New document for non immigrant B now required in Vientiane

[digitalchromakey]

Have a similar question, that's why I am posting it here. Kind of frustrated by asking people (who should abviously know) and getting every time different answers. Hello dejavu! I am hoping to get straight answers or tips how to do this and providing links, docs, if possible (so that I can proof it).

Situation:

Currently on NON-ED here IN THAILAND. I want to apply f or a work permit inside Thailand to get the letter of approval and wp3, before going on a visa run for NON-B. Want to ensure that I get the NON-B first time and the WP is waiting to get picked up upon return.

1. Can I apply for a work permit and letter of approval on a NON-ED inside Thailand? If a agency (hired by employer) is doing it, can they do it for me, while I am in Thailand?

2. What are the differences between WP1 (tt1?), WP2, WP3? Which one(s) do I have to use?

3. Can you describe briefly the process and docs I have to do/get? WP1 > Approval > WP3 > visa run > Work Permit?

4. For Vientiane: As I do not have former/current work permit I need the letter of approval, right? Is it the same then WP3?

5. How can I get WP3 as other Embassies require it.

6. Can I be inside Thailand while an agency is applying for WP3

7. Do I have to cancel my NON-ED before going on the visa run? Do I get NON-B if I don't (ED expires autom.)?

8. Can I get a re-entry for NON-ED and still get the NON-B on visa run? (In case for easy return if docs are missing)

9. Anyone heard of the same story getting a work permit and work visa inside thailand without leaving TH for Non-B visa run?

Thanks in advance!

1. yes

2 Use the WP1 application form if you are already resident in Thailand.

3.Apply sucessfully with form WP 1, you will get a receipt (A5 sized); this is what many erroneously call the WP3 (which is actually an application form of behalf of someone who is not yet in Thailand.

4. No, its a letter signed by the head of your local labour dept stating that you will be issued with a WP once you have the correct visa stamp (i.e. visa/entry).

5. See 3 above.

6. Strictly speaking no, although may get away with it if they don't spot your existing entry stamp in your passport.

7. No if it's a visa, yes if it's an extension of permission to stay.

8. You might have a problem at the border on re-entry with your new 'b" visa.

9. Yes it's possible if you are eligible for an extension of permission to stay based on working in the Kingdom of Thailand (National Police Order 777/2551 Case 2.1); in this case you can first convert to a non Immigrant Category 'B' Visa at immigration inside of Thailand then get an extension. It's rare but has been done.

[sfmadison2]

Have a similar question, that's why I am posting it here. Kind of frustrated by asking people (who should abviously know) and getting every time different answers. Hello dejavu! I am hoping to get straight answers or tips how to do this and providing links, docs, if possible (so that I can proof it).

Situation:

Currently on NON-ED here IN THAILAND. I want to apply f or a work permit inside Thailand to get the letter of approval and wp3, before going on a visa run for NON-B. Want to ensure that I get the NON-B first time and the WP is waiting to get picked up upon return.

1. Can I apply for a work permit and letter of approval on a NON-ED inside Thailand? If a agency (hired by employer) is doing it, can they do it for me, while I am in Thailand?

2. What are the differences between WP1 (tt1?), WP2, WP3? Which one(s) do I have to use?

3. Can you describe briefly the process and docs I have to do/get? WP1 > Approval > WP3 > visa run > Work Permit?

4. For Vientiane: As I do not have former/current work permit I need the letter of approval, right? Is it the same then WP3?

5. How can I get WP3 as other Embassies require it.

6. Can I be inside Thailand while an agency is applying for WP3

7. Do I have to cancel my NON-ED before going on the visa run? Do I get NON-B if I don't (ED expires autom.)?

8. Can I get a re-entry for NON-ED and still get the NON-B on visa run? (In case for easy return if docs are missing)

9. Anyone heard of the same story getting a work permit and work visa inside thailand without leaving TH for Non-B visa run?

Thanks in advance!

