The "H" word now seen by many as mildly offensive and dated

[Jingthing]

I'm posting this because I think it's interesting, and I agree anti-gay forces use the "H" word (homosexual) to insult us (deliberately not saying GAY), but I'm not entirely sure that this article is correct about the future of the "H" word.

The reason I'm skeptical is because of the word -- heterosexual -- which in no way would be considered offensive. What are we supposed to call heterosexual people? Straight? Isn't that kind of slang and also confusing as it also refers to non-drug users, people with respectable jobs, etc.? Some anti-gay people may call them just "normal" but that's a dig at gay people.

I wonder why this article did not address the issue I raise about the relationship of the two words.

Other than that, I basically agree with article. The word is mostly used in these times as a way of asserting refusal to accept our own term -- GAY.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/23/fashion/gays-lesbians-the-term-homosexual.html?_r=0

...

Franklin E. Kameny, a gay rights pioneer, coined the phrase “Gay is Good” in 1968 as a way to help strip away some of the negative association. By then, gay had become the preferred term among gays and lesbians. But it would take decades for the rest of the country to catch on.

...

Scholars expect the use of the term to eventually fall away entirely.

“These shifts always reflect a change in sensibility,” said Geoffrey Nunberg, a linguist who teaches at Berkeley. “That’s what happened when ‘Negro’ yields to ‘black’ and ‘African-American.’ It’s just an old-fashioned word that denotes a generally neutral but old-fashioned sensibility.”

Edited March 23, 2014 by Jingthing

[NeverSure]

If I say Black or Negro I mean no offense. Most of the black slaves that were in America back in that time didn't come from Africa. It was a lot more profitable for slavers with slaving ships to get them from closer places like Jamaica. They had black native agents who would round them up and have them waiting for slaving ships. (At a very good profit, of course.)

So in a way I don't buy the "African-American" bit. I actually don't see black. I see people. I play music and some of my best friends and group members have been black and I just see them as nice people who are great musicians. The same is true if I do business with them.

If America is nothing else, it is diverse. It's called a melting pot. There are large groups of every race and nationality and sexual orientation and I don't have the time or energy to worry about differences. I look at the character of the person before letting him be my friend regardless of any differences.

Now my grandfather's generation was different that way. He would say "He's a really big and strong Swede." Hell, I hadn't noticed that the guy had Swedish heritage, and wouldn't have known how to tell. So times change.

Now I want to tell you something. I resent the fact that gays hijacked the word gay. It used to mean happy and festive. "Have a Merry Christmas. Make your Yuletide gay." "Gay Paree." Hallmark cards has nixed the word gay and now says "Don we now our FUN apparel."

IMHO heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual are more like medical or scientific terms. I don't use them any more. I use Straight, Gay, and Bi. But they still put the same connotation on someone.

So again, I wish this group, who I accept totally as just another group of people, hadn't hijacked the word gay and had chosen something else. But it is what it is and I refer to them as gay.

Cheers

[sustento]

Dear Lord - have we found something else that offends us? There are times (not often) when I wish I was straight. At least there'd be less to be offended about.

[Jingthing]

I think black is still OK. The black people I know in the USA mostly say black. So I'll keep saying black until I start hearing OH NO YOU DI'INT from black people! African-American is in my view, just too long! Nobody says Negro anymore in the U.S. -- except some senility cases. The other N word, that's something else, a slur that's OK for the slurred to use but not anyone else.

As far as "hijacking" the word gay. Oh cry me a river! Language is DYNAMIC. Deal with it. That's such a tired and tedious complaint. Gay people are still fighting for BASIC CIVIL rights ... in the majority of U.N. nations gay is ILLEGAL, in a number of countries there is the DEATH PENALTY for gay people ... and we're still hearing insipid WHINING about "hijacking" a word? Oy bloody vey!

Edited March 23, 2014 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Dear Lord - have we found something else that offends us? There are times (not often) when I wish I was straight. At least there'd be less to be offended about.

You know, please don't exaggerate about this. Nobody is saying homosexual is a slur word. The article was about how it is being phased out culturally. It also points out quite correctly that it is used intentionally by politically anti-gay civil rights people to make a point that they do not respect calling gay people the word that the majority of gay people do call themselves. I don't think homosexual will EVER be a slur per se, but I do think the trend will continue against it. I just don't see it going away for the reason I mentioned before.

Edited March 23, 2014 by Jingthing

[NeverSure]

I think black is still OK. The black people I know in the USA mostly say black. So I'll keep saying black until I start hearing OH NO YOU DI'INT from black people! African-American is in my view, just too long! Nobody says Negro anymore in the U.S. -- except some senility cases. The other N word, that's something else, a slur that's OK for the slurred to use but not anyone else.

