Australian arrested in Pattaya for threatening Australian embassy

[simple1]

The last lot of people I would ask for any help is the Australian Embassy in any Country. I speak from a family members first hand experience some time ago in England.

Also point out that it was the Australian Embassy that notified the Indonesian Police in Bali that had 9 Aussies grabbed as they left Bali with heroin knowing that it meant the execution of them as a probable sentence.

I despise these 'Dealers in Death' BUT the Australian edict is that a Country that has execution as the penalty will not receive their offenders.

By the way the info was that good they could have just scooped them off the Plane as it landed in Sydney. Now it is claimed 'a mistake'

BUT , they have spent Time , Effort & Money to help Chapelle Corby in a Bali Jail a Convicted Drug Dealer ,because of the publicity she had generated. The Australian Embassies are totally Inconsistent , which makes them next to useless to Australians.

I M O

It was the Australian Federal Police (AFP) who notified Indonesian police, not Embassy consular staff.

[nonthaburial]

He should have known that very strong reasons for taking custody away from the birth mother are needed in most countries and Thailand is no different. Also it is not the Embassy that can arrange for that anyway. It is the Thai courts.

I can see nothing in this report that states the daughter was born to a Thai mother, nor do I see any reference that the mother and daughter are actually in Thailand.

[dudu]

He should have known that very strong reasons for taking custody away from the birth mother are needed in most countries and Thailand is no different. Also it is not the Embassy that can arrange for that anyway. It is the Thai courts.

I can see nothing in this report that states the daughter was born to a Thai mother, nor do I see any reference that the mother and daughter are actually in Thailand.

Good point, i remember trying to get the Australian Embassy involved in a custody battle with my German wife, while i was in Thailand and she in Germany, they had no bar of,by the way....

[Rimmer]

Inflammatory post and quoted replies removed

[Briggsy]

Another "Richard Head".

As pointed out normally when there are marital/relationship problems normally the best place for a child is with the mother, so if he has proof that the mother is unfit to look after the child then it would be the Thai courts to decide, I think he would find it difficult to prove he was fit to be a father.

No doubt the Australian Embassy is busy enough tracking down children abducted from Australia and getting them repatriated

I actually went to school with someone called Richard Head. That was his real name. I don't know what his parents were thinking.

[chooka]

He should have known that very strong reasons for taking custody away from the birth mother are needed in most countries and Thailand is no different. Also it is not the Embassy that can arrange for that anyway. It is the Thai courts.

I can see nothing in this report that states the daughter was born to a Thai mother, nor do I see any reference that the mother and daughter are actually in Thailand.

From another news source.......

He claimed that his former wife beat the child regularly before they were separated.

But police investigations found that Mr Moore's ex-wife provides good care to their child.

Mr Moore told police he used to be a soldier in Australia but had suffered a leg injury and left the military. He travelled to Thailand in 2010 and met his former wife.

Unless he met a farang wife in Thailand I would only assume that his ex is Thai.

[biplanebluey]

As verbal abusing the Embassy will give you what you want.

What a wancker!!

he's an Aussie------ that what them do-------HaHa-----wait til he really needs them !!!!!!!!!

[Carl64]

Not a smart thing to do, BUT dealing with any government agency in any country can bring out the worst in people!

[Considered Opinion]

he does not look like a PhD...

Neither does the official

Sent from my GT-P5100 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[cacruden]

I sympathize with him. He's already very upset over his child custody problem and to deal with sociopathic government drones on top of that cannot be easy.

The Australian Department of foreign Affairs (DFAT) have already announce that the are making cuts and scaling back assistance to Australians overseas. Aussies are being told that they are now virtually on their own when abroad.

"Australians who get into trouble overseas in future should not expect the level of consular service offered now, Foreign Affairs Minister Bob Carr says"

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1797559/Help-for-Aussies-busted-overseas-to-be-cut:-Carr

Maybe we should remind them of that little blue book we carry, called a passport, which entitles us to all the support our country can give us!

