The Chinese......Another View.

[ETatBKK]

Throughout history, China has played no part on the world stage whatsoever. I once asked my good Chinese friend

from Hong Kong why this was so. He told me historically that there has always been so much infighting amongst

the Chinese, they were never able to project any outward power. So I have no fears of China becoming a

world power on a political level. They will simply have a mountain of money from selling their stuff overseas.

But I have to say, their saber rattling in the South China Seas sure has those little frogs jumping

in fear........

yeah, Chinese always have struggles amongst each other, in their own land, or in somewhere else. yeah, fortunately they are not politically provoking or they neither demonstrate their power to others. if they behave like a 'bad boy', I could imagine the momentum of it.

I guess Chinese are more interesting on the return of the financial power than their political position.

[ETatBKK]

We had GUANXI in Europe and the US long before the chinese had GUANXI. It's just that we call it MAFIA. (Same structure).

But lo and behold, there has emerged a new form of Guanxi in Europe and the US: The alliance between Big Business (Big Banks) and the political elite. Mutual agreement: "We don't hurt you, if you don't hurt us."

Cheers.

I guess Chinese Guangxi ( literally relationship ) is by far more organic and more intimacy in every Chinese heart in the thousand years of Chinese culture.

in the past their Guangxi were being applied for sharing care, support and knowledge amongst each other. for example, within the extended families, and between master and followers. it was not much about opportunity, wealth and power, yet deepening the Guangxi and Faces in every Chinese.

in this modern money-hungry economic Chinese, Guangxi becomes a form of opportunity ( business or not ), for securing the access to wealth and power. that makes it an integral part of Chinese living.

[theblether]

Blether I've gotta ask, why would you want to be a godfather of someone whos family has a hatred of the west?

The story re my pal was to illustrate the racist attitudes held by the Chinese against Thais. My pal is guilty of that. Others are guilty of extreme hatred against the West, he is not.

While my pal was in Chiang Mai with me we got news that his wife was refused a visa to travel to the UK. I flew to Shanghai with him the next day and went to visit the UK Consulate. I asked to speak to a British national, went to a private interview room with them, with the husband and wife trailing along, and asked the basis of the refusal.

I was told that although she had complied with two previous visas there was no guarantee that she would comply with a third one. I thought that was Alice In Wonderland logic, comply perfectly twice and then be denied for compliance? Madness.

I pointed out a few salient facts and the visa was granted. I was a hero to both families as you may imagine. A few months later a pregnancy was announced and the wife returned to China to have the baby. A little girl was born and I was celebrated as a Godfather as I had made the visa happen and therefore, well, you know......

Unfortunately the little girl was born with two heart defects. I don't know the ins and outs but I do know that she was extremely lucky to survive. On the eve of her first birthday, having been given a good prognosis, the respective grandparents and parents met for a family meal to celebrate. It was during this meal that a decision was made and relayed to me immediately while I sat in my office in Scotland, that I was to now and forever be known as the babies official Godfather.

I thought that was lovely, anyway I've got an open invitation to wander over to celebrate said gift bestowed, and I'll do it sometime next year. I fancy going over in full Scottish regalia and getting a photo of the wee one sitting on my knee, I think that would be a cracker. I like the idea of a wee Chinese princess belting about the place talking about her Scottish Godfather.

I must be getting soft in my old age But hey, the way to break down prejudice is to interact with people, so to that extent, this is a minor victory in race relations.

That's what you get for asking.

Wiki has a good description of Guanxi.......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guanxi

Edited September 2, 2013 by theblether

[ABCer]

Guanxi, Mafia, Nomenklatura or Oligarchy what does a name matter?

At the bottom there is one thing - Power grabbed illegally.

Notwithstanding the fact that 'legality' is not applicable in any of these cases.

Edited September 2, 2013 by ABCer

[Tomtomtom69]

Guangxi, Shmuangxi, I didn't sign up for any of it and I don't take their crap. To me they are just foreigners in this country, just like me, and have no special rights or privileges. I've had a tourist Chinese "princeling" and "princess" try to order me around in Chiang Mai and I told them to eff off. The Thais should do the same.

You're right. Outside of China, nobody knows about nor cares about Chinese culture, except government repression and the worst toilets in the world - I'm talking about toilets where people shit all over the toilet seats and the smell is worse than if 10 dogs just died in one spot. Chinese tourists in Thailand are just like tourists from anywhere else - if you have money, you command respect, doesn't matter where you come from. I don't know what you mean about a Chinese tourist bossing you around - please explain.

