PM Cameron to make British welfare off limits to migrants

[MAJIC]

Cameron is Electioneering,he knows very well the only chance of stopping other European Countries Members from coming into the UK and claiming our generous Benefit System is to pull out of Europe,which he doesn't want to do,but a large part of his Party voted for a Referendum on Europe,and Cameron was compromised and reluctantly agreed to a Referendum in 2017,that's another four years of watching our country go down the tubes! and gives Cameron plenty of time to wriggle out of that agreement too.

Should Cameron decide to withhold Benefits to other European Nations the fines for breaking EEC/EEA Laws will come down like an avalanche!

The Immigration question is a major vote winner at the next Election,hence Teresa May is doing her best to curb the influx,which is shown by her hardline new immigation rules,changing the rules for those non members of the EEC/EEA Countries,having many detremental new rules to comply with,in order to bring their spouses into the UK.

The problem is Millions of EEC/EEA Members crossing open borders within Europe at will,which is where the main problem of those claiming the British Benefit system. Now from on January the 1st 2014, we have a predicted huge influx from Rumanian and Bulgarian (quotes have ranged up to a half a million people) Newly qualified EEC Citizens ready to come into the UK and get their noses into the already over burdened benefits trough. Cameron has the nerve to curb his own peoples Benefits,I doubt he will do the same to the Economic Migrants from Europe.

Cameron and the Conservative Party are well aware that in order to have a chance of power at the next Election,they must be seen to be doing something about Immigration,they can't do anything to stop the influx from Europe,so the rest of the worlds immigration policy has been made the scapegoat,with Draconian new rules,for the benefit of the voters. When it's patently obvious the main problem is the colossal influx from Europe! which comprises around 30 Countries,all looking after their own interests,to call us all Europeans is laughable,every Country is looking after their own Countries interests,and only revert to being Europeans,when they go bust and need a bail out,such as recently: Greece,Spain,Italy,Ireland and Portugal,right now they are Europeans,accepting a bail out,when they get back on their feet again,look out for some Sabre rattling Nationalism.

The Tories swept us into Europe on a pack of lies about the Common Market,and a United Europe for trading purposes only,under the Ted Heath Government (who admitted he dreamed of a Federal Europe,),don't rely on the Tories to get us out though!

Making British welfare off limits to migrants? don't hold your breath on that one either!

[MAJIC]

At least the soup kitchens and food banks that are being set up all over the UK will still be free.....

Yes they are: and sponsored by the people with donations!

[MAJIC]

The answer is very simple,all European Countries,should be responsible for their own people i.e. If you wish to travel to another Country,then your own Country should pay your welfare and housing needs!

Why is this not standard practice? because countries like the UK pay out much more in Benefits than most others,so the scroungers go from one Country to another to get the largest payout,anyone heard of how the Gypsies have been supported for decades?

[geriatrickid]

Good. Next; welfare and other state hand-outs not available to immigrants to all EU counties. If it sounds like trench mentality, I'm sorry, but there are just too many people wandering around trying to get hand-outs. Yet another proof of gross overpopulation of the planet, .....if any proof were needed.

Thailand should do that too. Anytime a destitute farang shows up at a public hospital refuse to render assistance

[jackr]

Make it reciprocal too. No access for Brits to Spanish health care of the Costa Del Yob.

Healthcare is already reciprocal regardless. This is about people coming over and holding their hand out, and Britain has been obliging to all 'n sundry for donkey's years. Don't make this about Brits taking from others.

[samran]

Make it reciprocal too. No access for Brits to Spanish health care of the Costa Del Yob.

Healthcare is already reciprocal regardless. This is about people coming over and holding their hand out, and Britain has been obliging to all 'n sundry for donkey's years. Don't make this about Brits taking from others.

Sorry for that. Forgive me for pointing out the stinking hypocracy in this argument.

[i claudius]

To be honest i think Britain would be better off out of the E.U end of .

[Alwyn]

About time but the answer is very simple. If (for example) a Romanian pitches up in England or Germany seeking benefits then it's fair he/she should get the benefits if meeting the correct criteria. He/she should get exaclty what they would have got in their home country and the home country should pay it -wether family allowance, income support, medical benefits or housing etc. Same should apply to Brits and everytbody else too within the EU. Those from outside the EU, what are they doing being allowed in the country anyway on anything other than a tourist visa (which allows them to 'tour')? If they have been granted student or working visa/permission this should not qualify them for benefits of any kind except medical if they are paying NI. Not rocket science really is it?

