Thai Army chief Prayuth behind PM-Suthep talks

[webfact]

Prayuth behind PM-Suthep talks
The Nation

Initiator of discussion unclear as both sides stick to their guns

BANGKOK: -- The two conflicting parties - Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban - would not have met on Sunday if Army chief General Prayuth Chan-ocha had not stepped in.

This is the first time Prayuth has played a role in the current political turmoil. Though the military side prefers to be seen as a "facilitator" or "mediator", some observers considered the part it played in the talks as a silent coup. After all, a coup with soldiers and tanks would be quite unacceptable.

However, it is still not clear who was the "real" initiator of the talks.

Suthep only told the public about the discussion an hour after it took place and provided no details, while Yingluck - in her first statement since peaceful protests turned violent late on Saturday - said she had called on the Army to coordinate talks with the other side.

Some sources, however, said the talks were coordinated by Prayuth via former defence minister Prawit Wongsuwan, who is close to Suthep.

Army chief uneasy about unrest

The first sign of Prayuth's role emerged on Sunday after deputy Army spokesman Winthai Suwaree told the media that the chief was pleading with police and anti-government protesters to stop what they were doing.

The statement was issued after police fired tear gas at crowds who were trying to occupy Government House and Metropolitan Police Bureau Headquarters.

The Army chief also offered to find a way for the two sides to hold future talks, the spokesman said, adding that Prayuth was feeling uneasy about the situation.

Initially, Yingluck wanted the discussion to be conducted through videoconferencing, but Suthep refused, asking to meet in person, a military source said. He also refused to meet at a venue related to the police force for fear of being captured.

The meeting was eventually staged at the King's own bodyguard, the 1st Infantry Regiment, on Phaholyothin Road.

The five people present at the meeting were Yingluck, Suthep, General Prayuth, Navy chief Admiral Narong Pipathanasai and Air Force chief Air Chief Marshal Prajin Janthong. The meeting lasted for about half an hour without any conclusions.

According to the source, the meeting began with Yingluck asking Suthep what he really wanted. Suthep responded by giving her an ultimatum to return the power to the people and pave the way for reform. However, the prime minister insisted that she had done nothing wrong and that his demand was unconstitutional.

"You should respect the million people who wholeheartedly came out to protest against you," Suthep was quoted as saying.

"I came via democratic means. I run the country on my own without listening to my brother," she said, referring to Thaksin Shinawatra.

The talks stalled as both sides continued sticking by their stance, prompting the top brass to ask if dissolution of the House of Representatives or Yingluck's resignation would be acceptable. Suthep said the "situation is beyond that".

According to the source, the three military commanders insisted that they would stand for Thailand and look for the best way out for the country, which included being a mediator in these talks.


-- The Nation 2013-12-03

[webfact]

Armed forces show strong will to help tackle political row

BANGKOK, 3 December 2013 (NNT) – The commanders of the Royal Thai Armed Forces have expressed readiness to work with all sides to calm the ongoing political protests and facilitate the protesters’ journey home.

After having coordinated talks between Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra and anti-government protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban on Sunday, Army Spokesman Col. Winthai Suwaree said the supreme commander and chiefs of the three armed forces had been doing their best to work with all sides in dealing with protesters in a peaceful manner. The commanders vowed that military officers would continue to operate with care to avoid clashes.

The military was ready to take care of the injured and help take the protesters home safely, the spokesman said.

The commanders also stressed on the use of non-violent approaches and reiterated that the armed forces were required to strictly follow regulations and the Constitution.


-- NNT 2013-12-03

[Prbkk]

Prayuth was pleading with Police and protesters to stop what they were doing? How extraordinary. The Police are trying to defend public property from an unruly mob trying to overthrow a democratically elected government and the Army asks THEM to stop? I would have thought a more logical and appropriate focus would have been pressure on the protesters to stop. It is clear that Suthep has taken comfort from these discussions and comments ( as reflected in his speech/rant last night) and fully intends to inflict his anarchy on the rest of the country.

The speech was very Nuremberg, 1930s. A thug and a fascist.

[MaxLee]

Prayuth was pleading with Police and protesters to stop what they were doing? How extraordinary. The Police are trying to defend public property from an unruly mob trying to overthrow a democratically elected government and the Army asks THEM to stop? I would have thought a more logical and appropriate focus would have been pressure on the protesters to stop. It is clear that Suthep has taken comfort from these discussions and comments ( as reflected in his speech/rant last night) and fully intends to inflict his anarchy on the rest of the country.

