Guarantee of Virginity: The Original Intention of Sin Sot

[Wavefloater]

I was doing some research and came upon this little bit of info:

" The origins of the sin sot are hidden in the past, although the concept of the 'bride price' is not new, even to the west. It was a form of guarantee that the bride was a virgin - the groom paid the family to ensure that this was the case. Not now, of course, but it is still a means of the bride saving 'face'

If the woman was cheated by the man, the sin sot was to offer her cash in recompense. By paying the sin sot, the groom is accepting her as a virgin (even though she may likely not be.) In Thailand, even today, men still do not like the idea of marrying a woman who has been with another man, particularly a divorcee or a mother. If it is proved that she has been unfaithful, it is tradition that the sin sot is returned to him.

Most of the customs observed with regard to the events leading up to marriage in Thailand have evolved over the years to protect the prospective bride. They are intended to prevent the young woman being taken advantage of, and protect her valuable virginity until she is married. The sin sot is intended to offer the groom some form of security that this is the case, and is returned to him if not. "

There is often discussion of sin sot at this forum, so I thought the origin may be interesting to some people.

Was your wife a virgin when you married after paying for that guarantee? (Only kidding, of course. What are the odds, huh?

[trainman34014]

Couldn't care less what it means as i would never have dreamed of paying it anyway. You take them for what they are and they do likewise. If that's not good enough then it's goodbye !

[David48]

Well ... wavefloater, since you have given a long quote, what about a reference for the source please?

.

[Wavefloater]

Well ... wavefloater, since you have given a long quote, what about a reference for the source please?

.

Can we do that here? So many rules, I'm never sure.

http://www.thailovelines.com/Frontinfo/thailand-marriage-customs.html

[theblether]

I've just read that link......they should have a toxic warning on it. It is truly atrocious.

[theblether]

Anyway, re sin sot, it's the biggest scam in Thailand and that's going some.

Go on to Pantip and they would hysterically ridicule the sin sot stories we see here.

The problem though is it divides us into two diametrically opposing camps........those that know that the Thais think we are nutters for paying it, and those that refuse to believe it.

We even get people admitting that they were charged more sin sot than any Thai man would ever be asked for, then try to justify it. They don't realize that they're being set up and fleeced from the get go.

The only words you want to hear from the mother in law are.........I do not want sin sot, just look after my girl.

Marry that girl. As for the rest of them, just tell them straight from the first time they bring it up. Under no circumstances, and if you are looking for a guy to pay sin sot for you, go get another boyfriend. See you later.

Paying sin sot is different from the Ceremonial Showing of sin sot, I have no problem with that, as long as the cash and Gold are returned after the ceremony.

If it's not, just dump your new wife on the spot, as you've married into a bad family. Just cut your losses and walk away before they have the skin off your back.

Leave it to the Thais, it's not our culture, it's as simple as that.

[h90]

Anyway, re sin sot, it's the biggest scam in Thailand and that's going some.

Go on to Pantip and they would hysterically ridicule the sin sot stories we see here.

The problem though is it divides us into two diametrically opposing camps........those that know that the Thais think we are nutters for paying it, and those that refuse to believe it.

We even get people admitting that they were charged more sin sot than any Thai man would ever be asked for, then try to justify it. They don't realize that they're being set up and fleeced from the get go.

The only words you want to hear from the mother in law are.........I do not want sin sot, just look after my girl.

Marry that girl. As for the rest of them, just tell them straight from the first time they bring it up. Under no circumstances, and if you are looking for a guy to pay sin sot for you, go get another boyfriend. See you later.

Paying sin sot is different from the Ceremonial Showing of sin sot, I have no problem with that, as long as the cash and Gold are returned after the ceremony.

If it's not, just dump your new wife on the spot, as you've married into a bad family. Just cut your losses and walk away before they have the skin off your back.

Leave it to the Thais, it's not our culture, it's as simple as that.

Well most modern Thai men pay the Sin Sod and get it back.

Or he pays it and he receive a new car/land/office/the cash back as gift which has the same value.

If he pays and not get nothing his friends call him kwai

[theblether]

Which proves my point h90, even the Thais will ridicule each other for being idiots re sin sot.