Big misconception there. The embassy contains a couple of primary functions:

- Trade

- Development (although Thailand often is too developed for most countries to qualify)

- Issuing Visas

It is not there to help every tom, dick, and harry with internal legal matters (where the law is being followed and it is not political in nature).

At most they might give you a list of local lawyers which you can see.

He cannot just take the kid and leave.... assuming that he actually managed to leave.... Australian legal system would be bound by international agreements on international child kidnapping to return the kid to Thailand and his/her mother.... since that is who has legal custody in the country in which the kid would have been kidnapped in. Not to mention he would have to have a Australian passport for the kid, and that likely could not be obtained with one parent not consenting.

[harrry]

I sympathize with him. He's already very upset over his child custody problem and to deal with sociopathic government drones on top of that cannot be easy.

The Australian Department of foreign Affairs (DFAT) have already announce that the are making cuts and scaling back assistance to Australians overseas. Aussies are being told that they are now virtually on their own when abroad.

"Australians who get into trouble overseas in future should not expect the level of consular service offered now, Foreign Affairs Minister Bob Carr says"

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1797559/Help-for-Aussies-busted-overseas-to-be-cut:-Carr

Maybe we should remind them of that little blue book we carry, called a passport, which entitles us to all the support our country can give us!

Big misconception there. The embassy contains a couple of primary functions:

- Trade

- Development (although Thailand often is too developed for most countries to qualify)

- Issuing Visas

It is not there to help every tom, dick, and harry with internal legal matters (where the law is being followed and it is not political in nature).

At most they might give you a list of local lawyers which you can see.

He cannot just take the kid and leave.... assuming that he actually managed to leave.... Australian legal system would be bound by international agreements on international child kidnapping to return the kid to Thailand and his/her mother.... since that is who has legal custody in the country in which the kid would have been kidnapped in. Not to mention he would have to have a Australian passport for the kid, and that likely could not be obtained with one parent not consenting.

Not in fact true unless Thailand is a signatory to the convention. In Thailand both party have an equal right to custody unless the court decides otherwise. The mother has no more rights than he has.

[jacko45k]

Have fun next time you try using that passport mate.

Some guys get a kick out of that type of security check!

[GrantSmith]

Wasn't this guy on TV recently asking for advice?

Who ever suggested threatening the embassy, well played

[cacruden]

Not in fact true unless Thailand is a signatory to the convention. In Thailand both party have an equal right to custody unless the court decides otherwise. The mother has no more rights than he has.

Exactly - you require both parents approval (until the age of 20) to get a Thai passport. You also have to have the approval of both parents to take the kid out of Thailand, without that it is KIDNAPPING - a crime. It does NOT require Thailand to be a signatory, it is an international convention that Australia has signed and as such Australia is bound. The only way Australian courts would not implement that is if it was shown (proof) that the child was in danger by returning to Thailand.

[jrtmedic]

laislica

An interesting perspective!

Behaving in a thuggish and abusive manner is not the means of soliciting "compassion "

Maybe a little thought should have been given prior demonstrating a lack of "compassion" and "Hoon" skills !

---------Jobsworth?

Edited August 17, 2013 by jrtmedic

[Dararasmi]

He should have known that very strong reasons for taking custody away from the birth mother are needed in most countries and Thailand is no different. Also it is not the Embassy that can arrange for that anyway. It is the Thai courts.

I can see nothing in this report that states the daughter was born to a Thai mother, nor do I see any reference that the mother and daughter are actually in Thailand.

From another news source.......

He claimed that his former wife beat the child regularly before they were separated.

But police investigations found that Mr Moore's ex-wife provides good care to their child.

Mr Moore told police he used to be a soldier in Australia but had suffered a leg injury and left the military. He travelled to Thailand in 2010 and met his former wife.

Unless he met a farang wife in Thailand I would only assume that his ex is Thai.

Thailand...the last refuge of the scoundrel...nutjob...criminal...loser...coward?

