Thai editorial: The open secret about our reform failures

[webfact]

EDITORIAL
The open secret about our reform failures
The Nation

What reforms will mean for our children
Most politicians don't want reform and can't be relied on to make necessary changes

BANGKOK: -- Some think the question why "reform" has never succeeded in Thailand is the toughest question. It depends on how we look at it, because while "reform" is so hard to implement here, the answer to that question is the simplest. We have never succeeded simply because "reform" often comes from the top down. Most reformist measures we have had have been meant to solve political bickering or put a break on a power play. There has been hardly a reform that truly affected the people.

The 1997 "People’s Constitution" was probably an exception. But then again, politics quickly came into play and the rest is history. Politics does not only inspire "fake" reform, but it also can muddy real changes. Unless this is thoroughly realised by all parties calling for a political change at the moment, Thailand will have another half-hearted reform and go back to Square One in no time.

Caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra has called for "reforms", and so has her arch-enemy Suthep Thaugsuban. Again, politics is at the fore. Again, it will involve deadlines, and fighting over who should do it, plus how, where and when. "People's needs" will be invoked by all, but how much real hope do we have?

Let's take a look at that 1997 charter. It was drafted because of social pressure. There had been a vicious circle of corruption, coups and uprisings. In between this, we had strong state control of the media. There was insufficient mechanism to counter the powers-that-be and enhance public participation in politics.

That very charter sought to foster two key values - strong democratic checks and balances and safeguards against conflicts of interests in the government. A system of assets scrutiny was introduced and backed up by empowerment of the so-called "inde?pendent" organisations like the Constitution Court, the Election Commission and the National Anti- Corruption Commission. For a while, it looked like the new system was working, as a man as influential as the Democrats' secretary-general was given a five-year political ban and many high-profile election candidates were charged with direct or indirect vote-buying.

What happened after that needs not be retold. It should only be said that if "reform" is put in the hands of politicians, they most likely will not try to uphold the values. All they do is find loopholes and excuses, or complain why "values" are twisted and used in a conspiracy against them. On a Nation Channel recently, an academic hit home on the issue of reform. He said Thailand's political strife was not caused by people having different values. Take away the "colours", he said, and we will see that all Thais want the same things. Thais want clean, accountable politics that respects the voices of the people.

It's the "colours" that make Thais think they want different things. The truth is, they only support different men who make them believe they have different needs. What Thais need is simple - clean politics that will keep corrupt politicians and military opportunists at bay and serve the national interest.

The 1997 charter was not written by Parliament, but by a special assembly. Few politicians liked it at first, and, deep down, not many would have liked it now. The Constitution was abolished in the 2006 coup, but before that the spirit of the charter had been all but dead. Even today, we still hear politicians question the wisdom of giving the likes of the Constitutional Court too much power.

Can we have another charter like that? Of course, we can. Will we succeed this time? Very doubtful. The funny thing about reform is that it's what all politicians vow to support but they don't really want it to happen. The evidence of that? The 1997 charter, its pitiful death and our current political mess.


-- The Nation 2013-12-23

[EricBerg]

Big changes do not come from top-down. They come from the basis, the people. Look f.i. at the Arabian spring. The dropping of the amnesty bill happened after broad groups in Thailand opposed it by going to the streets in huge numbers.

Only when many millions of Thais genuinely want change and are prepared to work hard for it, only then it will happen.

[MaiChai]

I am all for a revolution that Suthep hints at, the reality is who is going to have the clout to implement change? If the Yingluck government goes, who takes over and who then makes the decisions? Will there be too many people involved that a consensus cannot be reached and no decisions can be made? The next step must be outlining how its going to work?

[Stone Inscription 1]

In my opinion, you have two groups of middle class Chinese (Sino-Thai) elites fighting for power, wealth and prestige.

The Suthep Chinese group seems to have the backing of traditional elites and Bangkok Chinese, such as doctors, lawyers and educators.

The Yingluck/Thaksin Chinese group has the backing of urban Chinese elites such as doctors, lawyers and educators in urban areas in the north and northeast and some places in central Thailand.

