Compare life in Tokyo to life in Bangkok

[ihunnieibee]

Have any of you lived in Bangkok and Tokyo? I may be moving there so I wanted some information.

I'm female so it's ok if you don't mention about picking up ladies etc.

Can you give me any ideas about what is different there than here.

Any insights?

I know that it's more expensive by far but I want to know about lifestyles and things that may be considered rude there or differences like that.

Pros/Cons?

Please reply

[GreenSnapper]

In short:

First world - third world.

Much better life in Tokyo. And except for rent, costs are'nt much higher than here. Standards are much better for all products, people more honest and less scams.

You will like it.

[craigt3365]

I think you might do better with this over in the Travel forum. Why don't we try it over there and see where this goes.

I've only spent a few weeks there, but I found it extremely expensive compared to Bangkok. But, much better infrastructure, better transport options (taxis are way expensive), and GREAT restaurants!! I'm jealous. Have fun!!

[David48]

^^ Agreeing with craig above.

I had a week there a few years ago ... Golden Week, when they have heaps of holidays all in one week.

Very expensive place to be.

$5 to open the door on a Taxi (flagfall we call it) ... then the high rate.

The Train network is amazing ... think the London Tube network on steroids.

I enjoyed it ... but me experience is limited to Tokyo.

[GreenSnapper]

Never travel in Japan at Golden week. Of course this is expensive.

Otherwise hotels are better and similar priced as midrange BKK hotels. Smallish rooms, though. Food is of higher standard there than in BKK. Don't even think of "Fuji".

For those who live on a similar level as lower Thai society, Japan is expensive. But for those of us who like a bit higher life standard, it is not so much more.

[craigt3365]

Never travel in Japan at Golden week. Of course this is expensive.

Otherwise hotels are better and similar priced as midrange BKK hotels. Smallish rooms, though. Food is of higher standard there than in BKK. Don't even think of "Fuji".

For those who live on a similar level as lower Thai society, Japan is expensive. But for those of us who like a bit higher life standard, it is not so much more.

Not sure if everybody agrees with you:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/9326700/Top-10-most-expensive-cities-in-the-world-in-pictures.html?frame=2246120

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_cities_for_expatriate_employees

Here they list Bangkok as 81st, Tokyo as #1:

http://www.mercer.com/press-releases/cost-of-living-rankings

I've only been in Japan for a total of 3 weeks, but having visited some 80 countries now, it sure ranks in the top as the most expensive country I've ever visited!! Unfortunately, as I absolutely love it!!!!

[simple1]

OP: lot of expat forums for those living in Japan, do a search...

[Max2010]

Please be specific by "moving here". Will you be sent here by your company or you will come here to teach English or you will look for work once you are settled? How good is your Japanese? I live in Japan and have been to Thailand numerous times for holidays and business. Life expenses depend on your visa status whilst in Japan. For example, English teachers might struggler to pay their bills but employees brought in from HQ are paid better and are provided with free or subsidized accommodation.

Some common expenses you might want to know:

1. National Heath insurance. It is the best insurance to have. It is based on income, your first year can cost you just under $200 a year. It covers EVERYTHING. You just pay 30% of the bill, including dental. After that, it might cost you $150 a month (based on $3000 dollars a month salary) or higher. You can get cheaper private insurance for as little as $600 a year but I am not sure how much they cover.

2. You need to have either your company or Japanese friend to sponsor you to get an apartment. There is "key money" and down payment. Roughly three months of rent paid up front. I would live near my work, that way you can save on train expenses. Rental payments can be from $600-800 a month exclusive of other expenses.

3. Municipal taxes. You are expected to pay about $2000 a year (split monthly) on your second year of residence. Failure to pay this tax will result in your visa renewal to be denied.

4. Most Japanese banks will not issue credit cards to foreigners unless they have a high paying jobs and speak fluent Japanese. Try Citibank, they are less discriminatory. Bring your credit card records to prove you have clean record in your country.

5. Most Japanese use trains to go to work. Most companies pay for it. You will save money if you buy a monthly pass (as much as 40%). Any route outside your range, you will pay extra of course.