Another one with no idea of what the law actually says.

EU citizens do not automatically get benefits when they enter the UK - they have to have worked for at least a year (or been self-employed for the same amount of time) before they can claim unemployment benefits - but only the contributions based benefits. They cannot claim the non-contributory benefits.

Non-EU citizens can only claim benefits after being sponsored in as a spouse or partner and having completed five years in country and having gained Indefinite Leave to Remain or full settlement. Before 12 July 2013, those on settlement visas would have immediate access to full benefits, now new entrants do not.

I am well aware of the laws

[jinners]

Make it reciprocal too. No access for Brits to Spanish health care of the Costa Del Yob.

Errm why? I know many decent people lived/living there? Not sure which coast you lived on but very please I wasn't there.

[super22k]

Why not treat immigrants into the UK the same as Thailand treats people who come to Thailand. No benifits. No free health care. Must have thousands of pounds in a Thai bank. 90 day report etc.ect.ect........the list goes on. It could stop them coming to the UK.

The thought of millions of Romainians and Bulgarians coming to the UK frightens me. Why didnt successive governments forsee the problem?Most of the people did.

The truth is British M.P.s live in a different world. They help the financial institutions but dont care about the people.

When I stayed in some of these European countries (Poland.Czeck republic.Slovakia) I had to pay in full for any medical treatment I got.

[Chicog]

Government benefits should be restricted to tax payers and their direct families in every country, not just citizens, but all that qualify as tax payers.

It will obviously take some thought to come up with what is fair to be a qualified tax payer. And that is the real question.

Does not take a financial genius to figure out that this money will run dry if it is spent on a bunch of squating free-loaders!

What do you propose people on a basic state pension do? Benefits include not paying council tax for instance, free dental and medical care, etc. There are also many others like members of the armed forces who have served abroad and unable to work as the result of injuries. There are many single people who do not have 'direct families. I think your idea is half baked.

However, something has to be done to remove the scroungers from the benefits gravy train, particularly those with a horde of offspring, the bad back syndrome and who have never done a days work.

Don't forget the "I'm too depressed to work" brigade.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Whole discussion pointless. Not up to Cameron, up to EU.

Unless Cameron wants to leave EU, which will never happen, EU too big a gravy train for former MPs.

[MAJIC]

About time but the answer is very simple. If (for example) a Romanian pitches up in England or Germany seeking benefits then it's fair he/she should get the benefits if meeting the correct criteria. He/she should get exaclty what they would have got in their home country and the home country should pay it -wether family allowance, income support, medical benefits or housing etc. Same should apply to Brits and everytbody else too within the EU. Those from outside the EU, what are they doing being allowed in the country anyway on anything other than a tourist visa (which allows them to 'tour')? If they have been granted student or working visa/permission this should not qualify them for benefits of any kind except medical if they are paying NI. Not rocket science really is it?

Another one with no idea of what the law actually says.

EU citizens do not automatically get benefits when they enter the UK - they have to have worked for at least a year (or been self-employed for the same amount of time) before they can claim unemployment benefits - but only the contributions based benefits. They cannot claim the non-contributory benefits.

Non-EU citizens can only claim benefits after being sponsored in as a spouse or partner and having completed five years in country and having gained Indefinite Leave to Remain or full settlement. Before 12 July 2013, those on settlement visas would have immediate access to full benefits, now new entrants do not.

Your last statement is incorrect:

12 July 2013, those on settlement visas would have immediate access to full benefits.

Prior to July 12 2013. Those on settlement visas were entitled to free Healthcare,and only entitled to Benefits after obtaining ILR,over 2 years later.

[nong38]

Ok, I disagree with all the previous comments. Criticizing and implying that migrants are to blame for the UKs economic woes is nothing more for than the oldest of ploys, of blaming strangers or outcasts for the problems of society. I strongly suspect that if the total amount paid to these people by the UK government was totaled it would amount to a fraction of one percent of the economy. Banning these people from benefits would make no difference to anything in the UK. This rant is in the same vein as banning Thai wives of UK citizens from benefits, rabble rousing about nothing of importance.

