Obama, Cuban President Raul Castro Shake Hands at Nelson Mandela Memorial

[webfact]

Obama, Cuban President Raul Castro Shake Hands at Nelson Mandela Memorial
By ANTHONY CASTELLANO and MARY BRUCE

JOHANNESBURG: -- President Obama shook hands with Cuban President Raul Castro today at a memorial service for the late Nelson Mandela in South Africa.

Obama stopped to shake Castro's hand as he was walking to the podium to pay tribute to Mandela. The handshake between the presidents of the long-estranged Cold War rivals came at a ceremony honoring the life and legacy of the former South African leader at a soccer stadium in Johannesburg.

It's been more than 50 years since the U.S. cut diplomatic ties with Cuba following the Communist revolution led by Castro's brother, Fidel. While there have been glimmers of a thaw in relations in recent years, vast obstacles remain.

Full story: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/obama-cuban-president-raul-castro-shake-hands-nelson/story?id=21158776

-- abcNEWS 2013-12-11

[Spare]

Very civilized.

If Suthep meet Thaksin, I am sure there will be a punch out.

[Chicog]

That's remarkable, because I was convinced he was going to do something like this:

[folium]

Well proxy invasions, embargoes and sanctions have failed to bring any change for Cuba, perhaps it's time for a change of tack.

[Ulysses G.]

I have no love for Obama, but can not blame him for this. It is not the first time that an American president has shaken hands with a tyrant - or a tyrant's brother.

[NeverSure]

Actually there have been a lot of changes in Cuba, although not nearly enough. Like Russia and China, they have come to realize that without some capitalism, they can't survive. They now have a free trade zone and allow entrepreneurs to start businesses - with a license of course.

Their problems include them needing to import about 80% of their food and most of their oil. They export tobacco including their great cigars, sugar, and several other things. They now allow tourism which helps them. They need more manufacturing.

Mostly the people need to be freed from the oppressive communist government. It's amazing how many try to escape to the US via boat. I think it's only about 90 miles.

[folium]

Mostly the people need to be freed from the oppressive communist government. It's amazing how many try to escape to the US via boat. I think it's only about 90 miles.

Most of those changes came about after the collapse of the Soviet Union and its generous subsidized trade deals with Cuba.

Since then Cuba has been kept afloat by trading skilled personnel (which Cuba has in abundance) for oil and cash with Venezuela.

And if the US engaged with Cuba fully, the communist regime would not last long. The sanctions have just allowed the Castros to blame the USA for the problems actually caused by the failings and ineptitude of the Cuban government/regime.

[Chicog]

The Americans are just being vindictive about Fidel. They'll probably loosen up the day after he pops his clogs.

[DocN]

OUTRAGED...am I not one bit!

[Publicus]

Given the setting and the context, and that it was the national memorial service honoring the late Nelson Mandela, Prez Obama did the noble and civilized thing.

Castro was standing at the head of your basic formal diplomatic reception line, with the pres of Brazil next to him, and a couple of other presidents after that leading up to the speaker's podium where Prez Obama was headed.

Besides, I've had to buy cigars from central American and Caribbean countries except Cuba for much too long.

[Jingthing]

The entire Cuban policy of the U.S. has been an ineffective farce, really bad consequences for both Cubans and Americans, and the main reason behind it for decades has been blowhard far right wing Cuban-Americans in one state FLORIDA, who have leveraged their electoral power. NOW even among Cubans in Florida, the majority of them favor normalization. So what is Obama waiting for? Get 'er done.

Edited December 11, 2013 by Jingthing

[NeverSure]

The entire Cuban policy of the U.S. has been an ineffective farce, really bad consequences for both Cubans and Americans, and the main reason behind it for decades has been blowhard far right wing Cuban-Americans in one state FLORIDA, who have leveraged their electoral power. NOW even among Cubans in Florida, the majority of them favor normalization. So what is Obama waiting for? Get 'er done.

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

The people in Cuba are poor and oppressed. Communism has never worked for the masses. Of course you remember the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Cuba is itself an enemy of the US with no help in that regard from the US. It is not to be trusted any more than communist China is, or Communist Russia was. I still don't trust Russia.

Some day, as with ALL communist countries, Cuba will collapse as a system and guess who will help them pick up the pieces, and send aid?

[craigt3365]

I've been to Cuba a few times. The people are treated very poorly. I know there are some changes now, but back then (10 years ago), they couldn't buy and sell property, couldn't travel without approval, had issues with currency, etc. The police were terrible. We gave a guy a boom box when we left. He was almost put in jail because the police said he was too poor to afford this and must have stolen it. Even though we gave him a written letter stating it was a gift.

It was very weird being there.

[Naam]

Mostly the people need to be freed from the oppressive communist government. It's amazing how many try to escape to the US via boat. I think it's only about 90 miles.

Most of those changes came about after the collapse of the Soviet Union and its generous subsidized trade deals with Cuba.

