Missing Malaysia Airlines jet carrying 239 triggers Southeast Asia search

[coma]

I am with Canuckamuck. Theories of a controlled landing under the circumstances we know of, just doesn't wash. Why would it be flown to the end of its fuel limit then ditched into the middle of nowhere ? They would have had more than enough time to "ditch" at a time and place the their choosing. Did the crew all of a sudden get the guilts up at the last minute and tried to save all on board ? No !

Interesting watching BBC last night about the Chinese picking up pings last weekend, far from where the Australian Ocean Shield picked up the latest acoustic sounds. The Aussies basically accused the Chinese of picking up sounds from its own vessel. lol ! Just another Chinese red herding that has cost time and money. Remember the Chinese were the first to locate debris in the South China Sea ? Remember they were the first to locate debris in the Southern Indian Ocean ? Then they were first at locating "pings". They are quite similar to myself and the game of golf. They have all the gear but have no idea.

With the ever evolving adjustments to the search area, it just shows that they still have NO idea where the aircraft is. Or if it is even in the Indian Ocean. Like another poster said. It is more a keeping up appearances act for the families and world press.

[boomerangutang]

If it WAS suicide, it looks like somebody went to great lengths to hide the body as it were. The ultimate 'No suicide note' story.

Possible I suppose. Suicide whilst leaving an indelible mark on the world. Never to be forgotten as it were.

In any event it looks like somebody went to great lengths to conceal flight path and final resting place.

So, suicide or other?

If it was suicide and the pilot intended to hide his tracks as much as possible, he did a good job at it. All indications, thus far, point to this being the toughest-to-solve air disaster investigation in history, with all due respect to Emilia Earhart.

Concerning lack of floating debris: All the bouyant items, such seat cushions, are within the hull. If a pilot made a hard entry in to or on to the water, the hull would likely have split - spilling its contents. However, if he made a comparative slow entry, the hull might have stayed intact. I don't know how that could be done, but there must be ways of putting a plane in to the water which are comparatively slow.

Note: when the Silk Air plane went down in an Indonesian river bed, it went nose first (at full throttle?) and wound up being buried deep in mud.

[Chicog]

http://www.radioaustralia.net.au/international/2014-04-09/malaysia-airlines-mh370-ocean-shield-detects-two-more-signals-in-search-for-missing-flight/1293270

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[coma]

If it WAS suicide, it looks like somebody went to great lengths to hide the body as it were. The ultimate 'No suicide note' story.

Possible I suppose. Suicide whilst leaving an indelible mark on the world. Never to be forgotten as it were.

In any event it looks like somebody went to great lengths to conceal flight path and final resting place.

So, suicide or other?

If it was suicide and the pilot intended to hide his tracks as much as possible, he did a good job at it. All indications, thus far, point to this being the toughest-to-solve air disaster investigation in history, with all due respect to Emilia Earhart.

Concerning lack of floating debris: All the bouyant items, such seat cushions, are within the hull. If a pilot made a hard entry in to or on to the water, the hull would likely have split - spilling its contents. However, if he made a comparative slow entry, the hull might have stayed intact. I don't know how that could be done, but there must be ways of putting a plane in to the water which are comparatively slow.

Note: when the Silk Air plane went down in an Indonesian river bed, it went nose first (at full throttle?) and wound up being buried deep in mud.

If it was suicide. And financial gain being one of possible many reasons for an individual to commit such an act. Then wouldn't it be in the best interest of the culprit to conceal the act of suicide for insurance purposes ? Wouldn't the majority of life insurance policies not include suicide ? At this stage and with all the time that has passed, it sure would be difficult for anybody to prove suicide, let alone any other cause for the aircraft's disappearance.

[lopburi3]

http://www.radioaustralia.net.au/international/2014-04-09/malaysia-airlines-mh370-ocean-shield-detects-two-more-signals-in-search-for-missing-flight/1293270

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Above appears to be rather important - new signals last night.

Malaysia Airlines MH370: Ocean Shield detects two more signals in search for missing flight

Updated 9 April 2014, 13:16 AEST

[NeverSure]

If it WAS suicide, it looks like somebody went to great lengths to hide the body as it were. The ultimate 'No suicide note' story.

