Half children!: Encounters with Thais/schools

[Khon Thai Ben Khon Dee]

6 pages and nothing from the troll OP?

He tried to sign back in, but was too racist to remember the password.

[atyclb]

OP post seems to fit a profile of "ghost writer posts" low number of posts and a tv demographic pertinent topic that will almost certainly evoke strong emotions and many responses.

I could be wrong, i dont have a masters degree.

[maccaroni man]

IMO all that matters is their passport is Thai so when the timing is right they can do all the business they want in LOS we call it payback day lol

[onionluke]

I asked my son , just a few minutes ago, if he ever felt bad about what kids at schoolin Thailand called him . He was upset constantly with farang calling ( bokseeda) , receiving punches and threats and hostility . I have posted before that he was barred from the school pick up , a journey of 10km and I had no choice at the time but to take him myself on the bike . <deleted> them , my son is happy here away from that crap .

[Beetlejuice]

OP post seems to fit a profile of "ghost writer posts" low number of posts and a tv demographic pertinent topic that will almost certainly evoke strong emotions and many responses.

I could be wrong, i dont have a masters degree.

I think you are right.

These people create a thread with a topic that they know will provoke a lot of reactions and guaranteed to gather many replies, or in other words, they set the bait, sit back and wait for the fish to bite, the fish being us and in many cases the OP`s will disappear until another time.

I have this vision of some loner sitting on a computer with nothing much else to do and laughing out loud. Must remember to avoid getting enticed into these games and not participating in these types of threads next time

[iancnx]

Troll or not, interesting topic. With all the best will in the world you cannot deny there is a large slice of nationalist racism prevalent in many parts of the country. Only been here 8 years so still learning. I tend to believe that ASEAN will help to improve things in the much longer term. There is undoubtedly a cohort of racist dinosaurs whose extinction is long over due, but I believe in the positives generally. My son is just a year old. I am planning to home school until he is eleven. So 10 years for a NEW education Ministry to sort its sh1t out. But let us not kid ourselves, it will take probably a whole generation to sort out the general political quagmire that we find ourselves in. I hope I can equip my son with the necessary skills, resilience and compassion for him to be at the forefront of the inevitable CHANGE process about to be embarked upon.

[Khon Thai Ben Khon Dee]

I asked my son , just a few minutes ago, if he ever felt bad about what kids at schoolin Thailand called him . He was upset constantly with farang calling ( bokseeda) , receiving punches and threats and hostility . I have posted before that he was barred from the school pick up , a journey of 10km and I had no choice at the time but to take him myself on the bike . fuc_k them ,

Paradise.

[iancnx]

I asked my son , just a few minutes ago, if he ever felt bad about what kids at schoolin Thailand called him . He was upset constantly with farang calling ( bokseeda) , receiving punches and threats and hostility . I have posted before that he was barred from the school pick up , a journey of 10km and I had no choice at the time but to take him myself on the bike . fuc_k them ,

Paradise.

Onionluke please share Amphur location?

[wolfmanjack]

Am I the only one who can understand why they don't want luk kruengs to participate in English language competitions or why the other students might find it to be an unfair advantage? Why even hold the competition, just give the luk krueng the trophy since no one else has even a remote chance of winning.

I understand and I am pretty sure everyone else does that a kid raised in an english speaking home has an advantage. My daughter understood also but it wasn't really fair for the teacher to have my daughter practicing for the contest for weeks then when the time came for her not to be allowed to compete. There wasn't a rule against it so the teacher tried to take advantage of it.

My daughter also told me that there were kids in the contest that could speak about as well as she can. Some of them may have been LK and looked thai or have been attending after hours english classes all of their life. So it would be fair to say that rich kids whose parents can afford tutoring have an unfair advantage over the poor kids. No rule against them entering the contest either.

So where do you draw the line?

By the way my daughter is the only LK in her class and was tied for #2 in her class on the pre onet test. A non LK scored 2 points higher.

[Thai at Heart]

Am I the only one who can understand why they don't want luk kruengs to participate in English language competitions or why the other students might find it to be an unfair advantage? Why even hold the competition, just give the luk krueng the trophy since no one else has even a remote chance of winning.

