Aeon Bank now charge 150 B ATM fee

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

..

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I also said I didn't plan to do another cash advance for a month or so, but I lied...I did another one today. But this time I went in asking for Bt100K, the teller went to run the transaction but got an "Over Limit" rejection. Well, that's a little embarrassing and I immediately started wondering to myself is this a PenFed limitation or a really a branch limitation? Since I had successfully done a Bt50K counter withdrawal around 10 days ago and the teller didn't seem to know much English and my Thai ain't great, I just said run it again for Bt50K....and it processed fine and I deposited it all in my bank account.

Pib, did you go back today to the same BKK Bank Branch as the one you'd had success with the first time???

-----------------------------------------------------

On the subject of cash advance limits with credit cards...

Most of the accounts I'm familiar with usually list two amounts on your monthly statement:

1. is your total credit limit and how much you've used of it (which includes purchases, advances, everything)

2. is your cash or cash advance limit, which I presume usually applies to ATM or counter withdrawals.

When I looked at a recent Promise account statement today, it showed total credit limit and cash limit amounts that were identical. Penfed seems to be different in that regard, because most credit card accounts seem to have a higher total credit limit, and then a cash advance limit that's only a portion (maybe 25 or 50%) of the total credit limit.

However, those are limits for the billing cycle, not per transaction or per day. So you could still have a total cash advance limit that was the same as your total credit limit, but still be limited in how much cash you can pull per transaction or per 24 hour period.

BTW, thanks for checking with PFCU about their cash advance limits. I don't believe I've ever seen any reference to the $1000 or $2000 amounts per day or transaction in any of my account disclosures/paperwork.

[Pib]

I also said I didn't plan to do another cash advance for a month or so, but I lied...I did another one today. But this time I went in asking for Bt100K, the teller went to run the transaction but got an "Over Limit" rejection. Well, that's a little embarrassing and I immediately started wondering to myself is this a PenFed limitation or a really a branch limitation? Since I had successfully done a Bt50K counter withdrawal around 10 days ago and the teller didn't seem to know much English and my Thai ain't great, I just said run it again for Bt50K....and it processed fine and I deposited it all in my bank account.

Pib, did you go back today to the same BKK Bank Branch as the one you'd had success with the first time???

-----------------------------------------------------

On the subject of cash advance limits with credit cards...

Most of the accounts I'm familiar with usually list two amounts on your monthly statement:

1. is your total credit limit and how much you've used of it (which includes purchases, advances, everything)

2. is your cash or cash advance limit, which I presume usually applies to ATM or counter withdrawals.

When I looked at a recent Promise account statement today, it showed total credit limit and cash limit amounts that were identical. Penfed seems to be different in that regard, because most credit card accounts seem to have a higher total credit limit, and then a cash advance limit that's only a portion (maybe 25 or 50%) of the total credit limit.

However, those are limits for the billing cycle, not per transaction or per day. So you could still have a total cash advance limit that was the same as your total credit limit, but still be limited in how much cash you can pull per transaction or per 24 hour period.

Yes, I went to the same branch. My PenFed account statement list the total line of credit and the cash advance line of credit....the cash advance line of credit equals the total line of credit....or said another way I could use my total line of credit in cash advances if need be....but if I did that I wouldn't have no room to make a purchase transaction like paying for groceries at Tesco Lotus. However, but, there are daily cash advances limits as I identified in my other post that I dare you to find anywhere on the PenFed web site, your online account, the docs they send you, or your monthly statement. I had to make the call to find out the daily cash advance transaction limit. I probably should have asked do you also have a daily purchase transaction limit.

[Pib]

One other tidbit of info for anyone considering getting a PenFed credit card that has no foreign transaction fee or cash advance fee, unless something has changed since approx 2 years ago when I joined PenFed (i.e., opened a banks/shares account with them) for the first 6 months as a new PenFed member you are limited to "initiating" ACH inbound/outbound transfers of only $50. Then after the 6 month probationary period (which is what I call it), that $50 ACH in/out transfer limited is raised to $5,000/day for inbound/outbound. So what is this important relating to their credit card you may be thinking about getting or using if you already have one.