The key difference between the two groups is that the Thai people, rural farmers, support the Yingluck/Thaksin Chinese group.

The Suthep Chinese group cannot stand this, and wants to eliminate the Thai factor from influencing the composition of the government. Hence, he wants to set up a kind of oligarchy or people's assembly in which Thais will not be a factor.

This has nothing to do with democracy, it has everything to do with preserving power, privilege and wealth for the Chinese in Thailand.

This is not to say that the Yingluck/Thaksin group want to do much for the Thai people, but they will distribute medical and farming benefits somewhat. For example, the farmers who could plant 2 or 3 crops a year did very well from the rice scheme. The ones who lost, if they could not get around the rules, were the urban rice brokers, namely Bangkok Chinese and Chinese money lenders. They, obviously, support Suthep.

Read a book 'Political Conflict in Thailand' by David Morell. In it is a chapter about the Peasant's Federation of Thailand which operated in the '70s. This Federation was set up by Thai farmers and was very popular. One of their policies was to eliminate the Chinese middle man from taking most of the profits from their rice crop. Somewhere within a few months of its establishment over 21 peasant leaders in the Chiang Mai area were murdered

Who are the losers in all of this? The Thai people.

Now, there is one group we cannot talk about. However, anyone who wants to know how and why things changed in this area needs to read about the dictator, Sarit, who ran the government in the mid-50s. Analyse one of the key elements in his platform and you will see the dramatic change that Sarit introduced during his rule.

Again, ask yourself why Suthep and his fellow Chinese backers do not want Thai people to have any political influence in Thailand. Why do they want to confine politics to the Chinese (Sino-Thai) elites? The answer to this question will help you understand why Thailand will never have full democracy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarit_Thanarat

'pho yu pho kin'

[Thai at Heart]

In my opinion, you have two groups of middle class Chinese (Sino-Thai) elites fighting for power, wealth and prestige.

The Suthep Chinese group seems to have the backing of traditional elites and Bangkok Chinese, such as doctors, lawyers and educators.

The Yingluck/Thaksin Chinese group has the backing of urban Chinese elites such as doctors, lawyers and educators in urban areas in the north and northeast and some places in central Thailand.

The key difference between the two groups is that the Thai people, rural farmers, support the Yingluck/Thaksin Chinese group.

The Suthep Chinese group cannot stand this, and wants to eliminate the Thai factor from influencing the composition of the government. Hence, he wants to set up a kind of oligarchy or people's assembly in which Thais will not be a factor.

This has nothing to do with democracy, it has everything to do with preserving power, privilege and wealth for the Chinese in Thailand.

This is not to say that the Yingluck/Thaksin group want to do much for the Thai people, but they will distribute medical and farming benefits somewhat. For example, the farmers who could plant 2 or 3 crops a year did very well from the rice scheme. The ones who lost, if they could not get around the rules, were the urban rice brokers, namely Bangkok Chinese and Chinese money lenders. They, obviously, support Suthep.

Read a book 'Political Conflict in Thailand' by David Morell. In it is a chapter about the Peasant's Federation of Thailand which operated in the '70s. This Federation was set up by Thai farmers and was very popular. One of their policies was to eliminate the Chinese middle man from taking most of the profits from their rice crop. Somewhere within a few months of its establishment over 21 peasant leaders in the Chiang Mai area were murdered

Who are the losers in all of this? The Thai people.

Now, there is one group we cannot talk about. However, anyone who wants to know how and why things changed in this area needs to read about the dictator, Sarit, who ran the government in the mid-50s. Analyse one of the key elements in his platform and you will see the dramatic change that Sarit introduced during his rule.

Again, ask yourself why Suthep and his fellow Chinese backers do not want Thai people to have any political influence in Thailand. Why do they want to confine politics to the Chinese (Sino-Thai) elites? The answer to this question will help you understand why Thailand will never have full democracy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarit_Thanarat

'pho yu pho kin'

Yup. All there. People who poopoo this idea as conspiracy, just look at the businesses and history of the backers of both parties and realise that neither is acting altruistically or for the good of the country.

What Thailand is faced with is the lesser of two evils.