The speech was very Nuremberg, 1930s. A thug and a fascist.

Democratically elected government,... HAAAAHAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!, you mean a democratically elected "VOTE-BOUGHT government

Either way, no matter who is elected, the opposition leaders are ALL full of crap in their head, using Democracy as a veil of ignorance to achieve their strive for self-serving power

[Prbkk]

....and we are meant to take comfort from the ravings of a lunatic who promises not much more than the creation of a people's council ( aka gang of four) and an assurance that everything will be much better in the future? Sorry, I'm not buying this crap. In reality it means a dictatorship

[JRSoul]

I play this little game when I read about Yingluk's speeches - it's called "Count the Lies." Very easy, even young children can play and score well.

In the OP, I count 4 and a possible, but I particularly liked the double header "I run the country on my own without listening to my brother," though the classic PTP/red shirt "I have done nothing wrong," in the face of all evidence to the contrary, was a collector's item.

[Bender]

You should respect the million people who wholeheartedly came out to protest against you," Suthep was quoted as saying.

the million people who came?

oh please don't thai to me!

Clearly this Suthep is completely disillusioned, they should have held for him this meeting in a mental asylum or in a barnum circus

ps : 2 more days before its over!

Edited December 3, 2013 by Bender

[ricku]

ps : 2 more days before its over!

You sure about that?

I'm not really sure how a bday party can make all the political hate and confrontations just vanish into thin air?

Well, perhaps they'll take a short break, but it will be back.

[webfact]

Military steps up for the people
Panya Thiosangwan
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- As civil unrest and a deep political divide rock Bangkok, the military is demonstrating that Thai citizens can depend on it as it continues rescuing protesters and providing support.

Army chief General Prayuth Chan-ocha instructed the First Army Region's Royal Medical Department School to deploy 10 medical units to treat protesters injured by tear gas. The police launched a tear gas attack in a move to stop protesters from storming Government House and the Metropolitan Police headquarters yesterday in what they dubbed was a civil-disobedience movement.

Deputy Army spokesman Colonel Sirichan Ngathong said the forces had prepared medical teams to help protesters during the confrontation. Eight medical teams with ambulances were on stand by at Ayutthaya, Rajdamnoen Nok and Amnuay Songkram roads.

Manasit Sripirom, a member of one of the medical teams, said he had provided first aid to people hit by tear gas by spraying their faces with saline solution to reduce the 'burning' and then washing their faces with plain water.

He also had to protect himself with a full-protection mask.

Sithichai Bamrungpas, another member of one of the medical teams, said he too had sustained injuries while trying to rescue those who were badly injured and called on police to use less tear gas.

Earlier, the military top brass moved to bring anti-government protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban to the negotiation table with Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatara on Sunday night.

At Prayuth's order, a company of soldiers from the 11th Infantry Regiment King's Guard took control of the Ramkhamhaeng University area to rescue crowds protesting against the so-called "Thaksin regime" gathered inside the university compound after some were injured and killed in a shooting incident on Saturday night.


-- The Nation 2013-12-03

[mrtoad]

I play this little game when I read about Yingluk's speeches - it's called "Count the Lies." Very easy, even young children can play and score well.

In the OP, I count 4 and a possible, but I particularly liked the double header "I run the country on my own without listening to my brother," though the classic PTP/red shirt "I have done nothing wrong," in the face of all evidence to the contrary, was a collector's item.

Yes, there are three lies, just in those two short sentences if yo break it down into 1) " I run the country on my own" 2) "without listening to my brother" 3) "I have done nothing wrong"

One thing with Yingluck is that she is entrenched in her denial and uses all the skills so that she can maintain her position, despite all the evidence that suggests her position is dysfunctional and toxic ;blaming, intellectulizing, victim mentality, manipulation, crazy making, seduction, over generalistatons, rationalization, minimizing, comparison, uniqueness, distraction and Yinglucks favorite avoiding by omission.

[newcomer71]

Prayuth was pleading with Police and protesters to stop what they were doing? How extraordinary. The Police are trying to defend public property from an unruly mob trying to overthrow a democratically elected government and the Army asks THEM to stop? I would have thought a more logical and appropriate focus would have been pressure on the protesters to stop. It is clear that Suthep has taken comfort from these discussions and comments ( as reflected in his speech/rant last night) and fully intends to inflict his anarchy on the rest of the country.

The speech was very Nuremberg, 1930s. A thug and a fascist.

