Smoke, Smog, Dust 2014 Chiang Mai

[Tywais]

Hi

Is there a chart with last years PM10 data for the period January to May?

You can take a look through last years smoke topic to get a feel for what it was like starting here - http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/611721-smoke-smog-dust-2013-chiang-mai/page-2?p=6123853#entry6123853

Started getting bad around mid February.

[Tywais]

Today's reading. Peaked at 8:00AM and moving down at the moment.

[CNXBKKMAN]

8 km visibility at the airport . Ok at the moment.

[T_Dog]

Today's reading. Peaked at 8:00AM and moving down at the moment.

PM10 March 24 2014.jpg

Yep! After I posted about our poor visibility, the wind from the south came up and things are clearing up nicely!

[jonwilly]

Gents no disrespect to the knowledgeable folk who can download and search out information on how poor/bad the quality of air in CM is, I use what I was born with.

If my nose or my eyes come up negative then it's bad and I suffer.

Last two seasons where not that bad, from what has been said so far this year has been worse and I extend my sympathy to all concerned.

john

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Hi

Is there a chart with last years PM10 data for the period January to May?

Sure.

http://aqnis.pcd.go.th/webfm_send/1851

Relevant parts:

So that's the months on the left in rows: January through May.

First four columns show the PM10 (24 hour averages) :

* Highest value

* Lowest value

* Number of days that were over the 120 ug/m3 limit (also shows number of valid measurements, so '12/31' means 31 measurements with 12 days over the limit)

* Average PM-10

Last four columns show the same, but for PM2.5

Gents no disrespect to the knowledgeable folk who can download and search out information on how poor/bad the quality of air in CM is, I use what I was born with.

If my nose or my eyes come up negative then it's bad and I suffer.

Last two seasons where not that bad, from what has been said so far this year has been worse and I extend my sympathy to all concerned.

Which is fine when the topic is along the lines of 'this sucks' or 'this doesn't quite suck as bad as last year'. But occasionally we also discuss how the problem develops over time, say over 10 years, 20 years. Then it's nice to have numbers coming out of an air quality station as opposed to digging through posts on this forum where you (and others) post 'not that bad' or 'worse than last year' and then try to have a discussion based on that.

That aside, you are right that this year will likely end up with a higher PM10 average for the month of March compared to last year, though possibly not compared to 2012. That's looking exclusively at March though; February was pretty much the clearest on record; ever. End of April you can see how the year compares. (Of course an argument can be made that it's better when it's spread out more: relatively high values throughout Feb and March but few occastions where it goes over 120. This as opposed to a very clear Feb and early March, but then 10-15 horrendous days all together. I think I too prefer the former.)

Edited March 24, 2014 by WinnieTheKhwai

[Waffle]

LET IT RAIN!!

[stuurman]

Hi

Is there a chart with last years PM10 data for the period January to May?

Sure.

http://aqnis.pcd.go.th/webfm_send/1851

Relevant parts:

Untitled.png

So that's the months on the left in rows: January through May.

First four columns show the PM10 (24 hour averages) :

* Highest value

* Lowest value

* Number of days that were over the 120 ug/m3 limit (also shows number of valid measurements, so '12/31' means 31 measurements with 12 days over the limit)

* Average PM-10

Last four columns show the same, but for PM2.5

Great info thanks a a lot. If I understand correct it's mainly March/April that it gets really bad?

I'm now living in Penang Malaysia and consider moving to Chiang Mai next year.

We have our haze as well, normally only June/July/August but it seems to get more and more a year round phenomenon.

[chiang mai]

The sky to the North has just taken on that lovely grey color suggesting that the heavens are about to open up, fingers crossed.

[T_Dog]

The sky to the North has just taken on that lovely grey color suggesting that the heavens are about to open up, fingers crossed.

It rained fairly hard up at Mae Ngat Dam as we were having lunch, but a few miles away it is still as dry as a bone.

