Mentally ill Briton accused of claiming to be Prophet Mohammad sentenced to death: Pakistan

[F430murci]

Very sad and demonstrates the intollerance of religion and how backwards some states are.

Yes, we need a few more anti-religion states like North Korea, the former Soviet Union, China under Mao or Albania. Things went swimmingly for the common man in those places and feeding your uncle to hungry dogs is so much more progressive than what these religious people do.

Texas has executed an average of 15 people per year for at least the past 5 or 6 years. Since 1976 Texans have killed 509 people by execution and have already executed one person in 2014. Some of those people were quite nasty. Some of them were innocent and poor. I doubt many of them came from wealthy, powerful families.

I agree murder by government is barbaric no matter who does it, but the ease with which some people immediately rush to judgment regarding some religions or non-western countries is a bit convenient and invites comparisons. For example, what crime was committed to warrant the execution of several hundred thousand Iraqis by countries proclaiming themselves to be following Judeo-Christian principles? Sadaam Hussein may indeed have earned his hanging, but what about all the others who died ... the supposed "acceptable" collateral damage?

Condemning "legal" murder is fine, but it should be condemned universally, not just when it's being done by people who we enjoy criticizing or those we feel are somehow innately less worthy than ourselves.

Difference in:

Capital punishment for those who torture or rape and then kill their victims or who have committed multiple murders with other aggravating circumstances . . .

and

Capital punishment for someone saying something that is anti-Muslim or stoning a woman to death because she was an innocent victim of rape or rejected some loser Muslim that felt vengeful.

That wonderful culture that condones acid attacks, mercy killings and stoning women out of jealousy does not even punish those that committed the horrific acts of torture and murder of the innocent.

RE: Religion as an Excuse

Sorry to say, this is not so much about religion as it is about whack jobs with screws lose that are savage brutal people standing behind religion so they can brutally and savagely kill others with impunity.

Edited January 25, 2014 by F430murci

[scotinsiam]

All,

I am not seeing much sympath here. We are talking about someone who is mentally ill being murdered because of something he said.

lets put it into some perspective please.

[Steely Dan]

Does claiming to be someone who was arguably mentally ill automatically render the claimant likewise mentally ill? And does sentencing said person to death render those who imposed the sentence also mentally ill?

[GentlemanJim]

All,

I am not seeing much sympath here. We are talking about someone who is mentally ill being murdered because of something he said.

lets put it into some perspective please.

Much as I would normally tend to agree with your sentiments there is simply nothing you, I, anyone here or the British Government can do. The guy is a Muslim, he may or may not be Mentally ill, it is a common defence lawyers tactic, he could of course be the reincarnation of the prophet Mohammed! The fact is that the people of the same religion he is have decided to execute him for impersonating their main man. Yes it stinks, but as someone has already stated here, so does the execution of women for committing the crime of being raped!

Frankly if all these religious zealots (of whatever flavour!) could whip themselves up into a frenzy of activity, so zealous it would create a whirling black hole and swallow them all up, it could not come a day to soon. Religion was needed by the simple person to explain everything and was used by the evil person to take control of everything. In order to control everything, hellfire and brimstone await as a punishment for the departed and earthly punishment and execution waits to expedite them on their journey there. IF this guy is mentally ill, then his relatives in the UK did him no favours in allowing him to travel to Pakistan where sharia law is the entertainment of the day. He will be executed by his own people, of his own religion for doing something that to any sane person is nothing, but to 'his' fellow Muslims is worse than murder. And, in the off chance that he is the reincarnation of Prophet Mohammed, he will be able to report back in person to God fairly soon to appraise him of what a <deleted> up they both made of it.

I keep praying for the 'rapture' to come, because apparently when the rapture comes all of Gods chosen people are going to be whisked away to paradise and the non believers will be left here. Well rapture, please come, because if you whisked off all of Gods chosen people and the religious whack jobs, the Earth would then be paradise enough for me.

[Mario2008]

2 racist post removed.

[BigC]

If Britton has an ounce of care for its citizens which they don't then they have the power to over turn this sentence

Plenty of Pakistani people in England if we treated them in the same way maybe they would worry

[BigC]

This just proves yet again how seriously demented the people in these countries are! They really do live still in the stone age!

I can't believe that this religion is allowed to be practiced in the west

Surely the amount of lives it has claimed now the government of a so called allay has announce the murder of a British citizen wonder if England shall intervene as if one was sentenced to death for sending letters and was mentally ill in England then that would be murder

[Chicog]

If Britton has an ounce of care for its citizens which they don't then they have the power to over turn this sentence

And how does that work then?

