Suthep insists no election until reform starts

[thaigold]

Suthep is right in that a new election would simply cement things as they are, with Thaksin's grip firmly in place, unchanged, undeterred, and with reform being quickly discarded, as before. Everybody knows that. Thaksin knows that too, which is why he wants it. With a new election, nothing changes. Except that in power, Thaksin would be then free to pursue all the things he pursued in the last two and a half years - changes in the charter that benefit him, including an amnesty, as well as an opportunity to really clamp down on the independent agencies, which Pheu Thai have consistently wanted to do. So not only would a new election enable Thaksin's grip to remain exactly the same, but in fact it would be a whole lot worse, because Pheu Thai, Thaksin, and the UDD would set their sights on focusing their attention on the " reform " - as they see it - of the system of the legal checks and balances.

The efforts to cool this crisis have so far not worked. The idea of a televised debate between Yingluck and Suthep is a very positive step, and would likely be positively received nationally. Pheu Thai will reject it. Abhisit's " middle road " solution - a referendum that gives the green light to reform discussions before an election - is the clear solution, that ought to be embraced by all. It remains the key proposition that actually brings the two sides together and would also defuse the crisis peacefully as well as set a path forward. Yet Thaksin will certainly reject it. Because it threatens him. He is not interested in reform. He never was.

So the ensuing stalemate continues. But the courts are proceeding, as they should. The NACC will likely deliver a ruling next month. The law will ultimately be the vehicle for the path forward. As it should.

First, Mr. Scamper, stop furthering Suthep's line that Thaksin is the root of all evil in the Kingdom. He is not. Any Thai or foreigner can provide a long litany of political walking wounded from the halls of Thai politics since the 1960's.

And here's a thought to consider; what is the greater crime, a before the fact accusation of unproven guilt, or a coup d'etat to remove a twice elected Prime Minister by a majority popular vote? And trial in absentia? Are you serious?

Additionally, during this so called "reform period" what happens to the rights and aspirations of the majority populace who's elected representatives are to be vetted? Prime Minister Thaksin released the democracy genie from the jar, and it will never be contained again.

So my friend, rather than create divisions in the body politic, why not be a peacemaker and work for the Middle Way?

Long Live the King.

[fab4]

Maybe if Thaksin came back to hear all those cases awaiting his return ? Before the statute of limitations has them expire?

Anyway, the topic is not law cases, but reforms before elections.

Amazing, you did it again. Go off topic and then remind everybody else to remain on topic. Breathtaking hypocrisy that is so outrageous, it's funny. I salute you

[antimedia]

"Mr Suthep also said that the PDRC planned what could be the biggest ever demonstration of the people on March 29 to show Ms Yingluck that the majority of the people do not want election unless reform takes place first."

If the majority of Thai people wanted to be ruled by a group pushing a yellow agenda, then wouldn't the simplest thing be to push for an election as soon as possible?

The fact that the "Democrats" are boycotting elections and that Suthep is trying to shut them down suggests to me that even they themselves know the majority of Thai people aren't on board with their plans to install dictatorship.

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! Now have I got your attention; not yellow not red or any other bloody agenda colour, reform, read it again reform, is what he and the people want. Either wake up or close up.

Your post does not answer my point that Suthep obviously does not represent the majority of "the people".

And do you seriously believe that what he is pushing is some kind of "middle way" between red and yellow????

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No Suthep represents the west, New World Order in fact, to topple a democratically elected government. Unfortunately it is being handed to them on a platter by this moronic Thaksin and his PTP. THere is no middle way only there way.

[visionchaser45]

Suthep has no legitimate legal standing, nor does he have a mandate from the majority. Who is HE to "insist" on anything? He's nothing more than a loud-mouthed hypocrite and a treasonous swine. One to the back of the head should cure what ails him.

Edited March 26, 2014 by visionchaser45

[airconsult]

And I insist on no reform until Suthep "man's up" and faces the court on his murder, sedition and rebellion charges.

I'm pretty sure I'm more honest than him, so doesn't my declaration count more?

