President Obama announces health law fix

F430murci · December 19, 2013

Maybe there is hope yet? If enough register perhaps, just perhaps . . .

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People are flocking to the more successful state health insurance exchanges in the final days before a late-December deadline, exchange directors said Wednesday.

So many people are calling in for help that states have had to beef up call center staffing, and insurers have agreed to let deadlines slide a bit so that as many people as possible can get coverage starting Jan 1.

http://m.nbcnews.com/health/patients-pour-successful-state-insurance-exchanges-2D11770338

thaibeachlovers · December 19, 2013

March I think. Cheerleading for failure. Really sad.

Sent from my GT-S5360B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Not so. Cancelled policies expire end December.

The deadline to be eligible for coverage as of January 1st is December 23rd. It's for those who want or may need to get a new medical insurance policy effective January 1st, not for 7 million participants (or for 1 million or for, say, 20 million).

The ACA wants 7 or 8 million by the signup deadline in the law of March 31, 2014. Even then, the March 31st deadline date is not irrevocably final and it certainly is not Doomsday for those who would love to see it to be that.

It's written into the ACA that it will not be fully implemented until the end of 2018. So there's plenty of time for everything that needs to be done to get done.

Political hack Republican Party governors won't establish state websites for their populations and are actively obstructing and sabotaging the new ACA law, acting in a sinister league with Republicans in Washington.

However, the Republican Party has given up on its obsession of trying to repeal ObamaCare. The fact is most Americans have accepted ObamaCare, especially the reality of it, i.e., ObamaCare is the law and it's here to stay.

The insurance companies already have massive advertising campaigns ready to go and will launch them after January 1st providing the website holds up and the glitches are removed from the process of completing the forms to the insurers, both of which are expected to come to fruition.

Insurers have ready to go multimillion dollar ACA advertising campaigns which will spend up to $400 million to compete for ObamaCare subscribers, to include Aetna, Cigna, Humana, United Health Group, Blue Cross just to name a few.

Peace.

.

Around 5 million individual policies have been cancelled as of 1 January 2014. If they don't enroll on a new policy before then they will be uninsured.

Publicus · December 19, 2013

The facts are the Republican Party in Washington and in the states in which Republicans dominate the government are sabotaging ObamaCare in any and every way they can and cheerfully shall continue to do so.

Republican Party controlled states have not established online access to the ObamaCare insurance markets - they will never establish state online access to exchanges for the citizens of their respective state. Moreover, these particular states have also refused to accept the expanded Medicaid program for those who haven't any insurance coverage.

The Republicans in Washington and in the certain state capitals claimed the HealthCare.gov website troubles meant the whole of the program was a failure, yet their loud claims turned out to be either false or wrong, or both, as many people knew was the case to begin with anyway.

Then came the distortions about coverage, the number of people affected in particular. Once you put a false number out there, it sticks, which supports both the continued referencing of false data and then the willful and malicious extending the false data repeatedly and indefinitely. So now while the wild number of 120 million Americans' coverage being affected has rightfully been abandoned, right wingers have settled on " tens of millions" of Americans, which is defensively vague yet offensively scary enough sounding to suit their purposes of the moment.

And now it's the ObamaCare navigators who Republicans and the hard line right wingers are knowingly and falsely misrepresenting as being sinister schemers against the privacy of each and every American, that if you go online to examine the ACA evil people will target and victimize you.

The only thing everyone can be certain of is that Republicans and other hard line right wingers have more falsehoods and malevolent schemes up their sleeves against the ACA.

Yet the insurance companies are going ahead with their plans to begin their $500 million advertising campaign to attract enrollees and to have several million enrolled by the sign up deadline of March 31, 2014.

Publicus · December 19, 2013

March I think. Cheerleading for failure. Really sad.

Sent from my GT-S5360B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Not so. Cancelled policies expire end December.

The deadline to be eligible for coverage as of January 1st is December 23rd. It's for those who want or may need to get a new medical insurance policy effective January 1st, not for 7 million participants (or for 1 million or for, say, 20 million).

The ACA wants 7 or 8 million by the signup deadline in the law of March 31, 2014. Even then, the March 31st deadline date is not irrevocably final and it certainly is not Doomsday for those who would love to see it to be that.

It's written into the ACA that it will not be fully implemented until the end of 2018. So there's plenty of time for everything that needs to be done to get done.

Political hack Republican Party governors won't establish state websites for their populations and are actively obstructing and sabotaging the new ACA law, acting in a sinister league with Republicans in Washington.

However, the Republican Party has given up on its obsession of trying to repeal ObamaCare. The fact is most Americans have accepted ObamaCare, especially the reality of it, i.e., ObamaCare is the law and it's here to stay.

The insurance companies already have massive advertising campaigns ready to go and will launch them after January 1st providing the website holds up and the glitches are removed from the process of completing the forms to the insurers, both of which are expected to come to fruition.

Insurers have ready to go multimillion dollar ACA advertising campaigns which will spend up to $400 million to compete for ObamaCare subscribers, to include Aetna, Cigna, Humana, United Health Group, Blue Cross just to name a few.

Peace.

.

Around 5 million individual policies have been cancelled as of 1 January 2014. If they don't enroll on a new policy before then they will be uninsured.

'If' is true.

It would be a positive to these Americans IF the states that are controlled by Republican Party governments would establish state online exchanges to facilitate those citizens who need to shop the ObamaCare markets online to obtain the needed insurance by January 1, 2014.

Wouldn't it?!

Edited December 19, 2013 by Publicus

thaibeachlovers · December 19, 2013

Not so. Cancelled policies expire end December.

The deadline to be eligible for coverage as of January 1st is December 23rd. It's for those who want or may need to get a new medical insurance policy effective January 1st, not for 7 million participants (or for 1 million or for, say, 20 million).

The ACA wants 7 or 8 million by the signup deadline in the law of March 31, 2014. Even then, the March 31st deadline date is not irrevocably final and it certainly is not Doomsday for those who would love to see it to be that.

It's written into the ACA that it will not be fully implemented until the end of 2018. So there's plenty of time for everything that needs to be done to get done.

Political hack Republican Party governors won't establish state websites for their populations and are actively obstructing and sabotaging the new ACA law, acting in a sinister league with Republicans in Washington.

However, the Republican Party has given up on its obsession of trying to repeal ObamaCare. The fact is most Americans have accepted ObamaCare, especially the reality of it, i.e., ObamaCare is the law and it's here to stay.

The insurance companies already have massive advertising campaigns ready to go and will launch them after January 1st providing the website holds up and the glitches are removed from the process of completing the forms to the insurers, both of which are expected to come to fruition.

Insurers have ready to go multimillion dollar ACA advertising campaigns which will spend up to $400 million to compete for ObamaCare subscribers, to include Aetna, Cigna, Humana, United Health Group, Blue Cross just to name a few.