As far as I know, we gave Pakistan independence in 1947.

[BigC]

If Britton has an ounce of care for its citizens which they don't then they have the power to over turn this sentence

And how does that work then?

As far as I know, we gave Pakistan independence in 1947.

All countries that are part of the english common wealth England still has a voice

We have visas and passports I loads of their citizens even rescued that girl from swat valley

I think they owe us a few favours like please don't murder our citizen in cold blood.

Typical England saved their citizens from the Taliban Pakistan kills ours for writing some letters

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[sirineou]

settle down guys

No one said that this person was executed, only that he was sentenced to death

I am sure the British government is just a aware of these news as you all are and is taking steps to mitigate the situation

But be assured that the well being of the commonwealth is much more important than the fate of one idiot.

[F430murci]

settle down guys

No one said that this person was executed, only that he was sentenced to death

I am sure the British government is just a aware of these news as you all are and is taking steps to mitigate the situation

But be assured that the well being of the commonwealth is much more important than the fate of one idiot.

Unless you are that idiot or his family member.

If roles were reversed they would be marching in the streets, burning flags, burning embassies and shooting Americans or diplomats on sight.

Edited January 25, 2014 by F430murci

[kurnell]

Actually he can't be the Prophet Mohammed because I am.

Is that the correct spelling or are there 2?

[sirineou]

settle down guys

No one said that this person was executed, only that he was sentenced to death

I am sure the British government is just a aware of these news as you all are and is taking steps to mitigate the situation

But be assured that the well being of the commonwealth is much more important than the fate of one idiot.

Unless you are that idiot or his family member.

If roles were reversed they would be marching in the streets, burning flags, burning embassies and shooting Americans or diplomats on sight.

Yea I am sure all that is true. I am sure his family is concerned as well they should.

And I am sure the natives would be acting badly if the situation was reversed, But that's what makes as different from them, or do you want to be the same?

[Traveller45]

Watch me, I am Napoleon Bonaparte. Why did he write letters to "some officials" ? What officials? What was in those letters? And why is it "in reality a property dispute"?

[simple1]

First of all it is estimated 40,000 Pakistanis have died in the fight against Islamic extremism in Pakistan, perhaps some should take this into consideration before making sweeping generalised bigoted statements against Pakistanis. In addition senior Pakistani political moderates have been assassinated for speaking out against the blasphemy laws.

Some of these cases are driven by personal disputes, as an example from the URL below:

Following his release from hospital in Scotland it is believed he stopped taking his medication and travelled to Pakistan where he had a number of properties. There, it is claimed he entered into an eviction dispute with a local man.

After returning from a pilgrimage to Mecca, he was arrested when the man handed in letters he had discovered written to a lawyer and a politician claiming to be a prophet. His lawyer, who is now under guard after receiving threats for defending the Briton and who asked not to be named, said the letters had never been intended for distribution.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/death-sentence-for-british-pensioner-accused-of-blasphemy-in-pakistan-9083235.html

[Benmart]

Very sad and demonstrates the intollerance of religion and how backwards some states are.

I believe most religions proclaim religious tolerance in their teachings. It is man and his interpretations that are intolerant. States are products of man and their corruption is a by-product of those institutions.

Just my 2-Satangs Worth

[kingstonkid]

If Britton has an ounce of care for its citizens which they don't then they have the power to over turn this sentence

Plenty of Pakistani people in England if we treated them in the same way maybe they would worry

Read the article again he is a pakistani with a british passport.

The easiest thing in the world to get if you are Pakistani is a British passport.

He or the people around him knew what would happen if he was allowed to talk outside and tell others. If he was mentally ill then that should have been dealt with earlier.

While killing the guy may be extreme I laud the dedication that these countries have to their religions. pakistan and others have the belief that if you come t our country tolive youmust abide by our laws and customs.

Imagine. a country where you do not submit it to your values and language but accept that there is a reason that you are moving to this country and accept their laws.

Culd you image if England or the US said hey we doenot care what it was like in your country. You came to us for a better life therefore part of that is that you will abide by our laws and customs.

Therefore

NO SHARIA LAW IN OUR COUNTRY.