As far as "hijacking" the word gay. Oh cry me a river! Language is DYNAMIC. Deal with it. That's such a tired and tedious complaint. Gay people are still fighting for BASIC CIVIL rights ... in the majority of U.N. nations gay is ILLEGAL, in a number of countries there is the DEATH PENALTY for gay people ... and we're still hearing insipid WHINING about "hijacking" a word? Oy bloody vey!

Tough shirt. I'm allowed my preferences too, and we are allowed to disagree.

All of my life, "Native Americans" were called Indians. I think that's because an early explorer believed he had reached India. Now I'm supposed to say "Native American" when that's a crock. The fossil and ancient dwelling record show that there were "people who came before."

There is a rural road near me that's called "Dead Indian Road" and has been all of my life. Supposedly an early settler found a dead Indian on it and the term stuck. Not long ago the Indians objected but got nowhere. What are we supposed to called it? Deceased Native American Road? They finally compromised and changed the name to Dead Indian Memorial Road.

If Gays think they have it tough in America, they need to look at the slaves and the massacre of the Indians.

BTW, here's "someone" ("Some" motorcycle instructor) riding a Harley Wide Glide, kicking the crap out of a kid on what should be a much faster BMW 1200 R, riding on Dead Indian Memorial Road. The climb in elevation is about one mile and the steepness is hard to see from the helmet cam. The Harley looks like it's on tracks and the BMW is all over the road with major speed variations.

They are having a gay old time.

[I Like Thai]

The Blacks from Jamaica are a mixture of Black African slaves and White Irish slaves.

I think that somewhere in the world there is a committee, locked away somewhere, who spend their entire existence deciding what is the next word that is to become offensive.

When this word is released, another group of people, who spend their entire existence looking for something to be offended by, latch onto it. Then they complain until it is accepted by the world as offensive..

[Jingthing]

In my experience, people who complain all the time about gays "hijacking" the word gay USUALLY harbor "issues" with gay people in general. Nobody is stopping people from using the older meaning of gay.

The older meaning STILL EXISTS!

¹gay

adjective \ˈgā\

: sexually attracted to someone who is the same sex

: of, relating to, or used by homosexuals

: happy and excited : cheerful and lively

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gay

You do KNOW why most people don't use it anymore now that the dominant meaning of gay is about sexual orientation identity? Because they think gay as in the sexuality is a bad thing, something to be ashamed of , something to be embarrassed about, leading to stigmatization or worse. So go ahead, say you're having a gay old time in any way you want. What are you afraid of?!? People thinking you love the same sex? Does anyone SERIOUSLY think if you say Make the Yuletide Gay that you are proposing a Christmas gay sex event? So why not say it if you want to say it? I hope this point is clear. Nobody has "stolen" anything. MANY words have multiple meanings. Yes, you can disagree all you want. But I'm militant on this. It's an idiotic, trivial, insensitive, and petty thing to complain about. You can use the word GAY any way you bloody like. The gays did not stop you from using the word and will never stop you. If you don't use it any more in the older meaning, that is YOUR doing. Don't blame others. Blame yourself.

Edited March 23, 2014 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

The Blacks from Jamaica are a mixture of Black African slaves and White Irish slaves.

I think that somewhere in the world there is a committee, locked away somewhere, who spend their entire existence deciding what is the next word that is to become offensive.

When this word is released, another group of people, who spend their entire existence looking for something to be offended by, latch onto it. Then they complain until it is accepted by the world as offensive..

There is no such committee. Just so you know.

[sustento]

I'm losing the will to live

[isanbirder]

Yes, of course words change their meanings. The word GAY is ours now, and the old meaning is slipping out of use (mainly because it gets mistaken for the H meaning).

Remember "In my Father's house are many mansions"? And "having your conversation honest among the Gentiles"? Familiar to our forebears if not to us.

The word HOMOSEXUAL is rather different, because it has a specific technical meaning rather than an entirely colloquial one. People will continue to need it for that reason. But it will be used less and less in common speech.

[ToddWeston]

What a queer topic.....

I don't use the word homosexual as people in Canada refer to full fat milk as homo, I don't use the words same sex as it's not about sex, I don't use the word gay because of my other half, and how he's hurt being called a gaysian.

Remind me what are we supposed to call humans these days without offending anyone ?

Edited March 24, 2014 by ToddWeston

[Naam]

What a queer topic.....

I don't use the word homosexual as people in Canada refer to full fat milk as homo, I don't use the words same sex as it's not about sex, I don't use the word gay because of my other half, and how he's hurt being called a gaysian.