[davehowden]

In my opinion, you have two groups of middle class Chinese (Sino-Thai) elites fighting for power, wealth and prestige.

The Suthep Chinese group seems to have the backing of traditional elites and Bangkok Chinese, such as doctors, lawyers and educators.

The Yingluck/Thaksin Chinese group has the backing of urban Chinese elites such as doctors, lawyers and educators in urban areas in the north and northeast and some places in central Thailand.

The key difference between the two groups is that the Thai people, rural farmers, support the Yingluck/Thaksin Chinese group.

The Suthep Chinese group cannot stand this, and wants to eliminate the Thai factor from influencing the composition of the government. Hence, he wants to set up a kind of oligarchy or people's assembly in which Thais will not be a factor.

This has nothing to do with democracy, it has everything to do with preserving power, privilege and wealth for the Chinese in Thailand.

This is not to say that the Yingluck/Thaksin group want to do much for the Thai people, but they will distribute medical and farming benefits somewhat. For example, the farmers who could plant 2 or 3 crops a year did very well from the rice scheme. The ones who lost, if they could not get around the rules, were the urban rice brokers, namely Bangkok Chinese and Chinese money lenders. They, obviously, support Suthep.

Read a book 'Political Conflict in Thailand' by David Morell. In it is a chapter about the Peasant's Federation of Thailand which operated in the '70s. This Federation was set up by Thai farmers and was very popular. One of their policies was to eliminate the Chinese middle man from taking most of the profits from their rice crop. Somewhere within a few months of its establishment over 21 peasant leaders in the Chiang Mai area were murdered

Who are the losers in all of this? The Thai people.

Now, there is one group we cannot talk about. However, anyone who wants to know how and why things changed in this area needs to read about the dictator, Sarit, who ran the government in the mid-50s. Analyse one of the key elements in his platform and you will see the dramatic change that Sarit introduced during his rule.

Again, ask yourself why Suthep and his fellow Chinese backers do not want Thai people to have any political influence in Thailand. Why do they want to confine politics to the Chinese (Sino-Thai) elites? The answer to this question will help you understand why Thailand will never have full democracy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarit_Thanarat

'pho yu pho kin'

Sarip sounds like your typical Thai, or for that matter just a politician I guess:

"After Sarit's death, his reputation took a heavy blow when a bitter inheritance battle between his son, Major Setha Thanarat, and his young wife, Thanpuying Vichitra Thanarat, revealed the massive extent of Sarit's wealth (US$ 140 million).

He was discovered to have owned a trust company, a brewery, 51 cars and some 30 plots of land, most of which he gave to the dozens of mistresses he was found to have had.

Thai language newspapers published the names of 100 women who claimed to have shared his bed, shocking the public when it was learnt how corrupt he had actually been"

Edited December 23, 2013 by davehowden

[Tatsujin]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

[Thai at Heart]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Very very few.

The other thread about the businessmen of the year made me chuckle. Really quite sad. When the wool is finally pulled back it may be quite a shock.

[SaamBaht]

it's not necessarily reform that is needed but enforcement of existing laws

[Tatsujin]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Very very few.

The other thread about the businessmen of the year made me chuckle. Really quite sad. When the wool is finally pulled back it may be quite a shock.

For a country so proud never to have been colonized they seem to have a bit of a blind spot on that score, but at least the "Thai-Chinese" understand "business" a bit better than some "Thai's".

[Spare]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Very very few.

The other thread about the businessmen of the year made me chuckle. Really quite sad. When the wool is finally pulled back it may be quite a shock.

For a country so proud never to have been colonized they seem to have a bit of a blind spot on that score, but at least the "Thai-Chinese" understand "business" a bit better than some "Thai's".

This is from the BBC http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/1514916.stm

"Some 80 years ago, Thailand's King Rama VI called the Chinese the "Jews of the East". Across the region, they have faced much discrimination, often deeply resented for their wealth. In Manila, the community are often targeted by kidnappers."

I think now they are fighting back.

[Pops]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Take my word, most Thais know more then they will ever tell you.

They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public.

You should never forget that and not judge them based on the fact that they do not easily speak out on certain facts.

You would be surprised on how much the average Thai knows and realizes.