[Tomtomtom69]

Blether I've gotta ask, why would you want to be a godfather of someone whos family has a hatred of the west?

The story re my pal was to illustrate the racist attitudes held by the Chinese against Thais. My pal is guilty of that. Others are guilty of extreme hatred against the West, he is not.

While my pal was in Chiang Mai with me we got news that his wife was refused a visa to travel to the UK. I flew to Shanghai with him the next day and went to visit the UK Consulate. I asked to speak to a British national, went to a private interview room with them, with the husband and wife trailing along, and asked the basis of the refusal.

I was told that although she had complied with two previous visas there was no guarantee that she would comply with a third one. I thought that was Alice In Wonderland logic, comply perfectly twice and then be denied for compliance? Madness.

I pointed out a few salient facts and the visa was granted. I was a hero to both families as you may imagine. A few months later a pregnancy was announced and the wife returned to China to have the baby. A little girl was born and I was celebrated as a Godfather as I had made the visa happen and therefore, well, you know......

Unfortunately the little girl was born with two heart defects. I don't know the ins and outs but I do know that she was extremely lucky to survive. On the eve of her first birthday, having been given a good prognosis, the respective grandparents and parents met for a family meal to celebrate. It was during this meal that a decision was made and relayed to me immediately while I sat in my office in Scotland, that I was to now and forever be known as the babies official Godfather.

I thought that was lovely, anyway I've got an open invitation to wander over to celebrate said gift bestowed, and I'll do it sometime next year. I fancy going over in full Scottish regalia and getting a photo of the wee one sitting on my knee, I think that would be a cracker. I like the idea of a wee Chinese princess belting about the place talking about her Scottish Godfather.

I must be getting soft in my old age But hey, the way to break down prejudice is to interact with people, so to that extent, this is a minor victory in race relations.

That's what you get for asking.

Wiki has a good description of Guanxi.......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guanxi

For those of us who have been to China, Thais included, we know that many Chinese smell bad because they rarely shower, don't use deodorant and they have a mouth odor problem (my Thai friends keep telling me this every time they talk about Chinese people with me). I have a good number of Chinese friends and like them, we only care about the people we know not the average Mr. Li on the streets. Also, the personal habits of the majority of the population leaves a lot to be desired - especially the kids whose parents allow them to take a dump anywhere they please out on the streets or even inside shopping malls, yes you read that right, inside shopping malls. Why the hell they don't buy diapers (nappies) for their kids or use deodorant is beyond me, but even for someone like me, who works partly in China and partly in Thailand, and who has seen the worst toilets ever, the worst social habits ever, etc. I sincerely hope that such attitudes do not make their way to other countries, including to Thailand. Fortunately, the majority of the Chinese are not like that, but the minority of idiots like the ones mesquite described, do ruin it for the perceptions of the rest of us. Just like the OP pointed out about the education system in China (note that I disagree about the teaching of hatred about the west, it's more about teaching of hatred for the Japanese and in general teaching about how China is the best - as a side note China has very little reason to dislike the west, besides westerners are so rare in China the chance for any meaningful exchange between westerners and locals is very limited, hence the majority of Chinese also judge one foreigner's actions in China as reflective of those of all foreigners', which is not much different from what has been pointed out here). Thais, other foreigners etc. also judge Chinese people on the actions of those few that act in bad ways, so such stereotypes are quite universal. However, China really needs to have more foreigners visiting and living inside it's territory, but probably because it's such a large country, one can easily travel vast parts of the country without ever encountering another foreigner although cities like Shanghai, Beijing, Guangzhou, Chengdu and Kunming have plenty of foreigners these days.

Also, I don't see why Thailand should knee tow to these tourists either - they are like everyone else, nothing special. Most of them travel in tour groups and even the ones who travel individually don't have much more money than your average western tourist, quite the contrary, they often travel on budget tours and spend less on the airfare than most westerners as China is much closer to Thailand than Europe and North America are. Only Australia is reasonably close, but even Perth is generally further away from Bangkok and Phuket than most cities in China. Also, the vast majority of Chinese still earn only a pittance compared to the mighty Japanese, Koreans, westerners etc. perhaps only $1000 a month. While this is enough for a short holiday to Thailand, it's less than half (perhaps even just a third) of what a toilet cleaner (janitor) would make in Australia or Europe. So there you go - the Chinese who come to Thailand on holiday are usually not the mighty rich as they would rather go to the USA, Australia or Europe to splurge.