1. yes

2 Use the WP1 application form if you are already resident in Thailand.

3.Apply sucessfully with form WP 1, you will get a receipt (A5 sized); this is what many erroneously call the WP3 (which is actually an application form of behalf of someone who is not yet in Thailand.

4. No, its a letter signed by the head of your local labour dept stating that you will be issued with a WP once you have the correct visa stamp (i.e. visa/entry).

5. See 3 above.

6. Strictly speaking no, although may get away with it if they don't spot your existing entry stamp in your passport.

7. No if it's a visa, yes if it's an extension of permission to stay.

8. You might have a problem at the border on re-entry with your new 'b" visa.

9. Yes it's possible if you are eligible for an extension of permission to stay based on working in the Kingdom of Thailand (National Police Order 777/2551 Case 2.1); in this case you can first convert to a non Immigrant Category 'B' Visa at immigration inside of Thailand then get an extension. It's rare but has been done.

So, I found this post from a couple months ago which is more or less my exact situation. I am currently in Thailand on a NON-ED visa, and need to get my NON-B and Work Permit. I want to do it in Yangon.

The secretary at my future place of work has called to the Thai Embassy in Yangon and confirmed that we have everything we need except a Letter of Approval from the Ministry of Labour OR a Work Permit. When she called the MFA, they told her that I would need to leave the country in order to prove I was outside the country in order to apply for a Letter of Approval (LoA). This then takes 7 business days, meaning I have to hang around outside Thailand waiting for this LoA and then they have to mail it to me in Burma. This is doable, but I'd certainly like to avoid it if there's an easier route. So:

1) Can I apply for a WP before I go while I'm on this NON-ED visa? My understanding is that I would use the TT1 form to apply for this.

2) Can this WP (or whatever I get by applying with the TT1 form) be used in lieu of the LoA?

I got a work permit years ago and I don't remember any of this LoA business. I just took the forms out of country, got my NON-B, then applied for a WP and used that WP to extend the NON-B another 9 months. Maybe things have changed since then. Regarding the quoted comments above, I'm confused by digitalchromakey's answers to questions 1 & 6.

Many thanks for anyone who can help me with this. Very confused.

-Colin

[ubonjoe]

The problem you may have is your ED visa or extension. Many Labor Ministry (not MFA) work permit offices will not accept applications with them. You may have to get a tourist visa to apply for the work permit.

You can apply for work permits while here. What she was told is wrong.

[lopburi3]

Why would you call the MFA for a MOL letter advice? Is that in error? You should be able to apply for work permit on any type of entry - just that only a letter of receipt can be issued until your have the non immigrant visa entry.

Edit: as said above on an ED visa some will not accept that for anything but study but you should try.

[sfmadison2]

Thanks guys.

That was my fault. I had been reading up on visa requirements on the MFA website and wrote it wrong. I just checked with her and she called the MoL for advice. She didn't ask specifically about the WP, but about the LoA. She was told I would need to leave the country to start the LoA application process.

Ok, so say I am able to successfully apply for a WP and receive my letter of receipt. Do we know if this is an adequate substitution for the Letter of Approval?

Do you think it's best to just go ahead and apply for the WP? She wants to call the MoL and ask if I can apply with my NON-ED, but maybe that's just more likely to set us up for rejection.

[ubonjoe]

You can get the letter of approval while here also.

[sfmadison2]

Really? The info we've found so far says that one needs to show that one's most recent stamp is from outside of Thailand. Do you have a link or something you could point me to?

Really much appreciated.

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[digitalchromakey]

If you have successfully filed a Work Permit Application, but do not yet have the correct visa/entry stamp in your passport, then you will be issued with a receipt which is an A5 sized slip of paper which will be marked to show if you made a WP1 (TT1) or WP3 (TT3) application; you show the original again when you return to pick up your WP with the correct stamp/visa in your passport.

Most visa applicants show this paper (WP3 or WP1 Receipt) at Thai Consulates in lieu of the Letter of Approval (LOA) from Labour.

