Are you an Atheist/Believer?

[notmyself]

I doubt that you would accept responsibility, as an atheist, for all Stalin's crimes, or those of Mao, against the respective religions in their countries.

As soon as someone mentions Stalin, Mao or Hitler I know full well that they have no idea what they are talking about.

[anon8]

Can you really "respect" other people's religion? Or would it be more accurate to say you acknowledge their religion and you don't care as long as they don't bug you about it?

I can respect it. But please, just like masturbation, it would be polite to practice it in privacy of your home.

[Mossfinn]

Without committing to answering the question, because why should the question bother you , if no one is bothering you with the question.

However I refer to Pascals wager, from memory and only in part in regard to the wager that is:

If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing.

However if you don't believe and there is a God, you gain nothing ( Mossy' addendum to the wager )

[Mossfinn]

I doubt that you would accept responsibility, as an atheist, for all Stalin's crimes, or those of Mao, against the respective religions in their countries.

As soon as someone mentions Stalin, Mao or Hitler I know full well that they have no idea what they are talking about.

Godwin's Law!

[Mossfinn]

Most misery and suffering in the world is caused by one religion or another.

Wow.

Now that is a statement and a half

[anon8]

I wonder of those that don't believe in God, when you are child/loved one is diagnosed with cancer and the doctors say there is nothing that they can do, would you then pray to God?

I would seek another doctor immediately.

There are many uncurable illnesses. That is part of life. Praying to imaginary man in the sky, or sacrificing a sheep is something that educated, sane person does not do.

It is understandable that people pray to their gods in remote tribal areas in Africa. There are no schools, people have no educAtion in these parts of the world, so it is understandable people there belive in supernatural.

[Long tang]

What has this got to do with Thailand?

[Mossfinn]

Belief has a part to play in Thailand, also some threads are allowed to continue because of a certain stake individuals from around the World have in Thailand.

Maybe, no Mods have come across it yet, if you feel strongly, report it........ if you don't, there are a million other threads

[stiggy]

Atheist total.

Based on experience so far, working as a medic, plus dying and being resuscitated myself.

Faith is good and helpful for some people and I'm happy for them, the godly types I worked with after the tsunami also pushed me towards non belief.

A good act is a good act, you do not need a set of religious rules to justify behaviour.It's simple,be good and kind when you can and accept others for what or who they are.

My biggest irk with religious types,is how they cannot accept my own views on non existence of any divine being or entity.yet it's offensive if you won't accept there's.

[anon8]

Admiring somebody is not faith. Faith is blind belief in supernatural.

Or otherwise. Personally, I have blind faith in all this electron stuff. I've never seen one, but blokes tell me they have, and the light bulbs light up, the sun rises, and the little birds cheep. If I'd gone to a good madrassa, no doubt I could have related all those things to God.

I have complete faith that things unless otherwise supported will fall downwards. Many people believed that before Newton, and not many more, after him.

Anyway, believe what you want.

Quote whom you want, though your own views may be more convincing.

But if you want to avoid conflict, I suggest that you avoid rubbishing the views of others

SC

The 'electron stuff' is plain physics, there is a simple scentific explanation why the lights turn on, after you clicked the switch. No faith required.

Isaac Newton discovered law of gravity, gravity never had anything to do with faith, or beliefs.

You don't like people quoting Christopher Hitchens, you say my thoughts would be more convincing to you. But Hitchens was brilliant man, with mind razor sharp, I could never in 1000 years argue or debate anywhere near his level.

Hitchens is admired and often quoted, and I quoted part of his book title 'Religion poisons everything', because it is very difficult to describing religion more accurately in 3 words.

You posted earlier that to admire and respect a man like Hitchens is like faith, no, it isnt.

Physicists around the world respect and admire Alfred Einstein. That is not faith. That is recognizing a genious.

I haven't 'rubbished' views of others.

[David48]

What has this got to do with Thailand?

You're not a believer, are you?

.

[tw25rw]

I'd waver between 6 and 7. I can respect people's religion, or at least the right to adhere to one, as long as they respect my right not to.