Well, say you got a PenFed credit card, then started running up charges/cash advances, and when it came time to pay the monthly bill or maybe wanting to make an a prepayment on a cash advance like how I said I initiated from Penfed an inbound ACH transfer from one of my other banks to prepay the cash advance (an ACH transfer which PenFed credits immediately to my account), you would be limited to only initiating a $50 ACH pull from the Penfed online ibanking system for 6 months...and if your cash advance was for a much higher amount but you wanted to prepay it in full immediately you couldn't by using a PenFed initiated inbound ACH transfer. Instead, you would have to initiate an ACH payment "from" one of your other banks to your PenFed Shares or Money Market account, wait for the funds to arrive/clear/post to your PenFed Shares/Money Market account, and then do an internal PenFed transfer to pay your credit card bill/cash advance....by then you would have probably run up a week or two in cash advance interest...similar thing would happen if you had to mail in a check to make the payment.

So, if the 6 month probationary period for PenFed initiated ACH inbound/outbound transfers is still in effect for new members, be sure to take this in account as it would case some delays in paying your credit card bill "unless" you had enough funds in your PenFed Shares/Money Market account to do an "internal" transfer. Or, you initiated an ACH transfer "from" one of our other banks to your PenFed account and then can wait several days for it to arrive/be posted to your PenFed account....or you did more planning by transferring the funds a week or so before you did the cash advance.

Yea, unless something has change when I joined, PenFed ACH inbound/outbound transfer limitations are almost ridiculous for the first 6 months...and it just wan't me because when I discovered this a few years ago I called to confirm the limitation and there were plenty of people who complainted about the limitation when searching via Google. But as I said, maybe things have changed now for new members---or not.

[elzach]

Back in some earlier posts I talked about how I successfully used my PenFed "credit" card (no foreign transaction fee or no cash advance fee) to do a Bt50K counter withdrawal at a Bangkok Bank branch with no fees at the branch. Also talked about how PenFed credit cards allow you a cash advance line of credit which equals your total line of credit which is different from most banks which allow a total line of credit and only a portion is allowed for cash advance. After doing that cash advance I posted to my account an offsetting payment to ensure I got no charge due to interest since interest does start racking up from the day you get the cash advance although PenFed cards do not charge a foreign transaction fee or cash advance fee...they just charge interest on the cash advance.

I also said I didn't plan to do another cash advance for a month or so, but I lied...I did another one today. But this time I went in asking for Bt100K, the teller went to run the transaction but got an "Over Limit" rejection. Well, that's a little embarrassing and I immediately started wondering to myself is this a PenFed limitation or a really a branch limitation? Since I had successfully done a Bt50K counter withdrawal around 10 days ago and the teller didn't seem to know much English and my Thai ain't great, I just said run it again for Bt50K....and it processed fine and I deposited it all in my bank account.

I then came back home, logged onto my PenFed account and did an ACH transfer/pull from one of my other banks to cover/pay the cash advance to prevent any interest charges. Since even an external bank ACH pull is credit to your account immediately it prevents any interest charge from occurring...so a person can escape with no transaction or interest fees.

Now, maybe at the time of the Over Limit rejection I should have asked the teller if the rejection maybe wasn't really occurring on the Bangkok Bank end but it was busy in the bank, she didn't appear to know much English and I sure can speak a lot of Thai although I can understand a lot. Plus my gut was telling me this was a PenFed limitation and credit card cash advance may have daily/per transaction limits just like debit cards.

After looking all over the PenFed website, my Terms & Agreements for the credit card, my online account, etc., I couldn't find anything specific about credit card cash advance daily transaction limits, if any. So, tonight I called PenFed to ask the question of, "Do you have a credit card cash advance transaction limit per day or per transaction even though my cash advance line of credit is high/equals my total line of credit which is significantly north of $10K. The rep said yes, the credit card cash advance limit per day transaction is $1,000 (approx Bt32.5K) at an ATM....and the cash advance limit per day/transaction is $2,000 (approx Bt65K) at a bank branch/over the counter. There was the answer for the Over Limit rejection when trying to get Bt100K which is a little over $3,000. So, like debit cards limits per day/transaction the PenFed credit cards have similar limits for credit card cash advances. I asked the rep if I could get that $2,000 cash advance limit per day/transaction increased and it was a big No...said it would require literally the board of directors to approve such a permanent increase...I didn't ask if a person could call in an ask for a temporary one time increase as I don't ever plan to do that.

While talking to the rep I asked her if she could see the transaction yet...she said yes...and it was for X-amount...that amount matched the Visa exchange rate exactly which was a few stang better today than the TT Buying Rate. Out of curiosity I asked her does the transaction show up as purchase or cash advance...she said on her system she couldn't see that right now or on the withdrawal I did about 10 days ago...she could only see the date, amount and what bank/merchant accomplished the transaction, but said it would be broken out in different sections on my monthly statement which is not due for about another week.

