wrong statements is not good.

I said many believe Bargirls have to do it, I dit not say they were in anyway associated with them.

Of course making wrong statements is not good. I'm happy for you that you know something as basic as that. But don't be preachy, especially when you're wrong.

My point was that people know first-hand that women have choices in Thailand because they associate with many who don't work in bars -- not your interpretation. You decided to take it one step further (or maybe didn't read it right) and twist my meaning. However, in the future, I'll be carefully to state things simpler and more directly for you.

I'm happy you agree with everything else I said, though.

[Cluey]

I do honestly think the OP wasn't trying to imply "all" or "most" or even "a high proportion" of Thai girls were sex workers.

I think he meant to discuss "out of those who do choose sex work, how many do so out of economic necessity as opposed to supposed laziness?" or whatever else he thinks causes the 'bad morals'

[AnotherOneAmerican]

A very small percentage of the Thai sex workers work from bars.

Many Thai girls who aren't sex workers do work in bars.

so would you like us to explain to you what we are talking about, everyone else seems to understand we are talking about sex workers not wait staff.

try to keep up.

So if you are talking about sex workers, why call them bargirls?

Why not include the vast majority of sex workers who work from massage places, short-time hotels and brothels.

Edited June 12, 2013 by AnotherOneAmerican

[Nana Cowboy]

red alert another bar girl thread crosses the wires. Yawn

[Cluey]

So if you are talking about sex workers, why call them bargirls?

Why not include the vast majority of sex workers who work from massage places, short-time hotels and brothels.

-

It's a pretty common and understood euphemism isn't it. I think the OP probably wasn't used to the term "sex worker", probably would have used "prostitute" but didn't want to be so blatantly disparaging.

And he probably was specifically talking about that tiny segment of the industry that targets farangs, of which I believe the majority do solicit from bars, either as employees or freelancing.

And while it is true that in those sorts of bars, there may be a few staff that don't routinely go with customers, but in my experience that's only during their initial "getting acclimated" period and it usually just takes the right combination of high enough price and not-too-disgusting appearance for most of them to break through the barrier. I've always like the challenge of trying to take the cashier myself. . .

[AnotherOneAmerican]

And he probably was specifically talking about that tiny segment of the industry that targets farangs, of which I believe the majority do solicit from bars, either as employees or freelancing.

The OP never mentioned bars solely aimed at foreigner customers. I guess he never managed to get further than Pattaya.

Bars that cater to Thais usually have very few sex workers as employees.

[glassdude007]

You said this......

Or you take what you at the time believe to be the easy, lazy road and sell your self, resulting in mental issues of various kinds in most if not all Bargirls, and lose you self respect.

The reality is almost all have opted for the easy road, kicking their morals to the curb, unfortunately they wind up broke anyway with more then a few issues.

Do you really think that almost all of the women in Thailand are or have been sex workers ??

Your WAY of base with that statement, TERRIBLE...

[Chittychangchang]

Thai women are the same as any women in the world!

1/ They are attracted to success!

2/ They like a laugh and a good time!

3/ They like to be treated right!

Unfortunately the majority of Thai men don't fill the criteria.

CCC

Edited June 12, 2013 by Chittychangchang

[krisb]

What is it these "bar girls" do exactly?

Pour beers?

[Cluey]

Thai women are the same as any women in the world!

1/ They are attracted to success!

2/ They like a laugh and a good time!

3/ They like to be treated right!

Unfortunately the majority of Thai men don't fill the criteria.

-

Ya, keep believing that spin, "I no like Thai man, Thai man no good only like falang, like old man like fat man same same you"

Actually pretty stringent criteria there, probably most farang don't come up to scratch.

Have to say I've done all right without 1 & 2, and most people would call my #3 pretty kee nio.

[banglay]

It is more of a social economic choice, if Thailand had a Social Welfare system like Most of the 1st World countries I do not think the majority of girls would go down the bar girl route by choice ...

Nothings new :-

One in five women in England in the 1700s were prostitutes reports Zoe Brennan:

• The number of prostitutes in London at the time is estimated to be 63,000.
• Women engaged in prostitution because the pay was 80 times higher than the alternative of living a life of drudgery as a housemaid.
• Overall the prostitution industry was worth about 1.5 billion inflation adjusted pounds.

To read more about the horrific practices that were used to trap women into prostitution, 17th century condoms, how prostitutes were the celebrities of their times, and the prevalence of venereal diseases, click here.

Source: Daily Mail

[kannot]

Thai women are the same as any women in the world!

1/ They are attracted to success!

2/ They like a laugh and a good time!

3/ They like to be treated right!

Unfortunately the majority of Thai men don't fill the criteria.

CCC

ahem I think you can just change that statement to "men"