[GrantSmith]

Christ theblether seems that tumble you took the other day has turned you all philosophical

[mesquite]

Guangxi, Shmuangxi, I didn't sign up for any of it and I don't take their crap. To me they are just foreigners in this country, just like me, and have no special rights or privileges. I've had a tourist Chinese "princeling" and "princess" try to order me around in Chiang Mai and I told them to eff off. The Thais should do the same.

You're right. Outside of China, nobody knows about nor cares about Chinese culture, except government repression and the worst toilets in the world - I'm talking about toilets where people shit all over the toilet seats and the smell is worse than if 10 dogs just died in one spot. Chinese tourists in Thailand are just like tourists from anywhere else - if you have money, you command respect, doesn't matter where you come from. I don't know what you mean about a Chinese tourist bossing you around - please explain.

See post 24.

[Tomtomtom69]

I think it could be a complete life studies on Chinese Guangxi, Faces, Mao's children, Deng's children, the modern consequence of the one child policy . . .

Chinese will influence the pace of the world economy in next decades, that certainly influences the in-and-out of the Thai culture these days. a very popular film in China - lost in Thailand, brings MILLIONS of Chinese tourists to Thailand.

Central Department Stores, have public address in Chinese language, and offer special discount for Chinese tourists . . .

if you still could learn Chinese language, start now. if your kids are not yet in the Chinese language class, then bring them into this ABC of Chinese culture.

No need to learn Chinese, as the Chinese are rapidly learning English. They fully realize that having a language

that basically no one else uses, is a hindrance to them economically. So quietly, on a massive scale,

China has brought in many thousand of teachers to teach English. I finally got a sense of this when

I was traveling in China, and virtually every white person I met was a English teacher on holiday.

This of course was in central China, not Beijing.....

Well yes they are learning English, but more and more foreigners are also going to China to learn Chinese. In general, you can't get by in Chinese just with English so by that measure the Chinese have got a LONG LONG way to go when it comes to mastering English. Also, there are more foreigners living in China that can speak Chinese than there are foreigners living in any other Asian country that can speak the local lingo of those countries, including Thailand. It is still quite rare for a foreigner living in Thailand to speak Thai, but almost every foreigner living in China, especially in places like Kunming speaks at least some Chinese, with some of them speaking Chinese very well (particularly Europeans). The Japanese are good at writing, but suck at speaking as their Japanese accent makes them hard to understand.

[Tomtomtom69]

Guangxi, Shmuangxi, I didn't sign up for any of it and I don't take their crap. To me they are just foreigners in this country, just like me, and have no special rights or privileges. I've had a tourist Chinese "princeling" and "princess" try to order me around in Chiang Mai and I told them to eff off. The Thais should do the same.

Good for you. I would have done the same.

How exactly did they try to order you around?

Told me to get out of my seat in an airplane so they could sit there, and to not sit in an empty chair in a restaurant, one they had just vacated.

Oh OK, thanks for clearing that up. Once on a flight to Kunming back in 2010, some Chinese bitch wanted to sit next to her other "friends", but as it turns out, I was better off sitting next to another Thai passenger in the aisle seat rather than my originally assigned seat in the middle row. It turns out that that particular young woman should have been seated next to her other 3 friends anyway, but probably wasn't able to make herself understood at check-in. So I let it go. However, good that you told them to buzz off - was this on a flight from Chiang Mai to Kunming, or to Bangkok?

[harrry]

There is no way that any Thai official would send a text to him saying "why are you still in Thailand", as they did to the Australian Honorary consulate the other day, (another hard working man ). They wouldn't dream of it, they're terrified of him. Why? It's because he's playing them at their own game. Their is no one better in the world at using the "it's our culture" card than the Chinese, and no one better at cutting through the bs.

Interesting post. Please expand on how exactly he's playing them at their own game. How do the Chinese actually hold the Thais accountable? Do they threaten to cut investments?