[Waffle]

The sky to the North has just taken on that lovely grey color suggesting that the heavens are about to open up, fingers crossed.

It rained fairly hard up at Mae Ngat Dam as we were having lunch, but a few miles away it is still as dry as a bone.

Had a good 1 hour shower out here in Nonghan District also, it was great!

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Great info thanks a a lot. If I understand correct it's mainly March/April that it gets really bad?

Mostly March actually, and late Feb. Last year was a bit of an exception in that it started relatively late and lasted fairly long into April. That's not really typical though, normally it quickly ends in the first week of April or so. (Although, this year started late too.) Anyway, the below gives a good indication of that:

Edited March 24, 2014 by WinnieTheKhwai

[mallymal]

Educated guesses please: do you think the last couple of days rain showers will have put an end to the smoke pollution problem in Chiang Rai this season, or is it likely to creep back up again this side of Songkran?

Trying to work out when will be safe to return with our baby - currently have flights back on 1st April, was considering delaying for 2-3 more weeks, but wonder whether we need to?!

[naboo]

It will creep back, but the days of PM10 at 200+ shouldn't, though after today there is no rain forecast in the coming weeks so nothing can be ruled out.

[chiang mai]

I bet ya they will! One rain storm doesn't mark the end although I wish it did.

[mrmillersr]

Hi

Is there a chart with last years PM10 data for the period January to May?

Sure.

http://aqnis.pcd.go.th/webfm_send/1851

Relevant parts:

Untitled.png

So that's the months on the left in rows: January through May.

First four columns show the PM10 (24 hour averages) :

* Highest value

* Lowest value

* Number of days that were over the 120 ug/m3 limit (also shows number of valid measurements, so '12/31' means 31 measurements with 12 days over the limit)

* Average PM-10

Last four columns show the same, but for PM2.5

Great info thanks a a lot. If I understand correct it's mainly March/April that it gets really bad?

I'm now living in Penang Malaysia and consider moving to Chiang Mai next year.

We have our haze as well, normally only June/July/August but it seems to get more and more a year round phenomenon.

Take another look at the chart. The PM10 levels appear to have been okay for the months of January and February with zero days above the standard of what the Thais use for an acceptable level.. However, what is more revealing is that the more dangerous PM2.5 levels were above Thai acceptable standard levels 6 days in January and 14 days in February. Then in March there were 15 days out of 20 days measurable and in April 15 of 27 days that were measurable above the Thai standards. And again, this is using Thai standards for what is acceptable which is quite higher than what the western world would consider safe. Probably the reason they don't readily show PM2.5 levels, at least I haven't found them.

Bottom line the pollution in Chiang Mai covers a much larger time frame and is more dangerous than most people think. It may be okay for a short visit during parts of the year but definitely not somewhere I would recommend people live year round. For any of you that do, I suggest you do some more research on what the effects of breathing in PM2.5 particles can do to your health. You may think twice about living here as I doubt the situation is going to get any better.

[chiang mai]

Great info thanks a a lot. If I understand correct it's mainly March/April that it gets really bad?

Mostly March actually, and late Feb. Last year was a bit of an exception in that it started relatively late and lasted fairly long into April. That's not really typical though, normally it quickly ends in the first week of April or so. (Although, this year started late too.) Anyway, the below gives a good indication of that:

Air Statistics.jpg

A few points:

With the exception of a couple of years, there has been a downwards trend in the PM10 numbers thus some progress is being made:

My understanding is that the European standard for PM 10 is 50 ppm, not 120:

The last time I checked, PM 2.5 was not being measured anywhere, either in the EU or here, I stand to be corrected on this however.

EDIT: having just checked I see that PM 10 has an acceptable ceiling value of 50 in the US and Europe, beyond that it is rated as hazardous or severe.