Peace.

.

Around 5 million individual policies have been cancelled as of 1 January 2014. If they don't enroll on a new policy before then they will be uninsured.

'If' is true.

It would be a positive to these Americans IF the states that are controlled by Republican Party governments would establish state online exchanges to facilitate those citizens who need to shop the ObamaCare markets online to obtain the needed insurance by January 1, 2014.

Wouldn't it?!

As I understand it, if the state does not have an exchange the purchaser can use the federal exchange, you know, that website. Of course that isn't working properly though, IS IT!

Publicus · December 19, 2013

Around 5 million individual policies have been cancelled as of 1 January 2014. If they don't enroll on a new policy before then they will be uninsured.

'If' is true.

It would be a positive to these Americans IF the states that are controlled by Republican Party governments would establish state online exchanges to facilitate those citizens who need to shop the ObamaCare markets online to obtain the needed insurance by January 1, 2014.

Wouldn't it?!

As I understand it, if the state does not have an exchange the purchaser can use the federal exchange, you know, that website. Of course that isn't working properly though, IS IT!

Reiterating -

1) The federal site, HealthCare.gov has been successfully up and running for the past three weeks, handling more than a million hits on a given day.

2) It's a lot easier however and more convenient to go to your state website to inform yourself of the ACA law than to any national website.

3) States controlled by Republican Party governments are not cooperating with the ACA law by their refusal to establish state websites for all or any of their citizens to access.

4) It is more than the refusal of every citizen's access to available medical insurance - it is an active and willful partisan denial of essential medical care services to all of the citizens of each Republican Party governed state.

5) It's an unconscionable denial of essential public services to all the citizens of each such state by their partisan Republican Party rulers..

6) The active denial of access to all citizens of each state is in fact a partisan political resistance against the ACA medical insurance law.

7) It is in fact partisan political Republican Party sabotage of the ACA law.

8) The great catastrophe in this will be to the unsuccessful Republican Party, i.e., the partisan and ideological would-be saboteurs.

Edited December 19, 2013 by Publicus

chuckd · December 19, 2013

The facts are the Republican Party in Washington and in the states in which Republicans dominate the government are sabotaging ObamaCare in any and every way they can and cheerfully shall continue to do so.

Republican Party controlled states have not established online access to the ObamaCare insurance markets - they will never establish state online access to exchanges for the citizens of their respective state. Moreover, these particular states have also refused to accept the expanded Medicaid program for those who haven't any insurance coverage.

The Republicans in Washington and in the certain state capitals claimed the HealthCare.gov website troubles meant the whole of the program was a failure, yet their loud claims turned out to be either false or wrong, or both, as many people knew was the case to begin with anyway.

Then came the distortions about coverage, the number of people affected in particular. Once you put a false number out there, it sticks, which supports both the continued referencing of false data and then the willful and malicious extending the false data repeatedly and indefinitely. So now while the wild number of 120 million Americans' coverage being affected has rightfully been abandoned, right wingers have settled on " tens of millions" of Americans, which is defensively vague yet offensively scary enough sounding to suit their purposes of the moment.

And now it's the ObamaCare navigators who Republicans and the hard line right wingers are knowingly and falsely misrepresenting as being sinister schemers against the privacy of each and every American, that if you go online to examine the ACA evil people will target and victimize you.

The only thing everyone can be certain of is that Republicans and other hard line right wingers have more falsehoods and malevolent schemes up their sleeves against the ACA.

Yet the insurance companies are going ahead with their plans to begin their $500 million advertising campaign to attract enrollees and to have several million enrolled by the sign up deadline of March 31, 2014.

Permit me to comment on your post.

1. You claim..."Republican Party controlled states have not established online access to the ObamaCare insurance markets -"

Whle this is true up to a point there are a few facts you are wisely omitting.

There are 16 states who have established state exchanges. Democrats control 14 of them and Republicans govern in 2.

That means there are 34 states that have chosen, in accordance with individual States' rights, to refrain from establishing a state exchange. Of that 34 there are 28 Republican controlled states and 6 Democratic controlled states. Interestingly, of the six Democratic states that have not established exchanges, one is Delaware (home of VP Joseh Biden) and Illinois (home of, well, you know who).

2. You claim..."Then came the distortions about coverage, the number of people affected in particular. "

Specifically, which distortions are you referring to? Are you disputing the 5 million individual polilcyholders that have already lost or stand to lose health care under ACA or are you referring to the 70-80 million that stand to lose their employer mandated coverage in one years time?

3. You claim..."And now it's the ObamaCare navigators who Republicans and the hard line right wingers are knowingly and falsely misrepresenting as being sinister schemers "

FYI... http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/12/15/House-Report-Ill-Trained-Obamacare-Navigators-Encouraging-Fraud-Jeopardizing-Health-Financial-Info

From the article:

Breitbart News has obtained a House Oversight and Government Reform Committee report on the Obamacare Navigators that will be released Monday. It has found that Obamacare Navigators have been giving Americans misinformation and, in some cases, actively encouraging enrollees to commit fraud in order to raise their subsidies. To complicate matters further, there is no way for Americans to find out whether their Navigators are properly certified.

Health and Human Services (HHS) Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said at a Congressional hearing that it was “possible” for convicted felons to become Navigators. <snipped to conform with forum rule 22>

4. Finally, you claim..."The only thing everyone can be certain of is that Republicans and other hard line right wingers have more falsehoods and malevolent schemes up their sleeves against the ACA."

May I respectfully point out that the Republicans do not have a monopoly on falsehoods and malevolent schemes.

PolitiFact's ‘Biggest Lie of the Year' for 2013 belongs to President Obama

http://www.newsnet5.com/news/political/politifacts-biggest-lie-of-the-year-for-2013-belongs-to-president-obama

...and my personal favorite...

The biggest pinocchio of 2013 - “If you like your health-care plan, you can keep it.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2013/12/16/the-biggest-pinocchios-of-2013/

I won't even bother with the malevolent schemes that were used by Reid/Pelosi et al to pass this legislation in the first place.

Thank you for listening.

chuckd · December 19, 2013

Around 5 million individual policies have been cancelled as of 1 January 2014. If they don't enroll on a new policy before then they will be uninsured.

'If' is true.

It would be a positive to these Americans IF the states that are controlled by Republican Party governments would establish state online exchanges to facilitate those citizens who need to shop the ObamaCare markets online to obtain the needed insurance by January 1, 2014.

Wouldn't it?!

As I understand it, if the state does not have an exchange the purchaser can use the federal exchange, you know, that website. Of course that isn't working properly though, IS IT!

Reiterating -

1) The federal site, HealthCare.gov has been successfully up and running for the past three weeks, handling more than a million hits on a given day.

2) It's a lot easier however and more convenient to go to your state website to inform yourself of the ACA law than to any national website.