Summary: for you fine folks who have PenFed credit cards and even though your line of credit/cash advance line of credit may be sky high there is daily limits on cash advances as mentioned above. The $2,000 (approx Bt65K) limit for counter withdrawals is OK with me; would be nice if higher, but doing the counter withdrawal and subsequent deposit into my Bangkok Bank account is a one-stop/quick operation. Before between my two no foreign transaction fee "debit" cards I was limited to $1,000/day on each or $2,000 total between the two debit cards, but I would have to do 4 pulls at an AEON ATM to get that $2,000 (approx Bt65K) and then go deposit that amount...I always used a Cash Deposit Machine that was close to the AEON ATM in the same mall. Now, I'm effectively achieving the same thing, can do it in one credit card cash advance, and deposit the cash advance with the same teller. Then go in the next day..and the next day...etc...if necessary/I need more money. Works for me...I get the money immediately totally fee & interest fee (what all bankers hate) and get the full Visa exchange rate that is always plus or minus a few stang (today on the plus side a few stang) of the TT Buying Rate used for incoming wire transfers.

Pib, there's some good info here. Thanks.

My question is, and perhaps this has been asked already, any credit card will list, under Balances, "Purchases" and "Cash Advances" (with the advances portion usually subject to higher interest rates). On the day of your counter withdrawal here, you logged in to Penfed and did a ACH transfer from another bank to cover/pay the cash advance. In other words, you are pre-paying for that cash advance. The question now becomes, how do you know that the ACH transfer will be applied to "Cash Advances" and not to "Purchases"?? In a sense you are overpaying your balances, but this may just create a "credit" balance in your "Purchases" portion. I believe that something along those lines might be stated in the Terms of Agreement.

If I were you, I would wait to see that statement issued, to see how those prepayments were categorized.

[Pib]

Pib, there's some good info here. Thanks.

My question is, and perhaps this has been asked already, any credit card will list, under Balances, "Purchases" and "Cash Advances" (with the advances portion usually subject to higher interest rates). On the day of your counter withdrawal here, you logged in to Penfed and did a ACH transfer from another bank to cover/pay the cash advance. In other words, you are pre-paying for that cash advance. The question now becomes, how do you know that the ACH transfer will be applied to "Cash Advances" and not to "Purchases"?? In a sense you are overpaying your balances, but this may just create a "credit" balance in your "Purchases" portion. I believe that something along those lines might be stated in the Terms of Agreement.

If I were you, I would wait to see that statement issued, to see how those prepayments were categorized.

From the PenFed card agreement, the order of payments follow (and I think this is standard for all U.S. credit cards based on U.S. law which went in effect about a half dozen years ago due to industry abuse of the customer in applying credit card payments when a balance had various types of charges)

You understand and agree that payments will be applied

first to the card balance bearing the highest rate of interest,

then to each successive balance bearing the next highest rate

of interest until the payment is exhausted. You understand

and agree that payments will be applied in the following

order: (1) late payment fee; (2) finance charge; (3) annual

membership fee (if any); (4) paper statement fee (if any); (5)

credit life fee (if any); (6) previous balance cash advances;

(7) previous balance purchases; (8) new cash advances; and

(9) new purchases.

As you see, previous balance cash balances are paid before previous balance purchases and new cash advances are paid before new purchases. Basically, between cash advances and purchases, cash advances get fed before purchases. But a person must remember other charges get fed even before cash advances or purchases. For me I have been prepaying my "entire" balance of cash advances and purchases...I was only paying the entire balance to play it safe since I was during this cash advance thing. However, on this cycle and most cycles I don't have any purchases transactions, because up till now it's only been the two cash advances as rarely used my PenFed credit card for everyday purchases (except to exercise it a few times a year just to keep it active) because this PenFed credit card cash back reward program only applies to pay-at-the-pump fuel purchases (i.e., slide you card into a self serve fuel pump) which Thailand don't do. My card is the Plus card that pays 5% cash back on fuel and the Standard card pays 3%....the card pays zero on regular purchases like buying groceries or purchase like that. So I use my CapOne no foreign transaction fee Visa/Mastercad credit cards which pay 1.5% cash back on everything....the CapOne Visa card now gets used the great majority of the time over the CapOne Mastercard although the two cards cash back rewards programs are identical since the Visa exchange rate is usually just a little better than the Mastercard exchange rate.