Possible I suppose. Suicide whilst leaving an indelible mark on the world. Never to be forgotten as it were.

In any event it looks like somebody went to great lengths to conceal flight path and final resting place.

So, suicide or other?

If it was suicide and the pilot intended to hide his tracks as much as possible, he did a good job at it. All indications, thus far, point to this being the toughest-to-solve air disaster investigation in history, with all due respect to Emilia Earhart.

Concerning lack of floating debris: All the bouyant items, such seat cushions, are within the hull. If a pilot made a hard entry in to or on to the water, the hull would likely have split - spilling its contents. However, if he made a comparative slow entry, the hull might have stayed intact. I don't know how that could be done, but there must be ways of putting a plane in to the water which are comparatively slow.

Note: when the Silk Air plane went down in an Indonesian river bed, it went nose first (at full throttle?) and wound up being buried deep in mud.

If it was suicide. And financial gain being one of possible many reasons for an individual to commit such an act. Then wouldn't it be in the best interest of the culprit to conceal the act of suicide for insurance purposes ? Wouldn't the majority of life insurance policies not include suicide ? At this stage and with all the time that has passed, it sure would be difficult for anybody to prove suicide, let alone any other cause for the aircraft's disappearance.

I don't know about most policies or other countries, but my US based life insurance policy covers suicide but only beginning 2 years after the policy is issued.

[WorriedNoodle]

Even tho the news is centered on the pings off the Ozi west coast now I am left puzzled why the press reported the following THREE stories and never seemed to close them out with answers? Anyone else help?

1. What did the New Zealander actually see from the offshore platform in the South China Sea he said was a crashing airplane falling from the sky - same time as MH370 flight went missing?

2. What were the various different peoples in Mauritius all seeing and hearing when they reported a low flying aircraft flying by at same time MH370 might have diverted there?

3. Why have the FIVE people who checked into MH370 and but never got on the flight and had their bags removed never been identified and had their faces and good luck stories pasted all over the newspapers?

Just wondering how these stories can be thrown out there with no closure at all.... but with such long threads as this maybe all answered and I missed it?

[Chicog]

Even tho the news is centered on the pings off the Ozi west coast now I am left puzzled why the press reported the following THREE stories and never seemed to close them out with answers? Anyone else help?

1. What did the New Zealander actually see from the offshore platform in the South China Sea he said was a crashing airplane falling from the sky - same time as MH370 flight went missing?

2. What were the various different peoples in Mauritius all seeing and hearing when they reported a low flying aircraft flying by at same time MH370 might have diverted there?

3. Why have the FIVE people who checked into MH370 and but never got on the flight and had their bags removed never been identified and had their faces and good luck stories pasted all over the newspapers?

Just wondering how these stories can be thrown out there with no closure at all.... but with such long threads as this maybe all answered and I missed it?

I'm sure once they find the plane and the recorders it will determine any need to pursue these leads.

Pointless doing so now IMO.

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[Chicog]

From CNN:

"They believe the signals to be consistent with the specification and description of a flight data recorder," Houston said.

"I'm now optimistic," he added, "we'll find the aircraft or what's left of the aircraft in the not too distant future,

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[coma]

3. Why have the FIVE people who checked into MH370 and but never got on the flight and had their bags removed never been identified and had their faces and good luck stories pasted all over the newspapers?

Just wondering how these stories can be thrown out there with no closure at all.... but with such long threads as this maybe all answered and I missed it?

Think this once again. If you would be one of those 5 people, would you like to go to the front of the media and say how lucky you were.. while the families of the people who died are mouring their loved ones?

Furthermore there would be all kind of suspicious rumours about these "5 survivors" and the media would be knocking their doors. Not an pleasant situation to be.

By protecting their identifies, the authorities and the media has done more good than bad.

Where have you been ? This angle was cleared up 4 weeks ago. NOBODY checked in then did not board the plane. Five people that had booked and paid for the flight failed to show up on the day. This happens on a lot of flights. That is why they have wait lists. And in this occasion five people from the wait list were bumped up on the manifest.