3) States controlled by Republican Party governments are not cooperating with the ACA law by their refusal to establish state websites for all or any of their citizens to access.

4) It is more than the refusal of every citizen's access to available medical insurance - it is an active and willful partisan denial of essential medical care services to all of the citizens of each Republican Party governed state.

5) It's an unconscionable denial of essential public services to all the citizens of each such state by their partisan Republican Party rulers..

6) The active denial of access to all citizens of each state is in fact a partisan political resistance against the ACA medical insurance law.

7) It is in fact partisan political Republican Party sabotage of the ACA law.

8) The great catastrophe in this will be to the unsuccessful Republican Party, i.e., the partisan and ideological would-be saboteurs.

Only addressing number...

7) It is in fact partisan political Republican Party sabotage of the ACA law.

May I respectfully point out the only political sabotage of Obamacare has been done by the Democrats.

They wrote the bill.

They passed the bill.

One of their own signed the bill into law.

They implemented the law.

The 34 states that declined to open their own exchanges merely opted out in accordance with what the Congressional Democrats wrote into the law, what the Congressional Democrats passed and what the Democratic President signed.

All of this is self-inflicted sabotage, or more correctly worded, incompetence on a massive scale.

Publicus · December 19, 2013

@chuckd

Yes, of the 34 states that have not established a state online exchange, 28 are Republican Party controlled. That is clear and convincing evidence of a partisan bent and a fierce determination.

There you guys go again - 60 to 70 million to lose medical insurance next year. Not now, but at a point in the future. I see you read Breitbart News, apparently regularly if not religiously. Just a few months ago the number some right wingers were throwing around in the right wing media was 120 million. I see you've climbed down a bit - you'll climb down a bit more yet.

Speaking of Breitbart News, it's a right wing "all the news we like" organization. Only right wingers pay any attention to it or give it any credibility.

If I recall correctly, the right wingers got quite a citation for their wildly bogus claim during 2009 into 2010 that ObamaCare had "death panels" that would do us all in once and for all - or maybe do in only the right wingers or whomever.

Republican Party partisan politics and the politics of other right wingers is the core of the political opposition to the ACA law. Nothing changes that reality except a radical change in 'say anything' partisan Republican Party and right winger politics, policies, behaviors, changes that will occur shortly after hell freezes over.

chuckd · December 20, 2013

@chuckd

Yes, of the 34 states that have not established a state online exchange, 28 are Republican Party controlled. That is clear and convincing evidence of a partisan bent and a fierce determination.

There you guys go again - 60 to 70 million to lose medical insurance next year. Not now, but at a point in the future. I see you read Breitbart News, apparently regularly if not religiously. Just a few months ago the number some right wingers were throwing around in the right wing media was 120 million. I see you've climbed down a bit - you'll climb down a bit more yet.

Speaking of Breitbart News, it's a right wing "all the news we like" organization. Only right wingers pay any attention to it or give it any credibility.

If I recall correctly, the right wingers got quite a citation for their wildly bogus claim during 2009 into 2010 that ObamaCare had "death panels" that would do us all in once and for all - or maybe do in only the right wingers or whomever.

Republican Party partisan politics and the politics of other right wingers is the core of the political opposition to the ACA law. Nothing changes that reality except a radical change in 'say anything' partisan Republican Party and right winger politics, policies, behaviors, changes that will occur shortly after hell freezes over.

Thank you for your response.

How do you explain the remaining six states that chose not to have their own exchange? Is that also "partisan bent" or is there some other compelling reason why Democratic party governors would make that choice?

I am not surprised you attacked the source rather than the content of my post, but you did not disappoint us completely, with this remark...

"There you guys go again - 60 to 70 million to lose medical insurance next year. Not now, but at a point in the future."

Some months (years?) ago, a study was performed on the employer mandated policies for both large employers (100 or more workers) and small employers (less than 100 workers). The following estimates were made concerning the ability of existing plans to successfully be grandfathered under Obamcare in 2013.

Of the larger employers totaling coverage of some 133 million individuals, it was estimated that as many as 66% of them remain grandfathered, a mid range estimate of 55% remain grandfathered and a low range of 34% remain grandfathered.

In the smaller employer category consisting of some 43 million individual policy holders, it was estimated that as many as 51% remain grandfathered, a mid range estimate of 34% remain grandfathered and a low range of 20 % remain grandfathered.

Using this study, a conclusion is reached concerning those policy holders who would NOT be eligible for grandfather privileges and would be required to enter the exchanges is as follows::

1. High Range losing grandfather status:

Large employers would lose 34% of 133 million, or a total of 45.22 million lost policies.

Small employers would lose 49% of 43 million, or a total of 21.07 million lost polilcies.

2. Mid Range losing grandfather status:

Large employers would lose 45% of 133 million, or a total of 59.85 million lost policies

Small employers would lose 66% of 43 million, or a total of 28.38 million lost policies

3. Low range losing grandfather status:

Large employers would lose 66% of 133 million, or a total of 87.78 million lost policies

Small employers would lose 80% of 43 million, or a total of 34.4 million lost policies

On the basis of this study, the conclusion is as follows:

1. Using the high range remaining grandfathered, a total of 66.29 million policies would be lost.

2. Using the mid range remaining grandfathered, a total of 88.23 million policies would be lost.

3. Using the low range remaining grandfathered, a total of 122.18 million policies would be lost.

In short, the absolute best case scenario for those losing employer mandated coverage would be 66.29 million individuals and families.

The worst case would entail 122.18 million losing their employer mandated coverage.

The interesting thing about the study is that it was NOT performed by Breitbart or any other conservative think tank or blog.

It was performed long before the disasterous rollout, hence the estimate for the employer mandate being in the calendar year 2013. As you will recall, President Obama extended, illegally some believe, the law's effective date for employer mandate from 2014 to 2015, thus kicking this can farther down the road, or until Fall of 2014 when employer mandated policies will begin attempts at renewal.

The study was performed by Health and Human Services under the direction of Kathleen Sebelius, Secretary.

An archived copy of this study can be located here. It has been removed from the healthreform.gov web site.

http://web.archive.org/web/20100617160027/http://www.healthreform.gov/newsroom/keeping_the_health_plan_you_have.html

chuckd · December 21, 2013

As we speak, Obamacare continues to implode and the President continues rewriting the law to suit his political purposes.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Obama administration relaxes rules of health-care law four days before deadline

By Amy Goldstein

The Obama administration on Thursday night significantly relaxed the rules of the federal health-care law for millions of consumers whose individual insurance policies have been canceled, saying they can buy bare-bones plans or entirely avoid a requirement that most Americans have health coverage.

The surprise announcement, days before the Dec. 23 deadline for people to choose plans that will begin Jan. 1, triggered an immediate backlash from the health insurance industry and raised fairness questions about a law intended to promote affordable and comprehensive coverage on a widespread basis.