Yes, when my monthly statement occurs in another week or so I will know the final answer on did my prepayments which occurred on the same day as the cash advances and fully covered the cash balances (actually the entire card balance for any and all transactions) has prevented any days of interest being charged. I already know there will be no separate foreign transaction fee or cash advance fee since that is standard for PenFed credit cards and one of their big pluses.

[MrWorldwide]

A lot of complaints on my Oz forum re Citibank's customer service levels - unlike Oz banks where the person fielding the call usually actions the request straight away at a terminal, CITI seems to funnel everything from their call centre to a back office and the delays/stuffups are unacceptable to many. I'm assuming that the experience is much better for US-based CITI customers ?

[elzach]

Pib, there's some good info here. Thanks.

My question is, and perhaps this has been asked already, any credit card will list, under Balances, "Purchases" and "Cash Advances" (with the advances portion usually subject to higher interest rates). On the day of your counter withdrawal here, you logged in to Penfed and did a ACH transfer from another bank to cover/pay the cash advance. In other words, you are pre-paying for that cash advance. The question now becomes, how do you know that the ACH transfer will be applied to "Cash Advances" and not to "Purchases"?? In a sense you are overpaying your balances, but this may just create a "credit" balance in your "Purchases" portion. I believe that something along those lines might be stated in the Terms of Agreement.

If I were you, I would wait to see that statement issued, to see how those prepayments were categorized.

From the PenFed card agreement, the order of payments follow (and I think this is standard for all U.S. credit cards based on U.S. law which went in effect about a half dozen years ago due to industry abuse of the customer in applying credit card payments when a balance had various types of charges)

You understand and agree that payments will be applied

first to the card balance bearing the highest rate of interest,

then to each successive balance bearing the next highest rate

of interest until the payment is exhausted. You understand

and agree that payments will be applied in the following

order: (1) late payment fee; (2) finance charge; (3) annual

membership fee (if any); (4) paper statement fee (if any); (5)

credit life fee (if any); (6) previous balance cash advances;

(7) previous balance purchases; (8) new cash advances; and

(9) new purchases.

As you see, previous balance cash balances are paid before previous balance purchases and new cash advances are paid before new purchases. Basically, between cash advances and purchases, cash advances get fed before purchases. But a person must remember other charges get fed even before cash advances or purchases. For me I have been prepaying my "entire" balance of cash advances and purchases...I was only paying the entire balance to play it safe since I was during this cash advance thing. However, on this cycle and most cycles I don't have any purchases transactions, because up till now it's only been the two cash advances as rarely used my PenFed credit card for everyday purchases (except to exercise it a few times a year just to keep it active) because this PenFed credit card cash back reward program only applies to pay-at-the-pump fuel purchases (i.e., slide you card into a self serve fuel pump) which Thailand don't do. My card is the Plus card that pays 5% cash back on fuel and the Standard card pays 3%....the card pays zero on regular purchases like buying groceries or purchase like that. So I use my CapOne no foreign transaction fee Visa/Mastercad credit cards which pay 1.5% cash back on everything....the CapOne Visa card now gets used the great majority of the time over the CapOne Mastercard although the two cards cash back rewards programs are identical since the Visa exchange rate is usually just a little better than the Mastercard exchange rate.

Yes, when my monthly statement occurs in another week or so I will know the final answer on did my prepayments which occurred on the same day as the cash advances and fully covered the cash balances (actually the entire card balance for any and all transactions) has prevented any days of interest being charged. I already know there will be no separate foreign transaction fee or cash advance fee since that is standard for PenFed credit cards and one of their big pluses.

Thanks for that detailed info Pib.

Btw, what's the interest rate on the Cash Advances if I may ask? If it's something like 15%, then the finance charge on 50,000 bht would be about 20 bht/day. So with no cash advance fees, you'd still be way ahead (compared to an ATM pull) even if you paid one or two or three days later.

[grin]

Here's some more info on PenFed:

They do not support Quicken direct connect, just the ability to download transactions.

Their iPad app is pretty nice, although it only seems to work in portrait mode and not in landscape mode.

I had to sign a document and return it to complete the membership.

They also sent me a document with their service fees which I was going to scan but found online https://www.penfed.org/service-fees/‎

Grin

[Pib]

Thanks for that detailed info Pib.

Btw, what's the interest rate on the Cash Advances if I may ask? If it's something like 15%, then the finance charge on 50,000 bht would be about 20 bht/day. So with no cash advance fees, you'd still be way ahead (compared to an ATM pull) even if you paid one or two or three days later.