Every Asian nation looks to China with a mix of fear and trepidation. You may remember the story about the Chinese fishermen being slaughtered by Thai soldiers working in conjunction with a major drug runner, ( now captured, and sentenced to death I believe ). The Chinese told the Thai authorities that they were going to impose naval patrols in Thai Mekong waters as they couldn't be trusted to police it themselves.

There wasn't any negotiation, it was a command. We are sending our military vessels into your naval waters and that's it. As usual when faced with Chinese determination, the Thais bottled it.

It's the power of money, the power of history, and the sheer bottom line refusal by China to take no for an answer. The Thais know better than anyone that there's no one more threatening in this area that China. They have also felt the legendary tongue lashings that the Chinese diplomatic service hands out.

The Chinese diplomats will sit there in all politeness and go through the farce of pretending they understand Thailand's problem with the jet ski / speedboat / tuk tuk drivers, then they'll tell them direct, as XU Mingliang did recently. Stop talking crap, sort it out, and do it now.

There was a recent article where Xu ripped into the Phuket establishment calling them out as being thieves and con men. ( I can't find the link ), and saying that Phuket was a disgrace. He's been saying that straight to the Governors face too. The Chinese will use any technique they need to use to get their way. Any. If that means turning off the investment tap, so be it.

China wouldn't tell America that they're putting military in their waters.Perhaps these small neighbouring countries with shared borders they can bully a bit, that's the Chinese arrogance, but that's about it.

Not sure they are Thai waters,doesn't Laos control the Mekong

[mesquite]

Guangxi, Shmuangxi, I didn't sign up for any of it and I don't take their crap. To me they are just foreigners in this country, just like me, and have no special rights or privileges. I've had a tourist Chinese "princeling" and "princess" try to order me around in Chiang Mai and I told them to eff off. The Thais should do the same.

Good for you. I would have done the same.

How exactly did they try to order you around?

Told me to get out of my seat in an airplane so they could sit there, and to not sit in an empty chair in a restaurant, one they had just vacated.

Oh OK, thanks for clearing that up. Once on a flight to Kunming back in 2010, some Chinese bitch wanted to sit next to her other "friends", but as it turns out, I was better off sitting next to another Thai passenger in the aisle seat rather than my originally assigned seat in the middle row. It turns out that that particular young woman should have been seated next to her other 3 friends anyway, but probably wasn't able to make herself understood at check-in. So I let it go. However, good that you told them to buzz off - was this on a flight from Chiang Mai to Kunming, or to Bangkok?

BKK

[GrantSmith]

The funny thing about the chinese tourism is that they are allowed to go where their Government approves them to go..

It's not to say that they need to seek approval from the government prior to travel, but the government must have approved the destination first.

A company I worked for in farangland before moving to Bangkok has an accredited training program for its staff regarding Chinese visitation.

Quite ridiculous when you think about the 'requirements' which included: slippers for all Chinese guests, one Chinese language channel, food items on the buffet to be familiar with Chinese nationals, Chinese tea, Chinese newspaper and Chinese speaking staff. All this in order to get "approval" and be listed as an approved accommodation provider.

My previous GM, knowing my fondness for the Asian culture nominated me to be the hotels 'ambassador' for this program. Suited me fine, food being my thing I had no qualms in organizing the food items, but <deleted> me did I cop some grief from my colleagues when I told them that the boss wants all this stuff ordered in.

Subsequently the hotel was able to secure a number of Chinese airlines and tour groups which during the low season are sometimes the difference between being able to maintain extra staff or cutting them.

[Tomtomtom69]

The funny thing about the chinese tourism is that they are allowed to go where their Government approves them to go..

It's not to say that they need to seek approval from the government prior to travel, but the government must have approved the destination first.

A company I worked for in farangland before moving to Bangkok has an accredited training program for its staff regarding Chinese visitation.

Quite ridiculous when you think about the 'requirements' which included: slippers for all Chinese guests, one Chinese language channel, food items on the buffet to be familiar with Chinese nationals, Chinese tea, Chinese newspaper and Chinese speaking staff. All this in order to get "approval" and be listed as an approved accommodation provider.

My previous GM, knowing my fondness for the Asian culture nominated me to be the hotels 'ambassador' for this program. Suited me fine, food being my thing I had no qualms in organizing the food items, but <deleted> me did I cop some grief from my colleagues when I told them that the boss wants all this stuff ordered in.

Subsequently the hotel was able to secure a number of Chinese airlines and tour groups which during the low season are sometimes the difference between being able to maintain extra staff or cutting them.