The rule change was issued in a bulletin from the Department of Health and Human Services. It is the second major response by the Obama administration to a public and political furor that erupted in the fall when several million people who bought their own insurance began to receive notices that their policies were being canceled because they fell short of new benefit standards. <snipped>

Entire article here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/obama-administration-relaxes-rules-of-health-care-law-four-days-before-deadline/2013/12/19/81bc3132-690b-11e3-8b5b-a77187b716a3_story.html

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...and then there is this today. It seems "Obamacare itself is the "hardship".

7:27 AM, DEC 20, 2013 * BY DANIEL HALPER

'The First Crack in the Individual Mandate'

From the article...

1. The individual mandate includes a "hardship exemption." People who qualify can either ignore the individual mandate altogether or purchase a cheap, bare-bones catastrophic insurance plan that's typically only available to people under 30.

2. According to HHS, the exemption covers people who "experienced financial or domestic circumstances, including an unexpected natural or human-caused event, such that he or she had a significant, unexpected increase in essential expenses that prevented him or her from obtaining coverage under a qualified health plan."

3. Today, the administration agreed with a group of senators, led by Mark Warner of Virginia, who argued that having your insurance plan canceled counted as "an unexpected natural or human-caused event." For these people, in other words, Obamacare itself is the hardship.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/first-crack-individual-mandate_771543.html

PS: We already know the Weekly Standard is a conservative think tank.

thaibeachlovers · December 22, 2013

Only a few days left to Jan 1. How's it going, all you Obama care supporters? All 5 million plus that have been kicked off their plans signed up? Sure they are, 5555555555555555555.

Edited December 22, 2013 by thaibeachlovers

Jingthing · December 22, 2013

Time for single payer. Sorted!

Ulysses G. · December 22, 2013

Time for single payer. Sorted!

I concur. Unfortunately, after this farce, it is probably not going to sell.

Jingthing · December 22, 2013

Time for single payer. Sorted!

I concur. Unfortunately, after this farce, it is probably not going to sell.

Probably true. I've lost faith in the American "democratic" system. It's not any more democratic than the Thai system. It's controlled by money interests.

Publicus · December 22, 2013

The past couple of weeks have seen an especially quick growth in sign ups for ObamaCare as the December 23rd deadline is upon us for those seeking medical insurance effective January 1st.

We can expect to see 5 million enrolled by the deadline to the six month enrollment period that expires on March 31st next year. (No one in the government or among the insurance companies has said anything about 5 million enrolled by the present date - that's more of the bogus data right wingers love to distort in their willful and compulsive misrepresentations.)

Since October, 1.2 million have gained Obamacare coverage

Just about 1.2 million people have gained health coverage through Obamacare, according to new federal data released Wednesday morning.

Approximately 365,000 of those people have purchased private insurance and 803,000 have been determined to be eligible for the public Medicaid program.

These numbers count data from both October and November, and show an especially quick growth in HealthCare.gov enrollment

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/12/11/since-october-1-2-million-have-gained-obamacare-coverage/

Publicus · December 22, 2013

Because 28 states with Republican Party controlled governments have not established an ObamaCare medical insurance exchange, any qualified citizen of those states will be ineligible for subsidies to help pay the cost of signing up.

Only citizens whose state government has established a medical exchange are eligible for federal subsidies to the ObamaCare program.

So by consciously refusing to establish an ObamaCare medical insurance exchange, the 28 Republican Party controlled states are denying qualified citizens in each of the 28 states access to needed subsidies.

Denial of needed subsidies to citizens of each of these states is in effect denial of access to ObamaCare for many citizens of each Republican Party controlled state. This is yet another devious and malevolent way Republican Party governors and/or state legislatures are trying to sabotage ObamaCare for Americans who need it or that choose to try to obtain it.

The 28 Republican Party controlled states that have decided to deny all of their eligible and qualified citizens access to ObamaCare subsidies are thereby engaged in organized, deliberate and malicious, premeditated, partisan political attempts to sabotage.the ACA law before it can be successfully implemented.

The ACA law does not fully implement ObamaCare until 2018 so there is ample time to deal with the challenges the new law provides in this complex matter of the greatest importance to the people of the United States and which involves almost a fifth of the US's GDP.

So the new ACA law and its programs will come into effect despite the willful and obstructionist partisan schemes of the Republican Party in Washington and in the state capitals where partisan Republicans and other right wingers are in diabolical and destructive-minded control.

Edited December 22, 2013 by Publicus

chuckd · December 22, 2013

Because 28 states with Republican Party controlled governments have not established an ObamaCare medical insurance exchange, any qualified citizen of those states will be ineligible for subsidies to help pay the cost of signing up.

Only citizens whose state government has established a medical exchange are eligible for federal subsidies to the ObamaCare program.

So by consciously refusing to establish an ObamaCare medical insurance exchange, the 28 Republican Party controlled states are denying qualified citizens in each of the 28 states access to needed subsidies.

Denial of needed subsidies to citizens of each of these states is in effect denial of access to ObamaCare for many citizens of each Republican Party controlled state. This is yet another devious and malevolent way Republican Party governors and/or state legislatures are trying to sabotage ObamaCare for Americans who need it or that choose to try to obtain it.

The 28 Republican Party controlled states that have decided to deny all of their eligible and qualified citizens access to ObamaCare subsidies are thereby engaged in organized, deliberate and malicious, premeditated, partisan political attempts to sabotage.the ACA law before it can be successfully implemented.

The ACA law does not fully implement ObamaCare until 2018 so there is ample time to deal with the challenges the new law provides in this complex matter of the greatest importance to the people of the United States and which involves almost a fifth of the US's GDP.

So the new ACA law and its programs will come into effect despite the willful and obstructionist partisan schemes of the Republican Party in Washington and in the state capitals where partisan Republicans and other right wingers are in diabolical and destructive-minded control.

But, you see, there were 34 states that chose not to set up exchanges, not simply the 28 you have noted.

What about the residents of those 6 states controlled by Democrats that decided not to set up exchanges? What will happen to their federal subsidies?

Maybe Obama will sign an executive order passing them through so they will be eligible. After all, how could he leave his home state and Joe Biden's home state out in the cold?

By the way, those federal subsidies you claim are not payable to states without exchanges, the IRS in more of their infinite wisdom, said that little part of the law didn't really mean what Congress said so they have decided ALL STATES are eligible for federal subsidies on Obamacare...including the 34 (28+6) without exchanges.

There are some cases working their way through federal courts that are fighting the decision of the IRS in this matter so it will probably wind up in the hands of the Supreme Court.

If the Supreme Court has to side it is likely one of two things could happen. Either none of the 50 states plus DC will get federal subsidies for individual care or they will declare all of them should.

.

If it is "none", Obamacare will collapse.