However if the Thai Consulate you plan to travel to insists on the LOA, then Labour will issue you with one, providing your WP application is already successfully filed, it can take a few extra days to produce.

The Letter of Approval basically states your details and notes that that you are eleigible for a WP subject to the correct visa being issued, it is signed by the head of your local labour dept.

Edited November 13, 2013 by digitalchromakey

[sfmadison2]

Thanks so much for the info. I was hoping you'd comment on this as you seem to know the deal.

Ubonjoe and Lopburi seemed to think my NON-ED might make it difficult to apply for the WP--any thoughts on the best way to approach this? Maybe it's dependent on the employees at the Chiang Mai Ministry of Labour more than anything, I don't know.

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[digitalchromakey]

Thanks so much for the info. I was hoping you'd comment on this as you seem to know the deal.

Ubonjoe and Lopburi seemed to think my NON-ED might make it difficult to apply for the WP--any thoughts on the best way to approach this? Maybe it's dependent on the employees at the Chiang Mai Ministry of Labour more than anything, I don't know.

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Should be possible to file the application, since no visa per se is required to apply for a WP, but if you are already in Thailand then you must use form WP 1 (TT1).

Not sure about what Ubonjoe has posted as you would then be in a Catch 22 situation (since you cannot apply for a non immigrant 'B' visa in this region without a successful WP application - there is an exemption for teaching where other papers are first required).

I think the Issue is more that Labour will often not actually issue a WP supported by a non immigrant 'ED' visa or Extension of Permission to Stay based on Education, but you can apply for a WP and if all paperwork is filed successfuly then be granted one, subject to your obtaining the correct visa/entry stamp.

If you have any doubts, then by all means go to Labour in Chaing Mai with a Thai speaker and ask about this specific issue, they will be happy to help you through the specific process they require you to follow.

Edited November 13, 2013 by digitalchromakey

[sfmadison2]

That's very helpful. I will try to confirm this with Labour tomorrow and hopefully begin the process. Thanks again for taking the time to explain this in sufficient detail.

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[ubonjoe]

There have been reports of a work permit application being refused for having a ED visa/extension because they consider them to be a lower class entry than a tourist visa.

[digitalchromakey]

There have been reports of a work permit application being refused for having a ED visa/extension because they consider them to be a lower class entry than a tourist visa.

No doubting that somewhere out there exist Labour Dept employees that make it up as they go along when in doubt (not unique to Labour).

I have read this before and I can certainly appreciate the issue if the WP applicant holds an extant Extension of Permission to Stay for Education.

However I find it difficult to understand/rationalise as regards border entry status per se when, for example, a WP3 application can be made and successfuly filed without the potential employee even having entered Thailand - what 'class' of entry is this?

Edited November 14, 2013 by digitalchromakey

[ubonjoe]

A no class entry.

[sfmadison2]

UPDATE:

We called over to the MoL in Chiang Mai and they said it is no problem to apply for a WP with a NON-ED visa. My understanding is that we will use the TT1 form to apply, and that we would receive some kind of receipt of application. The secretary seemed to think that we would receive the actual WP, but I don't see how that can be given that I am still currently on an ED visa and one is not allowed to work on an ED visa.

I then called over to the Thai Embassy in Yangon and related this to them. They said that either a WP or confirmation of successful application for a WP is an acceptable substitute for the Letter of Approval.

Getting the papers ready now for the WP application. Hopefully no further issues.

[ubonjoe]

Do you have an extension of stay from immigration or a non-ed visa?

[sfmadison2]

I guess I never thought about this before. I got a non-ed last october/november and have since extended 3 times at Chiang Mai immigration. This last extension was for 6 more months and it expires on January 1st. Does that mean I have an extension of stay?

[ubonjoe]

Yes you have an extension. Are you attending classes? If not your extension is no longer valid.

[sfmadison2]

yes, technically i am still attending classes. as in the school (where i was legitimately studying until recently) has said they will recognize that i am still attending classes until the end of the visa.

is an extension good/better than just the non-ED?