Purchases and Cash Advances - Variable 9.99% APR See this Link for more info on PenFed credit cards. PenFed don't charge a higher interest rate for cash advances...it's the same as for purchases. Once again that' a major plus for PenFed cards since most cards do charge a higher interest rate for cash advances.

With no cash advance fees and since I prepaid I should have zero charge (no fees or interest)....but to be 100% sure I will need to wait and see my monthly statement due out late next week.

[Pib]

Here's some more info on PenFed:

They do not support Quicken direct connect, just the ability to download transactions.

Their iPad app is pretty nice, although it only seems to work in portrait mode and not in landscape mode.

I had to sign a document and return it to complete the membership.

They also sent me a document with their service fees which I was going to scan but found online https://www.penfed.org/service-fees/‎

Grin

And just to stress other than the $5 or $25 opening amounts for a Shares or Money Market accounts (both are types of savings accounts), respectively, there is no minimum monthly balance requirement to avoid a monthly maintenance fee. The $5 and/or $25 amounts will always be part of your balance and you get it back when closing the account, it's just you can not withdraw to below those amounts until you close the account. You only need to open a Shares account during the signup process...opening an Money Market or Checking account is purely optional. Now if you need a Checking account also then there is a monthly mx fee unless you maintain a $500 minimum balance or have a monthly $500 direct deposit flowing in.

Heck to be upfront about it I only opened a Shares account in order to get one of their credit cards...and later on I only opened a Money Market account so I didn't have to pay an annual fee for the Cash Back Plus card I have....with the exception of the Cash Back Standard card which has an annual fee of $25 after the first year (no fee for the first year) and the Cash Back Plus card which will have no annual fee if signing up for certain PenFed products like a Money Market account, all the other PenFed credit cards, like the Promise card that TallGuy has mentioned several times, their credit cards have no annual fee. And of course as mentioned several times by various folks no foreign transaction or cash advance fee.

[Langsuan Man]

A lot of complaints on my Oz forum re Citibank's customer service levels - unlike Oz banks where the person fielding the call usually actions the request straight away at a terminal, CITI seems to funnel everything from their call centre to a back office and the delays/stuffups are unacceptable to many. I'm assuming that the experience is much better for US-based CITI customers ?

Nope. they are called S...ty Bank for a reason

[paz]

A lot of complaints on my Oz forum re Citibank's customer service levels - unlike Oz banks where the person fielding the call usually actions the request straight away at a terminal, CITI seems to funnel everything from their call centre to a back office and the delays/stuffups are unacceptable to many. I'm assuming that the experience is much better for US-based CITI customers ?

Nope. they are called S...ty Bank for a reason

Not in my experience, i'm an US citigold customer, and their service for both accounts and c/c has always been great.

[ubonrthai]

I've done 5 transactions doing cash advance with my debit card at Bangkok Bank with no fee. That's 150b x 5 = 750b in ATM fee savings. The cost is a little extra hassle waiting. I'm learning when the best times to visit are and if you go during a busy time just press a few of the queue buttons such as loan department or currency exchange and you'll get help faster.

[Pib]

I've done 5 transactions doing cash advance with my debit card at Bangkok Bank with no fee. That's 150b x 5 = 750b in ATM fee savings. The cost is a little extra hassle waiting. I'm learning when the best times to visit are and if you go during a busy time just press a few of the queue buttons such as loan department or currency exchange and you'll get help faster.

Just reconfirms how different bank branches operate differently in Thailand. At the Bangkok Bank branch I've used for 2 credit card withdrawals as they absolutely refused to accept a debit card for a counter withdrawal...they would just point me to their ATM...but no problem using a credit card. Fortunately my PenFed credit card charges no foreign transaction or cash advance fee and I was able to prepay the withdrawal which should prevent any interest charges. But I won't know for sure for around another 8-10 days since my monthly card cycle runs through the 8th of each month.

[Langsuan Man]

A lot of complaints on my Oz forum re Citibank's customer service levels - unlike Oz banks where the person fielding the call usually actions the request straight away at a terminal, CITI seems to funnel everything from their call centre to a back office and the delays/stuffups are unacceptable to many. I'm assuming that the experience is much better for US-based CITI customers ?

Nope. they are called S...ty Bank for a reason

Not in my experience, i'm an US citigold customer, and their service for both accounts and c/c has always been great.