PS: Loved this little part of your post..."So the new ACA law and its programs will come into effect despite the willful and obstructionist partisan schemes of the Republican Party in Washington and in the state capitals where partisan Republicans and other right wingers are in diabolical and destructive-minded control. "

Sounds like something Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid might say.?

meechai · December 22, 2013

Only citizens whose state government has established a medical exchange are eligible for federal subsidies to the ObamaCare program.

But, you see, there were 34 states that chose not to set up exchanges, not simply the 28 you have noted.

Those citizens who supposedly lost federal subsidies/theoretical pennies probably saved $$$$

After all where does one think those subsidies were going to come from?

Taxes paid by whom?

This is probably the best way to end this mess.

Noncompliance

Peaceful Obamacare revolution

They are not going to fine or jail millions of citizens

Edited December 22, 2013 by meechai

chuckd · December 22, 2013

The past couple of weeks have seen an especially quick growth in sign ups for ObamaCare as the December 23rd deadline is upon us for those seeking medical insurance effective January 1st.

We can expect to see 5 million enrolled by the deadline to the six month enrollment period that expires on March 31st next year. (No one in the government or among the insurance companies has said anything about 5 million enrolled by the present date - that's more of the bogus data right wingers love to distort in their willful and compulsive misrepresentations.)

Since October, 1.2 million have gained Obamacare coverage

Just about 1.2 million people have gained health coverage through Obamacare, according to new federal data released Wednesday morning.

Approximately 365,000 of those people have purchased private insurance and 803,000 have been determined to be eligible for the public Medicaid program.

These numbers count data from both October and November, and show an especially quick growth in HealthCare.gov enrollment

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/12/11/since-october-1-2-million-have-gained-obamacare-coverage/

There are several problems with your overly optimistic post.

1. The target of individuals enrolled by March 31, 2014, was not 5 million...it was 7 million. I know of nobody that has said there must be 5 or 7 million signed up in the first two months...Republican or Democrat. Perhaps you have a link to this statement?

The targeted number of 7 million was established by the CBO and endorsed by the White House. See here:

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/44190_EffectsAffordableCareActHealthInsuranceCoverage_2.pdf Table 3

...and here...

"The Obama administration boldly vowed to hit its ambitious target of enrolling 7 million through the Obamacare health exchanges, despite new sign-up numbers that show it has a very long way to go to meet this goal.

A total of 364,682 people were enrolled in private Obamacare insurance plans nationwide by the end of November, according to federal figures released Wednesday."

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101262522

2. The 7 million target is for Obamacare insured and does not include Medicare numbers. Medicare programs are state run and not federally run programs.

3. Of the approximate 365,000 that have signed up for Obamacare (Not Medicare), how many have already made their fist premium?

How does the latest Obama ruling affect them since the ruling declares deadlines aren't really deadlines as there is the newly discovered disaster clause excusing all those folks from paying any penalty or even showing proof of coverage if they are unable "for any reason" to secure coverage?

In other words, the administration has declared Obamacare itself a man made disaster...or at the very least the web site as one.

Do you honestly believe individuals will be willing to pay the higher premiums for higher co-pays when they can get insurance under the latest ruling to cover catastrophic illnesses or accidents? Anybody in reasonably good health is going to opt out of Obamacare and go the cheaper route with catastrophic coverage only.

The most obvious problem I see with your blog is that it was written two weeks ago. Sebelius and Obama have been changing many things in those two weeks. Mostly they have removed the individual mandate from the program for at least another year...which is exactly what the Republicans wanted when they closed down the government in October.

Thank you.

Edited December 22, 2013 by chuckd

Publicus · December 22, 2013

Because 28 states with Republican Party controlled governments have not established an ObamaCare medical insurance exchange, any qualified citizen of those states will be ineligible for subsidies to help pay the cost of signing up.

Only citizens whose state government has established a medical exchange are eligible for federal subsidies to the ObamaCare program.

So by consciously refusing to establish an ObamaCare medical insurance exchange, the 28 Republican Party controlled states are denying qualified citizens in each of the 28 states access to needed subsidies.

Denial of needed subsidies to citizens of each of these states is in effect denial of access to ObamaCare for many citizens of each Republican Party controlled state. This is yet another devious and malevolent way Republican Party governors and/or state legislatures are trying to sabotage ObamaCare for Americans who need it or that choose to try to obtain it.

The 28 Republican Party controlled states that have decided to deny all of their eligible and qualified citizens access to ObamaCare subsidies are thereby engaged in organized, deliberate and malicious, premeditated, partisan political attempts to sabotage.the ACA law before it can be successfully implemented.

The ACA law does not fully implement ObamaCare until 2018 so there is ample time to deal with the challenges the new law provides in this complex matter of the greatest importance to the people of the United States and which involves almost a fifth of the US's GDP.

So the new ACA law and its programs will come into effect despite the willful and obstructionist partisan schemes of the Republican Party in Washington and in the state capitals where partisan Republicans and other right wingers are in diabolical and destructive-minded control.

But, you see, there were 34 states that chose not to set up exchanges, not simply the 28 you have noted.

What about the residents of those 6 states controlled by Democrats that decided not to set up exchanges? What will happen to their federal subsidies?

Maybe Obama will sign an executive order passing them through so they will be eligible. After all, how could he leave his home state and Joe Biden's home state out in the cold?

By the way, those federal subsidies you claim are not payable to states without exchanges, the IRS in more of their infinite wisdom, said that little part of the law didn't really mean what Congress said so they have decided ALL STATES are eligible for federal subsidies on Obamacare...including the 34 (28+6) without exchanges.

There are some cases working their way through federal courts that are fighting the decision of the IRS in this matter so it will probably wind up in the hands of the Supreme Court.

If the Supreme Court has to side it is likely one of two things could happen. Either none of the 50 states plus DC will get federal subsidies for individual care or they will declare all of them should.

.

If it is "none", Obamacare will collapse.

PS: Loved this little part of your post..."So the new ACA law and its programs will come into effect despite the willful and obstructionist partisan schemes of the Republican Party in Washington and in the state capitals where partisan Republicans and other right wingers are in diabolical and destructive-minded control. "

Sounds like something Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid might say.?

I'm well aware of the language of the law and of the differing interpretations of executive branch power in this respect, and that the different interpretations are working their way through the US courts.

So, as you continue to cheer for the failure of ObamaCare, I reiterate that the ACA is not scheduled for full implementation until 2018, which gives ample time to get the many complications inherent to the complex and broad ranging ACA law reorganized and improved.

You like to ignore the fact that the ACA will not be fully implemented until 2018.

Indeed, of the 50 states and the District of Columbia, there are 17 that have a State-based Marketplace; 7 states have a Partnership Marketplace between the state and the federal government; 27 have a Federally-facilitated Marketplace only. The IRS ruling that all are eligible for subsidies is in part based on the fact all are connected to the ACA medical insurance program.