Edited August 17, 2013 by Dararasmi

[harrry]

Not in fact true unless Thailand is a signatory to the convention. In Thailand both party have an equal right to custody unless the court decides otherwise. The mother has no more rights than he has.

Exactly - you require both parents approval (until the age of 20) to get a Thai passport. You also have to have the approval of both parents to take the kid out of Thailand, without that it is KIDNAPPING - a crime. It does NOT require Thailand to be a signatory, it is an international convention that Australia has signed and as such Australia is bound. The only way Australian courts would not implement that is if it was shown (proof) that the child was in danger by returning to Thailand.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hague_Convention_on_the_Civil_Aspects_of_International_Child_Abduction

It is a convention only applying between contracting parties.

If in fact they had been living in Australia and Thailand was a signatory to the convention the child would have to be returned to Australia (at the mother's expense) if the mother took the child to Thailand.

Edited August 17, 2013 by harrry

[malcoml]

What is he being charged with?

I have had very mixed experiences with both the Australian embassy and visa process centre. The biggest problem is obviously that when you go to either of these places you are dealing with someone that is in uniform as such. They carry the typical I'm in uniform so I'm important Thai attitude.

Our culture is just far too different for Thai people to have any position at the embassy regardless of their training.

My wife also mentioned to me that they spoke very bad to Thai people. Did not explain procedures clearly and generally made you feel an idiot. So much so my wife now refuses to go to the visa processing centre.

I have now happily relocated back to Oz after spending 4 years in Thailand. All I miss is cheap liquor and cheap women as to be honest I feel Thailand offers little else compared to Oz.

[briboy]

Wasn't this guy on TV recently asking for advice?

Who ever suggested threatening the embassy, well played

I thought the same thing, unable to find the thread so must be mistaken as always.

[SiamWallaby]

I haven't even replied to a thread on this forum for yonks. Still I get email with the thai headlines, even though I finally escaped.

Myself, I was stuck in Thailand for five years, fighting to get my daughter back home. Her mother gave her to me voluntarily at 3 weeks old and I've looked after her ever since.

The embassy, even though she was a citizen was adamant that she'd never be allowed to leave thailand. That is even though I had been to court about seven times in the thai family courts. Their stance was that both birth parents needed to be involved, that was the rules and there was no way around it. It did not matter that the mother was no longer in her life, her location was unknown, and I had reams of court documents to prove it.

Needless to say, I was on a plane 11 hours later after I finally got her passport. It was an ordeal I will never forget.

So instead of jumping on here and having a go at this bloke who is at least fighting for his daughter ( his methods of course I do not condone) instead of just heading back home and leaving some bird to look after his kid on her own, try and understand his frustration Going back home alone is what 99% of the blokes that come here do. No I do not have scientific evidence to support that but it is by direct observation. In every country village I lived in there were ladies that had luk kreung kids that the pops had bailed on.

Even though I would not have gone as far as threatening bodily harm to myself or the staff, I will admit to the highest level of frustration at the situation, as I felt trapped in a country that did not want me there, nor could I leave because I was all my daughter had. The proverbial catch 22. The Thai governments immigration told me that they did not have a visa for my situation when I was working through this, and that I should overstay my visa! The oz embassy flatly told me I could leave at any time, if I'd just put my australian citizen daughter in a thai orphanage. How do you think that made me feel?

We're both out of the country, now, she's in school and I'm working on my book outlining this experience. I hope that others will learn that, in some places, doing the right thing that we were taught will get you in more trouble and more heart ache than you could even dream of.

I used to think those blokes that leave these poor simple girls with unwanted and unsupported kids were just immature and selfish. I believed I was taught to be a man and take responsibility for my actions.

I sincerely doubt I would do the same thing again. It's just a situation that I hope others can avoid. I'd not wish my experience, or this particular blokes situation and subsequent reaction to it - on my worst enemy.

[Suradit69]

I wonder what's in the photo? The offended telephone at the embassy?

