Retirement extension income declaration.

[ubonjoe]

As I said, it took some effort for me, but I have had the same amount deposited every month in an account over the course of a given year EVERY MONTH for years even with the currency exchange fluctuations. I can readily pull off a hard copy activity report to demonstrate such and even, if necessary, do it online real-time on their own Immigration office computer if they were to doubt the validity or authenticity of such report.

 

Yes, that makes sense and demonstrates a disciplined approach to your finances.

 

I have tried, with some success so far, to transfer more dollars in when the exchange rate is more favorable and to use baht already in Thailand when the exchange rate is poor, but I suppose the "dollar cost averaging" on a regular monthly transfer would probably work out to about the same results.

 

Thanks to everyone for their contributions.

I think if you could show bank book(s) with transfers totaling 780k over a year that would satisfy immigration. Or even a lesser amount since there is no requirement for you bring in the full amount.

To save on transfer costs some people transfer funds every few months as needed.

You just have to prove you do have an income.

[Suradit69]

I'm still not getting it. Right now my US social security income is about 85,000 baht pm. This I can easily prove. But I don't want to transfer even 65,000 baht to Thailand every month, at least not at first. Being one who doesn't drink or care for bar girls, I don't need that much.

So what happens if I transfer only 50k and leave the rest in the US? Is my proof that I have, from just the one source, 85k pm enough to satisfy, or do I have to transfer 65k when I don't want to?. (after I get set up with a car and scooter and rental and all.)

On the embassy affidavit you would declare the dollar amount you receive each month from SS. Just to be prepared if Immigrations wants proof, you can request a statement from SS to be sent to you showing how much you've been receiving on a monthly basis and that amount should match what you put on the embassy letter. Depends on the office you use and the officer you deal with, but that proof hasn't been asked for very often ... yet.

Since the amount is greater than Baht 65,000, the letter from the embassy is all you need, but just to be safe if you bring along the statement from SS and a copy of your bank book when you apply for the extension, you'll be covered if they want to see some proof.

You do NOT need to bring into Thailand any certain amount. All you are saying is that you have at least Baht 65,000 available in regular monthly income from a foreign source. Of course, they have the right to ask for some evidence that at some point you are bringing some money in to support yourself and that you are spending some reasonable amount here, but that evidence doesn't seem to requested very often ... yet.

[JLCrab]

As I said, it took some effort for me, but I have had the same amount deposited every month in an account over the course of a given year EVERY MONTH for years even with the currency exchange fluctuations. I can readily pull off a hard copy activity report to demonstrate such and even, if necessary, do it online real-time on their own Immigration office computer if they were to doubt the validity or authenticity of such report.

Yes, that makes sense and demonstrates a disciplined approach to your finances.

I have tried, with some success so far, to transfer more dollars in when the exchange rate is more favorable and to use baht already in Thailand when the exchange rate is poor, but I suppose the "dollar cost averaging" on a regular monthly transfer would probably work out to about the same results.

Thanks to everyone for their contributions.

I think if you could show bank book(s) with transfers totaling 780k over a year that would satisfy immigration. Or even a lesser amount since there is no requirement for you bring in the full amount.

To save on transfer costs some people transfer funds every few months as needed.

You just have to prove you do have an incomE

Whatever you think is sufficient -- and you are in most cases probably right -- you want to gloss over the fact that, at least for a US citizen, you signed a sworn affidavit stating that you receive $US nnn EVERY MONTH and if a Thai Immigration Officer wanted for you to corroborate that EVERY MONTH you receive the specified amount, showing a bank book with 800K baht balance would not be the same thing.

[Suradit69]

As I said, it took some effort for me, but I have had the same amount deposited every month in an account over the course of a given year EVERY MONTH for years even with the currency exchange fluctuations. I can readily pull off a hard copy activity report to demonstrate such and even, if necessary, do it online real-time on their own Immigration office computer if they were to doubt the validity or authenticity of such report.

Yes, that makes sense and demonstrates a disciplined approach to your finances.

I have tried, with some success so far, to transfer more dollars in when the exchange rate is more favorable and to use baht already in Thailand when the exchange rate is poor, but I suppose the "dollar cost averaging" on a regular monthly transfer would probably work out to about the same results.

Thanks to everyone for their contributions.

I think if you could show bank book(s) with transfers totaling 780k over a year that would satisfy immigration. Or even a lesser amount since there is no requirement for you bring in the full amount.