6. Income tax is very low for a developed country for income under $30000 a year, As little as $600 a year.

7. Food can be both expensive or cheap depending on your taste. You can eat for as little as $5 a day or $100 a day. There are restaurants where you can buy a bowl of beef and rice for $2-3. Western restaurants such as Hard Rock Café, TGIF will cost you more of course.

8. Japan imports about 60% of their needs, and since the Yen is losing strength now, most items in the supermarket are more expensive. That said, you can feed yourself for as little as $150-200 a month (groceries). Again, it all depends on your taste. Australian and American beef/ pork is cheaper than local ones.

9. Certain nationalities can get Japanese Driver's License without taking a test. (USA can't), UK, Canada, Australia, NZ can. If you own a car, car pollution tax runs about $1000 a year, and car tax about $80-1000, depending on engine CC. Most Japanese drive small 1000CC cars and they pay $80 a year for it. I pay $400 for mine.

10. Entertainment is expensive in Japan. However you can still eat decently and have few drinks for as little as $50 a night exclusive of transportation expenses.

11. Its hard to get clothes for western people. Though we have western brands such as Zara, Gap and Eddie Bouer, they tend to stock for the locals. I depend heavily on amazon.com and on Japanese internet companies such as Nissen for my clothes. What will be considered XL in western world, its 3L here. LL is like M in the west.

12. A can of beer is $2, Tall boy $2.80. 500ML beer bottle is $3. Few supermarkets stock imported beers. The closer you live near Tokyo, the better your choices.

Wines can range anywhere between $4 a bottle to $15 world brands. Of course, you can also buy high end wines as well.

I hope the info will be useful to you. Feel free to leave a message here if you need further information.

Max 2010

[ihunnieibee]

OP: lot of expat forums for those living in Japan, do a search...

Thanks simple1.

I've been googling but I couldn't find anything as good as ThaiVisa and I also wanted some comparisons from people who know about Bangkok AND Tokyo.

I'll keep searching!

Thanks to everyone who has replied! ^^

[Tomtomtom69]

Please be specific by "moving here". Will you be sent here by your company or you will come here to teach English or you will look for work once you are settled? How good is your Japanese? I live in Japan and have been to Thailand numerous times for holidays and business. Life expenses depend on your visa status whilst in Japan. For example, English teachers might struggler to pay their bills but employees brought in from HQ are paid better and are provided with free or subsidized accommodation.

Some common expenses you might want to know:

1. National Heath insurance. It is the best insurance to have. It is based on income, your first year can cost you just under $200 a year. It covers EVERYTHING. You just pay 30% of the bill, including dental. After that, it might cost you $150 a month (based on $3000 dollars a month salary) or higher. You can get cheaper private insurance for as little as $600 a year but I am not sure how much they cover.

2. You need to have either your company or Japanese friend to sponsor you to get an apartment. There is "key money" and down payment. Roughly three months of rent paid up front. I would live near my work, that way you can save on train expenses. Rental payments can be from $600-800 a month exclusive of other expenses.

3. Municipal taxes. You are expected to pay about $2000 a year (split monthly) on your second year of residence. Failure to pay this tax will result in your visa renewal to be denied.

4. Most Japanese banks will not issue credit cards to foreigners unless they have a high paying jobs and speak fluent Japanese. Try Citibank, they are less discriminatory. Bring your credit card records to prove you have clean record in your country.

5. Most Japanese use trains to go to work. Most companies pay for it. You will save money if you buy a monthly pass (as much as 40%). Any route outside your range, you will pay extra of course.

6. Income tax is very low for a developed country for income under $30000 a year, As little as $600 a year.

7. Food can be both expensive or cheap depending on your taste. You can eat for as little as $5 a day or $100 a day. There are restaurants where you can buy a bowl of beef and rice for $2-3. Western restaurants such as Hard Rock Café, TGIF will cost you more of course.

8. Japan imports about 60% of their needs, and since the Yen is losing strength now, most items in the supermarket are more expensive. That said, you can feed yourself for as little as $150-200 a month (groceries). Again, it all depends on your taste. Australian and American beef/ pork is cheaper than local ones.