No.

It's of the animals he referred the embassy people as.

Police: look at this pictures mate, did you call the counsellor a Kwai?

Aussie: I plead the 5th.

Police: you called him an idiot then?

Aussie: I still want me daughter, can you help? I ll make it worth your while.

what's the 5th?????

Apparently someone thinks the 5th Amendment to the US Constitution applies to Aussies in Thailand.

[Maggusoil]

A child born overseas to an Australian national and registered with the Australian embassy is automatically an Australian citizen, he should have stayed cool, taken the daughter on a holiday to Grandma in oz and stayed there, chances would have been slightly better and the payoff,more affordable......anyway..

The child maybe an Australian citizen but the person named on the birth certificate as the father is not legally recognised in Thailand as such until you have made application through the courts and a judge deems you to be the lawful father. Those that have family visa's will know this process takes at least 3 months. If the guy hasn't been through this procedure then he is no more the father than Bill Smith of Kooweerup. The Embassy wouldn't touch him with a barge pole if he doesn't have this court document.

This is very interesting. Something I didn't know. Thank you for this. Next trip maybe. Good idea.

[ronthai]

A child born overseas to an Australian national and registered with the Australian embassy is automatically an Australian citizen, he should have stayed cool, taken the daughter on a holiday to Grandma in oz and stayed there, chances would have been slightly better and the payoff,more affordable......anyway.. alt=coffee1.gif width=32 height=24>

As he did not have sole custody awarded by a Thai court, requires Thai mothers written permission for the child to depart Thailand

Agree, with the reply.

A friend of mine whose son was born in England, had a british passport and all, had a very hard time to get custody of his son. I took him many years, even after the mother was jailed for 8 years for drugs dealing.

After a battle of 4-5 years he finally got custody and lives in England with his son and he is doing great at school and all. He does not even want to go back to Thailand now or have contact with his mom. He is now almost 12.

While the boy (6-9yo) was still in Thailand and with the grandparents, he hardly got any education. When dad got him to live with him in Thailand with permission from the grandparents (mom in jail) he put him in school here, but after 5 months he was taken away by the grandparents, back to the village.

[harrry]

I haven't even replied to a thread on this forum for yonks. Still I get email with the thai headlines, even though I finally escaped.

Myself, I was stuck in Thailand for five years, fighting to get my daughter back home. Her mother gave her to me voluntarily at 3 weeks old and I've looked after her ever since.

The embassy, even though she was a citizen was adamant that she'd never be allowed to leave thailand. That is even though I had been to court about seven times in the thai family courts. Their stance was that both birth parents needed to be involved, that was the rules and there was no way around it. It did not matter that the mother was no longer in her life, her location was unknown, and I had reams of court documents to prove it.

Needless to say, I was on a plane 11 hours later after I finally got her passport. It was an ordeal I will never forget.

So instead of jumping on here and having a go at this bloke who is at least fighting for his daughter ( his methods of course I do not condone) instead of just heading back home and leaving some bird to look after his kid on her own, try and understand his frustration Going back home alone is what 99% of the blokes that come here do. No I do not have scientific evidence to support that but it is by direct observation. In every country village I lived in there were ladies that had luk kreung kids that the pops had bailed on.

Even though I would not have gone as far as threatening bodily harm to myself or the staff, I will admit to the highest level of frustration at the situation, as I felt trapped in a country that did not want me there, nor could I leave because I was all my daughter had. The proverbial catch 22. The Thai governments immigration told me that they did not have a visa for my situation when I was working through this, and that I should overstay my visa! The oz embassy flatly told me I could leave at any time, if I'd just put my australian citizen daughter in a thai orphanage. How do you think that made me feel?

We're both out of the country, now, she's in school and I'm working on my book outlining this experience. I hope that others will learn that, in some places, doing the right thing that we were taught will get you in more trouble and more heart ache than you could even dream of.