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Edited March 26, 2014 by airconsult

[tilac2]

As one of Thailand's most notoriously corrupt politicians I guess he knows a thing or two about it.

If this is true, than he will have a clue how to end corruption. It is not important what he did (or is blamed for) in the past.

What he does now is what counts.

BTW I think PTP, Yingluck and their cronies know at least much more

On that basis let's employ "reformed" paedophiles to run our nursery schools.

[northernjohn]

As one of Thailand's most notoriously corrupt politicians I guess he knows a thing or two about it.

If this is true, than he will have a clue how to end corruption. It is not important what he did (or is blamed for) in the past.

What he does now is what counts.

BTW I think PTP, Yingluck and their cronies know at least much more

The only thing Snig27 cares about is that the corruption routes be left open wide and untouched.

I wonder why.

I can only talk for myself but if I was in business with the government and it depended on graft I would not want any thing changed.

On the other hand if I was in business with the government and I was losing business because I refused to pay them off I would want an honest Government.

I am in neither position just an old man who has retired to Thailand on pensions that are more than adequate and I care about the country and the people.

[cnxdefyer]

Suthep is right in that a new election would simply cement things as they are, with Thaksin's grip firmly in place, unchanged, undeterred, and with reform being quickly discarded, as before. Everybody knows that. Thaksin knows that too, which is why he wants it. With a new election, nothing changes. Except that in power, Thaksin would be then free to pursue all the things he pursued in the last two and a half years - changes in the charter that benefit him, including an amnesty, as well as an opportunity to really clamp down on the independent agencies, which Pheu Thai have consistently wanted to do. So not only would a new election enable Thaksin's grip to remain exactly the same, but in fact it would be a whole lot worse, because Pheu Thai, Thaksin, and the UDD would set their sights on focusing their attention on the " reform " - as they see it - of the system of the legal checks and balances.

The efforts to cool this crisis have so far not worked. The idea of a televised debate between Yingluck and Suthep is a very positive step, and would likely be positively received nationally. Pheu Thai will reject it. Abhisit's " middle road " solution - a referendum that gives the green light to reform discussions before an election - is the clear solution, that ought to be embraced by all. It remains the key proposition that actually brings the two sides together and would also defuse the crisis peacefully as well as set a path forward. Yet Thaksin will certainly reject it. Because it threatens him. He is not interested in reform. He never was.

So the ensuing stalemate continues. But the courts are proceeding, as they should. The NACC will likely deliver a ruling next month. The law will ultimately be the vehicle for the path forward. As it should.

the moment the courts pass judgement, will be the beginning. Just look at what's happening so far. This path that the politicians put us on is a bloody one, there have been threats and promises from both sides and the police don't seem to care, the military keeps claiming they're neutral and stand by, people are up in arms and everyone with the power to stop things or make changes just stand by waiting and watching. It's all very sad to watch. In the end it'll be finger pointing and placing the blame on this person and that but that won't change the damage done.

[noitom]

The army should run this guy out of town. He says no elections until reform platform is developed, but he wants to be in charge of determining who determines the reform points. Preposterous position. His position is untenable. Thai army please put this guy on a plane and shuttle him out. He is dangerous to Thailand.

[Thai at Heart]

As one of Thailand's most notoriously corrupt politicians I guess he knows a thing or two about it.

If this is true, than he will have a clue how to end corruption. It is not important what he did (or is blamed for) in the past.

What he does now is what counts.

BTW I think PTP, Yingluck and their cronies know at least much more

Indeed. They say Thaksin was so rich, he wouldn't be corrupt. Trust Suthep to sort out corruption. Oh please...

[ThailandNoob]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

You're another one who likes to throw around words like constitution, well under the constitution she can't step down, she has to be remain in position until after the new PM has been appointed THROUGH Elections.

Why would she step down because others want her to, it's like asking you to quit your TVF account and stop posting here

She broke already numerous other parts in the constitution. If you can't hold an election within the required time frame, she must step back. You can't be caretaker PM without election forever just because the constitution doesn't allow you to step back.

Let's look at the timeline first:

1) Yingluck was prepared to hold elections within the required 60 days after dissolution of parliament or in November 2013.