Democratically elected government,... HAAAAHAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!, you mean a democratically elected "VOTE-BOUGHT government

Either way, no matter who is elected, the opposition leaders are ALL full of crap in their head, using Democracy as a veil of ignorance to achieve their strive for self-serving power

I again make clear my position, before being pointed as a Thaksin-fan, or a redshirt.

This government is a bluff, puppeted by a Dubai fugitive.

But... telling they bought votes for delegitimate them, it's silly.

Both parts bought votes, and I know for sure people have been paid, offered a meal and transportation to ballot. So?

Both sides are s..t if we look at democracy, with the difference that Suthep's thugs are openly needing to estabilish a dictatorship, masked as a King's loyal people's council (which people should be, Suthep still did not tell us...)

[Roadman]

Well done to that man.Khun General Prayuth. About the only group that is showing any level of responsibility in the whole circus. The thought of The Army on take over is gaining appeal every day.

[mrtoad]

Prayuth was pleading with Police and protesters to stop what they were doing? How extraordinary. The Police are trying to defend public property from an unruly mob trying to overthrow a democratically elected government and the Army asks THEM to stop? I would have thought a more logical and appropriate focus would have been pressure on the protesters to stop. It is clear that Suthep has taken comfort from these discussions and comments ( as reflected in his speech/rant last night) and fully intends to inflict his anarchy on the rest of the country.

The speech was very Nuremberg, 1930s. A thug and a fascist.

Democratically elected government,... HAAAAHAAAAA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!, you mean a democratically elected "VOTE-BOUGHT government

Either way, no matter who is elected, the opposition leaders are ALL full of crap in their head, using Democracy as a veil of ignorance to achieve their strive for self-serving power

I again make clear my position, before being pointed as a Thaksin-fan, or a redshirt.

This government is a bluff, puppeted by a Dubai fugitive.

But... telling they bought votes for delegitimate them, it's silly.

Both parts bought votes, and I know for sure people have been paid, offered a meal and transportation to ballot. So?

Both sides are s..t if we look at democracy, with the difference that Suthep's thugs are openly needing to estabilish a dictatorship, masked as a King's loyal people's council (which people should be, Suthep still did not tell us...)

Nothing Red Shirt about that post, I agree on both points, neither side at present are a solution to the ongoing problems, they are just self serving individuals. I actually see little difference now, in what happened 2009 and 2010, other than the actions of The BIB.

[winstonc]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

[newcomer71]

I again make clear my position, before being pointed as a Thaksin-fan, or a redshirt.

This government is a bluff, puppeted by a Dubai fugitive.

But... telling they bought votes for delegitimate them, it's silly.

Both parts bought votes, and I know for sure people have been paid, offered a meal and transportation to ballot. So?

Both sides are s..t if we look at democracy, with the difference that Suthep's thugs are openly needing to estabilish a dictatorship, masked as a King's loyal people's council (which people should be, Suthep still did not tell us...)

Nothing Red Shirt about that post, I agree on both points, neither side at present are a solution to the ongoing problems, they are just self serving individuals. I actually see little difference now, in what happened 2009 and 2010, other than the actions of The BIB.

I only did the introduction as yesterday evening I have been painted as a redshirt, glad to see there are people which still accept a critical confrontation and free speech on TV!

[Local Drunk]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

There's a lot more to it. The police couldn't or wouldn't evacuate the students or the protesters, and did you notice how quickly Jutaporn called an end to the rally and sent his people home after the incidents. That just isn't his style.

[Emptyset]

There's an article in the BKK Post that suggests military may stage coup then install this so-called 'People's Council'. It's been rumoured for the past year or so that the plan is to install an appointed government with Prawit as PM. As the article states, Prawit brokered this meeting as he's been a good mate of Suthep since the Abhisit govt. He's also supposedly installed his people in key positions in the military during the last few years. But Prayuth still has the final say. Will he remain pragmatic and stay uninvolved or will he listen to the very anti-red anti-Thaksin Prawit and stage coup?

[Emptyset]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

There's a lot more to it. The police couldn't or wouldn't evacuate the students or the protesters, and did you notice how quickly Jutaporn called an end to the rally and sent his people home after the incidents. That just isn't his style.

There's always a lot more to it. Either the students didn't really need rescuing and the move was just to make the army look good or the snipers must have a good relationship with the army, given that soldiers evacuated students completely unarmed. The UDD did the right thing in calling off the rally imo.