Sorry, but I am not about to deposit 50,000 dollars to get "gold" service

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[paz]

Sorry, but I am not about to deposit 50,000 dollars to get "gold" service

No need to deposit it all, both loans and investment accounts counts toward the minimum.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I've done 5 transactions doing cash advance with my debit card at Bangkok Bank with no fee. That's 150b x 5 = 750b in ATM fee savings. The cost is a little extra hassle waiting. I'm learning when the best times to visit are and if you go during a busy time just press a few of the queue buttons such as loan department or currency exchange and you'll get help faster.

Ubon, can you elaborate a bit on what happened with that:

1. When you did the counter cash advances, were the individual amounts less than or more than BKK Bank's ATM withdrawal limit of 20K or 25K baht?

2. What country and card type was the debit card you were using?

3. Are you saying the BKK Bank staff at desks (as opposed to the tellers at the counters) were able to process the withdrawals for you?

Thanks very much for your report...

[ubonrthai]

I've done 5 transactions doing cash advance with my debit card at Bangkok Bank with no fee. That's 150b x 5 = 750b in ATM fee savings. The cost is a little extra hassle waiting. I'm learning when the best times to visit are and if you go during a busy time just press a few of the queue buttons such as loan department or currency exchange and you'll get help faster.

Ubon, can you elaborate a bit on what happened with that:

1. When you did the counter cash advances, were the individual amounts less than or more than BKK Bank's ATM withdrawal limit of 20K or 25K baht?

2. What country and card type was the debit card you were using?

3. Are you saying the BKK Bank staff at desks (as opposed to the tellers at the counters) were able to process the withdrawals for you?

Thanks very much for your report...

1. All between 30-32k but I'll try more if my home bank raises ATM withdrawal limit.

2. USA. It's just a small town bank DEBIT card that I use to withdraw from a checking account. It has a MasterCard logo on it.

3. All of the tellers seem to know what a cash advance is but they always pass it off to a branch manager.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1. All between 30-32k but I'll try more if my home bank raises ATM withdrawal limit.

3. All of the tellers seem to know what a cash advance is but they always pass it off to a branch manager.

Thanks for the added info.

Re No. 1, nah, don't worry about that. The issue isn't bigger amounts. The question is whether the banks are going to allow smaller amounts for counter withdrawals, smaller than what their normal ATM withdrawal limits are.

Re No. 3, that's interesting. So you're usually starting off talking to a teller, and then onward from there.

[lifemagic]

Remember why Aeon was free for so long. When the other banks started charging 150, aimed at foreigners, Aeon (Thai) cards were charged. In other words, Thai people were being charged a fee aimed at foreigners, and so Aeon put this sign on their machines promising they would never charge...

Thanks to this brilliant forum, I've never paid any fee so far. I've gone over the counter or Aeon and use a Metrobank card. Now I'm in Malaysia, when I get back next month, all of a sudden, Metrobank will charge and the Thai banks will charge (about three percent each on a hundred quid), plus my savings rate in the UK has gone down 1% recently (Virgin money) plus previously free share platfom is now charging. I've kind of gone from nothing to 7% down. However, it was free to years - I'm grateful for that at least.

I've some baht with me, I'll use the exchange booth in Soi Rambuttri for cash over the counter. I'm going to try and get a Halifax clarity card perhaps. I've given up on Thailand anyway, don't stay over the past few years so it doesn't affect me as much, the racism, dual pricing, rudeness. Quite happy here in Malaysia.

[55Jay]

I've done 5 transactions doing cash advance with my debit card at Bangkok Bank with no fee. That's 150b x 5 = 750b in ATM fee savings. The cost is a little extra hassle waiting. I'm learning when the best times to visit are and if you go during a busy time just press a few of the queue buttons such as loan department or currency exchange and you'll get help faster.

Ubon, can you elaborate a bit on what happened with that:

1. When you did the counter cash advances, were the individual amounts less than or more than BKK Bank's ATM withdrawal limit of 20K or 25K baht?

2. What country and card type was the debit card you were using?

3. Are you saying the BKK Bank staff at desks (as opposed to the tellers at the counters) were able to process the withdrawals for you?

Thanks very much for your report...

1. All between 30-32k but I'll try more if my home bank raises ATM withdrawal limit.

2. USA. It's just a small town bank DEBIT card that I use to withdraw from a checking account. It has a MasterCard logo on it.

3. All of the tellers seem to know what a cash advance is but they always pass it off to a branch manager.

Encouraging. I will visit my local town Bangkok Bank tomorrow and try my full monthly pull with Schwab Visa debit. See what happens. Even with the prospect of standing in line, doing one large pull and dumping straight into my BKB acct, is better than the Aeon field trips. Although not having Aeon in the toolbox is a bummer. The noose is tightening.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Encouraging. I will visit my local town Bangkok Bank tomorrow and try my full monthly pull with Schwab Visa debit. See what happens. Even with the prospect of standing in line, doing one large pull and dumping straight into my BKB acct, is better than the Aeon field trips. Although not having Aeon in the toolbox is a bummer. The noose is tightening.