Since then Cuba has been kept afloat by trading skilled personnel (which Cuba has in abundance) for oil and cash with Venezuela.

And if the US engaged with Cuba fully, the communist regime would not last long. The sanctions have just allowed the Castros to blame the USA for the problems actually caused by the failings and ineptitude of the Cuban government/regime.

a U.S. ineptitude was (among others) the "Bay of Pigs" engagement and establishing a camp with the hypocritical and ridiculous motto "honor bound to defend freedom".

[Jingthing]

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

..

But a mass murdering fascist dictatorship ... no problema.

Suggest you watch the great recent film: The Act of Killing

The obvious point is if the U.S. had engaged Castro's Cuba long ago (which I agree has/had many sins) today's Cuba would be very different and most likely in a better place for both Cuba and the U.S.

[JeffreyWitty]

The Americans are just being vindictive about Fidel. They'll probably loosen up the day after he pops his clogs.

You paint with a pretty broad brush.

I'm an American and I don't feel vindictive. In fact, a lot of us could care less. We are much more diverse in our opinions and beliefs than you would make us out to be. Additionally, don't believe the media hype engine - it's much ado about nothing. They hype this story due to a slow news day.

[JeffreyWitty]

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

Wake up and smell the Chinese fortune cookie my friend.

[Lokie]

Was in the right context for the occasion, if something good comes of it down the line, even better,

[Naam]

The Americans are just being vindictive about Fidel. They'll probably loosen up the day after he pops his clogs.

You paint with a pretty broad brush.

I'm an American and I don't feel vindictive. In fact, a lot of us could care less. We are much more diverse in our opinions and beliefs than you would make us out to be. Additionally, don't believe the media hype engine - it's much ado about nothing. They hype this story due to a slow news day.

basically you are right. but when somebody says "the Americans" he is not referring to American citizens but to U.S. governments and their policies. not only interesting but fascinating is how fast these policies can change (e.g. Noriega and Mubarak).

[HerbalEd]

The entire Cuban policy of the U.S. has been an ineffective farce, really bad consequences for both Cubans and Americans, and the main reason behind it for decades has been blowhard far right wing Cuban-Americans in one state FLORIDA, who have leveraged their electoral power. NOW even among Cubans in Florida, the majority of them favor normalization. So what is Obama waiting for? Get 'er done.

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

The people in Cuba are poor and oppressed. Communism has never worked for the masses. Of course you remember the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Cuba is itself an enemy of the US with no help in that regard from the US. It is not to be trusted any more than communist China is, or Communist Russia was. I still don't trust Russia.

Some day, as with ALL communist countries, Cuba will collapse as a system and guess who will help them pick up the pieces, and send aid?

Are you kidding?? The USA and China are big "buds" ... and each other's biggest trading partners.

When Castro won his revolution he went to visit President Eisenhower and was keep waiting all day with hat in hand but Eisenhower refused to see him. Castro wanted to establish good relations with the USA but after his humiliation in D.C. the Russians were very happy to be his friend.

I make no apologies for Castro's oppressive government, but the huge mistake made my the US government was to boycott Cuba. Had they done the opposite and let Cubans and Americans visit each country there's no way that Castro's communist regime could have lasted very long.

And why has this boycott lasted 50 years and yet the USA made friends with Vietnam years ago? Because of the right-wing Cuban expat community in Miami who absolute hate Castro. It's near impossible to win a national election if you show even the slightest favoritism towards the Cuban government.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts deleted.

[NeverSure]

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

Wake up and smell the Chinese fortune cookie my friend.

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

The people in Cuba are poor and oppressed. Communism has never worked for the masses. Of course you remember the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Cuba is itself an enemy of the US with no help in that regard from the US. It is not to be trusted any more than communist China is, or Communist Russia was. I still don't trust Russia.

Some day, as with ALL communist countries, Cuba will collapse as a system and guess who will help them pick up the pieces, and send aid?

Are you kidding?? The USA and China are big "buds" ... and each other's biggest trading partners.

When Castro won his revolution he went to visit President Eisenhower and was keep waiting all day with hat in hand but Eisenhower refused to see him. Castro wanted to establish good relations with the USA but after his humiliation in D.C. the Russians were very happy to be his friend.

I make no apologies for Castro's oppressive government, but the huge mistake made my the US government was to boycott Cuba. Had they done the opposite and let Cubans and Americans visit each country there's no way that Castro's communist regime could have lasted very long.

And why has this boycott lasted 50 years and yet the USA made friends with Vietnam years ago? Because of the right-wing Cuban expat community in Miami who absolute hate Castro. It's near impossible to win a national election if you show even the slightest favoritism towards the Cuban government.

There is a world of difference between being 'buds' and engaging in trade. The US is engaged in a military standoff with China right now for Japan and The Philippines. The US just flew 2 B-52 bombers through a "no fly zone" China had declared just to shove it up their nose.