Also, I can see no reference to PM2.5 being actively measured in Europe, except "where data becomes available". If that is correct, I suspect most strongly that Thailand is not actively measuring PM2.5 but is instead extrapolating those numbers from the PM10 values which may or may not be accurate..

.

Edited March 24, 2014 by chiang mai

[chiang mai]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_quality_index

[Somtamme]

Chiang Mai, yes you are correct there is a EU limit value for short term mean (24hr) PM10 across all European member states of 50ug/m3 not to be exceeded more than 35 times per calendar year. Clearly, in Thailand it is much higher at 120ug/m3 for any 24hr period. The reason for a more relaxed standard in Thai must be down to the practicalities of actions to reduce the concentration and furthermore, there must be an acceptance of a shorter life expectancy.

You also have to understand that the tools available to manage air quality have come along way from the smogs after the Second World War in Europe, which were primarily caused by widespread burning of coal. Widespread burning of agricultural crops and vegetation in ASEAN countries does seem to strike a similar cord.

But history has taught us that these smogs caused such distress and public outcry, that Govt finally introduced the Clean Air Act as a remedy in the UK. This Act made it an offence for any one to cause dark smoke. This was and still is today measured by the Ringlemann charts (basically a paper chart). It also brought in other provisions not really relevant to a hot country like Thailand (type approval of boilers and chimney height calculations etc.).

However, while I mention things have moved on, we also now have sophisticated methods of assessment and analysers like the European gravimetric reference ones to measure very accurately the fraction of particulate matter down to 10um. However, these instruments are no good for real time analysis, as they are based on the weight of a collected sample over the averaging period (24hr). Other less accurate devices like TEOM are used to collect real time data. The European Commission has also in recent years set a standard for PM2.5 but currently some countries, such as the UK have not as yet transposed this standard (25ugm3 as an annual mean). Whilst PM2.5 is thought to give a stronger association with observed ill-health effects (eg WHO and COMEAP) it should not be forgotten that around two-thirds of the PM10 fraction will typically comprise PM2.5.

Because, PM2.5 is not as yet prescribed into regulation in the UK, there are only designated areas where PM10 has been declared to warrant 'local air quality management areas' and requiring action by these authorities in pursuit of these objectives. I enclose maps showing where these areas are currently designated. You will need to select PM10 then choose 'show AQMA for PM10'.

http://naei.defra.gov.uk/data/gis-mapping

In UK by placing the responsibility on local authorities to find these areas and come up with actions to mitigate, it also imbeds a system of local controls for development and building projects. This system in the UK is recognised as very good in finding the local hot spots requiring actions and is something others could look to copy.

[T_Dog]

One could infer from this cable from a few years back that they are measuring PM 2.5.

https://www.wikileaks.org/plusd/cables/09CHIANGMAI38_a.html

[WinnieTheKhwai]

^ Right, and it is now showing up in the reports. Just not all stations have the capability it seems, or they're not confident about accuracy. But it's encouraging to see it included now, even if only in the non-real time data.

I actually don't even know what the local standard is for PM2.5. I can search for it later.

As an aside, the EU standard is 50 (daily average), however that's only part of it; it's not the case that values should never be higher (because they are, and often too for many parts of the EU). The standard is "No more than 35 permitted exceedences of 50 ug/m3 (24 average) per year.". So they could have values of 200 for a week and not break the standard. The USA EPA standard is currently 150 (1 permitted exceedence per year).

And then secondly, it's considerably easier to comply with a strict standard if you have a jet stream of Atlantic air blowing over you all the time, such as in Scotland (and most of North-Western Europe). Most of the world doesn't have that luxury and it's unrealistic to expect that for the region.

Scotland; sitting pretty.

Edited March 25, 2014 by WinnieTheKhwai

[Somtamme]

Winnie, yes you're correct in a way. Because PM10 and especially PM2.5 it is thought there is no real safe limit (see COMEAP) what has to be chosen is a dose limit, which follows a principle of as low as reasonably practicable (ALARP).