IF YOU JOIN OUR MILITARY YOU WILL ABIDE BY THE RULES SET DOWN (NO TURBANS ON THE GRENADE RANGE)

NO FORCED MARRIAGES

NI KILLING OR BEATING YOUR DAUGHTER BECAUSE SHE LIKES THE SCHOOL FOOTBALL HERO OR HE LOOKS AT HER AND SMILES AND SHESMILES BACK

[BigC]

If Britton has an ounce of care for its citizens which they don't then they have the power to over turn this sentence

Plenty of Pakistani people in England if we treated them in the same way maybe they would worry

Read the article again he is a pakistani with a british passport.

The easiest thing in the world to get if you are Pakistani is a British passport.

He or the people around him knew what would happen if he was allowed to talk outside and tell others. If he was mentally ill then that should have been dealt with earlier.

While killing the guy may be extreme I laud the dedication that these countries have to their religions. pakistan and others have the belief that if you come t our country tolive youmust abide by our laws and customs.

Imagine. a country where you do not submit it to your values and language but accept that there is a reason that you are moving to this country and accept their laws.

Culd you image if England or the US said hey we doenot care what it was like in your country. You came to us for a better life therefore part of that is that you will abide by our laws and customs.

Therefore

NO SHARIA LAW IN OUR COUNTRY.

IF YOU JOIN OUR MILITARY YOU WILL ABIDE BY THE RULES SET DOWN (NO TURBANS ON THE GRENADE RANGE)

NO FORCED MARRIAGES

NI KILLING OR BEATING YOUR DAUGHTER BECAUSE SHE LIKES THE SCHOOL FOOTBALL HERO OR HE LOOKS AT HER AND SMILES AND

SHESMILES BACK

Yes you have some good points personally I am really against sharia law

If we go k war with Afghanistan and Iraq for regime change then why stop there why not make an all out crusade

I was not aware he had 2 passports so I don't really care what happens to him

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[Credo]

I don't care about him personally, but I do care that gov'ts render assistance to their citizens. I also care that people are not executed for insanity, especially when that insanity does not hurt another human being.

[slipperylobster]

And 10 years later the find out it was true......Same case as Jesus.....

What the hell are you talking about???

[Steely Dan]

First of all it is estimated 40,000 Pakistanis have died in the fight against Islamic extremism in Pakistan, perhaps some should take this into consideration before making sweeping generalised bigoted statements against Pakistanis. In addition senior Pakistani political moderates have been assassinated for speaking out against the blasphemy laws.

Some of these cases are driven by personal disputes, as an example from the URL below:

Following his release from hospital in Scotland it is believed he stopped taking his medication and travelled to Pakistan where he had a number of properties. There, it is claimed he entered into an eviction dispute with a local man.

After returning from a pilgrimage to Mecca, he was arrested when the man handed in letters he had discovered written to a lawyer and a politician claiming to be a prophet. His lawyer, who is now under guard after receiving threats for defending the Briton and who asked not to be named, said the letters had never been intended for distribution.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/death-sentence-for-british-pensioner-accused-of-blasphemy-in-pakistan-9083235.html

True some Pakistanis died fighting extremism, however their government is hopelessly compromised and has been playing a double game with the West, look at the fate of those responsible for the tipoff leading to the killing of Osama Bin Laden, who was hiding out in a Pakistani army town. The blasphemy laws are also used to persecute Christians, Hindus and minority Muslim sects, often done cynically to confiscate the property of the accused.

Pakistan has some voices of reason as can be seen by their Tribune newspaper, but on the whole the society is dysfunctional to the degree of being mentally ill. Honor killings in tribal areas are often not even investigated. Female genital mutilation is common and every year thousands are killed due to being Shia or Armadi Muslims. It would arguably cause less suffering to get it over and done with quickly and nuke the place, the Indians may yet oblige if their nuclear armed stone aged neighbor loses control to the militants who already operate freely on the streets of Karachi.

In the meantime our British citizen of Pakistani origin is one of many who have been allowed into the UK with indecent haste by the cultural lemmings of New Labour. Of course those arriving are magically transformed into law abiding democrats at passport control, what could possibly go wrong, apart from honor killings, child brides, FGM or birth defects due to inbreeding that is?

Edited January 26, 2014 by Steely Dan

[BigC]

I don't care about him personally, but I do care that gov'ts render assistance to their citizens. I also care that people are not executed for insanity, especially when that insanity does not hurt another human being.