Edited December 23, 2013 by Pops

[Tatsujin]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Take my word, most Thais know more then they will ever tell you.

They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public.

You should never forget that and not judge them based on the fact that they do not easily speak out on certain facts.

You would be surprised on how much the average Thai knows and realizes.

Gonna have to completely disagree with you on that one. I'm never surprised now by how LITTLE the average Thai knows. They're just not interested in knowing much outside their own little bubbles.

[noitom]

The Thai people are losing out here for sure. No tickee no shirtee.

[noitom]

Open secret is an oxymoron.

[klauskunkel]

Tell you another secret about reform failures:

political reforms are done by politicians...that's why they fail

[Local Drunk]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Take my word, most Thais know more then they will ever tell you.

They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public.

You should never forget that and not judge them based on the fact that they do not easily speak out on certain facts.

You would be surprised on how much the average Thai knows and realizes.

"They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public."

I agree with that, but who do they fear? In all the thousands of finger pointing pictures posted in the press of alleged common criminal confessions obtained by the police... Have you ever seen one where the defendant has an attorney standing beside him or her advising them what to say?

There are no guarantees of individual rights here because the law isn't respected by those who should be upholding the law, and they are usually the ones who are suppressing it. Any government or leaders vowing reform must first start with the police, because they are the first link to the individual in the long chain of government oppression.

Sorry for the rant Pops...

Cheers, LD

[yellow1red1]

another reason for failure is the lofty goal. to become as advanced as the screwed up West. If the goal is a mud pit, you'll end up in a mud pit. eh

[Ulic]

The problem with reform is it takes money out of all and I mean all politicians pockets. As 70% of Thais

believe corruption is OK as long as it benefits them it will be a long difficult battle to truly reform. What

reform means now is the other side should stop corrupt practises. That way corruption is halved.

My guess is it starts with mandatory ethics classes in grade school that must continue through university.

Not really sure but it has to be a grass roots driven process.

[ppmacready]

I am all for a revolution that Suthep hints at, the reality is who is going to have the clout to implement change? If the Yingluck government goes, who takes over and who then makes the decisions? Will there be too many people involved that a consensus cannot be reached and no decisions can be made? The next step must be outlining how its going to work?

Until you change the education system here, its going to be ground hog day for a long time to come.

The yellow shirts have got what they wished for.

An uneducated people to control.

They just didn't bank on it being a red shirt controlling them.

[rametindallas]

I am all for a revolution that Suthep hints at, the reality is who is going to have the clout to implement change? If the Yingluck government goes, who takes over and who then makes the decisions? Will there be too many people involved that a consensus cannot be reached and no decisions can be made? The next step must be outlining how its going to work?

Until you change the education system here, its going to be ground hog day for a long time to come.

The yellow shirts have got what they wished for.

An uneducated people to control.

They just didn't bank on it being a red shirt controlling them.

When Dr. Thaksin first became PM, one of his platform planks was that he was going to be 'the education PM'. Can you, sir, name any step(s) Dr. Thaksin took, during his six years of unobstructed power, that could illustrate that he cared about reforming the education system in Thailand? I thought not.

On another note, there was no such thing as 'yellow shirts' until the corruption of the original Thaksin regime had become ridiculously apparent. Dr. Thaksin still controls the uneducated and manipulates them with money (through policy corruption) and lies (that he is their benefactor and all those government projects directed at his supporters came from his own pockets). The fact is, their benefactor is the middle class who are the only taxpayers in this country. The 'yellow shirts' never became part of the government so are not in any way responsible for governmental policy on education or anything but ousting Dr. Thaksin; that was their only goal and reason to come together.

Another fact is that there has never been a more divisive figure in Thai history as witnessed by the 'us against them' 'Red Villages' and his ultimate political invention, created from whole cloth, the propaganda spouting UDD. They work sorta like Herr Hitler's Brown Shirts did in the 1930s. Dr. Thaksin is an educated man and he has taken many lessons from history; both distant and recent. Either you are new to Thailand, and ignorant of what's been going on the last fifteen years, or you are incapable of seeing the reality that is the defacto dictatorship of Dr. Thaksin, as proved by the so called blanket amnesty vote when 100% of his puppet government voted in lockstep. So, please educate yourself from all the unbiased resources available on the World Wide Web.