I understand and I am pretty sure everyone else does that a kid raised in an english speaking home has an advantage. My daughter understood also but it wasn't really fair for the teacher to have my daughter practicing for the contest for weeks then when the time came for her not to be allowed to compete. There wasn't a rule against it so the teacher tried to take advantage of it.

My daughter also told me that there were kids in the contest that could speak about as well as she can. Some of them may have been LK and looked thai or have been attending after hours english classes all of their life. So it would be fair to say that rich kids whose parents can afford tutoring have an unfair advantage over the poor kids. No rule against them entering the contest either.

So where do you draw the line?

By the way my daughter is the only LK in her class and was tied for #2 in her class on the pre onet test. A non LK scored 2 points higher.

My kids old school did it all the time. It defeated the point of the competition. I asked my son if he wanted to enter and he didn't see the point.

The school put pictures up everywhere, but at the end of the day, having john smith when the competition when he is competing against somchai from the local school is basically stupid.

[TheUsualGarbage]

OP post seems to fit a profile of "ghost writer posts" low number of posts and a tv demographic pertinent topic that will almost certainly evoke strong emotions and many responses.

I could be wrong, i dont have a masters degree.

I think you are right.

Agree 100%. I think the OP is fabricated. Luk-krengs do not get turned away from schools due to their ethnicity.

[Dr. Burrito]

Well, my son's doctor, in explaining some health issues to us, told us that half breed kids have this skin problem. I tormented her for saying that.

Idiots!!

Half breed? Good Lord, man, you are watching The Western Channel far too much.

dr. b

[Now or Never]

I know many Thai teachers and the common complaint among them is that the Thai Education system is of a low standard and getting worse.

I suggest you find a good private foreign school.

Educated Thais send their children to good private foreign schools and then send their children overseas for university education.

[wym]

OP post seems to fit a profile of "ghost writer posts" low number of posts and a tv demographic pertinent topic that will almost certainly evoke strong emotions and many responses.

I think you are right.

Agree 100%. I think the OP is fabricated. Luk-krengs do not get turned away from schools due to their ethnicity.

I'm so inclined as well, but from my experience teaching in even very high-status schools' Thai IP/EP programmes, there certainly are times when the LK are publicly "set apart" due to their cultural differences and (perceived-unfair?) English language advantage.

And resentment by low-paid and full-of-themselves Thai teachers against outspoken buck-the-system farang teachers - and much more highly paid - is definitely there, but usually it simmers unspoken except when an administrator is putting us in our place.

So the shoe story also has a whiff of bs about it.

But I wouldn't completely rule out the possibility of either story, this is a big country and sometimes bizarre stuff does happen.

IMO even if true none of it is "racism" as such.

[rct99q]

I know many Thai teachers and the common complaint among them is that the Thai Education system is of a low standard and getting worse.

I suggest you find a good private foreign school.

Educated Thais send their children to good private foreign schools and then send their children overseas for university education.

I work with many and no they do not. The system is as good or as bad as the parents want it to be. Most Thai teachers supplement their childrens education as should all parents.

[wym]

Many of the rich ones certainly do, go see which families are represented in those top international schools.

I've tutored many Thai kids to prepare them to be sent over to the UK to attend boarding schools from 8 or 9 years old.

However most after-school tutoring here is needed exactly because the schools are so bad, In a good system like Finland the kids actually spend relatively little time in school, get to socialize and actually PLAY as children should, don't even start until they're seven and get top results.

[Somtamnication]

Another point to the LK debate is that if they have a full western name, not a Thai first name, they too will be denied the right to compete in English language competitions.

Happened to my son, and to many others in Phuket.

I did tell my wife that under no circumstances will I name my son Titiporn.

[Thai at Heart]

Another point to the LK debate is that if they have a full western name, not a Thai first name, they too will be denied the right to compete in English language competitions.

Happened to my son, and to many others in Phuket.

I did tell my wife that under no circumstances will I name my son Titiporn.

I couldn't do it either.