Keep in mind, Pib's been denied trying to use his U.S. debit card for a counter withdrawal at his local BKK Bank branch, but they were fine to do a cash advance on his credit card.

So, as with everything human-related about Thai banks, YMMV, and don't expect any consistency from place to place. Please do post about your result.

[Fasth]

Which ATM provides best rates now? I need to withdraw ~40k bht

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Except for a few isolated cases, all Thai bank ATMs are going to provide the same exchange rate, that being, the rate offered that day by the network behind your card, VISA or MC, or other.

What varies are the fees. All Thai bank ATMs are now charging a 150 baht fee per withdrawal for VISA cards. Most Thai bank ATMs are charging a 180 baht fee per withdrawal for MasterCards, but at least AEON and Citibank ATMs (the latter only exist in Bangkok) are only charging 150 baht per withdrawal for MasterCards.

Then, there's how much you can withdrawal per transaction from various Thai ATMs. Bank of Ayudhya (yellow) and Thai Military Bank ATMs both allow up to 30,000 baht per withdrawal -- assuming your home country bank's daily limit allows that large an amount per day. Most of the other Thai bank ATMs are limited to 20,000 or 25,000 baht per withdrawal.

Then there's your home country bank that issued your debit card. Different home country banks charge different amounts of so-called foreign currency fees for using the card outside your home country. A few charge no FCF, some charge 1%, a lot of big banks charge 3% or higher, including sometimes a flat amount plus a % amount. So the higher the FCF fee, the lower the amount of money going into your pocket. So if you're visiting Thailand, one of the most important things you can do is use a bank card with a no or low FCF.

The few isolated instances I referred to above occur when the Thai bank's ATM offers to let you see your withdrawal amount not in Thai baht, but instead in the currency of your home country. If you say YES to that, the bank will give you a very bad/low exchange rate and you'll be losing money, potentially another 2-4%. So, should you ever see a message on the ATM video screen offering to show you your deposit amount in your home currency, DECLINE IT. That deceptive offer is something called Dynamic Currency Conversion, which you should always avoid.

But, back to the beginning: if you wire money into Thailand or do a currency exchange at a currency booth, that's where the particular bank's own individual foreign exchange rates may vary some from bank to bank. But most of the time, if you're using a Thai bank ATM, the rate is going to be identical from ATM to ATM to ATM, assuming you use the same bank card at approximately the same period in the day.

Where there is an ongoing and slight variation in exchange rates is between using a VISA card vs a MasterCard. Generally speaking, VISA cards provide a slightly better exchange rate than their MC counterparts. So, all other things being equal, a VISA card is better than a MasterCard to use abroad -- but that's assuming there are no other meaningful differences between them such as the amount of any foreign currency fees or daily withdrawals limits and such.

So overall, the likely best thing to do is use a VISA card with a no or low foreign currency fee. And use a Thai Military Bank or Bank of Ayudhya ATM that will allow you 30,000 baht per pull, which still is going to cost you the 150 baht Thai ATM fee.

But, if you're willing to be a bit adventurous, you can instead walk into a Thai bank branch with your passport and ask to do a so-called counter withdrawal or cash advance against your debit card. Assuming your card's limit will allow it, you can often withdrawal 40,000 or more in one transaction and avoid the 150 baht ATM fee altogether. The catch is, some Thai bank locations won't do counter withdrawals and instead will direct you to their ATMs. Or, they'll only do a counter withdrawal against a credit card, but not a debit card. But if you're willing to be persistent, you can probably find some branch that will give you the 40,000 baht you want -- hopefully with a no or low Foreign Currency Fee card.

[SurfRider]

.

"Bank of Ayudhya (yellow) and Thai Military Bank ATMs both allow up to 30,000 baht per withdrawal"

The CIMB (Red Bank, from Malaysia) branch near me also offers 30,000 max ATM pull, so I would assume all other CIMBs allow the same.

.

[MrWorldwide]

Which ATM provides best rates now? I need to withdraw ~40k bht

http://bankexchangerates.daytodaydata.net/

Even if you find an ATM which allows a 30K pull, you will still have to make a second withdrawal anyway to get 40K - in your case, 2x20K pulls would seem to be the same if you are forced to drop 150K for each ATM use. Obviously, if you can find a machine which will accept a 30K withdrawal, and your daily withdrawal limit allows you to withdraw 60K, that's a better option.