So you're saying a Chinese visitor can't go to say, Afghanistan even if the Afghani government grants them a visa? This seems absolutely baloney to me, if as a Chinese visitor has a visa surely you can go to that particular country, Chinese government approved or not. However, please do explain if what I just said is wrong.

Edited September 2, 2013 by Tomtomtom69

[GrantSmith]

Yeah it's sort of like that, but the Chinese national isn't going to go to Afghanistan if it's not an approved destination...

[swissie]

Nevermind Guangxi folks. There will be other things that will occupy our minds with regard to China in the future.

The role of the "worlds-policeman" of the US is coming to an end. To be replaced by the Chinese-World-Police. The younger ones of us and especially their children, will think back to the time when the US was the "Worlds-Policemen" bound by democratic rules and regulations. = All in all a friendly Policeman.

The new World-Policemen will be handling the "problems of the world" in a different way. In a very different way.

So, let's enjoy the "Pax-Americana" as long as it lasts. What is to follow is nothing but scary. My words.

Cheers.

[Tomtomtom69]

Yeah it's sort of like that, but the Chinese national isn't going to go to Afghanistan if it's not an approved destination...

So you're saying that the government can prevent a Chinese national going to say, Afghanistan at the airport, on the basis it's not an approved destination? Wow, that's some nanny state that China.

However, what's interesting to note is that I'm aware that the Chinese authorities won't allow a Chinese national to leave China for a destination, approved or not, if they don't already have a visa for that country in their passports. It doesn't matter that Thailand, for example, allows Chinese visitors to visit for up to 15 days provided they have a confirmed round-trip plane ticket within 15 days, 10,000 Baht per visitor, the name of a hotel, a passport photograph and 1,000 Baht to pay for the visa on arrival - the Chinese authorities require Thai visas inside the passports of Chinese nationals. Only eligible foreigners can avail themselves of visa exempt and visa-on-arrival facilities in Thailand, if leaving from China. I find this an interesting case of Chinese rules overriding foreign ones. Why don't the Thais then just cancel the 15-day visa on arrival for Chinese, given it's so underused? The only Chinese who would be allowed to use it are the few who are in a third country and traveling to Thailand that way, but at some point they had to obtain a visa for at least one country in order to be allowed to leave China.

[theblether]

Yeah it's sort of like that, but the Chinese national isn't going to go to Afghanistan if it's not an approved destination...

So by dint, it wouldn't be out of the question for the Chinese government to ban travel to Phuket, which seems to be where they are getting most grief. Even though it's within a visa approved country there's no Chinese tour company that would go against that command.

Maybe that's what Phuket is needing, a couple of travel bans to shake the place, and the entire Thai tourist industry up.

[EyesWideOpen]

Nevermind Guangxi folks. There will be other things that will occupy our minds with regard to China in the future.

The role of the "worlds-policeman" of the US is coming to an end. To be replaced by the Chinese-World-Police. The younger ones of us and especially their children, will think back to the time when the US was the "Worlds-Policemen" bound by democratic rules and regulations. = All in all a friendly Policeman.

The new World-Policemen will be handling the "problems of the world" in a different way. In a very different way.

So, let's enjoy the "Pax-Americana" as long as it lasts. What is to follow is nothing but scary. My words.

Cheers.

I have often said the exact same thing. When some Euro trash is chortling to me about the demise of America, and its replacement as the world's superpower by China, I usually burst into laughter, and tell that person I hope they live long enough to see it. Because then the days of America as the world's superpower, will be referred to as the good old days............... To clearly see this, just ask the people of Tibet how they feel about having the iron fist of China ruling them..

Edited September 2, 2013 by EyesWideOpen

[GrantSmith]

If push came to shove, the Chinese Government could black ban travel to Phuket and/or Thailand just to prove a point.

It wasn't to long ago that the USA wasn't an approved destination.

[EyesWideOpen]

If push came to shove, the Chinese Government could black ban travel to Phuket and/or Thailand just to prove a point.

It wasn't to long ago that the USA wasn't an approved destination.