He.could have been Nakarin . just not doable.

[Xangsamhua]

Being genuinely accepted takes a very very long time. And then at the end, don't be surprised at what you learn even having been friends for decades.

Nationalism is a horrible thing.

Agreed. But there are 3 different levels of nationalism.

Street level.

Gov't level.

'Face' level. (by this I mean appearance)

Unfortunately Thais have symptoms of all three and 'loving' it. One of their 'culture' things.

I think the problem is "chauvinism" rather than "nationalism".

chauvinism

ˈʃəʊv(ɪ)nɪz(ə)m/

noun

1. 1.

   exaggerated or aggressive patriotism.

   synonyms: jingoism, excessive patriotism, blind patriotism, excessive nationalism, sectarianism, isolationism, excessive loyalty, flag-waving, xenophobia, racism, racialism, racial prejudice,ethnocentrism, ethnocentricity;

   partisanship, partiality, prejudice, bias, discrimination, intolerance,bigotry;

   male chauvinism, sexism, misogyny

   "they have a tendency towards small-mindedness and chauvinism"

Edited February 12, 2014 by Xangsamhua

[Xangsamhua]

OP post seems to fit a profile of "ghost writer posts" low number of posts and a tv demographic pertinent topic that will almost certainly evoke strong emotions and many responses.

I could be wrong, i dont have a masters degree.

I think you are right.

These people create a thread with a topic that they know will provoke a lot of reactions and guaranteed to gather many replies, or in other words, they set the bait, sit back and wait for the fish to bite, the fish being us and in many cases the OP`s will disappear until another time.

I have this vision of some loner sitting on a computer with nothing much else to do and laughing out loud. Must remember to avoid getting enticed into these games and not participating in these types of threads next time

I have a feeling you might be right. I worked in three Thai schools, government and private, in Bangkok and a provincial capital, for 13 years and never heard of such a thing as the OP claims. There might, however, be some discrimination against dual national English speaking kids in some matters, e.g. scholarships, where English is a criterion.

[wym]

Came across a brilliant article on "discrimination" - http://martinfowler.com/bliki/AlienatingAtmosphere.html

the context is women in the STEM arena, but I think very thought provoking wrt some of the discussions here.

Marginally relevant here, but couldn't find the "you idiots" thread anymore. . .

[onionluke]

I asked my son , just a few minutes ago, if he ever felt bad about what kids at schoolin Thailand called him . He was upset constantly with farang calling ( bokseeda) , receiving punches and threats and hostility . I have posted before that he was barred from the school pick up , a journey of 10km and I had no choice at the time but to take him myself on the bike . fuc_k them ,

Paradise.

Onionluke please share Amphur location?

That was back in Nadee 10 km south of Det Udom , about 50km south of Ubon . The village pre-school , was nothing more than a holding pen . The primary school in Det was privately run with pleasant teachers. The village school pick up ran the children to various schools in Det for 20 bhat .

My son is now in a charitable school for ethnic minorities in Hong Kong where tolerance is taught and we live in the Amphur of Lamma Island .

[cup-O-coffee]

The Head Teacher is quite right to be concerned, the issue is disruption to the learning speed of the class. Why not tell him/her that you've given your child explicit instruction to learn at half his/her normal speed thus allowing the rest of the class to keep up.

Apologies. I simply had to quote this again. Spectacular. Amazing. Brilliant. Very very well said.

[cup-O-coffee]

You really should have thought to get that discourse on pen-cam and put it on You Tube. They would have to create some kind of award for that. Maybe send a copy to every foreign embassy in the ASEAN. ...'would sure be a showstopper!

Anyways, the info is worth knowing, and merely more concrete substance for me to wonder why anyone would ever want to send their child to a glorified day-care (a.k.a. kennel). These places are not schools. Calling them such is simple denial.

[Espinete]

I am a single (Farang) dad with a 6 year old child. With school registrations I never encountered problems or xenofobic behavior. At least from the school management (local public school). In contrary, but perhaps due to my personal situation managements are more flexible towards a single parent?