To save on transfer costs some people transfer funds every few months as needed.

You just have to prove you do have an incomE

Whatever you think is sufficient -- and you are in most cases probably right -- you want to gloss over the fact that, at least for a US citizen, you signed a sworn affidavit stating that you receive $US nnn EVERY MONTH and if a Thai Immigration Officer wanted for you to corroborate that EVERY MONTH you receive the specified amount, showing a bank book with 800K baht balance would not be the same thing.

Well, not to beat the wording to death, but certifying that you receive the equivalent of Baht 65,000 or more a month is not the same as saying you receive Baht 65,000 in a bank in Thailand. In fact the affidavit declares I receive a certain amount of dollars per month not baht. Obviously the dollars are received in the US, not in Thailand. In my case the pension and SS payments are initially deposited in my bank in Chicago, but once they're in my bank account under my control, I've legally received them. Eventually those dollars make it to Bangkok Bank in NY without me ever laying hands on them and then some numbers are added to my account passbook in Thailand.

On the affidavit there's no mention of where or how the payments are received, just that each month I am receiving that stated amount.

[JLCrab]

The US Government, in preparing the Affidavit Form for requesting the Embassy's requesting the 'assistance' of Thai Immigration on behalf of the Extension of Stay applicant, did not include the word 'average' -- maybe they just forgot. The Police Order 777/2551 2.22 only says that you must have a 'monthly income' of no less than 65,000 baht per month; again, it says nothing about average.

It has been reported on this forum that some immigration offices have asked for proof that at least some but not all of your daily living funds have originated ex-Thailand; not the whole wad.

NB Beating a word to death is sometimes what lawyers get paid hundreds of dollars per hours to do.

[merijn]

I'm still not getting it. Right now my US social security income is about 85,000 baht pm. This I can easily prove. But I don't want to transfer even 65,000 baht to Thailand every month, at least not at first. Being one who doesn't drink or care for bar girls, I don't need that much.

So what happens if I transfer only 50k and leave the rest in the US? Is my proof that I have, from just the one source, 85k pm enough to satisfy, or do I have to transfer 65k when I don't want to?. (after I get set up with a car and scooter and rental and all.)

There is no requirement to transfer all the income to Thailand on a monthly basis.

You have to show that you receive the income but this does not have to be in Thailand.

They can ask for supporting evidence that you receive the income and/or transfer money to Thailand to support your living here.

[Suradit69]

As I said, it took some effort for me, but I have had the same amount deposited every month in an account over the course of a given year EVERY MONTH for years even with the currency exchange fluctuations. I can readily pull off a hard copy activity report to demonstrate such and even, if necessary, do it online real-time on their own Immigration office computer if they were to doubt the validity or authenticity of such report.

Yes, that makes sense and demonstrates a disciplined approach to your finances.

I have tried, with some success so far, to transfer more dollars in when the exchange rate is more favorable and to use baht already in Thailand when the exchange rate is poor, but I suppose the "dollar cost averaging" on a regular monthly transfer would probably work out to about the same results.

Thanks to everyone for their contributions.

I think if you could show bank book(s) with transfers totaling 780k over a year that would satisfy immigration. Or even a lesser amount since there is no requirement for you bring in the full amount.

To save on transfer costs some people transfer funds every few months as needed.

You just have to prove you do have an income.

At Jomtien at least they seem to only want photocopies of bank book pages for the previous three months. I always copy every page that has transactions for the current calendar year, but on one or two occasions the officer has handed back to me pages that went back further than three months, so the totals for the year would not be evident. And the letter from my bank manager only specifies those foreign deposits that were made in the previous three months as well.

[ubonjoe]

We were discussing back up proof for a income affidavit/letter not money in the bank option.

[JLCrab]

We were discussing back up proof for a income affidavit/letter not money in the bank option.

We were also discussing the word 'average' which does appear in Police Order 777/2551 under 2.18 as "must maintain an average annual income of no less than Baht 40,000 per month throughout the year" under the Member of Thai Family option but does NOT appear under the monthly income option for 2.22 Extension In the case of Retirement where it says at 3):

Must have evidence of having income of no less than Baht 65,000 per month;

without any use of the word 'average'.