Can you really "respect" other people's religion? Or would it be more accurate to say you acknowledge their religion and you don't care as long as they don't bug you about it?

More the latter. I respect their right to believe what they like and don't bother trying to convince them they are wrong, even if I do think it's non-sense. Unless they try to convince me first of course.

[tw25rw]

I wonder of those that don't believe in God, when you are child/loved one is diagnosed with cancer and the doctors say there is nothing that they can do, would you then pray to God?

My Dad had cancer. And though I didn't want him to die, dreaded it in fact, it never occurred to me for a second to pray or make any kind of offerings.

And much as I like the idea of being reunited with dead family after my own death, I don't believe in it. I'm entirely comfortable with the fact that their life came and went and one day it will be my turn to go, continuing to exist only in the form of decaying organic matter.

[notmyself]

I'd waver between 6 and 7. I can respect people's religion, or at least the right to adhere to one, as long as they respect my right not to.

Can you really "respect" other people's religion? Or would it be more accurate to say you acknowledge their religion and you don't care as long as they don't bug you about it?

More the latter. I respect their right to believe what they like and don't bother trying to convince them they are wrong, even if I do think it's non-sense. Unless they try to convince me first of course.

What about if 'they' try to convince others and in particular the clay like mind of a child? Do you also not bother?

[anon8]

Without committing to answering the question, because why should the question bother you , if no one is bothering you with the question.

However I refer to Pascals wager, from memory and only in part in regard to the wager that is:

If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing.

However if you don't believe and there is a God, you gain nothing ( Mossy' addendum to the wager )

That is debatable.

People who believe in afterlife, may not live their lives to the fullest. They believe they have all the time in the world in heaven, they believe there is a 2nd chance.

But there is zero evidence that there is anything waiting for us, after we die. All we ever gonna have is this short trip, and we should have as much fun as possible, enjoy every pleasure right now, and to the max.

So maybe it would be wiser to not to have religious beliefs, and live our lives to the fullest now, live every day. It is very likely that this is it, this life the only chance we have, there is no redoing it, no 2nd act.

Last point, and Im quoteing your post:

" If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing"

There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.

Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

[notmyself]

Without committing to answering the question, because why should the question bother you , if no one is bothering you with the question.

However I refer to Pascals wager, from memory and only in part in regard to the wager that is:

If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing.

However if you don't believe and there is a God, you gain nothing ( Mossy' addendum to the wager )

That is debatable.

People who believe in afterlife, may not live their lives to the fullest. They believe they have all the time in the world in heaven, they believe there is a 2nd chance.

But there is zero evidence that there is anything waiting for us, after we die. All we ever gonna have is this short trip, and we should have as much fun as possible, enjoy every pleasure right now, and to the max.

So maybe it would be wiser to not to have religious beliefs, and live our lives to the fullest now, live every day. It is very likely that this is it, this life the only chance we have, there is no redoing it, no 2nd act.

Last point, and Im quoteing your post:

" If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing"

There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.

Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

I think M'finn was throwing in Pascal's wager for a laugh.

Making oneself believe is part of the problem rather than a solution to it. Messrs Moss & Finn know full well that this argument has been thoroughly demolished and a prime example is which god? 1000s to choose from.

[David48]

All this talk of God

Credit

What about the concept of a Goddess?

.

[Mossfinn]

Without committing to answering the question, because why should the question bother you , if no one is bothering you with the question.

However I refer to Pascals wager, from memory and only in part in regard to the wager that is:

If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing.

However if you don't believe and there is a God, you gain nothing ( Mossy' addendum to the wager )

That is debatable.

People who believe in afterlife, may not live their lives to the fullest. They believe they have all the time in the world in heaven, they believe there is a 2nd chance.

But there is zero evidence that there is anything waiting for us, after we die. All we ever gonna have is this short trip, and we should have as much fun as possible, enjoy every pleasure right now, and to the max.

So maybe it would be wiser to not to have religious beliefs, and live our lives to the fullest now, live every day. It is very likely that this is it, this life the only chance we have, there is no redoing it, no 2nd act.

Last point, and Im quoteing your post:

" If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing"

There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.

Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.

Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

I am wondering where religion fits in here. And if someone states because one is Palestinian and the others Israeli, I will be amazed, it smacks with the other codswallop that all wars are created because of religion, come on. I expect better.

[Mossfinn]

Without committing to answering the question, because why should the question bother you , if no one is bothering you with the question.

However I refer to Pascals wager, from memory and only in part in regard to the wager that is:

If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing.

However if you don't believe and there is a God, you gain nothing ( Mossy' addendum to the wager )

That is debatable.

People who believe in afterlife, may not live their lives to the fullest. They believe they have all the time in the world in heaven, they believe there is a 2nd chance.

But there is zero evidence that there is anything waiting for us, after we die. All we ever gonna have is this short trip, and we should have as much fun as possible, enjoy every pleasure right now, and to the max.

So maybe it would be wiser to not to have religious beliefs, and live our lives to the fullest now, live every day. It is very likely that this is it, this life the only chance we have, there is no redoing it, no 2nd act.

Last point, and Im quoteing your post:

" If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing"

There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.

Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

I think M'finn was throwing in Pascal's wager for a laugh.

Making oneself believe is part of the problem rather than a solution to it. Messrs Moss & Finn know full well that this argument has been thoroughly demolished and a prime example is which god? 1000s to choose from.

@ notmyself, how has my statement been demolished? I have simply stated, if there is a God you win, if there isn't, you lose nothing, pray tell how that is demolished? If you choose from whichever gallery you wish, if he/she is there you win, if not, nothing to lose.

[notmyself]

All this talk of God

Credit

What about the concept of a Goddess?

.

The title of the topic is 'Are you an Atheist/Believer?' and does not stipulate the Christian god AKA God (note the capitalization of god) and therefore the term is non gender specific.

However.... You shall have no other gods before me is the second commandment so noting the 'no other gods' would suggest other gods.

[tw25rw]

I'd waver between 6 and 7. I can respect people's religion, or at least the right to adhere to one, as long as they respect my right not to.

Can you really "respect" other people's religion? Or would it be more accurate to say you acknowledge their religion and you don't care as long as they don't bug you about it?

More the latter. I respect their right to believe what they like and don't bother trying to convince them they are wrong, even if I do think it's non-sense. Unless they try to convince me first of course.

What about if 'they' try to convince others and in particular the clay like mind of a child? Do you also not bother?

I do find it offensive and would be perfectly happy to cast the seeds of doubt early into the developing mind, basically what my brother did to me when I was about 5 and started asking questions. Never had the opportunity to do it though. I often engage online preachers in the forums I participate in. Quite enjoy watching them wriggle like a fish.

[tw25rw]

All this talk of God

Credit

What about the concept of a Goddess?

.

Wearing too much to be the kind of goddess I would worship.

[anon8]

Without committing to answering the question, because why should the question bother you , if no one is bothering you with the question. However I refer to Pascals wager, from memory and only in part in regard to the wager that is: If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing. However if you don't believe and there is a God, you gain nothing ( Mossy' addendum to the wager )

That is debatable.People who believe in afterlife, may not live their lives to the fullest. They believe they have all the time in the world in heaven, they believe there is a 2nd chance.But there is zero evidence that there is anything waiting for us, after we die. All we ever gonna have is this short trip, and we should have as much fun as possible, enjoy every pleasure right now, and to the max.So maybe it would be wiser to not to have religious beliefs, and live our lives to the fullest now, live every day. It is very likely that this is it, this life the only chance we have, there is no redoing it, no 2nd act.Last point, and Im quoteing your post:" If you believe, and their is a God, you win, if you don't believe and there is no God, you lose nothing"There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

There was this man, he believed in God, one day this man put on a suicide murder belt with explosives, he entered a pizza place in Tel Aviv, and he killed innocent civilians, kids.Religion often is not just a harmless hobby.

I am wondering where religion fits in here. And if someone states because one is Palestinian and the others Israeli, I will be amazed, it smacks with the other codswallop that all wars are created because of religion, come on. I expect better.