What I DO encounter is xenofobism from parents. It is rather hard to get my child playing after school time with other kids. Often she tells me she is being teased. And I am called a "stupid buffalo" by other children. Of course when I am not present. When I am present they all perform the drilled 'Wai' to me. But parents; they do not like me. I work in Thailand, pay tax, have a child at a (free) school, drive a nice car, etc. That is not what entered in their brains during their time of education. A foreigner living legally in Thailand and 'lifting' on the social benefits of the country. The topic gossip I better leave out now because that horrible part of Thai society.....I can fill pages what has been said or speculated about me by parents in 'my' town.

[chiang mai]

The Head Teacher is quite right to be concerned, the issue is disruption to the learning speed of the class. Why not tell him/her that you've given your child explicit instruction to learn at half his/her normal speed thus allowing the rest of the class to keep up.

Apologies. I simply had to quote this again. Spectacular. Amazing. Brilliant. Very very well said.

Most posters simply don't get satire these days, it's terribly sad, really.

[laolover88]

I thank you all for your posts. I feel the thread that really emerges as a problem for the schools and the kids is

'disruption'..Just by being there and not being 100% docile Thai the kids are causing a problem. My nephew has encountered a further strange issue....teachers appear more interested in the state of his kid's fingernails and hair than

in their intellectual capacity!!!

For me this has raised another issue, too. I have always assumed, on the evidence, from my business and domestic life,

that Thais were pretty confident

and self assured..traits that I admire...but may be,

actually, they are, on the whole as a people, not confident, very insecure, not sure why, and that may be why foreignersencounter the odd mixture of bravado, insolence and deference to rules that characterises many of

my encounters?? I don't know...what do you think?

[featography]

I, an American, married to a Central Thai woman, and having a 3 y.o. Luk Khrueng in K2 we are both somewhat surprised, but not, with this story. We enrolled our daughter in,and love Tonkla school, here in Chiang Mai. They emphasize bilingual education, and have many children Luk Krueng farang as well as Luk Krueng Asian attending. I.m sorry to say they do not yet go as high as grade P6, but are adding grade levels as the school grows. The reason I bring this up, is you might, with your wife, contact in person the Tonkla's administration for suggestions as to what schools are available in the area with similar criteria as Tonkla. If you are serious and want another school option, I can contact another American who has his son enrolled in another school down town C.M. He mentioned that the school his Luk Krueng son attends is as good or better than Tonkla. Send me a private message if interested, I will get more information from him.

[eezergood]

So if this is the attitude with those who are half-Thai and bilingual (and it most certainly is, especially amongst the lesser educated Thai) isn't it stupefying how certain members who regularly post here claim, and truly believe, they are embraced as "one of us" by their neighbors and other Thais?

Chiang Mai is on target. The other parents will not like a "half breed" far outperforming their precious ones. Think of the disruption in English class, when, after twelve years of lessons, the other kids are saying, "Where you go?" while little Luke is saying, "Where are you going?"

Confusion!

Maybe it is not a matter of the LKs outperforming the other students but a disciplinary problem: The LKs male or female might be much bigger in some instances than their Thai contemporaries and tend to be bullies or the LKs are picked on by their fellow Thai students and the LKs' parents come in threatening legal action against the school for the school's lack of proper supervision.

In short - Loss of face......

Enough said really,

[Nip]

A Thai friend rang and made an appointment for my teenage daughter to enroll in a Christian school in Chonburi. When we arrived after traveling from south Thailand it was clear she was European. There was confusion all round the general office and suddenly there were no more vacancies that term. Suspecting this to be a racist inspired refusal I said ok what about next term then? Confusion within the ranks. A phone call is made and within seconds a not so Christian Brother appears and puts forward the excuse they feel my daughter would struggle with oral and written Thai. When I countered saying that she was not just fluent in Thai but Chinese and English too the not so Christian Brother said he was busy and attempted to walk away. I of course had my say when it was clear she would not be enrolled but the bottom line is the racism that starts in the family home spreads to the schools and it is palpable all over Thailand.

Total crap.