For example, in Scotland the health authorities have chosen a tighter standard for PM10 (50ug/m3) but not to be exceeded more than 7 times per calendar year over a 24hr mean. There is also a running annual mean for PM10 (40ugm3) applicable to all European countries (but this does not tend to get breached). It is interesting to see the US also sets a single 24hr objective.

So, you'll see what is important to understand is not necessarily the maximum concentration at any one time, but the dose people are exposed to and critically the associated costs this brings with it.

[keo]

Chiang Mai officials' attempt at reducing the effect of the smoke.

http://www.cm108.com/bbb/index.php/topic/2001-กิจกรรมเพิ่มความชุ่มชื้นลดผ/

They're obviously not familiar with the concept of preventitive action, and solving a problem at it's root cause. Instead they opt for this kind of ridiculous publicity stunt that will do nothing to help fix the annual problem of air pollution in Chiang Mai.

If this is all they've got, it's going to be a long time before we see this problem being stamped out.

Amazing Thailand.

[Tywais]

The latest from aqmthai.com. Looks like the system was broken for two periods as there is a straight line slope from morning March 22nd to morning march 23rd and another one at 1:00PM the 24th to the morning of the 25th. Find it highly unlikely that there would be a linear change like that.

City Hall shows at 12:00 a PM10 of 122.93

[CNXBKKMAN]

Chiang Mai officials' attempt at reducing the effect of the smoke.

http://www.cm108.com/bbb/index.php/topic/2001-กิจกรรมเพิ่มความชุ่มชื้นลดผ/

They're obviously not familiar with the concept of preventitive action, and solving a problem at it's root cause. Instead they opt for this kind of ridiculous publicity stunt that will do nothing to help fix the annual problem of air pollution in Chiang Mai.

If this is all they've got, it's going to be a long time before we see this problem being stamped out.

Amazing Thailand.

Bizarrely this demonstration may have come up with a way to tackle the smoke and many of the countries problems. The politicians are taken up in the platform to maximum extension and then thrown off. This will have to be repeated many times. More effective and useful people could then take over their duties and leading to a more prosperous Thailand.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

The latest from aqmthai.com. Looks like the system was broken for two periods as there is a straight line slope from morning March 22nd to morning march 23rd and another one at 1:00PM the 24th to the morning of the 25th. Find it highly unlikely that there would be a linear change like that.

City Hall shows at 12:00 a PM10 of 122.93

Capture.JPG

It's been out of whack since the storm and power cuts.

They'll end up removing these values, but you still get a straight line in the graph when there are no values.

The daily averages for the City Hall station still shows data, but that's with a delay of course.

For example, in Scotland the health authorities have chosen a tighter standard for PM10 (50ug/m3) but not to be exceeded more than 7 times per calendar year over a 24hr mean. There is also a running annual mean for PM10 (40ugm3) applicable to all European countries (but this does not tend to get breached). brings with it.

Right; even Chiang Mai yearly average is around that figure. (Low 40's for the yearly average). That doesn't tell the full story of course because it's great during the whole of the rainy season with a big peak around late Feb, March and early April.

[T_Dog]

Just got back from a bike ride south of the Pai road, HWY-1095 and found the trails only about half burned. It seems the further north you go from Chiang Mai, the more severe the burning is.

[rendos]

How are we to know that the AQI reading is correct, if there are one or two readings that are not present, especialy PM10.

[Choonpon]

Really hope the perpetrators will be caught and brought to justice asap. There's a chinese saying 'kill one to warn the rest'.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Choonpon

[CNXBKKMAN]

Really hope the perpetrators will be caught and brought to justice asap. There's a chinese saying 'kill one to warn the rest'.

I doubt they will catch anyone because they are not looking. The burning is thing they do around here every year. The air quality is tolerated and seen as normal for this time of year. All you can do is go somewhere else for a month or accept it. That's it, the whole story. Three lines nothing more.