40K w/300 baht fees = .75%

60K w/300 baht fees = .50%

Personally, I want that figure to read .00% every time I visit a CITI ATM, but the only constant in this thread appears to be change - I'd prefer that .25% in my pocket than in the hands of a Thai bank.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

.

"Bank of Ayudhya (yellow) and Thai Military Bank ATMs both allow up to 30,000 baht per withdrawal"

The CIMB (Red Bank, from Malaysia) branch near me also offers 30,000 max ATM pull, so I would assume all other CIMBs allow the same.

.

Thanks for confirming that, SR. It has been previously reported here that CIMB ATMs would allow 30K, but I hadn't gotten around to being able to confirm it.. Now you have!!!!

[elzach]

Except for a few isolated cases, all Thai bank ATMs are going to provide the same exchange rate, that being, the rate offered that day by the network behind your card, VISA or MC, or other.

What varies are the fees. All Thai bank ATMs are now charging a 150 baht fee per withdrawal for VISA cards. Most Thai bank ATMs are charging a 180 baht fee per withdrawal for MasterCards, but at least AEON and Citibank ATMs (the latter only exist in Bangkok) are only charging 150 baht per withdrawal for MasterCards.

Then, there's how much you can withdrawal per transaction from various Thai ATMs. Bank of Ayudhya (yellow) and Thai Military Bank ATMs both allow up to 30,000 baht per withdrawal -- assuming your home country bank's daily limit allows that large an amount per day. Most of the other Thai bank ATMs are limited to 20,000 or 25,000 baht per withdrawal.

Then there's your home country bank that issued your debit card. Different home country banks charge different amounts of so-called foreign currency fees for using the card outside your home country. A few charge no FCF, some charge 1%, a lot of big banks charge 3% or higher, including sometimes a flat amount plus a % amount. So the higher the FCF fee, the lower the amount of money going into your pocket. So if you're visiting Thailand, one of the most important things you can do is use a bank card with a no or low FCF.

The few isolated instances I referred to above occur when the Thai bank's ATM offers to let you see your withdrawal amount not in Thai baht, but instead in the currency of your home country. If you say YES to that, the bank will give you a very bad/low exchange rate and you'll be losing money, potentially another 2-4%. So, should you ever see a message on the ATM video screen offering to show you your deposit amount in your home currency, DECLINE IT. That deceptive offer is something called Dynamic Currency Conversion, which you should always avoid.

But, back to the beginning: if you wire money into Thailand or do a currency exchange at a currency booth, that's where the particular bank's own individual foreign exchange rates may vary some from bank to bank. But most of the time, if you're using a Thai bank ATM, the rate is going to be identical from ATM to ATM to ATM, assuming you use the same bank card at approximately the same period in the day.

Where there is an ongoing and slight variation in exchange rates is between using a VISA card vs a MasterCard. Generally speaking, VISA cards provide a slightly better exchange rate than their MC counterparts. So, all other things being equal, a VISA card is better than a MasterCard to use abroad -- but that's assuming there are no other meaningful differences between them such as the amount of any foreign currency fees or daily withdrawals limits and such.

So overall, the likely best thing to do is use a VISA card with a no or low foreign currency fee. And use a Thai Military Bank or Bank of Ayudhya ATM that will allow you 30,000 baht per pull, which still is going to cost you the 150 baht Thai ATM fee.

But, if you're willing to be a bit adventurous, you can instead walk into a Thai bank branch with your passport and ask to do a so-called counter withdrawal or cash advance against your debit card. Assuming your card's limit will allow it, you can often withdrawal 40,000 or more in one transaction and avoid the 150 baht ATM fee altogether. The catch is, some Thai bank locations won't do counter withdrawals and instead will direct you to their ATMs. Or, they'll only do a counter withdrawal against a credit card, but not a debit card. But if you're willing to be persistent, you can probably find some branch that will give you the 40,000 baht you want -- hopefully with a no or low Foreign Currency Fee card.

Great summary TGJ.

Just wanted to add, TMB will charge 150 THB for Mastercard cards also.

[ubonrthai]

[Pib's been denied trying to use his U.S. debit card for a counter withdrawal at his local BKK Bank branch, but they were fine to do a cash advance on his credit card.

Did he ask for a cash advance when handing over his debit card? I have a feeling this was a mistake.