Religion fits in here perfectly. The Muslim man was assured by Imaam in a mosque that there are 17, maybe 70, virgins waiting for him in heaven, if he dies as a marter.That is a religeous belief. Do you now see how it fits here?Who here has claimed all wars are caused by religion? If the last line in your post was directed to me, I ask you not to twist my post.

[David48]

All this talk of God

Credit

What about the concept of a Goddess?

.

Wearing too much to be the kind of goddess I would worship.

We still are in the 'Family Friendly' part of Thai Visa ...

Hence the choice ... but I know what you mean!

[notmyself]

@ notmyself, how has my statement been demolished? I have simply stated, if there is a God you win, if there isn't, you lose nothing, pray tell how that is demolished? If you choose from whichever gallery you wish, if he/she is there you win, if not, nothing to lose.

Granted if one considers wasting one's life on a folly to be nothing.

I'll free paraphrase now as it is late... It is considered quite reasonable for people to go to the dying and ask if they wish to repent and take the hand of Jesus. Should someone go to the dying and say they have only a short time to live, why not give the last of it to not being a slave, that would would be considered distasteful. Why is that?

Pascal's wager's biggest claim to drain is that it only works on those who are serfs and those who wish to be so. Had you gone into Pascal's ponce's you will hear of him speak about those who cannot be made to believe. If it were not for people not wanting to be slaves then we would still have them.

[anon8]

@ notmyself, how has my statement been demolished? I have simply stated, if there is a God you win, if there isn't, you lose nothing, pray tell how that is demolished? If you choose from whichever gallery you wish, if he/she is there you win, if not, nothing to lose.

You say "if there is a god, you win, if there isn't, you lose nothing"

Tell this to parents of murdered Palestian kid, to mom of murdered Isrealy kid!

In 17th century, men like me were burned alive by Catholics, I doubt that it was fun for the people who were burned alive.

Your quote is simply wrong.

The author of the quote you posted, sees religion as a harmless, fun game. It is anything but.

When it comes to religeon, we all lose. Big time.

[notmyself]

When it comes to religeon, we all lose. Big time.

Whilst I may well agree with you, you haven't established it as being a fact.

[Mossfinn]

Religion fits in here perfectly.

The Muslim man was assured by Imaam in a mosque that there are 17, maybe 70, virgins waiting for him in heaven, if he dies as a marter.

That is a religeous belief.

Do you now see how it fits here?

Who here has claimed all wars are caused by religion? If the last line in your post was directed to me, I ask you not to twist my post.

And he has done it for no other reason except he will be received into Heaven by 17, or maybe 70 or maybe even 12 & 20 Magpies, not for any other belief of self sacrifice, but because an Imam said so? So no, I do not see how it fits, unless you link to a specific incident, even then it doesn't really fit in the overall scheme of things. The Law of Karma fits better, me thinks.

[Mossfinn]

@ notmyself, how has my statement been demolished? I have simply stated, if there is a God you win, if there isn't, you lose nothing, pray tell how that is demolished? If you choose from whichever gallery you wish, if he/she is there you win, if not, nothing to lose.

Granted if one considers wasting one's life on a folly to be nothing.

I'll free paraphrase now as it is late... It is considered quite reasonable for people to go to the dying and ask if they wish to repent and take the hand of Jesus. Should someone go to the dying and say they have only a short time to live, why not give the last of it to not being a slave, that would would be considered distasteful. Why is that?

Pascal's wager's biggest claim to drain is that it only works on those who are serfs and those who wish to be so. Had you gone into Pascal's ponce's you will hear of him speak about those who cannot be made to believe. If it were not for people not wanting to be slaves then we would still have them.

A matter of choice to be believe in one's folly, I suggest it is not yours to presume on others, nor is it mine.

I see no problem with going to the dying and asking if they wish the Last Rites, everybody has the right to repent, even with their last breath, I do not buy into the accolade of serf because of it, I personally feel you do not understand, as I do not understand your belief, but hey, isn't that what make's the World go round, or flat, whatever the case may be.

As for the last paragraph, we still do, even euphemistacally speaking.

[notmyself]

The Law of Karma fits better, me thinks.

lol I think you are taking the Mick.