Many Christian schools in Thailand are run on strict orthodox Christian principles, they expect their pupils to abide by these principles, some unkind people may describe these as bible bashers.

If for any reasons the school believes a prospective pupil would not fit into this category, then the school would recommend that, that particular school with those particular curriculum's may not be suitable for certain students for those reasons. The same applies whether it be a Jewish school, Buddhist or whatever.

Also any foreign child that wishes to enrol in a Thai school would be welcome providing the child could prove his/her proficiency in their Thai language skills and no way would these children be instantly rejected without first being offered to take a test and without an evaluation to see culture wise whether or not the child could fit in and would be happy and content at an all Thai school.

This is about compatibility and what`s best for the child`s interests, not about racism or prejudice.

In your post you have made some valid points but some incorrect assumptions. And describing my post as being crap was crass. This was an international school. If you want to talk racism in Thai schools I will talk racism. And I would humbly suggest that I have far greater terms of reference than yours but would never assume or state that you were talking 'Crap' And I am not a pugnacious know all but know nothing drunken uneducated street warrior but a logical adult who always looks for positives before becoming embroiled in somewhat negative subjects such as this. Anyone who can not see that Thailand is plagued by many varied inbred forms of racism is either very fortunate or very naive. I could post shocking photographs of a beating my 12 year old (European) daughter received in a school in NST that required numerous trips to the local hospital. The photos are quite shocking. In another less racist environment criminal charges would have been filed and the culprits severely punished for such a racist hate crime. But not in this school. Not even a caution issued. She was moved to this school because of racist taunting in her previous school in Isaan. Her crime? Being different. She has lived in Thailand since she was two years old and writes and speaks Thai fluently indeed better than most of her classmates. She is also fluent in English and on many occasion's has been chastised by illiterate Thai English teachers who 'Thailand me come from' I approached the head master in the NST school to discuss what had happened to my daughter and he refused to meet with me. His assistant who was actually very understanding of the situation apologised and brought me to the deputy head who looked me straight between the eyes and said; 'The foreigner think this is the Land of Smiles. But he is wrong.' In the same manner and tone as the police man in Phuket when I dared to attempt file a criminal report against a Thai said; " Foreigner you stupid if you think Thai police help you against Thai people. You must believe in Santa Claus!" The final act of the defiance by the school (boarding) when my daughter left was to distribute her personal belongings among the other students. In all of this I managed to remain calm as I was aware that my daughters new school would require documentation from this school. Alas I could have had my day because the school refused to forward her educational records and receipts of fee payments made. In order to rectify this situation my daughter is now doing two years of school simultaneously in two different schools. The reason I traveled to Chonburi was that I was simply looking for a Christian school for my daughter. Before traveling by air to Bangkok and by car to Chonburi I called the school administrator 3 times to make sure there was a vacancy and was assured that there was. However when I walked into the office I was met with Thai racism head on. This non Christian Brother who appeared could not look me in the eye. Could not give me a reason as to why my daughter could not be enrolled. He first said there were no vacancies and suggested that she enroll in the next term. When I called his bluff and attempted to enroll her for the next term he said better I come back again. He flatly refused to allow me put her name down for the next term. Racism of course is not confined to Thailand but when you speak and understand Thai a whole new world of understanding of the Kingdom unfolds. When I say understand Thai I refer to understanding the subtleties of the language and its true meanings. And yes I can understand that Thai's have had similarly bad experiences with foreigners but if you want the truth might I suggest you allow alcohol be your guide. Anger an inebriated Thai and all the subdued racism pours fourth in abundance. I would also suggest that a lot of what is happening in Bangkok at the moment has roots in inter Thai racism. You should never assume that your opinion is the only opinion. If others have experienced racism and they clearly have you have no right to label their comments as crap. I have met many many non racist Thai people and have many many Thai friends but I also know where their loyalties will lie if push came to shove. I have chosen herein not to shred your nonsensical comments as you have the right to your opinion I only ask that you accept that others have more a more balanced realistic view of living in Thailand than you. If you are happy with your experiences of living in Thailand I am happy for you but please don't expect or try to belittle mine or force your opinions on everybody else.