Remind me what are we supposed to call humans these days without offending anyone ?

homo sapiens?

Edited March 24, 2014 by Naam

[Ace of Pop]

My friend with poor English coined the name Homosociables, and i like that.Our Crowd all get on,with all genders.

[petermik]

I,m definately not gay-but my boyfriend? I think so

[ToddWeston]

I,m definately not gay-but my boyfriend? I think so

Best double check and make sure he's not a homosexual 55555

[OMGImInPattaya]

I generally refer to them as "breeders." But a little more confusing now with all these anti-queer gays running off and getting married and raising families.

[Jingthing]

I generally refer to them as "breeders." But a little more confusing now with all these anti-queer gays running off and getting married and raising families.

Well I hope you're joking, but that's of course a slur word. I understand as an underdog minority it's sometimes seen as OK to push back with slurs against the majority. I'd be lying if I said I have NEVER used it playfully among friends, just to see how it feels to say it. I don't like how it feels. I want respect as a gay person and I want to give respect to all reasonable people as well.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[OMGImInPattaya]

I generally refer to them as "breeders." But a little more confusing now with all these anti-queer gays running off and getting married and raising families.

Well I hope you're joking, but that's of course a slur word. I understand as an underdog minority it's sometimes seen as OK to push back with slurs against the majority. I'd be lying if I said I have NEVER used it playfully among friends, just to see how it feels to say it. I don't like how it feels. I want respect as a gay person and I want to give respect to all reasonable people as well.

Of course, it's only used with other friends of Dorothy. If used in the company of straights, it would go right over their little heads.

[Jingthing]

I generally refer to them as "breeders." But a little more confusing now with all these anti-queer gays running off and getting married and raising families.

Well I hope you're joking, but that's of course a slur word. I understand as an underdog minority it's sometimes seen as OK to push back with slurs against the majority. I'd be lying if I said I have NEVER used it playfully among friends, just to see how it feels to say it. I don't like how it feels. I want respect as a gay person and I want to give respect to all reasonable people as well.

Of course, it's only used with other friends of Dorothy. If used in the company of straights, it would go right over their little heads.

I prefer friends who are respectful of people's differences. If I was hanging out with a gay person who used any kind of slurs against others regularly, I would have a low opinion of their character. I don't wish others to insult me just for who I am, so I don't feel like insulting others just because of who they are. I do draw the line at haters though, as in bigots, I do not feel toleration for such people. So I think it's OK, even necessary, to call out bigotry. In real life, we are all human and have natural biases, that's part of life that won't ever change, so often it's a matter of degree (like when you hurt people with those feelings). In other words, yes "PC" orthodoxy can go too far.

Edited March 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[David48]

Hey JT ... EVERYTHING^* you write about focuses on your Gayness' ... you seem to allow it to define you, almost like there is nothing for the next layer.

Why not try allowing your personality to 'define' you?

I have a good mate from the forum here who is Gay, was mentioned once over a cold beer and never bought up again.

^* I must be using the same brand of computer as JT ... my Caps Lock gets stuck sometimes also.

[Scott]

I think that it is perfectly acceptable to let 'Gayness' be the defining issue in the gay forum. I suggest that you take a look at other topics if you wish to have a more comprehensive view of a poster's personality.

Actually, I feel sorry for all those preppers, who now have a bomb shelter full of expired food -- talk about being defined by something.

[David48]

Actually, I feel sorry for all those preppers, who now have a bomb shelter full of expired food -- talk about being defined by something.

What's a 'prepper'?

"a bomb shelter full of expired food" ... was that an News Item I missed?

I really do have to try and keep up with the happening events, just that domestic issues overtake me ...

[Water Buffalo]

What would you prefer to be called? I am sure you would find being called anything offensive, but we have a name for literally everything, so....

[NeverSure]

In my experience, people who complain all the time about gays "hijacking" the word gay USUALLY harbor "issues" with gay people in general. Nobody is stopping people from using the older meaning of gay.

The older meaning STILL EXISTS!

¹gay

adjective \ˈgā\

: sexually attracted to someone who is the same sex

: of, relating to, or used by homosexuals

: happy and excited : cheerful and lively

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gay

You do KNOW why most people don't use it anymore now that the dominant meaning of gay is about sexual orientation identity? Because they think gay as in the sexuality is a bad thing, something to be ashamed of , something to be embarrassed about, leading to stigmatization or worse. So go ahead, say you're having a gay old time in any way you want. What are you afraid of?!? People thinking you love the same sex? Does anyone SERIOUSLY think if you say Make the Yuletide Gay that you are proposing a Christmas gay sex event? So why not say it if you want to say it? I hope this point is clear. Nobody has "stolen" anything. MANY words have multiple meanings. Yes, you can disagree all you want. But I'm militant on this. It's an idiotic, trivial, insensitive, and petty thing to complain about. You can use the word GAY any way you bloody like. The gays did not stop you from using the word and will never stop you. If you don't use it any more in the older meaning, that is YOUR doing. Don't blame others. Blame yourself.