The US and China are actually enemies who manage somehow to engage in trade. But that trade will wind down and only China will be hurt by that.

[TPI]

The entire Cuban policy of the U.S. has been an ineffective farce, really bad consequences for both Cubans and Americans, and the main reason behind it for decades has been blowhard far right wing Cuban-Americans in one state FLORIDA, who have leveraged their electoral power. NOW even among Cubans in Florida, the majority of them favor normalization. So what is Obama waiting for? Get 'er done.

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

The people in Cuba are poor and oppressed. Communism has never worked for the masses. Of course you remember the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Cuba is itself an enemy of the US with no help in that regard from the US. It is not to be trusted any more than communist China is, or Communist Russia was. I still don't trust Russia.

Some day, as with ALL communist countries, Cuba will collapse as a system and guess who will help them pick up the pieces, and send aid?

"Don't let the stars get in your eyes, don't let the moon break your heart" Isn't that the way the song goes? Mr J IMHO I think you need to have a close look at the world we're living in! Everything changes, the bastion of freedom has immigration checks a 100 miles from the nearest border, China allows a market economy to develop, South America legalises the "dreaded weed"! 59% of Americans say legalise the "dreaded weed" now!

We find out the the arch communist, FDR (to hear modern day GOP pundits), was a regular user of cocaine! You live in a world that doesn't exist any more. Time to change?

[Chicog]

The Americans are just being vindictive about Fidel. They'll probably loosen up the day after he pops his clogs.

You paint with a pretty broad brush.

I'm an American and I don't feel vindictive. In fact, a lot of us could care less. We are much more diverse in our opinions and beliefs than you would make us out to be. Additionally, don't believe the media hype engine - it's much ado about nothing. They hype this story due to a slow news day.

When I talk about "The Americans" in this context, I refer to the rich old farts that own and run the country.

[rotary]

I think they both better check their wrist to make sure they did not steal each others watches

[Credo]

I think they both better check their wrist to make sure they did not steal each others watches

And then the shame of finding out that both watches were made in China.

[harryfrompattaya]

Well proxy invasions, embargoes and sanctions have failed to bring any change for Cuba, perhaps it's time for a change of tack.

Obama is working very hard to make the Unites States like the higher advanced country of Cuban. American and the world is lucky to have Obama as President

[HerbalEd]

I think they both better check their wrist to make sure they did not steal each others watches

I'd be more concerned about slitting than watches.

Edited December 12, 2013 by HerbalEd

[geriatrickid]

The entire Cuban policy of the U.S. has been an ineffective farce, really bad consequences for both Cubans and Americans, and the main reason behind it for decades has been blowhard far right wing Cuban-Americans in one state FLORIDA, who have leveraged their electoral power. NOW even among Cubans in Florida, the majority of them favor normalization. So what is Obama waiting for? Get 'er done.

I can't recall when the US or any other Western country became buds with a communist dictatorship. Oil and water don't mix.

The people in Cuba are poor and oppressed. Communism has never worked for the masses. Of course you remember the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Cuba is itself an enemy of the US with no help in that regard from the US. It is not to be trusted any more than communist China is, or Communist Russia was. I still don't trust Russia.

Some day, as with ALL communist countries, Cuba will collapse as a system and guess who will help them pick up the pieces, and send aid?

"Don't let the stars get in your eyes, don't let the moon break your heart" Isn't that the way the song goes? Mr J IMHO I think you need to have a close look at the world we're living in! Everything changes, the bastion of freedom has immigration checks a 100 miles from the nearest border, China allows a market economy to develop, South America legalises the "dreaded weed"! 59% of Americans say legalise the "dreaded weed" now!

We find out the the arch communist, FDR (to hear modern day GOP pundits), was a regular user of cocaine! You live in a world that doesn't exist any more. Time to change?

For the record, FDR suffered from chronic sinus infections. The standard treatment at the time was for a physician to swab the mucous membrane of the nasal passage with a dilute solution of cocaine. This resulted in vasoconstriction allowing the patient to breathe and for the sinuses to drain. It was a medically acceptable practice.

In respect to Cuba, I would think that those espousing the moral righteousness of the 50's and 60's would have agreed with Castro's throwing out the U.S. Mob, shutting down the rigged casinos, closing the brothels and imposing strict penalties on corruption. In the early days of the revolution, the most active and vocal members were its leaders who had benefited from religious school educations. They had the fervor that only religious zealots can muster. Sure, it went pear shaped over time, but they learnt their moralistic nagging somewhere. It is interesting that Mugabe of Zimbabwe, a Jesuit school product, also shared the same views of gambling, booze and the like, and look at how well Zimbabwe has turned out.

In the meantime, the USA loss is the gain of the EU and Canada. Cuba is the affordable winter playground for Canada and many Europeans, all of whom are delighted to have the place to themselves. Canadian and EU companies have sizeable investments in Cuba and it's to their advantage if the US isn't there.