The Chinese put a black travel alert on the Philippines after those Chinese tourists will killed by the bozo

policemen on their " rescue" plan. But my understanding is that Chinese tourists still go there, so clearly

these alerts do not have a whole lot teeth in them. But yeah , it would be a bit of a wake up call to Phuket

to have a travel ban put on them. I personally think that Phuket has lost the plot, and at this point it does

not really matter what they do. Would be curious to know if Phuket or Pattaya gets the lion share of

Chinese ire over mistreated tourists.

[LawrenceChee]

The Chinese government controls travel destinations and approvals mainly thru CTS

A good example is with the current hiccups with Japan, the Chinese govt issued travel bans to Japan during the recent tsunami for health advisory and also a 2 week ban where they were "strongly advised " against travel for safety reasons when the tension was particularly high about a year ago

All royal Caribbean cruises were also diverted to Korean ports and all Japanese ports of calls removed to comply with the CTS advisory so yes they have a lot of clout

"Strongly advised" = stop selling all tours for CTS

[ETatBKK]

on the example of travelling, Chinese government ALLOWS Chinese residents going to Hong Kong for tour purpose after the 2008 downturn. BILLION of RMB flew to Hong Kong and Hong Kong economy recovered just in months.

this is just one example of power of China, in a very positive way !

reversely, Chinese government also could bring anyone from the plane, even who is on the way home. I saw that in June 1989.

[LawrenceChee]

This is an excellent article written by blether and it does provide background for a lot of people who are unfamiliar with guanxi and how the Chinese in general works

No right / wrong here just the way it works in china

Guanxi is the most important thing for business and in general living successfully in china entails

As for the rich Chinese they will continue to visit Thailand

The general trend there now is one long trip to places like Europe and USA and a few short ones to Singapore, Hong Kong and Thailand

If u work in the hotel business the high end Chinese guests are filling up the rooms at all the major band names and upping the APD ( revenue marker for the hotel biz) for the owners so unfortunately whatever your personal preferences are, these are the major clients the hotels wants these days

If you are at Chiang Mai , the 4 seasons, Meriden and Dhara Devi suites are all occupied by these folks

[SinglePot]

My China story (or one of): Around 1991 I was visiting the office of an American company in Beijing where I was talking with one of the engineers. The manager was hovering around and I guessed he was thinking "Why are you wasting my engineer's time?" When we were finished, the manager asked me "Are you finished?" and I braced for a tongue lashing. Instead he asked: Can you explain to me what is a leveraged buyout?"

So we spent the next hour or so discussing that and other things. I realized: He would never let on to anyone important that he didn't know what was a leveraged buyout but I was OK and he guessed that I would know. The Chinese in those days were very insecure about how far behind they were and you had to be very careful not to say anything like: You mean you don't know that?

It is just the same in 2013 as it was in your 1991 story JLCrab. I have recently returned from China where I worked for a year for US company.

[SinglePot]

@theblether

A long and detailed original post TB.

Not sure if I have grasped the focus of it.

I'll tell you one thing that may possibly be interesting and relevant though.

In the demographic that I operated in, it was very rare for me to meet a person who had a brother or a sister. They compensate for what we in the west might see as a loss.

The socio economic consequences of one child policy are as complicated and as interesting as your appreciation of what the Chinese call Guanxi.

For me there is a sense of the one child policy reinforcing the state's 'ownership' of the people. You are the one child that is allowed. You are here with our permission.

I will read again your original post and the many replies and probably drop a few comments in.

[NeverSure]

Nevermind Guangxi folks. There will be other things that will occupy our minds with regard to China in the future.

The role of the "worlds-policeman" of the US is coming to an end. To be replaced by the Chinese-World-Police. The younger ones of us and especially their children, will think back to the time when the US was the "Worlds-Policemen" bound by democratic rules and regulations. = All in all a friendly Policeman.

The new World-Policemen will be handling the "problems of the world" in a different way. In a very different way.

So, let's enjoy the "Pax-Americana" as long as it lasts. What is to follow is nothing but scary. My words.

Cheers.

Not in your lifetime. China is nothing more than a copier and a lapdog which provides cheap labor to manufacture things invented elsewhere. The inventors make the real money. China TOTALLY lacks the abilitly to create. They make Iphones and Nike shoes for the real money boys.

What is starting to happen is that China's labor, and the cost of shipping raw materials and then shipping back finished products is rising. The US hasn't forgotten how to manufacture and some companies are moving back. LINK LINK And I could go on.