NO!! The meaning of gay as quoted above didn't exist when I was growing up. It meant only happy, cheerful etc.

It was hijacked. You have to have a modern dictionary to find that meaning.

It doesn't bother me because I have issues with the sexual orientation. It bothers me because it in effect ruined some traditional sayings to the point that Hallmark now says "Make your yuletide FUN." So a tradition is ruined or stolen.

Gays could have chosen a different word or made one. Also you'll never convince me that all of them are gay any more than all straight people are cheerful.

Song lyrics:

Don we now our gay apparel.

Make your yuletide gay.

"I Feel Pretty" and witty and gay!

"Why do fools fall in love, Why do birds sing so gay?" - Frankie Lymon & The Teenagers, February 1956

And I could go on and on.

[NeverSure]

I think that it is perfectly acceptable to let 'Gayness' be the defining issue in the gay forum. I suggest that you take a look at other topics if you wish to have a more comprehensive view of a poster's personality.

Actually, I feel sorry for all those preppers, who now have a bomb shelter full of expired food -- talk about being defined by something.

Well, it may be a little off topic, but "preppers" don't have expired food. The food that could expire they eat and rotate. Many foods, if sealed in food grade mylar bags with oxygen absorbers can last for decades.

There have been seeds carbon dated to thousands of years old which stored in the right conditions germinated and bore more seeds. LINK

[Jingthing]

...

Gays could have chosen a different word or made one. Also you'll never convince me that all of them are gay any more than all straight people are cheerful.

...

It just happened. Historically, I believe it started as a code word back when all gays were forced to hide in the shadows. The same kind of thing as wearing a certain item of unusual clothing (which probably varied over time and countries) to signal to other insiders who knew THE CODE. It wasn't decided in a grand committee of the gays. Language in general changes and evolves ORGANICALLY, over time. This was clearly a case of that so now we have these MULTIPLE meanings of the word gay. Oh, the horror!

Are you actually so literal minded that you actually BELIEVE that gay in the sexuality sense is asserting that all gay people are happy/cheerful?

If you are, just so you know, that is not what gay people think, gay people are a very DIVERSE bunch of humans, just as anyone else.

Actually, I don't believe you believe that. I believe for some reason you are playing the stereotyped role of the cranky whiner about gay people stealing the word gay. It's the type of BS some anti-gay rednecks like RUSH LIMBAUGH would mouth.

Speaking of hijacking, this thread isn't about your tired old tedious complaint. It's actually about the word HOMOSEXUAL. So who has hijacked something? Gay people or YOU?

Cheers (not so much).

Edited March 25, 2014 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

What would you prefer to be called? I am sure you would find being called anything offensive, but we have a name for literally everything, so....

The OP was not about my personal issue with the word homosexual. I don't really have much of an issue with it, except that I do understand anti-gay people often intentionally use it as a coded way to disrespect gay people. Such as saying homosexual marriage instead of gay marriage. Words do have power. It has been observed that the U.S. gay marriage movement gained a lot more traction when the choice was made to say marriage EQUALITY more than gay marriage. The current word for gay people is GAY, as if you didn't know. Duh. For some time there was a trend to self describe as QUEER, as a way to own a slur word and turn it around. My impression is that this trend is well over.

[uptheos]

I'm heterosexual, I like sex with women

Men who prefer sex with other men are homosexual

What's the issue?

I think hi-jacking the word gay is a bigger deal.

Edited March 25, 2014 by uptheos

[Jingthing]

I'm heterosexual, I like sex with women

Men who prefer sex with other men are homosexual

What's the issue?

I think hi-jacking the word gay is a bigger deal.

The OP explains the issue.

The topic, again, is NOT about "hijacking" the word gay.

If straight people really want to harp on with that complaint (gay has now been a mainstream descriptor of same sex orientation for DECADES NOW, when exactly do such whines desist?), please do so on another forum, not the GAY forum which exists as a pro GAY environment, and by inference not a place to complain about the very word -- GAY.

You do reinforce my feeling that because the word heterosexual is definitely not going away, homosexual it's technical clinical opposite isn't going away either. I wonder why the article writer did not at least comment about that aspect of this.

But I think the word is in decline and agree it will continue to be.

Edited March 25, 2014 by Jingthing