When they hear of what some farangs fall for they just can't believe it, cannot believe it.

[h90]

Which proves my point h90, even the Thais will ridicule each other for being idiots re sin sot.

When they hear of what some farangs fall for they just can't believe it, cannot believe it.

Well the Thais are very outspoken.....

I recall that I showed them the postings of a guy who paid sin sot for a wife that was already married before and has a child.

They were laughing for hours in the office.

"you don't pay for a second-hand wife" so they told. Which might be a good argument for the "virgin" theory.

[David48]

Well ... wavefloater, since you have given a long quote, what about a reference for the source please?

.

Can we do that here? So many rules, I'm never sure.

http://www.thailovelines.com/Frontinfo/thailand-marriage-customs.html

Thanks for that ...

.

[Scottythai]

It's Tradition. But we must remember people only become traditional when it works in their favor.

[theblether]

Luckily we have a tradition, it's called Dowry, that means that the brides family pays us to take her on and they pay for the wedding too. I prefer our tradition.

[aussiebebe]

I've just read that link......they should have a toxic warning on it. It is truly atrocious.

Agreed. That website is awful. Another choice quote from the same page;

Perhaps before we discuss this quaint custom and we should point out that to Thais, marriage is also a sacred pact between a man and a woman

That one had me in stitches. Of all the Thai friends and acquaintances I have, none of them don't have a 'gig' on the side. Not a single one.

Thais are great at paying lip service to 'tradition' when it suits them; there's only one rule; you do whatever you want.

[theblether]

^^ Correct......and yet.....so may farang mugs fall for it

UNBELIEVABLE!!!

[Aussieroaming]

I paid Sin Sot and it was no problem at all. My partners parents discussed and agree on a figure and we presented it too them. They gave 100% of it back after the ceremony. The Sin Sot was all about me showing I had enough money to support their daughter and about them maintaining "face" in their community. It was an integral part of the ceremony and everyone walked away feeling happy.

I'm sure there are family's that only see the cash cow coming in the door, but for the family I married into the Sin Sot just represented certain values they wanted to uphold.

As for paying Sin Sot, I agreed to the payment before I ever realized that it would be returned because I wanted to show my wife that I respect and accept implications of marrying into a Thai family.

But I see why some blokes would baulk at handing over their hard earned coin too.

[Wavefloater]

I paid Sin Sot and it was no problem at all. My partners parents discussed and agree on a figure and we presented it too them. They gave 100% of it back after the ceremony. The Sin Sot was all about me showing I had enough money to support their daughter and about them maintaining "face" in their community. It was an integral part of the ceremony and everyone walked away feeling happy.

I'm sure there are family's that only see the cash cow coming in the door, but for the family I married into the Sin Sot just represented certain values they wanted to uphold.

As for paying Sin Sot, I agreed to the payment before I ever realized that it would be returned because I wanted to show my wife that I respect and accept implications of marrying into a Thai family.

But I see why some blokes would baulk at handing over their hard earned coin too.

I was talking to a group of younger Thai guys about sin sot, and when I told them that sometimes when a farang presents the gold and money to some Thai in-laws, it is not returned. At first they wouldn't believe this and was sure I was pulling their legs, Once some of them finally accepted that what I told them is true, they just kept shaking their heads in disbelief. So, it's good that yours was returned because if it hadn't and you just accepted that, you may have lost all respect from your wife and her family.

[theblether]

I paid Sin Sot and it was no problem at all. My partners parents discussed and agree on a figure and we presented it too them. They gave 100% of it back after the ceremony. The Sin Sot was all about me showing I had enough money to support their daughter and about them maintaining "face" in their community. It was an integral part of the ceremony and everyone walked away feeling happy.

I'm sure there are family's that only see the cash cow coming in the door, but for the family I married into the Sin Sot just represented certain values they wanted to uphold.

As for paying Sin Sot, I agreed to the payment before I ever realized that it would be returned because I wanted to show my wife that I respect and accept implications of marrying into a Thai family.

But I see why some blokes would baulk at handing over their hard earned coin too.

Terminology.......you did not pay sin sot, you showed sin sot for ceremonial purposes.