[hawker9000]

If it WAS suicide, it looks like somebody went to great lengths to hide the body as it were. The ultimate 'No suicide note' story.

Possible I suppose. Suicide whilst leaving an indelible mark on the world. Never to be forgotten as it were.

In any event it looks like somebody went to great lengths to conceal flight path and final resting place.

So, suicide or other?

If it was suicide and the pilot intended to hide his tracks as much as possible, he did a good job at it. All indications, thus far, point to this being the toughest-to-solve air disaster investigation in history, with all due respect to Emilia Earhart.

Concerning lack of floating debris: All the bouyant items, such seat cushions, are within the hull. If a pilot made a hard entry in to or on to the water, the hull would likely have split - spilling its contents. However, if he made a comparative slow entry, the hull might have stayed intact. I don't know how that could be done, but there must be ways of putting a plane in to the water which are comparatively slow.

Note: when the Silk Air plane went down in an Indonesian river bed, it went nose first (at full throttle?) and wound up being buried deep in mud.

Your information isn't really accurate, and I think you continue to underestimate the effects of high speed water impact. The Silk Air flight (Flight 185) went down subsequent to a nearly vertical dive from 35,000ft, with speeds exceeding the speed of sound for at least a few seconds during the dive. The speed was so great the aircraft actually started to come apart before impact. Not a single body or body part was found intact. Only six of the passengers could ever be positively identified. The entire aircraft and all of its passengers are said to have disintegrated upon impact. The tail section (and other parts of the airplane) separated entirely passing 12,000ft due to the aerodynamic forces imposed by the high speed. The time it took from 35,000ft to impact was less than a minute (do that math; that's an average vertical speed of almost 400mph; if not a perfectly vertical dive, then even faster!). Most of the wreckage debris was found within a relatively small area of about 200ft by 260ft in the Musi River near Palembang, Sumatra.

This incident actually provides a fairly good example of the extent of the disintegration that occurs as the result of high-speed water impact, although coming apart prior to impact as it did would actually mitigate the extent of the disintegration somewhat.

I know there was a Canadian TV presentation concerning this incident - I have no idea how accurate or complete their presentation of these facts might have been.

Edited April 9, 2014 by hawker9000

[Carmine6]

http://www.radioaustralia.net.au/international/2014-04-09/malaysia-airlines-mh370-ocean-shield-detects-two-more-signals-in-search-for-missing-flight/1293270

An Australian search vessel has picked up two more signals from what could be the black box from missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.

I don't get the article. Does it mean that they have detected two more signal sources, which are continuous. Or they detected two more pings and nothing else?

If it's the two more pings, what could cause that the pings are not continuous, but still happen every now and then? If I understood correctly, the pings are supposed to be transmitted once in every second.

These are a continuous series of basically a click every second. Like an audio version of a strobe. One was 5 minutes 32 seconds long, and the other about 7 minutes.

http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-updates/missing-malaysia-airlines-flight-mh370-more-signals-detected/story-fnizu68q-1226878441833

Regarding the initial 2 signals, here's a description:

“The analysis determined that a very stable distinct and clear signal was detected at 33.331 kilohertz and that it consistently pulsed at a 1.106 second interval,”

[webfact]

MH370 search chief hopeful of finding wreckage within 'days'
Agence France-Presse
PERTH, Australia

The Australian heading the search for missing Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 said Wednesday he hoped wreckage from the plane would now be found within days.

"Hopefully with lots of transmissions we’ll have a tight, small area and hopefully in a matter of days we’ll be able to find something on the bottom that might confirm that this is the last resting place of MH370," Angus Houston told reporters.

So far four transmissions have been detected by the Australian ship Ocean Shield, which is using US Navy equipment to try to pick up signals emitted by the plane’s black box recorders.

"I believe we are searching in the right area," Houston said, after revealing that expert analysis of the first two signals indicated they were consistent which those from flight data recorders.

He said once the work searching for the sounds in the water was completed, and there was no hope of hearing any more, an autonomous underwater vehicle would be sent down to have a look.

"I’m not going to confirm anything until someone lays eyes on the wreckage," he said.