I used to think those blokes that leave these poor simple girls with unwanted and unsupported kids were just immature and selfish. I believed I was taught to be a man and take responsibility for my actions.

I sincerely doubt I would do the same thing again. It's just a situation that I hope others can avoid. I'd not wish my experience, or this particular blokes situation and subsequent reaction to it - on my worst enemy.

My bet is that you found Thai immigration much more helpful and understanding than the Australian Embassy.

[me313]

A child born overseas to an Australian national and registered with the Australian embassy is automatically an Australian citizen, he should have stayed cool, taken the daughter on a holiday to Grandma in oz and stayed there, chances would have been slightly better and the payoff,more affordable......anyway..

Maybe the insults he was supposed to have said were a few short-breathed angry statements that the Embassy took the liberty of claiming were verbal abuse. The article doesn't state exactly how or what he said and to whom and under what conditions. These embassy officials are not very far distant from their Thai police counterparts and there could have been some collusion between the two types of agencies. It's hard for me to take what embassy officials say as being correct or even legally correct considering my own experience with them, here in Thailand. I am unsure whether it's any better in my own country, I doubt it.

[klauskunkel]

I sympathize with him. He's already very upset over his child custody problem and to deal with sociopathic government drones on top of that cannot be easy.

The Australian Department of foreign Affairs (DFAT) have already announce that the are making cuts and scaling back assistance to Australians overseas. Aussies are being told that they are now virtually on their own when abroad.

"Australians who get into trouble overseas in future should not expect the level of consular service offered now, Foreign Affairs Minister Bob Carr says"

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1797559/Help-for-Aussies-busted-overseas-to-be-cut:-Carr

Maybe we should remind them of that little blue book we carry, called a passport, which entitles us to all the support our country can give us!

Dang, I left it with the jet ski guys!

[Perry2010]

A child born overseas to an Australian national and registered with the Australian embassy is automatically an Australian citizen, he should have stayed cool, taken the daughter on a holiday to Grandma in oz and stayed there, chances would have been slightly better and the payoff,more affordable......anyway..

As he did not have sole custody awarded by a Thai court, requires Thai mothers written permission for the child to depart Thailand

That is incorrect, I brought by 11 month old son back to Australia (December 2012) to live when I split up with my wife. All I had was his passport and birth certificate (we had already contacted the Australian and Thai embassies and they both said that I didn't require anything other than his passport) and we left Thailand and entered Australia with no problems. As long as there are no court restrictions children can leave Thailand freely with their father or a relative.

[Chao Lao Beach]

I sympathize with him. He's already very upset over his child custody problem and to deal with sociopathic government drones on top of that cannot be easy.

I would say that embassy consular staff must deal with abusive calls on a regular basis when citizens are informed on what consular staff can and cannot do for them, yet no action is taken. As a complete assumption I would say that he went too far when threatening consular staff that lead them - AFP? - to decide to get the RTP involved.

I would guess that people he met in Thailand had misinformed him of his "rights" compounding his frustration and anger.

My guess is the person he spoke to may have been a Thai. Possibly an Australian citizen or someone who had studied in Australia but not someone who had lived there their whole life. When someone is upset and talking to the Australian Embassy they probably expect people to react and think in the same way as a person in an australian office does. Local staff however competant cannot give the same cultural context.

The fact is they employ security guards that do not even have a basic understanding of <deleted> English.

[paulchiangmai]

What a Clown!!

Makes me almost ashamed to be Australian when creatures such as this make idiots of themselves in Thailand. However, it must be said that he "looks" like a good upstanding, clean-cut example of a young Aussie and our Embassy should fall over backwards to race to his assistance and staff at the Embassy should be more than willing to take on-board whatever foul utterances he wishes to make. Yeh, and "Pigs can fly!"

Pack him up, send him back where he came from and toss him in jail to learn a lesson in good manners.

Surely if he were to be sent back home and jailed in order to learn some manners he would find you in there waiting for him.

[nami]

Embassies staff are useless rude parasites generally, no wonder he got angry.