A unified Europe, free from wars, and with open economic borders, is of benefit to all. Part of this process is receiving migrants, and allowing them to play a part in the society and in the economy. Rather than blame these people for whatever problems Britain has, look for a cause closer to home.

What sort of cause did you have in mind, un freezing our annual pension increases perhaps?

DC is right people from other countries should not be allowed into the UK to milk the benefit system, we have enough of our own doing that. I have no problem with immigrants coming into the UK so long as they fit into the British culture and yes that does mean learning the language, contribute to society and generaly try to get along, but I would also say England is very densely populated compared to Scotland and Wales, its time spread the load a bit more evenly, not easy I grant you but if you want to come there is where you go or look eleswhere, the UK should not be home and bank for anyone who turns up.

[Chris Lawrence]

Stop the wars which should slow the immigartion problem!

[transam]

Stop the wars which should slow the immigartion problem!

Don't think so, freebies attract us all.

[Scott]

A post which was a quote only was deleted.

When responding, please make sure your post is outside the quote box.

Edit: Off-topic post and replies deleted.

[giggles]

its been announced today that 400,000+ migrants are claiming bennys already !you can look it up

so its a bit late ,as 1000s more headed in from eastern europe in 2014 .

also Poland gumment has grabbed most of the privately managed pension funds to the tune of billions to pay of gumment debt ,so more Poles in the UK will be forced to claim even more benefits now.

[giggles]

its been announced today that they dont know exactly how many immigrants are arriving ,just that an extra 35,000 school places will be needed for immigrants kids ,very soon

[SinCityGr8One]

How about the Gubment hand out a box containing condoms to all migrants. With a guaranteed life time supply. 5-7-10-12+ children? Nuts in this day and age!

Sent from my GT-S5360B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[7by7]

The topic title and headline in the linked to article are both incorrect.

Non EEA immigrants cannot claim public funds until they have no time restriction on their stay in the UK; except for those they have contributed to via their NICs, if any.

This includes family members of British citizens and has been the rule for many years; certainly it was the case 13 years ago when my wife came to the UK.

Also, this is not an EU matter, it is an EEA one. (Don't know the difference? See here.)

The freedom of movement treaties and the rights bestowed by them are an EEA matter, not an EU one. The UK leaving the EU wont change these freedom of movement rights, unless we leave the EEA as well.

Immigrants from other EEA countries and Switzerland are allowed to claim public funds, as long as they do not become an unreasonable burden on the state. Exactly the same rules apply to Brits living in all other EEA countries and Switzerland.

The myth of EEA immigrants entering the UK and being handed a fat benefit payment and the keys to a council house are just that: a myth.

Cameron should know all this, and instead of pandering to the right and potential UKIP voters in his own party by promising to solve a 'problem' which doesn't exist, he should be educating the public as to the actual truth of the matter.

[transam]

The topic title and headline in the linked to article are both incorrect.

Non EEA immigrants cannot claim public funds until they have no time restriction on their stay in the UK; except for those they have contributed to via their NICs, if any.

This includes family members of British citizens and has been the rule for many years; certainly it was the case 13 years ago when my wife came to the UK.

Also, this is not an EU matter, it is an EEA one. (Don't know the difference? See here.)

The freedom of movement treaties and the rights bestowed by them are an EEA matter, not an EU one. The UK leaving the EU wont change these freedom of movement rights, unless we leave the EEA as well.

Immigrants from other EEA countries and Switzerland are allowed to claim public funds, as long as they do not become an unreasonable burden on the state. Exactly the same rules apply to Brits living in all other EEA countries and Switzerland.

The myth of EEA immigrants entering the UK and being handed a fat benefit payment and the keys to a council house are just that: a myth.

Cameron should know all this, and instead of pandering to the right and potential UKIP voters in his own party by promising to solve a 'problem' which doesn't exist, he should be educating the public as to the actual truth of the matter.

Why are migrants claiming cash, not immigrants, migrants able to claim top ups. ?

[7by7]

The word migrant means either an immigrant or an emigrant; e.g. a person entering the UK from another country to live or a person leaving the UK to live elsewhere

So, in this matter migrant means immigrant to the UK.

Whether referred to as 'migrants' or 'immigrants' the fact is that they cannot claim cash on arrival in the UK; well, they can claim it, but they wont get it!

Asylum seekers are another matter.

