Phnom Penh - Violent crackdown on small group peaceful protesters & journalists

[scobie redux]

Re "youn", a Cambodian perspective on the term:

http://www.phnompenhpost.com/national/meaning-yuon-1

Totally understand what you're saying but if a group finds a word offensive then it is offensive. I know for a fact that Vietnamese in Phnom Penh hate it. Rainsy knows what he is doing when he uses it and while educated Cambodians might rationalize the words use, when Rainsy is using the term to motivate his rank and file supporters he is doing it very deliberately.

[Sheryl]

There is no other word to use when speaking in Khmer, to Khmers, to indicate the people or country of Viet Nam. The word "Viet Nam/Viet Namese" is not understood by non-English speakers.

If the Vietnamese find the word offensive, it's like a French person finding "barang" offensive. Or a Chinese finding "chin" offensive. etc. etc. The Cambodians are not obligated to revise their own language because some people have taken a dislike to the Khmer name for their nationality, a term that in itself has no derogatory meanings and also no existing linguistic alternative.

I suspect that even if they did coin a new word, Vietnamese in PP would come to feel the same way about that. Because the problem is not the word but the animosity with which it is often spoken by Cambodian people, and changing the word used won't alter that.

There is a lot of resentment against Vietnamese in PP especially. Part of it is historical grievances (including some pretty recent history), part of it is anger at Vet Nam's military support to the Hun Sen regime and part of it is that the two cultures are a bit like oil and water, they are not very compatible, and in PP they are often living side by side under crowded conditions. For example, in the village where my family live, Viet Namese neighbors steal, cook and eat pet dogs belonging to their Khmer neighbors. Happened to my family and they had to not only deal with the grief of losing the dog but have the smoke from the "barbecue" literally wafting into their yard as the neighbors openly ate the pet. Not saying all Viet Namese are that insensitive but enough are that it adds to the hostility. I think this is less of an issue upcountry because people are not so crowded together, making it is easier for Vietnamese to follow their own cultural habits without it impinging on others.

Specific cultural practices that most Khmers find offensive aside, the two nationalities communictae in very different ways that lead to a lot of misunderstanding. Vietnamese are, in comparison to Cambodians, very direct and comparatively aggressive. The Cambodians tend to be passive aggressive, and the Vietnamese tend to not get that and mistake it as just "passive", making matters worse because they don't pick up on the clues indicating they are causing offense or coming on too strong. I have seen this play out many times in work settings where there was every desire on both sides to cooperate, but it went south nonetheless.

None of this is in any way caused by the political opposition nor by the fact that the Khmer word for the people of Viet Nam is "youn". There is a lot that can and should be done to improve relations between Khmer and Vietnamese but insisting the Khmer alter their language isn't one of them and neither is supporting an unpopular dictatorship.

I do believe that ultimately good relations will be formed between the people of the two countries as it is in both their interests, but I don't see that happening as long as the current unpopular regime so heavily supported by Viet Nam stays in place.

[khunsiam]

Re "youn", a Cambodian perspective on the term:

http://www.phnompenhpost.com/national/meaning-yuon-1

Totally understand what you're saying but if a group finds a word offensive then it is offensive. I know for a fact that Vietnamese in Phnom Penh hate it. Rainsy knows what he is doing when he uses it and while educated Cambodians might rationalize the words use, when Rainsy is using the term to motivate his rank and file supporters he is doing it very deliberately.

In Thailand, they are also called "khon Yuon" by "Lao" speaking Isaan people.

[Nivea]

I don't wish to turn this into an argument among foreigners as to which party/persons are best for Cambodia since I think the entire point is that the Cambodian people, not anyone else, should have the right to decide this. I would however suggest you read some of Rainsy's writings, interviews etc (a 2005 interview on BBC Hard Talk can still be found online, and he has recently published a book). As what you say suggests impressions taken from others rather than a first hand examination. Bear in mind that he has held high government office in the past, as have others in his party, so there is clear past record of policies and effectiveness.

"Youn" is the term used throughout Cambodia for the Vietnamese, it is found in Khmer dictionaries (defined as simply meaning "Vietnamese") and most Khmer would tell you that in and of itself, it has no derogatory connotation. Certainly I have heard Khmers use the term in contexts that were clearly not derogatory, e.g. "the best/most trustworthy mechanics in town are youn" etc. There are even popular food dishes names "X youn" to connotate Vietnamese style cooking. The fact is that in speaking to ordinary Cambodians, especially rural people, "youn" is the only term that will work to indicate Vietnam/Vietnamese.

There is animosity on the part of the Khmer towards the Vietnamese, of course. And while it goes way, way back, long before any of the current players were alive, what is fueling it more than anything nowadays is Viet Nam's support (including substantial military support) to the Hun Sen regime.

I have been looking for this type of opinion piece for a long time, and I am glad that have read yours. I must say that your view is certainly valuable and it serves to add to the views of the common Cambodian views as well. According to one Westerner's account, the Vietnamese occupiers of Cambodia placed a restriction on the term the Cambodians could use to identify the Vietnamese. As occupiers, the Vietnamese demanded that the Cambodians stop using the traditional term "youn" to refer to them. Instead the Vietnamese occupiers substituted the term "youn" with another Khmer phrase "Mit Yerng" or our friends. So the Vietnamese sweet and soup dish called "Samlaw Machu Youn" becomes "Samlaw Machu Mit Yerng". After Cambodia opened up its borders to the world, adventurous Westerners started arriving. For some strange reasons, some of these Westerners thought that the Khmer traditional term of "youn" is racist towards the Vietnamese in Cambodia. Trying to be politically correct, the only technical term the Cambodian officials can come close to identify the Vietnamese is through this non-native word "Vietnam". In English, Vietnam is the name of the country, while Vietnamese is the name of the inhabitants of Vietnam. The non-native term Vietnamese is never used in the Khmer language. To meet the demands of the Westerners and Vietnamese occupiers, the Cambodians translate the term Vietnamese as "the inhabitants of Vietnam". And thus in Khmer-language news or writing, the Vietnamese are only identified as "them of Vietnam" literally. This adopted translation is supposedly to make the foreigners happy, I suppose. This adaptation is very strange indeed. It is well-known that the Khmer had identified the Vietnamese as "youn" for ages - before the arrival of the French colonists, during the French colonial era, during the American-Vietnam war, and until now. So why now that is the term "youn" thought by the few Westerners as racist towards Vietnamese? If anything, it is the Vietnamese who have superior complex towards the Cambodians in general. For nearly a hundred years during the French colonial era, the Vietnamese imported by the French to Cambodia had much higher living and educational standards than the rag-tag Cambodians. It has been 60 years that Cambodians have had their independence from France. For those past 60 years, how many times have the Vietnamese invaded Cambodia and used Cambodian territory? The answer is countless. To the Vietnamese, Cambodia is a lesser nation and Cambodians are the lesser people. For the few Westerners to continue to step down on the Cambodians in this 21st century, it is so unfair to the defenseless people.