[rebelplatoon]

It's interesting that red shirts never follow any news on yellow shirts and vice versus. This would help both sides understand each others grievances. I see red shirts only watching the provocative red shirt rallies and yellow shirts only the yellow shirt side of the story. Both sides have points. Some good points, some that come from akusala thoughts (unwholesome thoughts) The only way out is to have a dialogue. The way out is not a non-elected Government, that is a joke. It should either be an agreed upon business government (which would take both factions in government to work together as equal partners) or new elections. I see the latter coming up with an interim government to be installed by the military as neither side will budge.... Sad but true. And yes, on the 5th it will be over. For a day.

[Xonax]

It's interesting that red shirts never follow any news on yellow shirts and vice versus. This would help both sides understand each others grievances. I see red shirts only watching the provocative red shirt rallies and yellow shirts only the yellow shirt side of the story. Both sides have points. Some good points, some that come from akusala thoughts (unwholesome thoughts) The only way out is to have a dialogue. The way out is not a non-elected Government, that is a joke. It should either be an agreed upon business government (which would take both factions in government to work together as equal partners) or new elections. I see the latter coming up with an interim government to be installed by the military as neither side will budge.... Sad but true. And yes, on the 5th it will be over. For a day.

The RED and YELLOW shirt propaganda radio and tv programs should be banned, as all they do is to brainwash the people! Every radio and tv station should be forced to, in a neutral way, to tell both sides of the story.

[HiSoLowSoNoSo]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

There's a lot more to it. The police couldn't or wouldn't evacuate the students or the protesters, and did you notice how quickly Jutaporn called an end to the rally and sent his people home after the incidents. That just isn't his style.

There's always a lot more to it. Either the students didn't really need rescuing and the move was just to make the army look good or the snipers must have a good relationship with the army, given that soldiers evacuated students completely unarmed. The UDD did the right thing in calling off the rally imo.

Do you really believe that the Snipers were from the army??? Why don't you ask any of the terrified RU students if they didn't need any rescuing or the rector of RU.

[Larry001]

Does Suthep think he is the most important person in Thailand. My god what an egotistical maniac. Allow the elected party to run th country. That is what DEMOCRACY means. Really do Sutheps supporters believe he is an honest well meaning person. Supporters of Hitler, Sudam Hussain and many others thought likewise

[smedly]

if the three top military brass tell Yingluk to step down then she has no option but to follow their order, you could call it a coup or just simply the best way forward - I believe it is going to happen very soon

After which reform must take place and it must be 100% solid with lessons learned to stop this BS ever happening again - PTP overstepped and they should never have had the ability to do that, rules laws checks must be put in place - I believe that is what Suthep is aiming for, then let the people vote in a referendum to approve the changes, two changes IMO that they must put in place are - the scraping of immunity from prosecution of members of parliament - and for a two thirds majority requirement for all future Charter and Constitutional amendments in the house

[Emptyset]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

There's a lot more to it. The police couldn't or wouldn't evacuate the students or the protesters, and did you notice how quickly Jutaporn called an end to the rally and sent his people home after the incidents. That just isn't his style.

There's always a lot more to it. Either the students didn't really need rescuing and the move was just to make the army look good or the snipers must have a good relationship with the army, given that soldiers evacuated students completely unarmed. The UDD did the right thing in calling off the rally imo.

Do you really believe that the Snipers were from the army??? Why don't you ask any of the terrified RU students if they didn't need any rescuing or the rector of RU.

No, though I wouldn't make assumptions about the identity of the gunmen yet, but by the time the army got there whoever was shooting must've already gone or the army surely wouldn't go in there unarmed. It was a PR move by the military, and a good one.

[Jasun]

Anyone know the police vs army numbers?

[siampolee]

Certainly an interesting turn of events,it has been noticeable that the military have been prominent in areas where medical services were given to the anti government demonstrators. regarding the links twixt the military and Suthep there may well be some truth in that suggestion.

The scale of this current protest and its duration to date have I would suggest surprised many people in positions of power, politically and military and no doubt the police too.

Those people and their organisations may well now be detecting the scent of ''the wind of change.'' The public have got a voice they have seen a leader emerge from the political arena and it seems as if that leader has the charisma, the charm whatever to actually inspire the peoples support for change. whether or not that change will be as that leader desired aims or not remains to be seen.

To my mind there has been sent a clear clarion call from the people of Thailand that they are totally disenchanted by this current puppet government and its aims in sponsoring a dubious bill to both whitewash and rehabilitate their convicted criminal sponsor puppet master.

The public are well aware of the ultimate aims of this puppet government regarding the establishment of a new political dynasty that truth be known has higher aims than a premiership for life too.