Well the whole concept of sharia law I find insane so I don't know how one defines sanity in a case where you can be put to death because of your believes

If he sent death threats or something then there might be a small case but writing a letter saying that you believe that you are the god or what ever is not worthy of a death penalty as long as he was not a danger to himself or anyone else

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

Edited January 26, 2014 by BigC

[BigC]

If Britton has an ounce of care for its citizens which they don't then they have the power to over turn this sentence

And how does that work then?

As far as I know, we gave Pakistan independence in 1947.

Sorry off topic post but that was the same year the ak47 was made rip Kalashnikov

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

[F430murci]

First of all it is estimated 40,000 Pakistanis have died in the fight against Islamic extremism in Pakistan, perhaps some should take this into consideration before making sweeping generalised bigoted statements against Pakistanis. In addition senior Pakistani political moderates have been assassinated for speaking out against the blasphemy laws.

Some of these cases are driven by personal disputes, as an example from the URL below:

Following his release from hospital in Scotland it is believed he stopped taking his medication and travelled to Pakistan where he had a number of properties. There, it is claimed he entered into an eviction dispute with a local man.

After returning from a pilgrimage to Mecca, he was arrested when the man handed in letters he had discovered written to a lawyer and a politician claiming to be a prophet. His lawyer, who is now under guard after receiving threats for defending the Briton and who asked not to be named, said the letters had never been intended for distribution.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/death-sentence-for-british-pensioner-accused-of-blasphemy-in-pakistan-9083235.html

True some Pakistanis died fighting extremism, however their government is hopelessly compromised and has been playing a double game with the West, look at the fate of those responsible for the tipoff leading to the killing of Osama Bin Laden, who was hiding out in a Pakistani army town. The blasphemy laws are also used to persecute Christians, Hindus and minority Muslim sects, often done cynically to confiscate the property of the accused.

Pakistan has some voices of reason as can be seen by their Tribune newspaper, but on the whole the society is dysfunctional to the degree of being mentally ill. Honor killings in tribal areas are often not even investigated. Female genital mutilation is common and every year thousands are killed due to being Shia or Armadi Muslims. It would arguably cause less suffering to get it over and done with quickly and nuke the place, the Indians may yet oblige if their nuclear armed stone aged neighbor loses control to the militants who already operate freely on the streets of Karachi.

In the meantime our British citizen of Pakistani origin is one of many who have been allowed into the UK with indecent haste by the cultural lemmings of New Labour. Of course those arriving are magically transformed into law abiding democrats at passport control, what could possibly go wrong, apart from honor killings, child brides, FGM or birth defects due to inbreeding that is?

I agree to the extent that as long as people like Simple and the people causing problems keep trying to make excuses or rationalize the behavior and thought processes, nothing will change and this segment of the world continue to live in the problem and continuing spreading the problem.

Oh, and then people like Simple and the people living in and causing the problems just throw the bigot label around to a void acceptance of or looking the truth.

Edited January 26, 2014 by F430murci

[TimTang]

I'm Spartacus.

I am the walrus.

Goo Goo Ga Joob, Goo Goo Ga Joob!

[simple1]

First of all it is estimated 40,000 Pakistanis have died in the fight against Islamic extremism in Pakistan, perhaps some should take this into consideration before making sweeping generalised bigoted statements against Pakistanis. In addition senior Pakistani political moderates have been assassinated for speaking out against the blasphemy laws.

Some of these cases are driven by personal disputes, as an example from the URL below:

Following his release from hospital in Scotland it is believed he stopped taking his medication and travelled to Pakistan where he had a number of properties. There, it is claimed he entered into an eviction dispute with a local man.

After returning from a pilgrimage to Mecca, he was arrested when the man handed in letters he had discovered written to a lawyer and a politician claiming to be a prophet. His lawyer, who is now under guard after receiving threats for defending the Briton and who asked not to be named, said the letters had never been intended for distribution.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/death-sentence-for-british-pensioner-accused-of-blasphemy-in-pakistan-9083235.html

True some Pakistanis died fighting extremism, however their government is hopelessly compromised and has been playing a double game with the West, look at the fate of those responsible for the tipoff leading to the killing of Osama Bin Laden, who was hiding out in a Pakistani army town. The blasphemy laws are also used to persecute Christians, Hindus and minority Muslim sects, often done cynically to confiscate the property of the accused.

Pakistan has some voices of reason as can be seen by their Tribune newspaper, but on the whole the society is dysfunctional to the degree of being mentally ill. Honor killings in tribal areas are often not even investigated. Female genital mutilation is common and every year thousands are killed due to being Shia or Armadi Muslims. It would arguably cause less suffering to get it over and done with quickly and nuke the place, the Indians may yet oblige if their nuclear armed stone aged neighbor loses control to the militants who already operate freely on the streets of Karachi.