I grow weary of exposing the right wing's lies about ObamaCare, from the gross falsehoods of 2009 - that for example there were "death panels" in ObamaCare - to the falsehood that Delaware and Illinois deliberately and willfully have screwed their citizens by not establishing a state exchange in either. The fact is, neither state foresaw the problem that has surfaced, i.e., that not having a state exchange would disenfranchise those who need subsidies to participate in ObamaCare, which is also why the IRS had to make its ruling.

The fact is many posters here are professional opponents of ObamaCare and in fact oppose dogmatically and fanatically anything Prez Obama proposes. They are armed to the teeth with false data and bogus disinformation about ObamaCare - such as the "death panels" - so responding repeatedly to such villainous mischaracterizations and to their malicious and endless "death panel" kind of deliberate distractions only encourages them in their nefarious means and pursuits.

Just to correct the most recent instance of a knowing falsehood, if the Supreme Court were to rule against the IRS determination, it would not necessarily mean as claimed above that the ACA subsidy provision would be stricken absolutely, i.e., affecting all 50 states and the District of Columbia. This is so because the subsidy provision is specifically provided to states that do actively establish State-based Marketplace exchanges. Seventeen states have done exactly that while another seven states have a state-federal Partnership Marketplace exchange.

TVF readers who like honest, true, accurate information concerning ObamaCare can visit this link anytime if they like: http://obamacarefacts.com/state-health-insurance-exchange.php

So enough of dealing with the professional campaigners who knowingly, falsely, alleged "death panels" and who continuously campaign to mangle the public perception of ObamaCare, the ACA.

I say continuously, not simply continually.

That's continuously, which means even while we sleep.

Publicus · December 22, 2013

The past couple of weeks have seen an especially quick growth in sign ups for ObamaCare as the December 23rd deadline is upon us for those seeking medical insurance effective January 1st.

We can expect to see 5 million enrolled by the deadline to the six month enrollment period that expires on March 31st next year. (No one in the government or among the insurance companies has said anything about 5 million enrolled by the present date - that's more of the bogus data right wingers love to distort in their willful and compulsive misrepresentations.)

Since October, 1.2 million have gained Obamacare coverage

Just about 1.2 million people have gained health coverage through Obamacare, according to new federal data released Wednesday morning.

Approximately 365,000 of those people have purchased private insurance and 803,000 have been determined to be eligible for the public Medicaid program.

These numbers count data from both October and November, and show an especially quick growth in HealthCare.gov enrollment

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/12/11/since-october-1-2-million-have-gained-obamacare-coverage/

There are several problems with your overly optimistic post.

1. The target of individuals enrolled by March 31, 2014, was not 5 million...it was 7 million. I know of nobody that has said there must be 5 or 7 million signed up in the first two months...Republican or Democrat. Perhaps you have a link to this statement?

The targeted number of 7 million was established by the CBO and endorsed by the White House. See here:

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/44190_EffectsAffordableCareActHealthInsuranceCoverage_2.pdf Table 3

...and here...

"The Obama administration boldly vowed to hit its ambitious target of enrolling 7 million through the Obamacare health exchanges, despite new sign-up numbers that show it has a very long way to go to meet this goal.

A total of 364,682 people were enrolled in private Obamacare insurance plans nationwide by the end of November, according to federal figures released Wednesday."

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101262522

2. The 7 million target is for Obamacare insured and does not include Medicare numbers. Medicare programs are state run and not federally run programs.

3. Of the approximate 365,000 that have signed up for Obamacare (Not Medicare), how many have already made their fist premium?

How does the latest Obama ruling affect them since the ruling declares deadlines aren't really deadlines as there is the newly discovered disaster clause excusing all those folks from paying any penalty or even showing proof of coverage if they are unable "for any reason" to secure coverage?

In other words, the administration has declared Obamacare itself a man made disaster...or at the very least the web site as one.

Do you honestly believe individuals will be willing to pay the higher premiums for higher co-pays when they can get insurance under the latest ruling to cover catastrophic illnesses or accidents? Anybody in reasonably good health is going to opt out of Obamacare and go the cheaper route with catastrophic coverage only.

The most obvious problem I see with your blog is that it was written two weeks ago. Sebelius and Obama have been changing many things in those two weeks. Mostly they have removed the individual mandate from the program for at least another year...which is exactly what the Republicans wanted when they closed down the government in October.

Thank you.

I'm citing a news story in the MSM, the Washington Post specifically, same as you do.

The significant and substantial difference between you and I is that I've never cited, nor do I read Breitbart News along with other right wing disinformation organizations.

chuckd · December 22, 2013

The past couple of weeks have seen an especially quick growth in sign ups for ObamaCare as the December 23rd deadline is upon us for those seeking medical insurance effective January 1st.

We can expect to see 5 million enrolled by the deadline to the six month enrollment period that expires on March 31st next year. (No one in the government or among the insurance companies has said anything about 5 million enrolled by the present date - that's more of the bogus data right wingers love to distort in their willful and compulsive misrepresentations.)

Since October, 1.2 million have gained Obamacare coverage

Just about 1.2 million people have gained health coverage through Obamacare, according to new federal data released Wednesday morning.

Approximately 365,000 of those people have purchased private insurance and 803,000 have been determined to be eligible for the public Medicaid program.

These numbers count data from both October and November, and show an especially quick growth in HealthCare.gov enrollment

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/12/11/since-october-1-2-million-have-gained-obamacare-coverage/

There are several problems with your overly optimistic post.

1. The target of individuals enrolled by March 31, 2014, was not 5 million...it was 7 million. I know of nobody that has said there must be 5 or 7 million signed up in the first two months...Republican or Democrat. Perhaps you have a link to this statement?

The targeted number of 7 million was established by the CBO and endorsed by the White House. See here:

http://www.cbo.gov/sites/default/files/cbofiles/attachments/44190_EffectsAffordableCareActHealthInsuranceCoverage_2.pdf Table 3

...and here...

"The Obama administration boldly vowed to hit its ambitious target of enrolling 7 million through the Obamacare health exchanges, despite new sign-up numbers that show it has a very long way to go to meet this goal.

A total of 364,682 people were enrolled in private Obamacare insurance plans nationwide by the end of November, according to federal figures released Wednesday."

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101262522

2. The 7 million target is for Obamacare insured and does not include Medicare numbers. Medicare programs are state run and not federally run programs.

3. Of the approximate 365,000 that have signed up for Obamacare (Not Medicare), how many have already made their fist premium?

How does the latest Obama ruling affect them since the ruling declares deadlines aren't really deadlines as there is the newly discovered disaster clause excusing all those folks from paying any penalty or even showing proof of coverage if they are unable "for any reason" to secure coverage?