"We need to make hay while the sun shines. We need all the data we can," he said, in reference to the weakening black box battery.

AFP


-- The Nation 2014-04-09

[WorriedNoodle]

3. Why have the FIVE people who checked into MH370 and but never got on the flight and had their bags removed never been identified and had their faces and good luck stories pasted all over the newspapers?

Just wondering how these stories can be thrown out there with no closure at all.... but with such long threads as this maybe all answered and I missed it?

Think this once again. If you would be one of those 5 people, would you like to go to the front of the media and say how lucky you were.. while the families of the people who died are mouring their loved ones?

Furthermore there would be all kind of suspicious rumours about these "5 survivors" and the media would be knocking their doors. Not an pleasant situation to be.

By protecting their identifies, the authorities and the media has done more good than bad.

Where have you been ? This angle was cleared up 4 weeks ago. NOBODY checked in then did not board the plane. Five people that had booked and paid for the flight failed to show up on the day. This happens on a lot of flights. That is why they have wait lists. And in this occasion five people from the wait list were bumped up on the manifest.

I did not even follow if the persons did check in or just booked/paid their flights, it was not essential.

My point is that not all the information has to be realeased to the press and to the public. The relevant people know the details, we don't need to know.

Thanks for closing out this part of the story for me. Not checking in at all sounds very reasonable versus checking in the getting off again on a flight that has likely crashed. Had it been the latter then that should at least be explained like the two guys on fake passports, even with identities kept private.

[P45Mustang]

Well, if it was a can of beer at 6000 metres, the Aussies would find it.

So i'm confident.

[GentlemanJim]

An area the size of Scotland?! To be searched with an underwater vehicle?? To take weeks???

Wouldn't it be more like lifetimes? (And that's assuming the area defined for the search IS actually where the aircraft is.)

Certainly more than weeks but less than a lifetime. A multibeam and/or side scan sonar surveying a swath of 1km wide at 5km/hr (5km2 coverage/hr) should have a bin size small enough to pick up large debris pieces. Scotland is 78,772 Km2. One vessel should in theory be able to cover the area in 15,754 hours or 656 days. Put 4 vessels out there and you cover the area in 164 days. In reality there would be time lost for turn arounds, weather, technical problems etc.

It is practical to seach this area, its all a matter of how much money you want to throw at it.

The ocean bed in the search area is very mountainous, sadly, I think a life time would be closer to the mark.

[Tywais]

A Chinese patrol ship has said that multiple floating objects have been spotted in the Indian Ocean close to where an Australian ship detected suspicious signals.

The Haixun 01 is going to the zone, according to Xinhua news agency, after the items were spotted by a patrol aircraft.

It is heading to the search zone of 75,000 square kilometres where they were spotted.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/missing-flight-mh370-live-updates-3390995#ixzz2yNFa2eFA

[canman]

An area the size of Scotland?! To be searched with an underwater vehicle?? To take weeks???

Wouldn't it be more like lifetimes? (And that's assuming the area defined for the search IS actually where the aircraft is.)

Certainly more than weeks but less than a lifetime. A multibeam and/or side scan sonar surveying a swath of 1km wide at 5km/hr (5km2 coverage/hr) should have a bin size small enough to pick up large debris pieces. Scotland is 78,772 Km2. One vessel should in theory be able to cover the area in 15,754 hours or 656 days. Put 4 vessels out there and you cover the area in 164 days. In reality there would be time lost for turn arounds, weather, technical problems etc.

It is practical to seach this area, its all a matter of how much money you want to throw at it.

The ocean bed in the search area is very mountainous, sadly, I think a life time would be closer to the mark.

There is not much bathometry in this area. From what I can see on google earth it does not look too bad. I would call it hilly rather than mountainous. The topography of the seabed may complicate the the seach slightly but not significantly.

[Asiantravel]

One month on from the disappearance of Malaysian flight MH370, Katia Moskvitch asked aviation experts how we should redesign planes to avoid such an event happening again.

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20140407-six-ways-to-avoid-losing-a-plane

[fire and ice]

Well, if it was a can of beer at 6000 metres, the Aussies would find it.

So i'm confident.

Only if it was still cold.