So to say the 'average' option is OK for Retirement implies that the Royal Thai Police were sloppy in their delineation, at least in translation, of their terms for extension of stay based on Retirement 'cause they really meant to say that 'average monthly income throughout the year' is OK for retirement as well.

[HalC]

For the US Embassy affidavit you make a sworn statement that that is what you receive every month without any mention of word 'average'. Regardless of the various Immigration Police Orders, if an Immigration official wants to see corroboration that that is in fact what you receive every month, then it would be up to that 'competent' official as to what he or she feels is is sufficient corroboration of the words 'every month' that you have sworn to in your affidavit.

In theory, even if your monthly transfers were greater than the minimum 65K per month, an Immigration officer might say that a fluctuating amount does not correspond to the every month statement you made and have sworn to on your US income affidavit. A few years back I tried to have the US Consular Officer notarize a modified version of the US Affidavit that would better correspond to my financial posture at the time . The US Consular said that they will in fact notarize it, but that various Thai Immigration officials have refused to accept amended US Affidavits that vary from the standard form they see every day.

... and you still have to be able to prove that such funds of 65K per month have been transferred from outside the Kingdom. BTW I also have never been asked for backup proof but it took a lot of effort to be able to provide a consistent dollar amount per month (as is sworn on the US affidavit) to meet the 65K amount per moth without fluctuations of Baht to dollar rates. Also that some offices insist on using the US$1 note exchange rate instead of the US$100 note rate.

I don't agree with your interpretation of what the affidavit says.

It really boils down to being able to honestly sign the affidavit. I don't think they could charge you for making a false statement if you have the potential to have the sworn income.

As far as back up proof I don't believe immigration would care if it is the exact amount shown on affidavit or not.

There is no requirement that you bring all money into the country.

And by the way I only have to show 40k not the excessive 65k.

Now my bank book shows the full amount of my SS payments because I use direct deposit to Bangkok Bank NY. I do have assets/funds I could use on affidavit for 65k but why would I.

Hi Everyone, I have read all the comments and appreciate the helpful info but I am still a bit unclear about one particular point. When I arrive permanently in Thailand shortly with my Retirement 'o' Visa, do I have to physically go each and every 90 day's to the Embassy in BKK to obtain my income statement or ( as I assume and hope) can I have the local immigration office in Korat City sight/accept my local Kasikorn Bank managers confirmation letter plus my printed internet banking statement and that will be sufficient. I realise that it can depend a lot on what regional office and who interviews you but I do hope that I don't have to make that trek into BKK 4 times a year. Many thanks in advance.

[lopburi3]

Exactly what do you intend to have for a visa? Non immigrant O single/multi entry? Or retirement O-A single/multi? In no case is financial proof needed every 90 days. And the choice is income or bank deposit or combination so for yearly extensions of stay you have an option. The 90 day reports to immigration would simply by TM.47 address reports.

[ubonjoe]

You are confusing extensions and 90 day reports. Nothing is needed for them other than a TM47 form and your passport.

Your extension will be valid for one year as long as your passport is valid for one year when you apply.

Edit: Failed to notice I was not on last page or I would not of posted. Mobile app.

[JLCrab]

As I just noticed a dis-agreement with my interpretation of the US Income Affidavit provided by the US Embassy in Bangkok, I would just say: As prepared by the US Embassy staff -- on behalf of the Consular Officer who signs such sworn Affidavit -- if they really meant and it was their clear intent that you have an average of USD $xxxx per month over the course of the preceding year instead of every month as clearly stated in the Affidavit, then they could have easily said so.

[Estrada]

A senior immigration officer refused to accept past dividend income as proof of a regular monthly income. His reason was that they require proof of a steady income such as a regular pension payment. They are not interested in past dividends but are interested in future income to support your stay. To quote him "the stocks could crash and pay no dividend". So you cannot use investments and past or potential dividends as proof of monthly income. We are lucky now that they accept B800,000 in a time deposit in Thailand as a basis for granting the one year extension, in the past they would only accept it in an ordinary savings deposit account in a Thai Bank which for many paid no interest. I keep B800,000 in 10 month Bangkok Bank time deposit account bearing 3.25% interest. This provides me with a no hassle renewal of my one year permit to stay on the basis of retirement.

[JLCrab]

As an American, anytime you maintain $10,000 or more in one or more foreign bank accounts you have to file an annual FBAR report with the IRS and at that point they might want to know more.

So the monthly income affidavit option is far more preferable to that potential..