In other words, the administration has declared Obamacare itself a man made disaster...or at the very least the web site as one.

Do you honestly believe individuals will be willing to pay the higher premiums for higher co-pays when they can get insurance under the latest ruling to cover catastrophic illnesses or accidents? Anybody in reasonably good health is going to opt out of Obamacare and go the cheaper route with catastrophic coverage only.

The most obvious problem I see with your blog is that it was written two weeks ago. Sebelius and Obama have been changing many things in those two weeks. Mostly they have removed the individual mandate from the program for at least another year...which is exactly what the Republicans wanted when they closed down the government in October.

Thank you.

I'm citing a news story in the MSM, the Washington Post specifically, same as you do.

The significant and substantial difference between you and I is that I've never cited, nor do I read Breitbart News along with other right wing disinformation organizations.

How does your last comment address my post?

I cited three sources. They are the Washington Post, CNBC News and the Congressional Budget Office, none of them considered right wing.

Simply disprove my information if you disagree with it. If you can't do that then you may continue attacking my sources.

Thank you.

Publicus · December 22, 2013

chuckd, you write and I note:

In other words, the administration has declared Obamacare itself a man made disaster...or at the very least the web site as one.

That is intentional and purposefully devious and deceptive writing intended to obfuscate. "...or at the very least" my arse.

And you write:

The 7 million target is for Obamacare insured and does not include Medicare numbers. Medicare programs are state run and not federally run programs.

Everyone - everyone - has known since the day the HealthCare.gov website opened October 1st and crashed hours afterward that enrollment would not be the originally targeted 7 million by the expiration of the enrollment period on March 31st next.

The anticipated enrollment at this point can reasonably be projected to be 5 million by March 31st. There are presently 1.2 million enrolled, which is a good start, with more having enrolled during recent weeks in the lead up to the Dec 23 deadline to be covered beginning January 1st. However, you're jiggling numbers and that's nothing new from you.

And Medicaid is expanded by ObamaCare, not Medicare as you state in my above quote of you.

Now, yes, you and TVF readers know it is the Medicaid program that is expanded - that Medicare is not included in the ACA. But in your frantic flurry of flinging out any figures and numbers and any names of any programs, you continue to <deleted>*k it all up into one big bag of garbled right wing garbage that belongs in the bin.

And speaking of the Medicaid expansion by ObamaCare, only one Republican Party controlled state has signed up for the expansion. Republican Party controlled states are thus denying their low income and poor citizens access to a vital aspect of their unmet medical insurance needs while in this way simultaneously and actively trying to sabotage the ACA. Then you cynically shout out that ObamaCare enrollment isn't what it should be.

Looking at another of your devious claims, you continue in this vein of distorted and intentionally dishonest disinformation:

A total of 364,682 people were enrolled in private Obamacare insurance plans nationwide by the end of November, according to federal figures released Wednesday."

So I must point out from the Washington Post dated December 11th that the complete data as of that date are:

Since October, 1.2 million have gained Obamacare coverage

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/12/11/since-october-1-2-million-have-gained-obamacare-coverage/

Approximately 365,000 of those people have purchased private insurance and 803,000 have been determined to be eligible for the public Medicaid program. These numbers count data from both October and November, and show an especially quick growth in HealthCare.gov enrollment

That's 1.2 million as the Washington Post headline in my post above clearly states, along with hundreds of headlines throughout the country after the government made the announcement.

And since then, the recent weeks of December show that during the lead up to the Dec 23rd sign up deadline for your ObamaCare coverage to begin January 1st, there is a rush of people nationwide filing application forms. Gee, it sure would help Americans if the Republican Party controlled states would join the other states to establish a state exchange in each.

So considering all of the above and a hellovalot more, whatever are you on about?

You're on about your right wing agenda of misinformation, disinformation, distortions, lies, deception and the like that the right has been scurrilously pursuing every day since 2009 with, among other malicious lies, the malevolent lie that ObamaCare had so-called "death panels.".

Indeed, by citing only the 364,682 number, you selective skew your assertions thus making your claims against ObamaCare wholly unreliable. You continue to jiggle numbers and data. You are still firing off statements that fly in all directions simultaneously, or fly off in the most convenient direction of the moment. The fact is and always has been that your reach exceeds your grasp. Depending on the numbers and data you need, you exclude data or include data, sometimes long reams of data as posted on a previous page when the data no longer applies and had already been removed from the government website.

So at this point of the thread I'll leave you to masturbate in your bogus numbers, data, figures, and to make your disingenuous and deliberately dishonest and false conclusions from the highly selected and cooked data the right so much loves.

I'll not have any more of it because ObamaCare is here to stay despite the lies of the right and the sabotage being conducted nationwide by the Republican Party in Washington and in the state capitals.

Death panels, anyone?

Edited December 22, 2013 by Publicus

Jay Sata · December 22, 2013

If you are poor and sick in the USA you die.

In Cuba you don't pay and you live.

Have I missed something?

F430murci · December 22, 2013

If you are poor and sick in the USA you die.

In Cuba you don't pay and you live.

Have I missed something?

Yes, you missed that health care in US is better than anywhere else in the world and that you need mental health treatment and perhaps an SSRI to address your issues.

canman · December 23, 2013

If you are poor and sick in the USA you die.

In Cuba you don't pay and you live.

Have I missed something?

Yes, you missed that health care in US is better than anywhere else in the world and that you need mental health treatment and perhaps an SSRI to address your issues.

Not sure how you measure the effectiveness of a countries health care system. I would have thought life expectancy at birth and infant mortality rates would be good indicators.

On both of these metrics Cuba does better than the USA. The USA ranks 34th in the world for infant mortality and 40th for life expectancy at birth. Source is Wikipedia, CIA fact book gives similar results

chuckd · December 23, 2013

Before I anwer the little fit of pique above, let me post today's opposition to the current health care law.

Oops.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Democratic senator says Obamacare could have 'meltdown,' hurt party

Reuters – 10 hours ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Barack Obama's healthcare law could have a "meltdown" and make it difficult for his Democratic Party to keep control of the U.S. Senate next year if ongoing problems with the program are not resolved, a Democratic senator said on Sunday.

Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia, who has urged delaying a penalty for people who do not enroll for health insurance in 2014 under the law, told CNN that a transitional year was needed for the complex healthcare program, commonly known as Obamacare, to work.

"If it's so much more expensive than what we anticipated and if the coverage is not as good as what we had, you've got a complete meltdown at that time," Manchin told CNN's "State of the Union" program.

"It falls of its own weight, if basically the cost becomes more than we can absorb, absolutely."

Not Breitbart source here: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/democratic-senator-says-obamacare-could-39-meltdown-39-172125028.html

Publicus · December 23, 2013

Before I anwer the little fit of pique above, let me post today's opposition to the current health care law.