In the meantime our British citizen of Pakistani origin is one of many who have been allowed into the UK with indecent haste by the cultural lemmings of New Labour. Of course those arriving are magically transformed into law abiding democrats at passport control, what could possibly go wrong, apart from honor killings, child brides, FGM or birth defects due to inbreeding that is?

I agree to the extent that as long as people like Simple and the people causing problems keep trying to make excuses or rationalize the behavior and thought processes, nothing will change and this segment of the world continue to live in the problem and continuing spreading the problem.

Oh, and then people like Simple and the people living in and causing the problems just throw the bigot label around to a void acceptance of or looking the truth.

I do not withdraw my comments on bigoted statements by some members such as Steely Dan who has now gone so far as to support a general nuclear attack on Pakistan. To be blunt members who post such comment, in my opinion, should be banned from TV. However, please provide one instance where I have made excuses on issues such as the blasphamy laws, attempted to justify etc etc.

If I recall correctly, you had previously apologised for similar unjustified personal attacks.

Edited January 27, 2014 by simple1

[Scott]

I think we have had enough of the personal attacks on other members. Continued off-topic posts will be deleted and suspensions will be given.

Posters have every right to express their opinion within the rules.

Continue at your own peril.

[Steely Dan]

The context in which I considered Pakistan being nuked was somewhat tongue in cheek, but clearly hypothetical, in that it might actually reduce human suffering. On a practical level prevailing winds may take out somewhere useful, if blowing anywhere other than toward Afghanistan..An even better case could be made for nuking North Korea, but I digress.

To return to the nub of the issue, the life of the prophet Mohammad is well documented, without going into details I would speculate that were it possible to travel back in time and swap the original Mohammad with the 2014 version the world would be a better, saner place now, and the original would be shipped off to the Hague quicker than you could say Assad.

Such talk would gt you killed in much of the Islamic world, and I dare say you would get little support for clemency from UK based Muslims; Have any UK based Muslim spokesmen made such an appeal?

Finally insults and appeals for censorship are in effect an attempt to impose Islamic blasphemy laws on everyone, they amount to a global lesse Mus-jesty law and have to be opposed tooth and nail if freedom of speech means anything.

[johna]

Lets all hope that Mohammad Asghar will safely return home to Edinburgh in time to lead Scotland in a Holy War of independence from the farangi infidels.

[simple1]

The context in which I considered Pakistan being nuked was somewhat tongue in cheek, but clearly hypothetical, in that it might actually reduce human suffering. On a practical level prevailing winds may take out somewhere useful, if blowing anywhere other than toward Afghanistan..An even better case could be made for nuking North Korea, but I digress.

To return to the nub of the issue, the life of the prophet Mohammad is well documented, without going into details I would speculate that were it possible to travel back in time and swap the original Mohammad with the 2014 version the world would be a better, saner place now, and the original would be shipped off to the Hague quicker than you could say Assad.

Such talk would gt you killed in much of the Islamic world, and I dare say you would get little support for clemency from UK based Muslims; Have any UK based Muslim spokesmen made such an appeal?

Finally insults and appeals for censorship are in effect an attempt to impose Islamic blasphemy laws on everyone, they amount to a global lesse Mus-jesty law and have to be opposed tooth and nail if freedom of speech means anything.

In reference to the Pakistani blasphemy laws, a leading Pakistani human-rights lawyer Asma Jahangir, said they were instituted by Pakistani dictator General Zia ul Haq in the 1980s, "as a pretext for waging war in Afghanistan and adopting an aggressive stance towards India. By advancing a more orthodox version of Islam, he was able to hold on to a repressive regime and quell any opposition".

I am sure you are aware that the application of blasphemy laws is more often than not used as a tool in personal disputes/politics and efforts to revise the laws are mired in political power fights, not upon religious principles. Some Islamic scholars have highlighted that in fact there is no foundation in the Koran or Hadith justifying blasphemy laws.

In my opinion the laws on ‘Free Speech’ were never intended to provide cover for hate speech. Such abuse of Free Speech is a nightmare for governments to be able to censor/prosecute, no matter a persons’ political or religious persuasion. In the small world of TV the rules are fairly clear and are exercised are the discretion of the Mods. I have to admit I sometimes do not understand why some of the OTT posts are not removed.