2) BUT the EC said is wasn't prepared to do so and refused to support an election within the required timeframe.

3) EC insisted that Yingluck issue a royal decree that would force the EC to agree to hold the election within the required timeframe.

4) Yingluck refused saying the Constitution already provides for the 60-day timeframe.

5) EC filed an objection with the Constitutional Court.

6) The Court accepted the objection, thereby causing the Government to miss the constitutionally mandated deadline.

7) The Court ruled that ANY date for the election was legal so long as both the Government and EC agreed to the date.

8) The Government and EC agreed to Feb. 2, 2014 as the date for the election and also to an advanced voting date.

9) PDRC blockades several candidate registration stations

10) Yingluck requests EC establish alternate registration stations and EC refuses saying that's unconstitutional.

11) EC provides alternate registration stations for some candidates blocked by the PDRC at their usual station but not for other candidates.

12) PDRC blockades 10% of the polling stations to prevent anyone from voting.

13) The Government and the EC agree to a followup election date to cover the blockaded polling stations.

14) All previous blockaded polling stations are open on the scheduled election day.

15) PDRC asks the Constitution Court to nullify the Feb. 2nd election because the date for the blockaded 10% of the polls was resch\eduled to a date later than the Feb. 2nd election.

16) The Court nullifies the Feb. 2nd election.

17) The Court implies that another national election has to be scheduled; this will be far after the 60-day deadline required by the Constitution.

18) Suthep announces he will blockade any rescheduled national election until reforms are instituted; 1-2 years hence.

If anyone was violating the constitution it is, ironcially, the Constitutional Court. Even then its rulings are inconsistent with its own reasoning.

Couldn't you add the PDRC to that list, with their blockades / disruptions etc.?

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[ThailandNoob]

The army should run this guy out of town. He says no elections until reform platform is developed, but he wants to be in charge of determining who determines the reform points. Preposterous position. His position is untenable. Thai army please put this guy on a plane and shuttle him out. He is dangerous to Thailand.

The fact that the army hasn't done so already (or even taken steps to stop his thugs from attacking polling booths or candidate registration centres) speaks volumes about where Prayuth's loyalties lie.

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[rubl]

Maybe if Thaksin came back to hear all those cases awaiting his return ? Before the statute of limitations has them expire?

Anyway, the topic is not law cases, but reforms before elections.

Amazing, you did it again. Go off topic and then remind everybody else to remain on topic. Breathtaking hypocrisy that is so outrageous, it's funny. I salute you

To quote some poster called Fab4 "I'ts called humour man, humour"

[rubl]

The army should run this guy out of town. He says no elections until reform platform is developed, but he wants to be in charge of determining who determines the reform points. Preposterous position. His position is untenable. Thai army please put this guy on a plane and shuttle him out. He is dangerous to Thailand.

The fact that the army hasn't done so already (or even taken steps to stop his thugs from attacking polling booths or candidate registration centres) speaks volumes about where Prayuth's loyalties lie.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

This may surprise, but many people think that using the army to disperse anti-government protesters is undemocratic, not to be done.

[BlueNoseCodger]

The army should run this guy out of town. He says no elections until reform platform is developed, but he wants to be in charge of determining who determines the reform points. Preposterous position. His position is untenable. Thai army please put this guy on a plane and shuttle him out. He is dangerous to Thailand.

Are you kidding me? The Democrats have and always will be the political front for the military coups. Between the Navy Seal guards and army special warfare supply lines, and Rear Admiral Klom-In's unfortunate blabber mouth hinting at the game, their fingerprints are all over this one.

They're not about to run this guy out of town.

Suthep position is untenable, but without him, the army has no excuse to be in town, and the EC has no excuse to block elections.

So he marches, day, after day, after day, with his guards, yesterday they're wearing red crosses and pretending to be doctors, today they're wearing farmer tartan scarves and pretending to be farmers, tomorrow they're wearing black stripe t-shirts and berrets and carrying strings of onions and pretending to be French men. It's like their script writer use to write Thai soap-opera and has forgotten what real life looks like!