Edited December 23, 2013 by rametindallas

[Stone Inscription 1]

Khun Rametindallas, you could be writing about PAD and the so-called Suthep reformers who want to impose an oligarchy or dictatorship in which Thais have no say in their government. They, too, manipulate their followers through bribes, propanganda and unlawful gatherings and bullying. I cannot think of one positive thing done by PAD or Suthep.

You need to go back and look at Thai history and politics since 1932.

[Thai at Heart]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Take my word, most Thais know more then they will ever tell you.

They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public.

You should never forget that and not judge them based on the fact that they do not easily speak out on certain facts.

You would be surprised on how much the average Thai knows and realizes.

"They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public."

I agree with that, but who do they fear? In all the thousands of finger pointing pictures posted in the press of alleged common criminal confessions obtained by the police... Have you ever seen one where the defendant has an attorney standing beside him or her advising them what to say?

There are no guarantees of individual rights here because the law isn't respected by those who should be upholding the law, and they are usually the ones who are suppressing it. Any government or leaders vowing reform must first start with the police, because they are the first link to the individual in the long chain of government oppression.

Sorry for the rant Pops...

Cheers, LD

I worked for a bunch implicated in seeing off about 40,agricultural activists in the 70s.

They control agriculture completely and will never accept a change to the market that hurts them.1%. Never

[JRSoul]

Khun Rametindallas, you could be writing about PAD and the so-called Suthep reformers who want to impose an oligarchy or dictatorship in which Thais have no say in their government. They, too, manipulate their followers through bribes, propanganda and unlawful gatherings and bullying. I cannot think of one positive thing done by PAD or Suthep.

You need to go back and look at Thai history and politics since 1932.

When were PAD in government, except in red propaganda? Suthep's term as DPM was rather short, with more pressing problems, but the subsidy on school uniforms and texts was a positive step on keeping the poorest Thais' children in school. Its removal simply because it was a democrat policy was nothing short of bastardry.

[rametindallas]

Khun Rametindallas, you could be writing about PAD and the so-called Suthep reformers who want to impose an oligarchy or dictatorship in which Thais have no say in their government. They, too, manipulate their followers through bribes, propaganda and unlawful gatherings and bullying.

I cannot think of one positive thing done by PAD or Suthep.

PAD was useless, a waste of people's time and harmed the country. As for Suthep, other than truly defeating the blanket amnesty by getting Parliament dissolved, neither can I. Once new elections were announced, the protests should have ended and campaigning by all sides commenced. Mr, Suthep is no better at handling the psychological ego boost of political power than Dr. Thaksin. Mr. Suthep has already gone far into undemocratic territory.

You need to go back and look at Thai history and politics since 1932.

I majored in History in university and know Thai history better than most, including changes in social relationships between the classes and ethnic groups. I would rather an imperfect democracy controlled remotely by Dr. Thaksin than what Mr. Suthep is proposing or a government formed by the military.

I still stand by my previous post.

[Pops]

I wonder how many "Thai's" realize that the "Chinese" have colonized them and own the country now?

Take my word, most Thais know more then they will ever tell you.

They also know how dangerous it can be, to just voice your opinion/knowledge in public.

You should never forget that and not judge them based on the fact that they do not easily speak out on certain facts.

You would be surprised on how much the average Thai knows and realizes.

Gonna have to completely disagree with you on that one. I'm never surprised now by how LITTLE the average Thai knows. They're just not interested in knowing much outside their own little bubbles.

The fact, that they are not interested in things you are interested in, does not mean they know little.

They just know different things than you.

Things that they themselves are interested in probably.

They probably know a lot of things that you do not know.

A big difference between the "average Thai" and "the average Foreigner", that I notice a lot is, that the "average Foreigner" seems to publicly voice his/her opinion, after knowing only part of the facts and the "average Thai" seems to rationalize a bit more and not claim to know the facts well enough to publicly give his/her opinion.

Please do not forget that the Thais do not easily speak what's on their mind, and will avoid certain subjects.