[ubonjoe]

It is about the same. In theory if you did get get the work permit you could change the reason for your extension to working at immigration. But immigration may not allow it.

[sfmadison2]

I see. Thanks for that info. It sounds like a whole other topic -- do you know if there's an old thread detailing this type of situation?

As it is I'm happy to visit Burma anyway (never been), so perhaps it's just best to try and go the standard route (leave thailand, get non-b, get WP, extend non-b. Had a pleasant conversation with a couple women at the Thai Consulate in Yangon this morning, and I feel hopeful that it is not a place where one is likely to meet unexpected strictness. They said it takes one day to process the visa.

As I mentioned in another thread, I hope to be able to give a more recent update on Yangon after this is all over.

Edited November 14, 2013 by sfmadison2

[Rama]

Yes, I know someone else that had the same experience last week. He then went outside and talked to one of the fixers outside and got it fixed for 3 or 4,000 baht....................

[digitalchromakey]

UPDATE:

We called over to the MoL in Chiang Mai and they said it is no problem to apply for a WP with a NON-ED visa. My understanding is that we will use the TT1 form to apply, and that we would receive some kind of receipt of application. The secretary seemed to think that we would receive the actual WP, but I don't see how that can be given that I am still currently on an ED visa and one is not allowed to work on an ED visa.

I then called over to the Thai Embassy in Yangon and related this to them. They said that either a WP or confirmation of successful application for a WP is an acceptable substitute for the Letter of Approval.

Getting the papers ready now for the WP application. Hopefully no further issues.

If Chang Mai Labour are happy with your passport/stamps, then go with the flow and get the WP, if not do the visa run.

You haven't said what work you are doing, but assuming that you are not teaching, then the document attached below shows what papers you require for an Extension of Permission to Stay based on Working in the Kingdom of Thailand.

Visa extension on the basis of employment 777 2551 Case 2.1t.pdf

As you may only have been working for a couple of months should you be able to you apply for an extension following your Education Extension with a WP, then you will not have last year's personal tax return (PND 91) plus only two months of PND 1 Salary Tax Payments and Social Insurance contributions. This should be still ok as Immigration will see that you have only recently started work.

If you can't meet the criteriae for an extension, then visa runs for Non Immigrant 'B' Visas are your only other option. At the moment you should be able to get a One Year Multiple Entry Non 'B' from Penang witht he correct papers and a WP.

Here is a link to the MFA list of requirements for a non immigrant 'B' visa .http://www.mfa.go.th/main/en/services/123/15388-Non-Immigrant-Visa-%22B%22-(for-Business-and.html

Good luck.

[sfmadison2]

UPDATE:

We called over to the MoL in Chiang Mai and they said it is no problem to apply for a WP with a NON-ED visa. My understanding is that we will use the TT1 form to apply, and that we would receive some kind of receipt of application. The secretary seemed to think that we would receive the actual WP, but I don't see how that can be given that I am still currently on an ED visa and one is not allowed to work on an ED visa.

I then called over to the Thai Embassy in Yangon and related this to them. They said that either a WP or confirmation of successful application for a WP is an acceptable substitute for the Letter of Approval.

Getting the papers ready now for the WP application. Hopefully no further issues.

If Chang Mai Labour are happy with your passport/stamps, then go with the flow and get the WP, if not do the visa run.

You haven't said what work you are doing, but assuming that you are not teaching, then the document attached below shows what papers you require for an Extension of Permission to Stay based on Working in the Kingdom of Thailand.

As you may only have been working for a couple of months should you be able to you apply for an extension following your Education Extension with a WP, then you will not have last year's personal tax return (PND 91) plus only two months of PND 1 Salary Tax Payments and Social Insurance contributions. This should be still ok as Immigration will see that you have only recently started work.

If you can't meet the criteriae for an extension, then visa runs for Non Immigrant 'B' Visas are your only other option. At the moment you should be able to get a One Year Multiple Entry Non 'B' from Penang witht he correct papers and a WP.