Oops.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Democratic senator says Obamacare could have 'meltdown,' hurt party

Reuters – 10 hours ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Barack Obama's healthcare law could have a "meltdown" and make it difficult for his Democratic Party to keep control of the U.S. Senate next year if ongoing problems with the program are not resolved, a Democratic senator said on Sunday.

Senator Joe Manchin of West Virginia, who has urged delaying a penalty for people who do not enroll for health insurance in 2014 under the law, told CNN that a transitional year was needed for the complex healthcare program, commonly known as Obamacare, to work.

"If it's so much more expensive than what we anticipated and if the coverage is not as good as what we had, you've got a complete meltdown at that time," Manchin told CNN's "State of the Union" program.

"It falls of its own weight, if basically the cost becomes more than we can absorb, absolutely."

Not Breitbart source here: http://ca.news.yahoo.com/democratic-senator-says-obamacare-could-39-meltdown-39-172125028.html

He says 'if' more than any other single word.

I'd read the article before you posted it and I thought he was talking about the New York Yankees winning the American League next year, it was so full of ifs. (His state, West Virginia, doesn't have any professional sports teams.)

Because here's the definition of 'if' from the Merriam Webster Dictionary:

¹if

conjunction \ˈif, əf\

—used to talk about the result or effect of something that may happen or be true

—used to discuss the imaginary result or effect of something that did not happen or that is or was not true

—used to say that something must happen before another thing can happen

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/if

Sen Manchin spends most of his time wonking on with the third meaning of 'if' - something must happen before another thing can happen. Or, I would add, not happen.

In general Sen Manchin has offered some valid critiques of his party's president, Barack Obama. Manchin also is covering his own butt with his voters back in West (By God) Virginia. WVA became a state by breaking off from Virginia to side with the Union at the outbreak of the civil war, however, it presently is full of Confederates.

The former governor, Sen Manchin did a good job to get elected to the Senate as a Democrat in this very red Republican party state in presidential elections..

The Democratic Party present governor has accepted the Medicaid expansion program for the economically laggard West Virginia, but has not implemented a state ACA exchange.

WVA is below the national average of internet users by state rankings.

Edited December 23, 2013 by Publicus

chuckd · December 23, 2013

Mr. Publicus:

This is in response to your post of 23 December 2013 at 04:13 AM.

I find myself in a real conundrum. I cannot quote your post in this missive as it would exceed the maximum number of quotes allowed by forum software. I cannot change your post by deleting a small portion of it since that would be a violation of forum rules and you would report me for the infraction. All of my work would be for naught.

I will just have to forge ahead without being able to use your post.

1. You claim, relating to my comment about Obamacare causing the latest individual mandate delay because of a declared disaster:

"That is intentional and purposefully devious and deceptive writing intended to obfuscate. "...or at the very least" my arse."

The delay was issued for those 5 million former policy holders that lost coverage and have either been unable to get on the web site or cannot afford the new Obamacare premiums. Since losing coverage was a result of Obamacare and the web site serves a direct function for Obamacare (when it works) it would seem that Obamacare, alone, is the reason for this further delay in the individual mandate. I must have missed Mother Nature's fury in the past week that might have otherwise been reason enough to cause a delay.

One interesting sidenote of the latest Executive change to the law is that individuals who did not have a policy that was cancelled, are not eligible for the latest delay and are, seemingly, not eligible to purchase catastrophic coverage. They must proceed with all flank speed to sign up for Obamacare and pay those premiums.

Following is a NOT Breitbart article that clearly sets out why the delay was issued and it had nothing to do with Republicans.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Why the Latest Obamacare Delay Is the Biggest One Yet

This time it's about fairness

By Kate Pickert @katepickertDec. 20, 2013

When fairness goes out the window, you know politics has caused the White House to take its Obamacare scramble to a whole new level.The administration said Thursday night that people with canceled policies will not be subject to the individual mandate in 2014. This is huge, but you wouldn’t know it from Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius’ letter announcing the change, which she sent in response to senators worried that those who saw their health insurance policies canceled this fall did not “consider” Obamacare replacement policies to be affordable.

Read more: Obamacare: Mandate Delay Is The Biggest Change Yet | TIME.com http://swampland.time.com/2013/12/20/obamacare-mandate-delay/#ixzz2oGugVzPm

2. You said:

" Everyone - everyone - has known since the day the HealthCare.gov website opened October 1st and crashed hours afterward that enrollment would not be the originally targeted 7 million by the expiration of the enrollment period on March 31st next."

As late as November 3, a White House spokesman was still saying the 7 million was attainable but I have heard none of the spin doctors making the claim recently. I would like to point out that not everyone knew the target was 7 million. Some thought it was only 5 million.

3. You said...

"And Medicaid is expanded by ObamaCare, not Medicare as you state in my above quote of you."

Well, you got me. I did say Medicare when it was clearly Medicaid. Medicaid is the free stuff the federal government and states have been handing out.

The only way Medicare is impacted is the billions that are being removed from the program in the future to help pay for Obamacare. But that's an entirely different can of worms not yet addressed.

Please permit me to humbly apologize for typing "Medicare" instead of "Medicaid" on my previous post and perhaps causing confusion and consternation among the populace.

4. You said...

"Looking at another of your devious claims, you continue in this vein of distorted and intentionally dishonest disinformation:"

This was in relation to the statement in my quoted post that, "A total of 364,682 people were enrolled in private Obamacare insurance plans nationwide by the end of November, according to federal figures released Wednesday."

If you find this claim devious, as you say, then I suggest you contact CNBC and complain since the comment is a direct quote from the linked article...not a devious claim by me.

5. You further make this claim:

"And since then, the recent weeks of December show that during the lead up to the Dec 23rd sign up deadline for your ObamaCare coverage to begin January 1st, there is a rush of people nationwide filing application forms."

Since the Obama administration considers the numbers of enrollees a State Secret please provide some data to explain this astounding claim. It would seem this rush to sign up has been well hidden from both Obama and Sebelius as well as the American people, or there would have been no need for the delay of last week. You think?

I won't address your personal attack, although the masturbation suggestion did get me rather excited. Not worth any more time.

Thank you.

PS: In some minds, the death panel is alive and well. This from Mark Halperin on November 26, 2013:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In an interview on Monday with the conservative Newsmax, Time's Mark Halperin said that so-called "death panels" are enshrined in the Affordable Care Act.

"It's going to be a huge issue," Halperin said. "And that's something else about which the President was not fully forthcoming or straight-forward."

"So, you believe there will be rationing, a.k.a 'death panels'?" host Steve Malzberg asked Halperin, the co-author of the 2012 election chronicle "Double Down."

"It's built into the plan. It's not like a guess or like a judgment. That's going to be part of how costs are controlled," Halperin said before arguing that it's necessary to ration care."

The interview is here: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/mark-halperin-death-panels-are-built-into-obamacare-video

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