9. Certain nationalities can get Japanese Driver's License without taking a test. (USA can't), UK, Canada, Australia, NZ can. If you own a car, car pollution tax runs about $1000 a year, and car tax about $80-1000, depending on engine CC. Most Japanese drive small 1000CC cars and they pay $80 a year for it. I pay $400 for mine.

10. Entertainment is expensive in Japan. However you can still eat decently and have few drinks for as little as $50 a night exclusive of transportation expenses.

11. Its hard to get clothes for western people. Though we have western brands such as Zara, Gap and Eddie Bouer, they tend to stock for the locals. I depend heavily on amazon.com and on Japanese internet companies such as Nissen for my clothes. What will be considered XL in western world, its 3L here. LL is like M in the west.

12. A can of beer is $2, Tall boy $2.80. 500ML beer bottle is $3. Few supermarkets stock imported beers. The closer you live near Tokyo, the better your choices.

Wines can range anywhere between $4 a bottle to $15 world brands. Of course, you can also buy high end wines as well.

I hope the info will be useful to you. Feel free to leave a message here if you need further information.

Max 2010

Very useful information. I am surprised about how cheap the cheaper restaurants in Tokyo are ($2-3 a dish), which is peanuts compared to the ridiculous price of eating out in Australia, where everything is like A$9 and up or even the USA, where you might find something for around $6-$7 but usually prices are on par with Australia, although cheaper than Europe.

Eating out in Bangkok is becoming expensive though - forgetting cheap street stalls, which are not everyone's cup of tea, any shopping mall restaurant meal, even the cheapest is likely to cost you 99 Baht or more, even if you try to be as frugal as possible. Otherwise, 150-200 Baht ($5-7) is more common (and that's usually not even including a drink). Today I spent 215 Baht for a meal including a drink at Black Canyon and I chose one of the cheaper items on the menu.

I agree that Tokyo is much more expensive than Bangkok if you live in Bangkok like a Thai i.e. you rent a 4000 Baht a month apartment, which consists of a single room and no kitchen on a high numbered Soi in Sukhumwit, or perhaps anywhere in the city away from the expensive downtown areas...(could be Bang Khen, Bang Khae, Samut Prakan, Chaeng Wattana, Ngam Wong Wan, Raminthra, Rangsit etc. but then transport would become an issue as neither the Skytrain nor the MRT go to many of those places, though that is set to change over the coming years), you eat mostly street food or food from small, local hole-in-the wall restaurants, you forgo soft drinks and shakes in favor of water (often free), you either don't do any cooking yourself at all or if you do, you use only the cheapest ingredients purchased from a local market, you catch the bus, skytrain or MRT rather than drive or catch cabs and you don't frequent western style bars or clubs in any of the downtown districts.

IF however, as another poster has stated you prefer living in a 3-bedroom western style apartment with all the mod-cons for 50,000 Baht a month, you still catch the skytrain from time-to-time but you also own a car or even if you don't, you spend a lot of time riding in cabs, you eat out at expensive restaurants, shop at Tops, Foodland etc. for expensive imported ingredients, go out on the town often and in general, you live in a western style "bubble", then yes, I'm sure you won't find Tokyo that much more expensive than living here.

[rfukata]

you may check out other Jpn. cities such as osaka, kyoto, hiroshima for example. as far as expenses go, Osaka is more

affordable compared to Tokyo. Food in Osaka is good, a lot of outside stalls at reasonable prices.

You may find a dialect variance btw. Tokyo & Osaka, (osaka is Kansai-ben dialect). Kyoto is a short train ride from Osaka,

very pleasant, beautiful place.

[surangw]

easier to make genuine friends in Japan.

[thrilled]

If your use to living on A million baht in Bangkok,then maybe triple that in Tokyo.close to 3 million baht.Tokyo is A better place to love.Just not cheap.

[Payboy]

People in Japan go about doing their jobs without putting their hands out for tips.

[craigt3365]

People in Japan go about doing their jobs without putting their hands out for tips.

I don't experience people doing that here very often.

One problem with Japan is they are very xenophobic. Especially the men. Lots of places you can't eat or drink because you are gaijin. English signage is non-existent, especially outside the big cities. Very few outside the tourist areas speak English. We had a heck of a time traveling around the countryside. Very difficult.