Another thing is productivity and again, invention. For years China has manufactured much of the clothing for the US and other countries. Some guys in the US just invented a complete assembly line that makes clothes without human intervention. It's all computerized. Good bye China. Then there's 3D printing which will take a lot of jobs in manufacturing from China. A lot.

China has peaked and is slipping at the same time it builds mountains of debt. It's wallowing. Watch it fail.

[SinglePot]

Blether I've gotta ask, why would you want to be a godfather of someone whos family has a hatred of the west?

The story re my pal was to illustrate the racist attitudes held by the Chinese against Thais. My pal is guilty of that. Others are guilty of extreme hatred against the West, he is not.

While my pal was in Chiang Mai with me we got news that his wife was refused a visa to travel to the UK. I flew to Shanghai with him the next day and went to visit the UK Consulate. I asked to speak to a British national, went to a private interview room with them, with the husband and wife trailing along, and asked the basis of the refusal.

I was told that although she had complied with two previous visas there was no guarantee that she would comply with a third one. I thought that was Alice In Wonderland logic, comply perfectly twice and then be denied for compliance? Madness.

I pointed out a few salient facts and the visa was granted. I was a hero to both families as you may imagine. A few months later a pregnancy was announced and the wife returned to China to have the baby. A little girl was born and I was celebrated as a Godfather as I had made the visa happen and therefore, well, you know......

Unfortunately the little girl was born with two heart defects. I don't know the ins and outs but I do know that she was extremely lucky to survive. On the eve of her first birthday, having been given a good prognosis, the respective grandparents and parents met for a family meal to celebrate. It was during this meal that a decision was made and relayed to me immediately while I sat in my office in Scotland, that I was to now and forever be known as the babies official Godfather.

I thought that was lovely, anyway I've got an open invitation to wander over to celebrate said gift bestowed, and I'll do it sometime next year. I fancy going over in full Scottish regalia and getting a photo of the wee one sitting on my knee, I think that would be a cracker. I like the idea of a wee Chinese princess belting about the place talking about her Scottish Godfather.

I must be getting soft in my old age But hey, the way to break down prejudice is to interact with people, so to that extent, this is a minor victory in race relations.

That's what you get for asking.

Wiki has a good description of Guanxi.......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guanxi

There is nothing special or enticing about Guanxi TB.

I'll scratch your back if you scratch mine.

In its legal form it is cartels, monopolies and leverage.

In its illegal form it is bribery, corruption and backhanders.

And there is a lot of the latter going on in China as the manufacturing and construction businesses make the average western economy look like a corner shop.

[SinglePot]

Nevermind Guangxi folks. There will be other things that will occupy our minds with regard to China in the future.

The role of the "worlds-policeman" of the US is coming to an end. To be replaced by the Chinese-World-Police. The younger ones of us and especially their children, will think back to the time when the US was the "Worlds-Policemen" bound by democratic rules and regulations. = All in all a friendly Policeman.

The new World-Policemen will be handling the "problems of the world" in a different way. In a very different way.

So, let's enjoy the "Pax-Americana" as long as it lasts. What is to follow is nothing but scary. My words.

Cheers.

Not in your lifetime. China is nothing more than a copier and a lapdog which provides cheap labor to manufacture things invented elsewhere. The inventors make the real money. China TOTALLY lacks the abilitly to create. They make Iphones and Nike shoes for the real money boys.

What is starting to happen is that China's labor, and the cost of shipping raw materials and then shipping back finished products is rising. The US hasn't forgotten how to manufacture and some companies are moving back. LINK LINK And I could go on.

Another thing is productivity and again, invention. For years China has manufactured much of the clothing for the US and other countries. Some guys in the US just invented a complete assembly line that makes clothes without human intervention. It's all computerized. Good bye China. Then there's 3D printing which will take a lot of jobs in manufacturing from China. A lot.

China has peaked and is slipping at the same time it builds mountains of debt. It's wallowing. Watch it fail.

True. but only half the story.

McDonalds, Starbucks and General Motors want to sell their stuff to as many of the potential 1.4 billion Chinese consumers as they can. The west may not need Chinese manufacturing, but they need Chinese

purchasing.

[klubex99]

Ahhhhh China!

If you thought Thais were xenophobic, they aint got nothing on the Chinese establishment.

All a bit ripe, when you consider that the Chinese are crawling all over the world raping the natural resources and mineral wealth from every poor country on earth that will take a backhander at government level.