[Tywais]

Ping geography: Source Independent.co.uk

[P45Mustang]

No worries mate.

Castlemaine 4X

[draftvader]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-26950387

Teams searching for the missing Malaysia Airlines plane have reacquired signals that could be consistent with "black box" flight recorders.

[GentlemanJim]

An area the size of Scotland?! To be searched with an underwater vehicle?? To take weeks???

Wouldn't it be more like lifetimes? (And that's assuming the area defined for the search IS actually where the aircraft is.)

Certainly more than weeks but less than a lifetime. A multibeam and/or side scan sonar surveying a swath of 1km wide at 5km/hr (5km2 coverage/hr) should have a bin size small enough to pick up large debris pieces. Scotland is 78,772 Km2. One vessel should in theory be able to cover the area in 15,754 hours or 656 days. Put 4 vessels out there and you cover the area in 164 days. In reality there would be time lost for turn arounds, weather, technical problems etc.

It is practical to seach this area, its all a matter of how much money you want to throw at it.

The ocean bed in the search area is very mountainous, sadly, I think a life time would be closer to the mark.

There is not much bathometry in this area. From what I can see on google earth it does not look too bad. I would call it hilly rather than mountainous. The topography of the seabed may complicate the the seach slightly but not significantly.

As you bow to our experience above the water I will certainly bow to yours below it. I want you to be right. We all need answers, firstly of course from a compassionate point of view for the next of kin, and secondly, we involved in the industry do not want this to happen again if we can help it and at the moment we really do not know how to do that until we get a clue as to why and how this happened.

[P45Mustang]

Right. Back to the story.

So.

As events unfold, we move from the cynicism of many that it is nowhere near the Indian Ocean to:

'Well it may be down there but the ocean floor is tricky.'

It seems pretty clear to me that they will find chunks of metal down there, and the only chunks of metal are likely to be from MH370.

Once they find aircraft parts there is a very high probability they will find the black box.

When the black box is analysed there will be detailed information about who said what to who, what interference took place, and may provide clues to who did what, and why they did it.

I look forward to hearing the outcome.

Cheers.

[EyesWideOpen]

Right. Back to the story.

So.

As events unfold, we move from the cynicism of many that it is nowhere near the Indian Ocean to:

'Well it may be down there but the ocean floor is tricky.'

It seems pretty clear to me that they will find chunks of metal down there, and the only chunks of metal are likely to be from MH370.

Once they find aircraft parts there is a very high probability they will find the black box.

When the black box is analysed there will be detailed information about who said what to who, what interference took place, and may provide clues to who did what, and why they did it.

I look forward to hearing the outcome.

Cheers.

My understanding is that the cockpit voice recorder only records for two hours, looping over

the previous block of time. So if they do find it, there will be a whole lot of who said what to who

missing....... I suspect the airline industry will be changing this period of time to the length of a

flight.

[T_Dog]

Right. Back to the story.

So.

As events unfold, we move from the cynicism of many that it is nowhere near the Indian Ocean to:

'Well it may be down there but the ocean floor is tricky.'

It seems pretty clear to me that they will find chunks of metal down there, and the only chunks of metal are likely to be from MH370.

Once they find aircraft parts there is a very high probability they will find the black box.

When the black box is analysed there will be detailed information about who said what to who, what interference took place, and may provide clues to who did what, and why they did it.

I look forward to hearing the outcome.

Cheers.

I don't think they will learn much from the voice recorder, as it has a limited record time. The only thing that will be heard is Bitchin Betty, the computerized system voice calling out alerts as the first engine runs out of fuel and various conditions occur. They might learn more from the digital flight data recorder, but the airframe will likely hold the most clues to what happened. It is not going to be a short process.

[P45Mustang]

Yep 2 hr voice record seems crazy.

The box should give us a clue on whether it flew to Diego Garcia, via Pakistan, after a meteor hit it presumably?

[retell]

Well, if it was a can of beer at 6000 metres, the Aussies would find it.

So i'm confident.

Only if it was still cold.

At that depth about 2 c.

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[retell]

Are the thinking of a name for the search area , triangle is taken so maybe Perth Pentacle

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