Those emotions have radiated out from the public and would it seems now have emboldened the military to become some what more open regarding their feeling on the current political stage and of course the larger auditorium of the sovereign state of Thailand.

According to the just received S.M.S. ( Nation Breaking News Service 11-09: hrs) it seems as if the Supreme Commander is meeting with the three service chiefs after December 5th. to discuss how best to deal with the current situation here in Thailand.

To me this surely indicates that this current period of protest is not over and it would suggest that possibly behind the scenes teams of advisers will be or already are dealing with those involved in the current protests in what may be best described as a, '' Civil military coup.'' Sometimes painful surgery or what at the time is considered unpleasant medication is the only cure for a problem.

All this current mayhem is down to one creature and his family and their brown nosing acolytes and the pursuit for ultimate power and an insatiable lust for revenge at any price.

As an aside it is also interesting to note that the Jutuporn has like his other Red Shirt leadership partners seem to have vanished into a distant big red sunset, also it is noticeable that the mighty mouth of Thaksin well the public one anyway is also silent, one again wonders why this may be.

Time alone will tell how this current scenario will develop.Let us hope that a new chapter, a cleaner chapter leading to a full volume of honesty is about to be written in the saga of Thai politics.

If that is so those of us who are and have been here for a long while or may have only just arrived but are committed to Thailand with families and employment, business etc will be able to rest assured our children and also ourselves will indeed benefit from a better cleaner political scene with political honesty and civil order.

I stated in a number of earlier posts that this is the ''end game.'' how it ends will be the factor that decides the future of Thailand and its peoples.

Democratic freedom or a dictatorship? Let us earnestly hope the former triumphs over the latter scenario..

[Baerboxer]

Prayuth was pleading with Police and protesters to stop what they were doing? How extraordinary. The Police are trying to defend public property from an unruly mob trying to overthrow a democratically elected government and the Army asks THEM to stop? I would have thought a more logical and appropriate focus would have been pressure on the protesters to stop. It is clear that Suthep has taken comfort from these discussions and comments ( as reflected in his speech/rant last night) and fully intends to inflict his anarchy on the rest of the country.

The speech was very Nuremberg, 1930s. A thug and a fascist.

Unfortunately the current government don't act very democratically, do they? Think - acting illegally, refusing to respect the law, acting above the law, cheating parliamentary procedures, lying, getting caught lying and refusing to tell the truth, refusing to answer questions, refusing to divulge meaningful statistics etc

Interesting comparison of Suthep's speech last night to those made at Nuremberg during the 1930's. Perhaps you can post the link(s) to the particular speech(s) you think are comparable so we can read and judge for ourselves.

[Baerboxer]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

There's a lot more to it. The police couldn't or wouldn't evacuate the students or the protesters, and did you notice how quickly Jutaporn called an end to the rally and sent his people home after the incidents. That just isn't his style.

There's always a lot more to it. Either the students didn't really need rescuing and the move was just to make the army look good or the snipers must have a good relationship with the army, given that soldiers evacuated students completely unarmed. The UDD did the right thing in calling off the rally imo.

From the picture I saw, the sniper was dressed in black and armed with a pistol. No idea how many other snipers, nothing to suggest they were trained snipers with sniper rifles. Just thugs with pistols. Whose side? Who really knows, certainly not TV posters

Armed with a pistol, would you go up against professional soldiers? A religious or total fanatic might, but its almost guaranteed suicide, whether the soldiers were armed with guns or not.

UDD - good that they went home - as to what/who made the decision and for what reasons? Just more vivid speculation. But, really, do you think Jutaporn, based on past behavior made the call out of concern for people's safety ?

sniper t

[Baerboxer]

Anyone know the police vs army numbers?

Why - do you want to telephone them?

If you are asking would the police stand up against the army ......................

[smedly]

very interesting the army stepping in to help the protesters.(medics)..could there be something more in that..i hope so...

There's a lot more to it. The police couldn't or wouldn't evacuate the students or the protesters, and did you notice how quickly Jutaporn called an end to the rally and sent his people home after the incidents. That just isn't his style.

There's always a lot more to it. Either the students didn't really need rescuing and the move was just to make the army look good or the snipers must have a good relationship with the army, given that soldiers evacuated students completely unarmed. The UDD did the right thing in calling off the rally imo.

UDD - good that they went home - as to what/who made the decision and for what reasons? Just more vivid speculation. But, really, do you think Jutaporn, based on past behavior made the call out of concern for people's safety ?

sniper t

I think the reds went home because most of the people in the stadium told the red leaders "I didn't sign up for this" once the killing started