Here is a link to the MFA list of requirements for a non immigrant 'B' visa .http://www.mfa.go.th/main/en/services/123/15388-Non-Immigrant-Visa-%22B%22-(for-Business-and.html

Good luck.

No, you're right, not a teaching job.

I haven't started working yet as I thought that would be illegal on my Non-ED. Don't I have to be on a Non-B with a WP on the way to be working in Thailand? Also, I wasn't entirely against the visa run, as I wanted to visit Burma anyway (790 baht BKK-Yangon tickets pre Xmas!), so I have planned on getting my visa there. (I never knew you could get a one year Non B, though. I'd assumed it was 3-months, then the ability to extend another 9 months upon getting the WP. Something like this.)

I hadn't thought about what I would do if they actually gave me a WP on top of my Non-ED. Can you really extend a Non-ED based on working? This seemed to be what Ubonjoe was suggesting "in theory" as well. The extension of stay document you included does state that one only needs a 'temporary visa'. The company should be able to fulfill all the requirements, the only part I'm confused about is extending "ED" into a "B". For whatever reason I thought you had to give up/cancel one class of visa before you could move into another.

Anyway, thanks again for taking the time. Really appreciate the input.

[ubonjoe]

The only visa entry requirement for an extension is that it be a non immigrant visa as written in the police order. It is the same for work permits.

You cannot change from one type of non immigrant visa to another. But you can change the reason for an extension of stay.

Edited November 15, 2013 by ubonjoe

[sfmadison2]

The only visa entry requirement for an extension is that it be a non immigrant visa as written in the police order. It is the same for work permits. You cannot change from one type of non immigrant visa to another. But you can change the reason for an extension of stay.

Ok, but can you be granted an extension of stay in order to work while still residing under a Non-ED visa?

[ubonjoe]

The only visa entry requirement for an extension is that it be a non immigrant visa as written in the police order. It is the same for work permits. You cannot change from one type of non immigrant visa to another. But you can change the reason for an extension of stay.

 

Ok, but can you be granted an extension of stay in order to work while still residing under a Non-ED visa?

I suspect your ED visa expired long ago.

If a person had a ED visa entry the permit to stay from it could be extended for working according to the police order if you got a work permit.

[sfmadison2]

The only visa entry requirement for an extension is that it be a non immigrant visa as written in the police order. It is the same for work permits. You cannot change from one type of non immigrant visa to another. But you can change the reason for an extension of stay.

Ok, but can you be granted an extension of stay in order to work while still residing under a Non-ED visa?

I suspect your ED visa expired long ago.

If a person had a ED visa entry the permit to stay from it could be extended for working according to the police order if you got a work permit.

If my ED visa expired, then I don't know what kind of visa I'm staying on. I will have a look at my passport when I get back home. It was the school that helped me to extend the visa though, so at the very least I am on a Non-ED extension of stay. Is that not still an ED visa, or is that now in the territory of general unspecified extension of stay?

[lopburi3]

An extension, which you seem to have, is for a specific purpose and yours would be for study if a school had extended it for you.

[ubonjoe]

 

 

The only visa entry requirement for an extension is that it be a non immigrant visa as written in the police order. It is the same for work permits. You cannot change from one type of non immigrant visa to another. But you can change the reason for an extension of stay.

 

Ok, but can you be granted an extension of stay in order to work while still residing under a Non-ED visa?

 

I suspect your ED visa expired long ago.

If a person had a ED visa entry the permit to stay from it could be extended for working according to the police order if you got a work permit.

 

 

If my ED visa expired, then I don't know what kind of visa I'm staying on. I will have a look at my passport when I get back home. It was the school that helped me to extend the visa though, so at the very least I am on a Non-ED extension of stay. Is that not still an ED visa, or is that now in the territory of general unspecified extension of stay?

A visa only allows to enter the country. On entry you are given a permit to stay. The permit to stay is what is extended. So you are here on the extended permit to stay that you were given when you entered the country using the Ed visa that allowed you to enter the country.