[transam]

The word migrant means either an immigrant or an emigrant; e.g. a person entering the UK from another country to live or a person leaving the UK to live elsewhere

So, in this matter migrant means immigrant to the UK.

Whether referred to as 'migrants' or 'immigrants' the fact is that they cannot claim cash on arrival in the UK; well, they can claim it, but they wont get it!

Asylum seekers are another matter.

32,000 migrants given permission to work in UK are claiming benefits. Yahoo news.

[Totster]

Make it reciprocal too. No access for Brits to Spanish health care of the Costa Del Yob.

Yup, most Brits would be happy to pay for health insurance when visiting Spain if it means cutting benefits to migrants.. funny you picked Spain also, seeing as they are one of the biggest spongers in the EU.. !

totster

[7by7]

The word migrant means either an immigrant or an emigrant; e.g. a person entering the UK from another country to live or a person leaving the UK to live elsewhere

So, in this matter migrant means immigrant to the UK.

Whether referred to as 'migrants' or 'immigrants' the fact is that they cannot claim cash on arrival in the UK; well, they can claim it, but they wont get it!

Asylum seekers are another matter.

32,000 migrants given permission to work in UK are claiming benefits. Yahoo news.

Can't find that particular article; why no link?

There are plenty of similar articles, though; such as this one from the Telegraph.

But none of them explain the situation of those claiming. For example, many of the benefits being claimed are NIC based; if someone has paid into the system and then needs to claim from it, why shouldn't they?

This type of article also ignores the immigration status of the claimant. Indeed, the Telegraph article linked to above admits that the figures include people who have lived in the UK for so long that they are now British citizens!

For an overview of who can claim what, see Benefits for non UK nationals from NI direct.

I am not saying that the system is perfect and does not need overhauling, but Cameron in his pronouncements is pandering to right wing groups like Migrationwatch and ignoring the facts.

[transam]

CAMERON is now looking at the books and at last trying to weed out the spongers from a ridiculous system that the planets spongers know about. That's why folk are queuing up to get into sponge land.

[theblether]

Make it reciprocal too. No access for Brits to Spanish health care of the Costa Del Yob.

Yup, most Brits would be happy to pay for health insurance when visiting Spain if it means cutting benefits to migrants.. funny you picked Spain also, seeing as they are one of the biggest spongers in the EU.. !

totster

It's a poor example, the EHIC has worked well and with little controversy for years. It's one of the success stories of European integration. If only all European schemes were are equitable and fair as this one.

No one of right mind complains about immigrants getting access to services if they deserve it. It was the appalling headline stories that the press ran, and rightly so, about people living in mansions and the like. People in the country were staggered when they discovered that the Housing Benefit bill was £23 Billion a year, and that people were receiving more in housing benefit than the average wage in the country.

That was Alice In Wonderland economics, landlords were raising their rentals to match the available benefit rate. Out went the begging bowls with the Olivers saying "Please Sir, can I have some more" and off we went again. The average Brit is fair minded, unfortunately it's not the average Brit that runs the country. It's a cabal of politicians working on behalf of interest groups that have got their snouts super glued to the trough.

The only answer is full Independence for the Bank Of England. Governments keep writing checks they can't afford in the hope of buying the electorate. It looks like good short term politics but it's atrocious long term economics.

However it came to pass Cameron is correct to address this issue. The next issue he needs to address is the amount of Brits that think they are entitled to the trough too. All of these matters are inter connected.

[7by7]

Transam; read the link to NI direct* in my previous, and also the Home Office publication Public Funds.

Many Brits don't know the facts, Cameron should be educating them, not playing to their ignorance and prejudices.

If foreign 'spongers' are queuing up to get into 'spongeland' they are going to be very disappointed when or if they get to the UK!

*Edit; forgot to say that NI in this instance stands for Northern Ireland; but the basic rules are the same throughout the UK.

Edited September 9, 2013 by 7by7

[transam]

Transam; read the link to NI direct* in my previous, and also the Home Office publication Public Funds.

Many Brits don't know the facts, Cameron should be educating them, not playing to their ignorance and prejudices.

If foreign 'spongers' are queuing up to get into 'spongeland' they are going to be very disappointed when or if they get to the UK!

*Edit; forgot to say that NI in this instance stands for Northern Ireland; but the basic rules are the same throughout the UK.

The spongers are here. At last someone is looking at where all the UK folks tax cash is going.