No one would object to that.

It's the numerous cases where people have had the p*ss taken out of them by evil and manipulative women and families that cause the problem.

Wavefloater is correct in his post.......fair minded Thais cannot believe, simply cannot believe these stories.

[Jasun]

I'd pay the million baht NOT to wait until after marriage for sex.

[Aussieroaming]

I paid Sin Sot and it was no problem at all. My partners parents discussed and agree on a figure and we presented it too them. They gave 100% of it back after the ceremony. The Sin Sot was all about me showing I had enough money to support their daughter and about them maintaining "face" in their community. It was an integral part of the ceremony and everyone walked away feeling happy.

I'm sure there are family's that only see the cash cow coming in the door, but for the family I married into the Sin Sot just represented certain values they wanted to uphold.

As for paying Sin Sot, I agreed to the payment before I ever realized that it would be returned because I wanted to show my wife that I respect and accept implications of marrying into a Thai family.

But I see why some blokes would baulk at handing over their hard earned coin too.

I was talking to a group of younger Thai guys about sin sot, and when I told them that sometimes when a farang presents the gold and money to some Thai in-laws, it is not returned. At first they wouldn't believe this and was sure I was pulling their legs, Once some of them finally accepted that what I told them is true, they just kept shaking their heads in disbelief. So, it's good that yours was returned because if it hadn't and you just accepted that, you may have lost all respect from your wife and her family.

Agreed...they appreciated the fact that I accepted the need to offer SinSot and at the end of the day common sense ruled. We needed the money to start our life and they didn't. Good for everyone in the end.

[Aussieroaming]

I paid Sin Sot and it was no problem at all. My partners parents discussed and agree on a figure and we presented it too them. They gave 100% of it back after the ceremony. The Sin Sot was all about me showing I had enough money to support their daughter and about them maintaining "face" in their community. It was an integral part of the ceremony and everyone walked away feeling happy.

I'm sure there are family's that only see the cash cow coming in the door, but for the family I married into the Sin Sot just represented certain values they wanted to uphold.

As for paying Sin Sot, I agreed to the payment before I ever realized that it would be returned because I wanted to show my wife that I respect and accept implications of marrying into a Thai family.

But I see why some blokes would baulk at handing over their hard earned coin too.

Terminology.......you did not pay sin sot, you showed sin sot for ceremonial purposes.

No one would object to that.

It's the numerous cases where people have had the p*ss taken out of them by evil and manipulative women and families that cause the problem.

Wavefloater is correct in his post.......fair minded Thais cannot believe, simply cannot believe these stories.

Agree...I showed it. I'll admit I knew I was marrying into a strong middleclass family so if I had "lost" the Sin Sot it would have been a surprise

[ttthailand]

Anyway, re sin sot, it's the biggest scam in Thailand and that's going some.

Go on to Pantip and they would hysterically ridicule the sin sot stories we see here.

The problem though is it divides us into two diametrically opposing camps........those that know that the Thais think we are nutters for paying it, and those that refuse to believe it.

We even get people admitting that they were charged more sin sot than any Thai man would ever be asked for, then try to justify it. They don't realize that they're being set up and fleeced from the get go.

The only words you want to hear from the mother in law are.........I do not want sin sot, just look after my girl.

Marry that girl. As for the rest of them, just tell them straight from the first time they bring it up. Under no circumstances, and if you are looking for a guy to pay sin sot for you, go get another boyfriend. See you later.

Paying sin sot is different from the Ceremonial Showing of sin sot, I have no problem with that, as long as the cash and Gold are returned after the ceremony.

If it's not, just dump your new wife on the spot, as you've married into a bad family. Just cut your losses and walk away before they have the skin off your back.

Leave it to the Thais, it's not our culture, it's as simple as that.

That's too much of a risk .......pay no sinsod whatsoever...!!!

Must agree .... except if paid and kept by wife's family you will know right then that it is time to get out before you get started.... the writing is on the wall....

[EyesWideOpen]

Well, if sin sod is paid to ensure virginity, and the average age a Thai girl loses her virginity is 15, guess there is no need to worry about sin sod anymore unless you are a pedophile... :-)