[Max2010]

The only places foreigners (gaijin) can't go are in hot springs. That's because many do not allow people with tattoos . Tattoos are getting popular here but most people relate them with gangsters(yakuza), so most affordable public owned hot springs will deny entrance to them.

Osaka or any other city is not as cheap or expensive as Tokyo. Again, it depends how you wanna live. I mentioned earlier that you can eat a bowl of beef and rice or noodles very cheaply anywhere in Japan. You can also buy cheap ready made food (obento) in supermarkets or convenience stores. The food is freshly made because the shelf life here is only few hours for obento food.

About racism, I think it depends on a person rather than a nation. I have read many racist comments about Thai people on TV but I can't assume all Europeans/ North Americans are racists. Contrary to popular belief, most Japanese have very limited English proficiency and are shy. In order to have a rich social life here, one must learn Japanese. There are still issues which might upset a foreigner like being stopped constant by cops or discriminated by landlords but overall, I can live with it knowing that I live in a clean country with little violent crime and the educational system is pretty good even though English is not their strongest subject in their schools. They have managed to build their economy to be the third richest in the world, so they must be doing something right!

[77Dan]

I spent 5 years in Tokyo and then moved to Bangkok where I've been for several years.

I've enjoyed both countries, though largely thanks to my work.

Yes, Tokyo is more expensive and living space is smaller, so you really need a decent job. You won't get a visa without a proper job anyway.

But I found the life there more fulfilling. Purely my own view, but I think there is much more depth to society and culture there. I found there is more to do and see in the cities, though that might have more to do with my own interests. In Tokyo for instance lots of great parks, you can ride your bike around the city, take the train to the mountains to go for a hike, visit a hot spring, museum, concert, music festival etc. In Bangkok, I find I spend most of my time near the BTS line, whereas in Japan you can take a train or bus almost anywhere. Of course Thailand is great when leave Bangkok and go to beach etc but if's harder to do unless you have your own car.

The flipside is that life is not so laidback. This is actually part of the fun when you arrive as Japanese society is very interesting to observe and Japanese also love to socialise after a hard day's work. Coming from Tokyo to Bangkok I missed the life there, although now when I go back I do find it a little sterile - no street life for instance, and very crowded. But like, Bangkok it's never boring. I think the two cities have that in common.

More so than Thailand, I think you really need to learn Japanese to get the most out of it. But as one previous poster said, you can actually make genuine friends in Japan, something many people I know struggle to do in Thailand, particularly with Thai men (I know some people do have Thai friends here but in my view it's easier in Japan). In Bangkok, my Thai colleagues look horrified at the idea of socialising with the farang, apart from at the annual work drinks/dinner, but in Tokyo I regularly went out with colleagues for food, drink, karaoke etc.

I don't think Japanese are really much more xenophobic than Thais, unlike a previous poster. Many are very interested in foreign culture.

In terms of what might be considered rude there, make sure you take off your shoes when you enter a house, don't pass food with chopsticks or blow your nose too loudly on the subway and you'll probably be fine. I think Japanese appreciate politeness and a sense of humility. But then many are flocking to Thailand to get away from all that as they find society too rigid...

Cheers

[KED]

I haven't lived in Japan but have visited many times. I was surprised at how hesitant and unconfident most Japanese were at speaking English. Also, I think for a western woman, Japan would be a more comfortable environment, even with the xenophobia.

[Mad Hatter]

I used a site that has extensive price comparables and they show that Tokyo is 90% more exensive thant BKK and Osaka is 79% more. However, Nagoya is only 29% more expensive than BKK. I worked in Seoul for 1 year so more familiar with Seoul than Tokyo but I've heard they are very similar. The one struggle is finding a group to hang out with because it's hard to break into socializing with the locals.

[Mad Hatter]

I used a site that has extensive price comparables and they show that Tokyo is 90% more exensive thant BKK and Osaka is 79% more. However, Nagoya is only 29% more expensive than BKK. I worked in Seoul for 1 year so more familiar with Seoul than Tokyo but I've heard they are very similar. The one struggle is finding a group to hang out with because it's hard to break into socializing with the locals.