The Senate coup is the next attempt I think. The army is trying to stay in town for that.

Edited March 27, 2014 by BlueNoseCodger

[Toscano]

People talk about the prospect of having GOOD PEOPLE running the country .

Corruption is rife throughout Thailand , it would be safer to assume that there aren't any good people .

In another blog I have read that the corruptness of politicians corrupt the people .

To put it another way , when all the people are corrupt you are unlikely to find GOOD politicians .

Edited March 27, 2014 by metisdead
Bold font removed, please do not make it a habit to post in bold fonts.

[Spalpeen]

"Suthep insists no election until reform starts". And there I was thinking that elections in Thailand could only be called by Royal decree. Now it seems Suthep's approval is also required.

What ever happened to the Lese Majeste law?

[Trouble]

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Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Step down so that the country can ben manipulated by "good people" for who knows how long without a firm date for elections? Who is going to be able to remove these 'good people' if they choose not to hold elections "when the time is right"? Be careful what you wish for Costas, my old potato

12-14 month was the time frame.....If they wouldn't hold election they would get ousted like the Shinawatras. But if you have any better idea to reform Thailand, please tell. The Shinawatras are as far from being "good people" as you can find in Thailand and surely won't make any reforms to cut themself off the feeding trough.

I don't particularly care for the woman, I'd much prefer is she was replaced by the electorate, and not through a judicial or Military Coup.

There have been other suggestions, hold a referendum and let the people, not the minority but the majority decide if they'll accept the reforms first, Suthep is as stubborn as they come, as to whether he's right or not that's down to time, as to whether he'll be revered as a National Hero ( I highly doubt the Issan people would ever look upon him as such) that's again open to debate, but the truth is, many of his initial followers are sick of it all now, they've not progressed, sure they've had some forums, but stop pushing forwards ideals that are unacceptable to the majority, the PDRC movement has also dwindled, same as the support for the PTP/UDD so put it to the vote, it really doesn't get any simpler.

Let the elections run, stop acting like a spoilt child, give the current administration, IF they win, the same 12-14 months in which the reforms you so desire have to happen, or they're out on their ass.. yes, we all know they didn't do a great job, in fact it was abysmal, but they have no choice now, let the public determine who should run the country, who ever it is has 12 months to get their act together.. simple, and if they fail, then the Military step in, and have 6 months control, so that the future ruling party can have everything in place..

I keep reading about reforms. I would like someone to put forth what reforms should be discussed. This idea of reforms is just window dressing for wanting a change in the current government. Suthep and his cronies would never initiate real reforms because it would necessitate their own surrender to the greater good. Neither side wants real reform as it would mean many of those on both sides would have to be excluded from future government positions. No real reform will ever occur. It is particularly difficult to even have a debate on the subject when no one is willing to state what reforms should be on the agenda. It is all just political posturing.

[MAJIC]

Hmm!.... love him or hate him you have to admire his honesty and Integrity he will not give in,even though i'm sure he knows his life is on the line! everyday.

A prince amongst thieves!

[Publicus]

Hmm!.... love him or hate him you have to admire his honesty and Integrity he will not give in,even though i'm sure he knows his life is on the line! everyday.

A prince amongst thieves!

[ThailandNoob]

The army should run this guy out of town. He says no elections until reform platform is developed, but he wants to be in charge of determining who determines the reform points. Preposterous position. His position is untenable. Thai army please put this guy on a plane and shuttle him out. He is dangerous to Thailand.

The fact that the army hasn't done so already (or even taken steps to stop his thugs from attacking polling booths or candidate registration centres) speaks volumes about where Prayuth's loyalties lie.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

This may surprise, but many people think that using the army to disperse anti-government protesters is undemocratic, not to be done.

??? I think that the actions I described in my last post (attacking polling booths and candidate registration centres) are undemocratic, not to be done.

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[wellred]

Is this woman deaf?

I know she is dumb, but she should be able to understand what is good for her country.

Step down, Yingluck.

Step back farang. Your just here on holiday let the Thais deal with their own issues.